Valedictorian gives a hell of a speech

[al27052]

Originally Posted by Zebra

You said it.

The links below the story

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I know it was hot this summer Oklahoma but, really?

This sounds like New of the Weird kind of stuff.

[Algher]

As a graduate of an Oklahoma high school, this does not surprise me. We were told that any graduation ceremony shenanigans would result in no physical diploma provided. Since this was back when nice print jobs were NOT just a Kinkos away - it was almost a real threat to the 2/3rds who would never get any additional education.

We also had to show our cap to get our diploma - since somehow throwing your cap in the air was considered bad manners.

[Kaio]

Originally Posted by Hbns

I have heard several instances of "fuck" uttered around the engineering office this morning, but I can guaran-damn-tee not one "fuck" gets uttered during a presentation to a potential customer. Doubt any "hell's" either. Now after a couple cocktails with dinner and things have again become less formal... who knows?

Granted, but that's true just about whenever you're talking to someone you've just met and don't know well. I don't swear to the person asking me for directions, either. Should we end up becoming friends, however, the filter is turned off.

[aceplace57]

Southwestern Oklahoma State University? I would have expected a valedictorian to get offers from bigger schools. I graduated from a state university and got a good education. But, I didn't have her GPA in high school either.

I'd suck it up and write a short apology. Let the 2 bit principal feel important. She worked her ass off for that diploma. Why lose it now over one misunderstanding?

http://abcnews.go.com/US/oklahoma-va...3#.UDKr3aCi9K0

Her transcripts were sent on to Southwestern Oklahoma State University in Weatherford and life went on as usual until she and her father went to collect her diploma from the high school office last week.

[markdash]

Originally Posted by Kimballkid

If she has a cock to suck, I think she may have bigger things to worry about than a diploma.

Really? Mine sure isn't bigger than a diploma.

[Boyo Jim]

Originally Posted by Procrustus

I don't care if she said "Jesus can suck my cock," they can't withhold her diploma. Stupid power play by petty bureaucrats.

Originally Posted by Kimballkid

If she has a cock to suck, I think she may have bigger things to worry about than a diploma.

If Jesus is sucking her cock, then Jesus has given her a cock to suck, and he apparently likes her, so I think she wouldn't have much to worry about at all.

[StusBlues]

Originally Posted by MeanOldLady

What does she actually need the physical diploma for? I know she wants it so her parents can frame it or whathaveyou, but she's already graduated and is off to college soon. My response would be, "Keep it then, assholes. I'll be goddamned before I apologize to you petty dictator chucklefucks."

Good point. I have never needed my physical high school diploma for anything, ever. I've needed my physical college diploma exactly once--which is good, because it looks fake as hell and is signed by a guy now under scrutiny for abetting a pedophile.

If it were me, knowing what I know now, I'd be sorely tempted to say "up yours, I'm outta here."

Then again, this is coming from a guy who was invited to Homecoming to crown the king--and didn't. Ms. Nootbaar may have deeper connections within the community than I did. It's a certainty her affinity for the school couldn't be any weaker than mine was.

[StusBlues]

Originally Posted by Kimballkid

If she has a cock to suck, I think she may have bigger things to worry about than a diploma.

It's Oklahoma. I'm sure she has a rooster out back somewhere.

[StusBlues]

Originally Posted by aceplace57

Southwestern Oklahoma State University? I would have expected a valedictorian to get offers from bigger schools. I graduated from a state university and got a good education. But, I didn't have her GPA in high school either.

I went to a jerkwater high school probably not unlike Ms. Nootbaar's. Our valedictorian went to a two-year college and is now a vet tech about a half-mile from said lycee.

[Hbns]

Originally Posted by Kaio

Granted, but that's true just about whenever you're talking to someone you've just met and don't know well.

I agree. However it wasn't a casual conversation amongst peers and associates. It was a commencement address which one presumes had parents and other relatives in attendance. Certainly people she has never met before.

Again, I think the punishment is excessive and I think the administration is really reaching to get so worked up over the use of hell. It smacks of the administration taking the slippery slope of "zero tolerance" rules too far. Sometimes discretion is a good thing, but it seems to be out of fashion in our schools of late.

[Simplicio]

Originally Posted by Hbns

Again, I think the punishment is excessive

...really? Again, it seems a minor penalty for a minor offence. The student has to choose between forgoing getting a symbolic but worthless piece of paper to hang up on her wall or she has to spend ten minutes whipping up a BS apology letter.

[Manda JO]

It's worth mentioning that it was in a direct quote: I'd have been more offended if she's mangled (as much as you can mangle Twilight) to make it more innocuous. So it's not just a weak profanity, it's a weak profanity she quoting from a book that is almost certainly in her own school's library and considered generally acceptable for tweens to read.

[drewtwo99]

I was valedictorian, never used any swear words in my speech, and I never got my diploma. Never cared one iota either. Neither should she.

[RickJay]

I have no idea where my high school diploma is. If she's going to university, that diploma will trump it a thousand times over.

[Balance]

Originally Posted by aceplace57

Southwestern Oklahoma State University? I would have expected a valedictorian to get offers from bigger schools.

It's possible that she did, but wasn't able or willing to take advantage of them for some reasons. I was valedictorian of my (very small) graduating class, and I had offers from quite a few major schools, but even with those offers, I would have had to go into crushing levels of debt to get my degree at one of them. The state university made a much better offer--starting with an automatic tuition waiver--and was in an area with a much lower cost of living. Between that and working multiple jobs most of the time, I was able to graduate debt-free. I was willing to make that trade.

In her situation, I would not apologize. I don't know that I would bring suit, either, mostly because I don't believe it would have been necessary. I had other ways to get what I wanted.

[Folacin]

Originally Posted by aceplace57

Southwestern Oklahoma State University? I would have expected a valedictorian to get offers from bigger schools. I graduated from a state university and got a good education. But, I didn't have her GPA in high school either.

Originally Posted by Balance

It's possible that she did, but wasn't able or willing to take advantage of them for some reasons. I was valedictorian of my (very small) graduating class, and I had offers from quite a few major schools, but even with those offers, I would have had to go into crushing levels of debt to get my degree at one of them. The state university made a much better offer--starting with an automatic tuition waiver--and was in an area with a much lower cost of living. Between that and working multiple jobs most of the time, I was able to graduate debt-free. I was willing to make that trade.

Yeah, same here. In addition, (or in agreement, I guess) - it could have been a social thing than a money thing - some people just don't want to go far away to school, or be the only person they know there.

[RTFirefly]

Originally Posted by Ionizer

I am very familiar with Prague, sad to say. I am not surprised at all at how the supposed adults are acting there. Something I have always found interesting is the fairly popular church there (my presumption, but have seen the parking overflowing there up and down the road/highway). The 'Christianity' (of various stripes) is notably strong around there, bluntly speaking.

It's a wonder they allow the Bible in that church. Do they have any idea how many times the word 'hell' appears in the Bible?

(I'm sure they'd say, "that's different," without being able to offer a coherent explanation of how. Usually what happens at that point in these conversations is a recitation of the commandment about not taking the Lord's name in vain. When you say, "I didn't realize God's name was 'hell,'" they fall back on some verse in one of Paul's letters about keeping one's speech gracious, but by that point things are getting pretty vague.)

[RTFirefly]

Originally Posted by Zebra

I guess that was some pig.

It's a tangled web we weave.

[monstro]

A school threatening to withold your diploma is only second to "It'll go on your permanent record!" in terms of ridiculousness.

I couldn't tell you where my high school diploma was right now if my life depended on it.

I say let the dipshit school win this one. She's shamed it quite effectively, no matter what they end up doing.

[Boyo Jim]

Originally Posted by monstro

A school threatening to withold your diploma is only second to "It'll go on your permanent record!" in terms of ridiculousness.

I couldn't tell you where my high school diploma was right now if my life depended on it.

I say let the dipshit school win this one. She's shamed it quite effectively, no matter what they end up doing.

Oh, no. If there's any justice (which there isn't), her lawsuit will bankrupt the school district, the town, the county and the whole fuckin' state, so people will have to move out and live somewhere civilized. Texas, maybe.

[cwthree]

Originally Posted by aceplace57

I'd suck it up and write a short apology. Let the 2 bit principal feel important. She worked her ass off for that diploma. Why lose it now over one misunderstanding?

I wouldn't. It's a high school diploma - it's neither proof of graduation nor the record of her academic performance. The alleged "offense" doesn't merit an apology, and the principal no longer has any power over her. It's as good an opportunity as any to make it clear to TPTB that most grown-ups don't really measure themselves by how well they did in high school.

[WisdomofLife]

I had to scan my high school diploma for a job I was applying for one time. Didn't know why they didn't just do a background check . Must have not had the money or ability to do one I guess.

[Jeep's Phoenix]

Her transcript information has already been released, right? I don't see what the big deal is -- she doesn't owe them an apology, and the school can keep the little piece of paper. I haven't seen my high school diploma since the week after I graduated.

I quoted Richard Brautigan in my valedictorian speech. I had also memorized the entire speech in advance -- the copy of the speech I turned in lacked the quote, since the principal thought it was too controversial. ("If you get hung up on everybody else's hang-ups, then the whole world's going to be nothing more than one huge gallows." The principal wanted it removed because he thought it was about capital punishment.)

[Czarcasm]

Does anyone know if the school actually has her marked down as having "graduated"? Is it just a piece of paper they are withholding from her?

[Rick]

A link to the Superintendent's email in that story.
I sent him the following email:

I'm just wondering if you have any clue as to just how stupid your actions are making you look to the rest of the country?
Your actions are making people who had previously never heard of you or your community estimate your intelligence as being somewhere between a bag of hair and a box of rocks. In case you are not aware, this is not a good thing for you or your communities reputation. People are wondering if your family tree forks.

The lady said hell in a speech. big deal. The lady also had a 4.0 GPA. In these days of dismal test scores by students, I am reminded of what Abe Lincoln said when told that US Grant drank "Find out what brand of whiskey and send a case to each of my other generals". In your case if saying hell would motovate your students to get a 4.0 GPA, I would be holding cursing classes, if I were in your job.

You are hassling your best and brightest. Not a very smart move.
To quote from that famous philosopher Kenny Rogers "You got to know when to hold em, and know when to fold em"
Seriously, give it up and give the young lady her diploma. This is a battle you can't win.

[al27052]

Originally Posted by Rick

A link to the Superintendent's email in that story.
I sent him the following email:

Well that's entertaining. You had a couple of typos in there, though, which doesn't help your case.

I just can't even believe someone from here actually emailed him. I suspect, though, that a lot of people from across the country did.

[runner pat]

Originally Posted by al27052

Well that's entertaining. You had a couple of typos in there, though, which doesn't help your case.

I just can't even believe someone from here actually emailed him. I suspect, though, that a lot of people from across the country did.

I am so hoping it comes back corrected and with a grade.

[Rick]

Originally Posted by runner pat

I am so hoping it comes back corrected and with a grade.

Judging by his actions, I doubt there is much of a chance for that. Don't forget, those that can do, those that can't teach, and those that can't teach administer.

[al27052]

Originally Posted by runner pat

I am so hoping it comes back corrected and with a grade.

Few bureaucrats have the guts.

But yes, it would be funny, if it was done well.

[WisdomofLife]

We had a similar incident when I was going to high school. I was orchestra class and the music/drama department was performing the musical, New York, New York (I think it was, but memory is faulty). Anway, the graphic arts teacher printed out promotional/remembrance shirts with the play's motto/slogan: "It's oen hell of a town." Well it was suppose to be "It's one heck of town.". Well, the music teacher threw a hissy fit over the use of the word "hell." She thought it was inapporiate and wanted the graphic arts teacher to reprint the shirts. I am not sure if he did or not (I don't think he did). She also used the "someone please think of the children" in that she didn't want her two daughters to wear or when see them.

Also, she had a fit over dialogue in the play, South Pacific. In the play, Americans sailors and soliders use the word, "Jap", to refer to the Japanese. The music teacher was Japanese herself. She started throwing a fit and again used her daughters as a excuse to get it changed (claims she didn't want them to hear the term). I can understand her feelings on the issue, but Americans did this during this time. Anyway, I pointed this out in the class and one of the upperclassmen (non-Japanese) thought I was a horrible person.

[BigT]

Originally Posted by Simplicio

...really? Again, it seems a minor penalty for a minor offence. The student has to choose between forgoing getting a symbolic but worthless piece of paper to hang up on her wall or she has to spend ten minutes whipping up a BS apology letter.

Really? You think an impermanent word is equivalent to nearly permanent piece of paper? You think a word that has almost no value even as a curse word is equally valuable to a sheet of paper that is lauded by nearly everyone?

I don't get it when people find two things of minimal value and equate them.

[rocking chair]

mr cooper had this story on the rediculist last night.

he may not have been informed about the pig.

[LouisB]

In the early 1950s, in a small town in Texas, I had a teacher who refused to use the word "helicopter" because "hell" was a bad word and should never be used in conversation. She insisted the the correct pronunciation was "heel e oh copter. Texas and Oklahoma are not too far apart when it comes to idiocy.

[Simplicio]

Originally Posted by BigT

Really?

Really

You think an impermanent word is equivalent to nearly permanent piece of paper? You think a word that has almost no value even as a curse word is equally valuable to a sheet of paper that is lauded by nearly everyone?

Getting a HS degree is lauded. Almost no one cares if you have the physical piece of paper. Plus she can whip off a quick BS apology and get the piece of paper if it is important to her.

I think the minor punishment here was in proportion to the minor offence.

The actual prohibition against swearing is a little silly, but its kind of weird that people are treating this like some sort of OK specific thing. You'd get in trouble for swearing in a speech in my HS in a liberal, largely secular NE state as well. Personally I don't care if kids swear when they address their classmates. But then, I don't really care if they can't either. If the school wants to ban cursing during public addresses (and I suspect almost all schools do, not just schools in OK), it doesn't really fill me with righteous fury.