Fox News and Liberals

[Milum]

"Sorry, folks, a good discussion, but we don't let trolls play in our sandbox.' - Lynn, Administrator.

Your wish is my command Lynn, now that that pesky troll has been banned, let us continue on with our good discussion.

Why do liberals hate FOXNEWS? Is it...

* Because they don't have their own national radio talk show?

* Because they hate the American people because they consider them low-life rabble who are coarse and fundamental in their way of thinking?

* Because the election was stolen from Al Gore and then someone stole Al Gore and put him away in a lock box where he can't run for president as a martyr?

* Because they wanted the Iraqi people to work out their difficulties with Saddam on their own and then Bush and Fox and the Devil intervened and today the Iraqis are free?

Naw, even the least of Liberals aren't that shallow.

So why do liberals hate FOXNEWS?

[cheddarsnax]

Originally posted by Milum
[i]So why do liberals hate FOXNEWS?

Would you like to present some ideas of your own (real ones, I mean) to start this debate? Or are you, ya know, just askin'?

[Chefguy]

What sort of screwball questions are these? The premises don't merit debate, as far as I can tell. Perhaps if you rephrased them in a more coherent format, you would get some response.

[El_Kabong]

I'm a liberal. and I don't hate FOX News, exactly, I just don't find particularly unbiase, interesting, or useful as a news source.

Does the OP seriously believe that someone taking issue with Fox News would ONLY do so for the reasons listed in his post? Because that would be, you know, silly.

[elucidator]

Fox? Is that the one with the Daily Show?

[El_Kabong]

Sorry for the typos. Didn't have my coffee this morning.

[Milum]

Sure cheddarsnax, I get it. You want a real official style debate. Ok, like, you know, here's the proposition....

Resolved: After fifty years of neo- liberal reporting of information by all major news outlets the American public embraced the more balanced information that came available through FOXNEWS with enthusiam. This shift in their prime source of information from traditional news to FOX refects a basic need of the american people to extract accurate information from the outside events that effect them.

And Liberals, who need public information distributed that promotes the social ideas of a self-selected elite, hate that which disrupts their grand march towards socialism.

How's that, cheeddarsnax and Chefguy?

Hey! You guys sing the same song. Strange.

[Chefguy]

Originally posted by Milum
Sure cheddarsnax, I get it. You want a real official style debate. Ok, like, you know, here's the proposition....

Resolved: After fifty years of neo- liberal reporting of information by all major news outlets the American public embraced the more balanced information that came available through FOXNEWS with enthusiam. This shift in their prime source of information from traditional news to FOX refects a basic need of the american people to extract accurate information from the outside events that effect them.

And Liberals, who need public information distributed that promotes the social ideas of a self-selected elite, hate that which disrupts their grand march towards socialism.

How's that, cheeddarsnax and Chefguy?

Hey! You guys sing the same song. Strange.

Interesting that you would spout the same "liberal media" nonsense as other dittoheads. The "major news outlets" are owned by mega-corporations, who (with the exception of Time Warner) toe the conservative line and support the conservative agenda with rather large contributions. It would seem that much of your news over the past five decades has been slanted to the right after all.

I see no cite to support a "shift...in prime source of information". Can you offer one?

Your last point is speculation and opinion, not debate.

['possum stalker]

Do you want to rebut any of things that were posted in the locked thread, or are you just showboating?

Lots of people sing the same song you do, my friend.
Whenever two people disagree with a conservative it becomes a 'Great Liberal Conspiracy'. Whenever two conservatives disagree with a liberal its 'The Voice of the People is Finally Heard'. This is reminiscent of the mystery of how the media can be 'liberal' when half the media outlets program several hours of bitching about the 'liberal media' every day.

For people who hate the 'victim culture,' conservatives spend a lot of time bewailing their trials at the hands of the pointed-headed intellectuals. (not that I'm pickin' on you, Milum. just a general observation).

[Mr. Evil Breakfast]

Originally posted by Milum
Sure cheddarsnax, I get it. You want a real official style debate. Ok, like, you know, here's the proposition....

Resolved: After fifty years of neo- liberal reporting of information by all major news outlets the American public embraced the more balanced information that came available through FOXNEWS with enthusiam. This shift in their prime source of information from traditional news to FOX refects a basic need of the american people to extract accurate information from the outside events that effect them.

And Liberals, who need public information distributed that promotes the social ideas of a self-selected elite, hate that which disrupts their grand march towards socialism.

How's that, cheeddarsnax and Chefguy?

Hey! You guys sing the same song. Strange.

social ideas of s self-selected elite??!!

That's much more true about conservatives then about liberals.

I think the basic problem that liberals have with Fox News is this: they editorialize when they should just report. In simpler terms, they give their opinion and pass it off as factual news.

Which is one of the very first things they teach you, or they should teach you, at journalism school. I don't care if you editorialize, but if you are going to do so, then say so upfront, rather then trying to pass it off as news.

That is the essence of what Fox does.

And it is bad and shoddy journalism, not to mention bad and shoddy ethics.

[Soup_du_jour]

Liberals hate Fox News because it is a blatantly biased source of news that claims to be objective.

[Beagle]

I like having three news networks with slants, and different slants from every journalist. Sure, it would be nice if they wore bias lablels on their heads, but over time you learn them. Dan Rather: D. Britt Hume: R. Walter Cronkite: D. George Will: R. Cokie Roberts and Sam Donaldson: D.

Fox News actually hires liberals and lets them speak. I know many people don't watch Fox on principle, or whatever, but that does make one less able to know the actual facts of what goes on.

But, O'Reilly is an increasingly unhinged blowhard. Ann Coulter is like a verbal black mamba. Sean Hannity may well be the first artificial conservative life form. Or, he reads off his notes a lot.

But, Fox used to have FAIR's Cohen on their media criticism show (insomnia, and I'm a geek). He left for greener pastures. No, he was not disappeared by Cal Thomas. How's that for fair and balanced? Seriously.

[Milum]

Look! Over both of your left shoulders fellow posters. See ! People are looking. And they see...

Would you like to present some ideas of your own (real ones, I mean) to start this debate? Or are you, ya know, just askin'?

What sort of screwball questions are these?

Does the OP seriously believe that someone taking issue with Fox News would ONLY do so for the reasons listed in his post? Because that would be, you know, silly.

Do you want to rebut any of things that were posted in the locked thread, or are you just showboating?

Interesting that you would spout the same "liberal media" nonsense as other dittoheads.

And then Elucidator adds some dismissive in-house humor...

Fox? Is that the one with the Daily Show?

And then, finally, Mr. Evil Breakfast explains that FOX does not do what he was taught to do in journalism school, and Chefguy asks for a cite proving tha FOXNEWS is popular with the people.

Anyway thank you Soup_du_jour, for your opinion that Liberals hate Fox News because it is a blatantly biased source of news that claims to be objective. Your post was refreshingly honest in your opinionated views.

Whew! Being a OP poster child for the right on this leftman's board is not a happy chore for the fainthearted, but I guess it could be worse; I could be declared a troll and banished.

[elucidator]

Now why would anyone say such a thing?

[Sterra]

Originally posted by elucidator
Fox? Is that the one with the Daily Show?

You know that is really insulting to the Daily Show.

In answer to the OP I don't hate Fox, but it has single handedly turned the term "fair and balanced" into an accusation of bias.

[hansel]

Originally posted by Milum
So why do liberals hate FOXNEWS?

Because Fox News has about the same level of interesting debate as the OP, and uses the same self-pitying, slanted rhetoric for beating its own chest.

It's gotten to the point where I idolize conservative commentators who make rational, articulate arguments, just because they seem so rare in a world where Fox, Colter, Limbaugh, Hannity et al dominates that side of the debate.

[Chefguy]

Originally posted by Milum
Look! Over both of your left shoulders fellow posters. See ! People are looking. And they see...

Would you like to present some ideas of your own (real ones, I mean) to start this debate? Or are you, ya know, just askin'?

What sort of screwball questions are these?

Does the OP seriously believe that someone taking issue with Fox News would ONLY do so for the reasons listed in his post? Because that would be, you know, silly.

Do you want to rebut any of things that were posted in the locked thread, or are you just showboating?

Interesting that you would spout the same "liberal media" nonsense as other dittoheads.

And then Elucidator adds some dismissive in-house humor...

Fox? Is that the one with the Daily Show?

And then, finally, Mr. Evil Breakfast explains that FOX does not do what he was taught to do in journalism school, and Chefguy asks for a cite proving tha FOXNEWS is popular with the people.

Anyway thank you Soup_du_jour, for your opinion that Liberals hate Fox News because it is a blatantly biased source of news that claims to be objective. Your post was refreshingly honest in your opinionated views.

Whew! Being a OP poster child for the right on this leftman's board is not a happy chore for the fainthearted, but I guess it could be worse; I could be declared a troll and banished.

So you present unfounded arguments, are taken to task for them, then refuse to debate and instead mock the people responding to your nitwitism? From what I've read from other conservatives on this board, they would be appalled to have such an ill-spoken person as yourself as a poster child for any of their causes. I know I'm done here.

['possum stalker]

Milum , Logic and coherent arguement rule in GD, not ideology. I often agree with Sam Stone because he makes logically points, rather than going for the Right-Wing Victim schtick.
And Sam Stone is mighty conservative.

So to answer my own question, you are showboating (maybe Witnessing is a better word) and shan't address any of the arguments in the closed thread. Or any arguments anywhere. Too bad. woulda been innersting.

[owlofcreamcheese]

because it can be misspelled faux news and its HILARIOUS, and if there is a news report and someone uses it as a cite you can pretend its not possibly true and its HILARIOUS

[Mr. Evil Breakfast]

Originally posted by Milum
And then, finally, Mr. Evil Breakfast explains that FOX does not do what he was taught to do in journalism school,

So, it's somehow OK for Fox to ignore and violate one of the central tenants of journalism, but no one else is allowed to?

[cheddarsnax]

Pit.

[Milum]

Bye Chefguy, bye 'possum stalker, sorry if my "nitwitism" has caused you two boys distress. But Chefboy I didn't respond to your rather worn report that the media is owned by rich folks because that obvious point has been discussed ad nauseam and even though 75% of the actual reporting and compiling media were polled as dyed-in-the-wool liberal democrats, the owners of the largest and most influential newspapers and television networks were judged to be slightly conservative, but even so most of these folks liked to hob nob with the smart set and so they largely voted Democrat, and they voted with their money.

And 'possum stalker, sorry I didn't address any of the arguments in the closed thread that you thought needed re-addressing. I didn't see any that I thought worth revisiting. What? Is your finger broke? Why didn't you type them in?

Geez. Take this OP job and shove it! I quit!

And no, Mr Evil Breakfast, it is not all right for Fox to violate the rule of objective reporting when they are reporting and not editorializing. All that matters in reporting is an effective transfer of truth.

But the use of the time-earned reputation for honesty and accuracy by a highly regarded news outlet, such as the New York Times et al, to promote a personal political agenda under a guise of objective reporting, is much much worse.

[rjung]

If this OP is a representative example of what passes for a 'great debate" among American conservatives, no wonder Fox pundits like Bill O'Reiley end up just shouting at folks instead -- anything more civilized is just too difficult for them.

[Short]

I propose that Fox has a strong conservative bias. Consider the following:

Owner: Rupert Murdoch, who stated "we'll do whatever is our patriotic duty."
President: Roger Ailes, whose former job was as a conservative media advisor (no experience as a journalist).
Talking Head: Tony Snow, who according to his Online Bio "took a sabbatical from journalism to work in the White House for President George H. Bush."
Talking Head: David Asman, who formerly headed the (rather conservative) op/ed pages of the Wall Street Journal.
Talking Head: Brit Hume, who formerly worked for the conservative Weekly Standard.
Talking Head: Sean Hannity who describes himself as a conservative.
Talking Head: Bill O'Reilly (see Below)
Talking Head: Newt Gingrich, yes that Newt Gingrich.
Show: Special Report with Brit Hume, which in a recent study was found to feature disproportionatly Republican and conservative guests (and virtually exclusivly white males).
Show: O'Reilly Factor (see Below)

Bill O'Reilly deserves a special place, all to himself. Hume, for instance, is conservative but is undeniably a fully credentialed journalist. I am not willing to say the same about O'Reilly. O'Reilly claims to be independent. He cites positions such as being anti-death penalty. His preference to the death penalty is to put people in "gulags" (his word). Bill O'Rielly is independent of something alright; my vote is for reality.

Consider that he has:
- Accuses a sitting member of congress (Jim McDermott, D-WA) of "giving aid and comfort to Saddam." Note this is an accuastion of treason.
- Promoted a boycott of French goods.
- Suggested an African-American guest, Rev. Al Dixon, could "go back to Africa" Extra! May/June 2002, pp22
- Compared the Koran to Mein Kampf, and later denied it,
- Stated that treason laws might apply to "some of the peaceniks that are walking around, but that be a little bit of a stretch here."
- Said criticism of the Patriot act was "seditious"
- Stated that noncitizens should not have attorney-client privledge
- Called District Court Judge Shira Schedindlin "subversive" for disallowing a student to be detained indefinitly as a material witness. He suggested the House Judiciary Comittee impeach her.
- Surreally sugested in May 2002 that there might be a link between the Oklahoma City Bombing and Al Qaeda.
- Asked if "Al Gore [is] running on a quasi-socialist platform"
- Suggested "homosexuals, whether they're in the Boy Scouts or in the Army or in high school [should] Shut up, don't tell anyone what you do, your life will be a lot easier."

You'll note that I included only his opinions, not his numerous unretracted false statements (commonly called lies). The former are indicitive of his right wing views. The latter are demonstrative of his sheer insanity. I am getting tired of typing, and O'Reilly's documented lying is so vast that I can hardly do it justice. If you need instances O'Reilly lying outright, I'm happy to provide them.

Please further note that this post is not an exhaustive documenting of Fox News's Right Wing Bias, it is barely scratching the surface.

[Gaudere]

Take this OP job and shove it! I quit!

[Moderator Hat ON]

Ok. You don't want to debate (as it seems you do not), you don't get a thread.

[Moderator Hat OFF]