Interesting Article About the Muppets' Swedish Chef

[HeyHomie]

Back in 2008 I posted a thread about the Swedish Chef. The consensus was that Swedes regarded him as Norwegian, and generally didn't "get" his appeal.

Now a much better writer than I has written a much more thorough article about TSC. The general idea is that Swedes regard him as Norwegian, and generally don't "get" his appeal.

[Floater]

This was news to me. I have never heard before that we would regard him as Norwegian (and definitely not Swedish).

[Acsenray]

Now I know exactly how to annoy the next Swedish person I meet. Just ask was "Bork! Bork! Bork!" means.

[Alessan]

Back when my wife was a sous-chef in the Russian Tea Room, her boss, the pastry chef, was Swedish. Every so often she would sneak up behind him and murmur "Bork bork bork." Used to drive him crazy.

[Floater]

Even though we're not unfamiliar with the expression we are not offended by it as it has no relevance to us.

[Martian Bigfoot]

Originally Posted by Floater

This was news to me. I have never heard before that we would regard him as Norwegian (and definitely not Swedish).

For what it's worth, this Norwegian can't understand a damned word he says. He also acts like he has a habit of visiting the wine cellar maybe a bit too often. Both of which clearly conspire to mean that he's neither Swedish nor Norwegian, but Danish.

[Acsenray]

Originally Posted by Floater

Even though we're not unfamiliar with the expression we are not offended by it as it has no relevance to us.

The OP links to an entire article in which Swedish people are quoted as saying that they are annoyed when people keep asking them about the Swedish Chef. Now, that might not be your personal experience, but are you purporting to speak for the entirety of Swede-dom?

[Max Torque]

In Jim Henson: The Works, someone (probably either his son Brian or wife Cheryl, I'll have to check) mentions that in the pre-Sesame Street days, Jim loved riding around in his convertible listening to a tape on how to speak "mock Swedish". The voice of the character grew from that foundation. Identifying the Chef as Swedish rather than Norwegian is very likely the fault of whoever created that tape, if fault is to be laid anywhere. Cultural sensitivity wasn't exactly a thing in the early 60s.

[Floater]

Originally Posted by Acsenray

... but are you purporting to speak for the entirety of Swede-dom?

I am not, but the Swedish chef is a definite non-issue in Sweden, although perhaps not among Swedish expats who are being bugged about him all the time by non-Swedes.

[LavenderBlue]

Great. Now what I really want to know: What do chickens think of Gonzo? How do frogs feel about Kermit? Pigs about Ms. Piggy? Comedians about Fozzy Bear?

[Acsenray]

Originally Posted by Martian Bigfoot

For what it's worth, this Norwegian can't understand a damned word he says. He also acts like he has a habit of visiting the wine cellar maybe a bit too often. Both of which clearly conspire to mean that he's neither Swedish nor Norwegian, but Danish.

Aha! A very useful stereotype is uncovered. Danes are drunks. I've also heard it said that Danish pronunciation is extremely difficult to understand. Perhaps the two are connected.

[AHunter3]

I would have thought that these days the first question Swedes would get from Americans would be "What do you think of Stieg Larson?"

[Diceman]

Originally Posted by LavenderBlue

Great. Now what I really want to know: What do chickens think of Gonzo? How do frogs feel about Kermit? Pigs about Ms. Piggy? Comedians about Fozzy Bear?

Didn't they eventually decide that Gonzo was an alien?

[DrFidelius]

Originally Posted by Acsenray

Aha! A very useful stereotype is uncovered. Danes are drunks. I've also heard it said that Danish pronunciation is extremely difficult to understand. Perhaps the two are connected.

Danes also ride bicycles everywhere, possibly even into their bedrooms. I don't believe they would know a good wine if they were hit over the head with a bottle, but their criteria for a "good beer" is a volumetric measurement.

Or so I heard.

(Purveyor of outdated stereotypes since 1972)

[DrFidelius]

Originally Posted by Diceman

Didn't they eventually decide that Gonzo was an alien?

He might not be an alien, but he is a chicken fucker.

[Beware of Doug]

The Chef attempts to boil a löobster.

[Martian Bigfoot]

Originally Posted by Acsenray

Aha! A very useful stereotype is uncovered. Danes are drunks. I've also heard it said that Danish pronunciation is extremely difficult to understand. Perhaps the two are connected.

Originally Posted by DrFidelius

Danes also ride bicycles everywhere, possibly even into their bedrooms. I don't believe they would know a good wine if they were hit over the head with a bottle, but their criteria for a "good beer" is a volumetric measurement.

Or so I heard.

(Purveyor of outdated stereotypes since 1972)

OK, I'm sorry, and I won't do it again. I guess I just thought that with all the "Norwegians only eat lutefisk" jokes around here, I could get away with one small cheap Danish stereotype.

(I love Danes, though, honestly.)

[Johnny Bravo]

I didn't find the linked article terribly interesting, but I did want to mention that I was highly entertained by the Order/Chaos Muppet article that's linked to in the article.

[Johnny Angel]

I liked the article, particularly the discussion of language tonality. But what I was thinking about it on my walk this morning is that while I myself find the Swedish Chef funny the Swedes have every reason to be annoyed by the Swedish Chef. It's not even an accurate stereotype, and is the first thing that comes to Americans' minds when discussing their culture, with the possible exception of meatballs. But, but, but... I actually find the news that Swedes are annoyed by this pretty funny in itself. Is that terrible of me?

So... how do the Swedes feel about being called Squareheads?

[Chronos]

I guess I just thought that with all the "Norwegians only eat lutefisk" jokes around here, I could get away with one small cheap Danish stereotype.

It's my understanding that Norwegians don't actually eat lutefisk at all, and that the substance exists only so that Norwegians can laugh at how gullible drunk foreigners are for trying it.

[Little Nemo]

And Kermit? He's not really French.

[Max Torque]

Originally Posted by Chronos

It's my understanding that Norwegians don't actually eat lutefisk at all, and that the substance exists only so that Norwegians can laugh at how gullible drunk foreigners are for trying it.

Even people who like it don't like it. I remember seeing a Minnesota woman being interviewed about lutefisk on TV during the Christmas holidays, and she said, "Well, when I was a kid they told me it was tradition, so I would eat it, but I could only eat about a teaspoon. Now that I'm an adult, I can eat a whole tablespoon."

[Robot Arm]

Originally Posted by Martian Bigfoot

For what it's worth, this Norwegian can't understand a damned word he says. He also acts like he has a habit of visiting the wine cellar maybe a bit too often. Both of which clearly conspire to mean that he's neither Swedish nor Norwegian, but Danish.

He is, in fact, Japanese.

[Chimera]

Originally Posted by LavenderBlue

Great. Now what I really want to know: What do chickens think of Gonzo? How do frogs feel about Kermit? Pigs about Ms. Piggy? Comedians about Fozzy Bear?

How very inappropriate of you to ask how police about Ms. Piggy and the how the French feel about Kermit.

[Tblue]

Originally Posted by Diceman

Didn't they eventually decide that Gonzo was an alien?

They decided he was a "Weirdo", I believe? (pretty sure that's true - am an ardent Muppet fan.)
Just don't ask me how I feel about a Corporation replacing Jim Henson's name with their own, and people will remain mentally intact with no borking. Which makes me wonder something else...

I don't know if it's a local (read: New Zealand) colloquialism, or not, but to bork something up means to make a mess of it. At least, among me and my friends. I think I've heard it used by others as well.

It's only just now occurred to me that this stems directly from the Muppet Show! Anyone else used that phrase or heard it themselves?

[jayjay]

Originally Posted by Acsenray

Aha! A very useful stereotype is uncovered. Danes are drunks. I've also heard it said that Danish pronunciation is extremely difficult to understand. Perhaps the two are connected.

Scandinavia and the World

[drastic_quench]

Is it spelled Bork? Is there standardized gibberish?

[Beware of Doug]

Originally Posted by Acsenray

Aha! A very useful stereotype is uncovered. Danes are drunks.

All Scandinavians are drunks. Danes just own up to it.

[JKellyMap]

Originally Posted by Diceman

Didn't they eventually decide that Gonzo was an alien?

He was labeled as a "Whatever" on one occasion.

[aruvqan]

Originally Posted by Martian Bigfoot

For what it's worth, this Norwegian can't understand a damned word he says. He also acts like he has a habit of visiting the wine cellar maybe a bit too often. Both of which clearly conspire to mean that he's neither Swedish nor Norwegian, but Danish.

But he doesn't sound like he has a mouth full of mashed potatoes, so he can't be Danish.

[SCAdian]

Originally Posted by aruvqan

But he doesn't sound like he has a mouth full of mashed potatoes, so he can't be Danish.

Don't the Germans say that it's Americans who speak with Kartoffelmund?

[Zebra]

Maybe he is Icelandic?

Bjork! Bjork! Bjork!

[bienville]

Originally Posted by Diceman

Didn't they eventually decide that Gonzo was an alien?

Originally Posted by Tblue

They decided he was a "Weirdo", I believe? (pretty sure that's true - am an ardent Muppet fan.)

Originally Posted by JKellyMap

He was labeled as a "Whatever" on one occasion.

Unfortunately, Diceman is correct.

Gonzo had always, had always, been a Whatever.
This was an entirely satisfactoy explanation for both fans and for Gonzo himself until . . .

the absolute worst of all theatrically released Muppet movies, the execrable Muppets From Space. The entire plot of this movie was that Gonzo was depressed that he didn't know what he was. He finds out he is an alien when Earth is once again visited by aliens of Gonzo's race. Everyone gets along very well and Gonzo is happy and all is right with the world.

Except all wasn't right with the world because this movie sucked and it cheapened one of the all time greatest Muppet characters by demystifying him in the lamest way imaginable.

Still, as it was an official theatrically released Muppet movie, I'm afraid we have to accept it as canon.

[Tblue]

Gah! So he was. I totally forgot about that one. (I guess my fandom is mostly from/for the tv series. I... haven't even seen the latest movie!)

[aruvqan]

Originally Posted by SCAdian

Don't the Germans say that it's Americans who speak with Kartoffelmund?

No idea, but the EVE Online corp I hang with in 0.0 is mainly scandanavians leavened with a couple South Africans, a finn, a couple of good old boy rednecks from Biloxi Mississippi [hope they are safe today] and little old me.

I regularly hear the Norwegian and the Dane joke arguing with each other to stop singing or to swallow before speaking.

[Johnny Angel]

Originally Posted by bienville

Except all wasn't right with the world because this movie sucked and it cheapened one of the all time greatest Muppet characters by demystifying him in the lamest way imaginable.

Name something that movie didn't cheapen in the lamest way imaginable. I almost can't stand to look up into space anymore.

[Wakinyan]

Originally Posted by Floater

This was news to me. I have never heard before that we would regard him as Norwegian (and definitely not Swedish).

Originally Posted by Floater

Even though we're not unfamiliar with the expression we are not offended by it as it has no relevance to us.

Originally Posted by Acsenray

The OP links to an entire article in which Swedish people are quoted as saying that they are annoyed when people keep asking them about the Swedish Chef. Now, that might not be your personal experience, but are you purporting to speak for the entirety of Swede-dom?

Originally Posted by Floater

I am not, but the Swedish chef is a definite non-issue in Sweden, although perhaps not among Swedish expats who are being bugged about him all the time by non-Swedes.

I'm Swedish and with Floater on this one. Never heard about the Norway thing, and haven't met anybody IRL since the eighties who ever mentioned The Swedish Chef.

[Face Intentionally Left Blank]

Originally Posted by Max Torque

In Jim Henson: The Works, someone (probably either his son Brian or wife Cheryl, I'll have to check) mentions that in the pre-Sesame Street days, Jim loved riding around in his convertible listening to a tape on how to speak "mock Swedish".

Where the hell would one get such a thing? Why would one get such a thing? Who would make such a thing? You've raised so many more questions than you've answered.

[sisu]

Originally Posted by LavenderBlue

Great. Now what I really want to know: What do chickens think of Gonzo? How do frogs feel about Kermit? Pigs about Ms. Piggy? Comedians about Fozzy Bear?

Drummers love Animal, they think he is a complement......

[GuanoLad]

Originally Posted by Max Torque

In Jim Henson: The Works, someone (probably either his son Brian or wife Cheryl, I'll have to check)

Cheryl is his daughter. His wife was Jane.

[rocking chair]

Originally Posted by Face Intentionally Left Blank

Where the hell would one get such a thing? Why would one get such a thing? Who would make such a thing? You've raised so many more questions than you've answered.

from his last name, i figured there may be swedish in his backround some where. perhaps he got the tape for that? or someone gave it to him. i got a scandinavian joke book for a secret santa once 'cause my last name is danish.

(very happy the chef is swedish, not danish!)

[74westy]

I noticed the article didn't ask any Norwegians what they thought.

[Slow Moving Vehicle]

Originally Posted by Martian Bigfoot

For what it's worth, this Norwegian can't understand a damned word he says. He also acts like he has a habit of visiting the wine cellar maybe a bit too often. Both of which clearly conspire to mean that he's neither Swedish nor Norwegian, but Danish.

Could Martin Bigfoot be exhibiting a bit of culinary envy? For Americans, a "danish" is a deliciously calorie-laden pastry, while a "swede" is the British word for what we call a rutabaga. And a "Weejun" is a shoe.

[Face Intentionally Left Blank]

Originally Posted by rocking chair

from his last name, i figured there may be swedish in his backround some where. perhaps he got the tape for that? or someone gave it to him. i got a scandinavian joke book for a secret santa once 'cause my last name is danish.

(very happy the chef is swedish, not danish!)

Ah, thanks. Upon reflection, the 60's did have it's share of odd, esoteric books & humor tapes, didn't it?

[digs]

Originally Posted by Zebra

Maybe he is Icelandic?

Bjork! Bjork! Bjork!

That was beautiful. And reminded me of Robot Chicken's Swedish Chef.

[Steophan]

No-one's asked the truly important question, which is how accurate a portrayal of the modern scientist is Beaker?

[rocking chair]

Originally Posted by Face Intentionally Left Blank

Ah, thanks. Upon reflection, the 60's did have it's share of odd, esoteric books & humor tapes, didn't it?

and the '70's, 80's, 90's... i got the joke book in the late 90's office thing.

there was a mid west thing going on with talk minn., lutheran cook books, and scandinavian stuff.

bork! bork! bork!

[cochrane]

Originally Posted by Beware of Doug

The Chef attempts to boil a löobster.

The Chef attempts to make Pöpcørn Shrimp.