I pit the derisive, condenscending, anti-conspiriacy ... [merged threads]

[Chimera]

One of the funniest damned things I find in the entire Illuminati bullshit is this.

Almost all of the CTs postulate that the goal of these societies is to control the world and reduce us to servitude. Most of them postulate that society as we know it will be destroyed and we'll be reduced to the dark ages under their control. This has the following flaws;

1> If they've been working at this for 200+ years, they're miserable incompetent fuckups, because we keep advancing, the population growing, we're getting objectively more comfortable, richer and living longer. The complete opposite of stated goals.
2> The rich only live in such opulance and comfort, surrounded by all manner of luxury precisely because we have advanced to where it is readily available and affordable. Flat screen TVs and tablet computers only exist because billions of dollars were spent under the expectation of selling millions of the damned things, and they only improve because there is such a large and lucrative market. If there were only say, 10,000 illuminati living in luxury while the rest of us lived in mud huts, their 'luxury' would be that they lived in slightly less muddy huts. The economics and technology they currently live in would collapse along with the rest of the world.
3> Along those lines, daily access to luxury goods produced all over the globe depend on cheap and abundant transportation. That exists because millions are able to afford it every day. Take away the masses' ability to do this and you deprive the megarich of their cheap and abundant wines, scotch, salmon, exotic fruits, etc.
4> Being slave masters of millions is a lot of work and is fraught with dangers of revolt and assassination. Running an investment bank or owning that bank produces much higher rewards than outright evil.
5> Central Planning has shown itself to be a miserable failure. Cite: Every goddamned totalitarian so-called 'Communist' state. If a bureacracy of hundreds of thousands or millions couldn't do it, how the fuck do a small cabal of 'elites' do it?

[Kozmik]

Originally Posted by 42fish

That's not evidence for the Illuminati. That's evidence for the Bush administration being slimy.

At least you're getting closer:

Originally Posted by Marley23

So we've just gone from 242 people to thousands and thousands of people.

[Smeghead]

Originally Posted by Kozmik

At least you're getting closer:

Has the whole entire board lost its collective mind and gone totally batshit insane today, or is it just me?

[Chimera]

Originally Posted by Smeghead

Has the whole entire board lost its collective mind and gone totally batshit insane today, or is it just me?

There does seem to be a higher level of background noise today.

[Trinopus]

Originally Posted by Loach

The truth is just a way for The Man to keep us down.

There might actually be something to that... One of the first steps in any really successful revolution is the institution of an entirely new truth.

(Fortunately, the institution of a new truth does not always lead to a successful revolution!)

Originally Posted by Smeghead

Has the whole entire board lost its collective mind and gone totally batshit insane today, or is it just me?

False dichotomy: it might be you and only a few others, but not everyone. Um... Like... Hm... Okay, ya got me: it's everyone!

[Chimera]

Originally Posted by Trinopus

There might actually be something to that... One of the first steps in any really successful revolution is the institution of an entirely new truth.

I thought the first step in a successful revolution was to destroy all competing revolutionaries.

At least that's what that one song tells me.

[Marley23]

Originally Posted by Kozmik

At least you're getting closer:

You're doing that coy bullshit again. One of the reasons I think you might be mentally ill is the fact that you appear to think the posts you are making are meaningful. A lot of them are not. Earlier you said 242 people run the world as if the head of every government runs the nation by himself. I said that was idiotic, and it was transparently idiotic. Rather than accepting this obvious point, you're now trying to use it as evidence for your conspiracy theory. How does this work in your mind? It's evidence against your theory. Barack Obama doesn't run the U.S. by himself. The government in this country alone includes one president, 15 cabinet members, 535 Congressional Representatives, nine Supreme Court justices, and (to me) uncountable other advisers and critical staffers. Then there are the state level governments. That's just the U.S. The government structure in a lot of other countries is generally similar. How does that work with your "242 people run the world and get their marching orders from the Illuminati" bullshit?

Really, talk to a psychiatrist. This is boring and stupid.

[Der Trihs]

Originally Posted by Chimera

2> The rich only live in such opulance and comfort, surrounded by all manner of luxury precisely because we have advanced to where it is readily available and affordable. Flat screen TVs and tablet computers only exist because billions of dollars were spent under the expectation of selling millions of the damned things, and they only improve because there is such a large and lucrative market. If there were only say, 10,000 illuminati living in luxury while the rest of us lived in mud huts, their 'luxury' would be that they lived in slightly less muddy huts. The economics and technology they currently live in would collapse along with the rest of the world.
3> Along those lines, daily access to luxury goods produced all over the globe depend on cheap and abundant transportation. That exists because millions are able to afford it every day. Take away the masses' ability to do this and you deprive the megarich of their cheap and abundant wines, scotch, salmon, exotic fruits, etc.

To be fair, an awful lot of rich and wannabe-rich don't seem to grasp that. They seem to buy the idea that the wealthy elite do everything of importance and are responsible for everything worthwhile, and the rest of us are just lazy, disposable drones.

[cmyk]

Originally Posted by Rune

I’ll have to disagree. I don’t care if people are idiots, as long as they’re idiots on account of their own reasoning. Some of my best friends are complete idiots. I’m probably an idiot.

And a contrarian one at that.

Made-up, pattern seeking, paranoid bullshit is nothing to be impressed about, especially from their own reasoning. Anyone can do that if they're ignorant jackasses or smoked a fucking joint.

You seem to mistake CTs for actual intellectual thought and critical thinking.

Seriously, watch that TED Talk about 4 o'clock in the Morning. It's uncannily the same thought process, wonderfully satired by Rives, that Kozmik is using here.

[Chimera]

Originally Posted by Der Trihs

To be fair, an awful lot of rich and wannabe-rich don't seem to grasp that. They seem to buy the idea that the wealthy elite do everything of importance and are responsible for everything worthwhile, and the rest of us are just lazy, disposable drones.

Perhaps. But the Bill Gates' and Warren Buffets and their like, the people who actually own and/or run the companies that make this stuff, have a solid clue as to what kind of economies of scale are necessary to create and improve this shit in the first place.

It's kinda why I always laugh at the Star Trek episodes where the find a colony of mere hundreds or a couple of thousand that has been lost for generations. And the people have nice clothing, large buildings, transportation and tech items. I have an awareness of how much work each of those items requires from zero to raw materials to finished goods, and I laugh to think that they somehow mined all the various materials from widely scattered sites (which they found how?), grew the plants, manufactured all the chemicals and then had to make the large number of small batch finished goods they'd need.

"Hey Fred, we're going to need 20 more tires in size x and 60 in size y. How soon can you have those for us?"

[Kozmik]

Originally Posted by Marley23

Americans are a pretty paranoid bunch of people in my experience.

And the rest of the world isn't?

Originally Posted by Marley23

Al Qaeda was behind the attacks and it's not a country, but why the fuck is the Illuminati necessary?

Because the Illuminati, like Al Qaeda, is not connected to any one country. Even though 15 of the 19 hijackers were citizens of Saudi Arabia, that does not mean that Saudi Arabia was behind the attacks.

Originally Posted by Marley23

as if the head of every government runs the nation by himself.

Something we can agree on.

Originally Posted by Marley23

Barack Obama doesn't run the U.S. by himself. The government in this country alone includes one president, 15 cabinet members, 535 Congressional Representatives, nine Supreme Court justices, and (to me) uncountable other advisers and critical staffers.

George W. Bush didn't run the U.S. (or the world for that matter) by himself. He had PNAC members in his cabinet and as advisers and critical staffers.

[42fish]

Originally Posted by Kozmik

Because the Illuminati, like Al Qaeda, is not connected to any one country.

The International Red Cross isn't connected to any one county either. How do you that they weren't the ones behind 9/11 instead of the Illuminati? Face it, anyone constantly trying to suck out your blood is pretty damn suspicious.

[Kozmik]

Originally Posted by Der Trihs

and the rest of us are just lazy, disposable drones.

No, the leaders of every government are disposable drones to them.

Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.

[Ace309]

Does Alessan's quote, which you agreed with in post 140, accurately describe the strongest evidence you have to connect Stuxnet to the Illuminati?

[Marley23]

Originally Posted by Kozmik

And the rest of the world isn't?

I can't speak to every country, but I do see Americans as being very paranoid. Then again, a lot of people in the Middle East blame the Jews for everything.

Because the Illuminati, like Al Qaeda, is not connected to any one country.

That doesn't address why they are necessary to make the theory work. Want to try again?

Something we can agree on.

Then why did you say "242 people run the world?"

He had PNAC members in his cabinet and as advisers and critical staffers.

Yes, it turns out the Republican president had conservative advisers and staffers! Crazy shit, right! Must be the work of the Illuminati. There's no other explanation.

Originally Posted by Kozmik

No, the leaders of every government are disposable drones to them.

There's no them.

[Chimera]

Oh come on. There's always a THEM to tiny minds.

[Great Antibob]

Them!?

[Kozmik]

Originally Posted by Ace309

Does Alessan's quote, which you agreed with in post 140, accurately describe the strongest evidence you have to connect Stuxnet to the Illuminati?

Yes.

Originally Posted by Marley23

Then why did you say "242 people run the world?"

Because politics, at the highest level, is believed to be between countries. I claim that that there are higher levels.

Originally Posted by The New York Times, July 5, 2012

Italy and Germany are "willing to work together" to overcome the crisis afflicting the currency bloc, Ms. Merkel said Wednesday before a meeting of German and Italian officials and business executives. Mr. Monti said both countries understood the need to cede some sovereignty to build a stronger Europe.

And to build a stronger New World Order.

[Ace309]

Is Stuxnet your strongest evidence for the existence of some higher level of politics?

[Kozmik]

Originally Posted by Ace309

Is Stuxnet your strongest evidence for the existence of some higher level of politics?

Yes.

[Capt Kirk]

KOZ

You have lost it. Really you need help.

Stuxnet is of course a conspiracy against Iran, either the US or Israel did it(possibly both) in an attempt to halt the enrichment of Uranium and of course they are going to deny it, its cyberwarfare, every country(that can) does it and everyone denies it. Welcome to the Internet age. This is not evidence of the Illuminati, it is strong evidence that the West is making an all out effort to stop the Iranians from building a Nuclear Weapon.

The actions of the ECB are aimed at keeping the EU together, this is being deliberated in public and reported on daily, yes some meetings are private but the results are not. The livleyhoods of 500 million people are directly at stake and the breakup of the EU would be bad for the rest of the world. European integration has been going on for 60 years in a very public way, it has gone in fits and starts and will continue. If you fail to understand why re-read your early 20th century history texts from college.

It is a shame you are wasting your mind and time on this BS, you are smart and should quit looking for the Bogey-Man in every dark corner. The Illuminati were dreamed up by paranoid people who have a limited understanding of the world and felt helpless. This view can only be supported by ignoring the facts. Be critical, ask questions but quit being an idiot

CAPT

[Kozmik]

Originally Posted by Capt Kirk

Stuxnet is of course a conspiracy against Iran, either the US or Israel did it(possibly both) in an attempt to halt the enrichment of Uranium and of course they are going to deny it, its cyberwarfare, every country(that can) does it and everyone denies it. Welcome to the Internet age. This is not evidence of the Illuminati, it is strong evidence that the West is making an all out effort to stop the Iranians from building a Nuclear Weapon.

Alessan, who I respect, would not agree with me:

Originally Posted by Alessan

Therefore, everything is initiated and implemented by the same small group of people acting more-or-less independently of national governments.

Alessan, who you also should respect, would not agree with you either:

Originally Posted by Alessan

Stuxnet was initiated and implemented by a small group of people acting more-or-less independently of national governments.

[Enuma Elish]

Marley23 - Are you really getting irked because a pit thread doesn't contain internal logic?

[Kozmik]

Originally Posted by Acsenray

Hell, just start with stating an actual hypothesis before you even go to those steps.

Hypothesis:

Originally Posted by Alessan

everything is initiated and implemented by the same small group of people acting more-or-less independently of national governments

[Capt Kirk]

Originally Posted by Kozmik

Alessan, who I respect, would not agree with me:




Alessan, who you also should respect, would not agree with you either:

I believe he was talking about your beliefs not his own. Most assuredly Iran believes that Israel and the US did it.

You still have not answered my three questions directly and are still delusional, in my view, until you do.

CAPT

[Kozmik]

Originally Posted by Capt Kirk

I believe he was talking about your beliefs not his own.

Yes, I know. I wrote that Alessan would not agree with me and neither would he agree with you. Read for clarity, please.

[Great Antibob]

Just to clarify (bolding mine):

Originally Posted by Alessan

I think the logic is as follows:

a. Stuxnet was initiated and implemented by a small group of people acting more-or-less independently of national governments.

b. Therefore, everything is initiated and implemented by small groups of people acting more-or-less independently of national governments.

c. Therefore, everything is initiated and implemented by the same small group of people acting more-or-less independently of national governments.

The problem is, of course, that a. does not prove b., and b. does not prove c.



The thing about OCD, you see, is that it often puts the normal human tendency to look for patterns into overdrive, causing one to see patterns that aren't necessarily there.

[Kozmik]

Originally Posted by Great Antibob

Just to clarify (bolding mine):

How about waiting for Alessan to clarify, smartass?

[Great Antibob]

Originally Posted by Kozmik

How about waiting for Alessan to clarify, smartass?

Nah, this is more fun.

I like watching this show. It's very much like watching my infant nephews try to logic their way into a later bedtime or more candy.

And I still think you need to get some help and/or take your meds.

[Capt Kirk]

KOZ

I and others here have repeatedly asked you for evidence, you have provided nothing but cherry picked quotes and wild assed theories. You started this thread. Provide evidence, real evidence not your out of context quote from some professor, not a misunderstood quote from a NYT columnist, not a wild eyed conjecture unsupported by facts and we will happily listen.

I will assert once again that a state or states were responsible for Stuxnet, prove me wrong, I dare you

CAPT

[Kozmik]

Originally Posted by Capt Kirk

I will assert once again that a state or states were responsible for Stuxnet

I will emphasize once again that Alessan would disagree with you:

Originally Posted by Alessan

Stuxnet was initiated and implemented by a small group of people acting more-or-less independently of national governments.

Those are Alessan's words, not mine.



Alessan does not agree with me neither:

Originally Posted by Alessan

Therefore, everything is initiated and implemented by the same small group of people acting more-or-less independently of national governments.

But that's beside the point.

[Capt Kirk]

Originally Posted by Kozmik

I will emphasize once again that Alessan would disagree with you:


Those are Alessan's words, not mine.



Alessan does not agree with me neither:

But that's beside the point.

I said YOU provide some evidence, but you cannot can you? So you once again revert to some one else on this board who said something that may or may not support one of your lame theories. Facts come on bring em'. Give us one fact that shows the Illuminati made Stuxnet, one fact that is verifiable. That is all I am asking for, do it or STFU

CAPT

[Alessan]

Kozmik -

You're trying to figure out how the world works. I'm less ambitious. I'm trying to figure out how one person works - that person being you, Kozmik.

I was trying to understand your logic. I was not agreeing with it or claiming it was viable, I was simply trying to understand how you went from Stuxnet to the Illuminati. It seems as though I was correct. That's nice.




Personally (and based on absolutely no inside information), I think Stuxnet was written by the kids at Mamram, and all it proves is that Israeli military hackers have some mad skillz and that Israel was never afraid to engage its enemies on new battlefields. I do not in any way, shape or form conclude that it was initiated by some invisible cabal of international masterminds, because such an invisible cabal of international masterminds does not exist.

[Marley23]

Originally Posted by Kozmik

Because politics, at the highest level, is believed to be between countries. I claim that that there are higher levels.

OK. So far you've posted no evidence, and there's no logic to what you've said in support of this idea.

Originally Posted by Enuma Elish

Marley23 - Are you really getting irked because a pit thread doesn't contain internal logic?

No.

[Capt Kirk]

Ok now that we have cleared that up.
Koz the ball is in your court, evidence please

Capt

[Loach]

Originally Posted by Alessan

I do not in any way, shape or form conclude that it was initiated by some invisible cabal of international masterminds, because such an invisible cabal of international masterminds does not exist.

If I could join an organization and become invisible I would in a heartbeat. Because that would be really cool.

[Who_me?]

Originally Posted by Loach

If I could join an organization and become invisible I would in a heartbeat. Because that would be really cool.

Being invisible is overrated. I always seem to have people bumping into me... and they never apologize.

[Docta G]

Originally Posted by Kozmik

Idiocracy. Not just a movie.

Yes, it's also a felicitous designator for your unique neurochemistry.

[Vinyl Turnip]

Kozmik's mental processes are controlled by a shadowy group of idiocrats calling themselves the Illucidati. Wake up and smell the ayahuasca, sheeple!

[Ace309]

Kozmik, just to clarify, are you Miriam Lawrence of New York, NY? That's the assumption I made when I read post 157, but I'm not sure whether that was what you intended.

[Loach]

Originally Posted by Who_me?

Being invisible is overrated. I always seem to have people bumping into me... and they never apologize.

Just sit quietly in the dressing room and you'll be OK.

[BrainGlutton]

Originally Posted by Great Antibob

Them!?

No, worse! They!

[Malleus, Incus, Stapes!]

Yah know, my brother and I were having a discussion tonight at the dinner table about whether being off your meds was the opposite of getting high. You know, because one's from taking drugs and one's from not taking drugs? I suggested that it be called "getting low".

Is it just me, or have there been a lot of "low" people hanging out here lately?

[Morgyn]

Originally Posted by Who_me?

Being invisible is overrated. I always seem to have people bumping into me... and they never apologize.

I'm terribly sorry. I didn't see you there.

What I do see is that we are apparently having our regular end-of-school-year influx of kids! who! live! to! shock! with! their! original! positions!

Ah, youth.

[Great Antibob]

Originally Posted by BrainGlutton

No, worse! They!

Damn, you're right.

If Rowdy Roddy Piper says they're bad news, I believe him.

And I'm all out of bubblegum.

[Jackmannii]

Originally Posted by Chimera

One of the funniest damned things I find in the entire Illuminati bullshit is this.

Almost all of the CTs postulate that the goal of these societies is to control the world and reduce us to servitude. Most of them postulate that society as we know it will be destroyed and we'll be reduced to the dark ages under their control. This has the following flaws;

1> If they've been working at this for 200+ years, they're miserable incompetent fuckups, because we keep advancing, the population growing, we're getting objectively more comfortable, richer and living longer. The complete opposite of stated goals.

Ah, but it is only due to the vigilance of the non-sheeple that we have not already fallen off the precipice into mass eugenicide and eternal servitude to our dark masters.

Besides, the "objective" evidence of improved standards of living and lifespan is spoon-fed to you by the Illuminati-controlled media. We actually lived far longer, ate better and had happier lives back in 1840.

Here is a YouTube video that proves it.

[Munch]

Originally Posted by Malleus, Incus, Stapes!

Is it just me, or have there been a lot of "low" people hanging out here lately?

Think they wear yellow coats?

[gamerunknown]

Originally Posted by Chimera

Central Planning has shown itself to be a miserable failure.

Because of the Illuminati agent provocateurs, duh.

[Marley23]

Originally Posted by gamerunknown

Because of the Illuminati agent provocateurs, duh.

Please: agents provocateur. I know we're dealing with the terrifying prospect of a conspiracy of global hackers who control our every thought and deed, but that's no excuse for incorrectly pluralizing French words.

[pikey pete]

Originally Posted by Rune

It has become absolutely insufferable fashionable to be the cynic. It’s the new ironic. A position completely void of any insight or personal investment, or indeed drive to make changes. I’ll take the idealist and dreamer any day of the week. Also the conspiracy nut.

i will direct you back to the first bit of Menckenian wisdom...the one about underestimating things...