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  #1  
Old 10-06-2016, 11:52 AM
Terminus Est Terminus Est is online now
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Arrow Season 5

So is anyone still watching? The first episode of the season wasn't half-bad. Fight scenes where it looked like they actually gave a damn. Flashbacks that weren't completely irrelevant. Oliver shooting trick arrows; heck, Oliver actually shooting multiple arrows. Has the show turned it around? Only time will tell.
  #2  
Old 10-06-2016, 01:07 PM
N9IWP N9IWP is online now
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Unfortunately my bored board meeting ran late and I forgot to record it.

CW puts shows online, right?

Brian

Last edited by N9IWP; 10-06-2016 at 01:07 PM.
  #3  
Old 10-06-2016, 01:54 PM
Mahaloth Mahaloth is offline
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Skipping this season, may check it out on Netflix next year. I found it too predictable and boring last year. Flash, too, sadly.
  #4  
Old 10-06-2016, 04:08 PM
Daddypants Daddypants is offline
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Unfortunately my bored board meeting ran late and I forgot to record it.

CW puts shows online, right?

Brian
Yes, they do, and commercial free. That's how I watched it.
  #5  
Old 10-07-2016, 08:01 AM
N9IWP N9IWP is online now
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I like trick arrows, but a parachute arrow?

Is Felicity's beau someone we've seen before?

Brian
  #6  
Old 10-07-2016, 08:26 AM
epbrown01 epbrown01 is offline
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This sounds bad but I've gotta say I'm glad Arrow's back to just killing people this season. And I felt bad for the actress playing Black Canary losing her gig last year, but apparently she's still on the show every week in flashbacks.

And pardon me, how is Felicity still in the kick-ass penthouse that belongs to, afaik, Ollie and Thea? You dump a guy, you don't get his luxury apartment! You sure don't move in a pasty boy-toy with an Alfalfa haircut.
  #7  
Old 10-07-2016, 01:52 PM
MaxTheVool MaxTheVool is offline
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I thought the pilot episode was good rousing fun. The idea of Ollie deliberately training a team of sidekicks is an interesting one, and certainly a totally new element for the show.
  #8  
Old 10-07-2016, 02:45 PM
Fenris Fenris is offline
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This is the last chance I'm giving this season unless there are a few changes.

1) If anyone EVER trusts Malcolm Merlin again--or even goes along with one of his plans, I quit. Seriously dudes, he's been lying and manipulating things since season 1 and I'm bored with characters dumb enough that they can't learn that he's untrustworthy.

2) Ollie is allowed to say "...failed THIS CITY!" in his faux Batman voice no more than once every three episodes. Less would be better.

3) The guy with the accent--the drunk cop who's Black Canary's daddy has to pick a fucking side and stick with it for the whole season (or even two seasons. That would actually be better). Enough of the "Ollie you done good for the city. But now I hate you and must destroy you. After I hug you for saving someone." crap. I like the actor, but the character is schizo.

4) No More Flashbacks--they're getting weaker than the flashbacks in the second and third seasons of LOST (remember the "How the whiney doctor got his tattoo" episode? Yeah, we're approaching that level)

and

5) More villains. NEW villians

Finally, it won't happen, but I want Diggle to become Mr. Terrific (because, dudes, he already is. He looks the part, he walks the walk, and most importantly, both the character and the actor have the coolness to pull off the "Fair Play" bit) and the scrawny little lab tech guy can be Jakeem Thunder or Black Lighting or (obscure but cool) Impala or Bloodwynd (the costume's great and a spellchecker would help with the unfortunate typo-look of the name) or Static (who he looks like an older version of) or any of a half dozen other characters that he even vaguely resembles. But Mr. Terrific should look like a linebacker and should exude coolness*...and the lab guy doesn't.


*The whole point of the character--the original and the new '90s version--is that they were trying to provide crazy-awesome male role models to kids who were gang members and you can't do that looking like that lab-tech kid.
  #9  
Old 10-07-2016, 03:11 PM
Noelq Noelq is offline
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Dark Ollie is fun Ollie.

I'm happy to see this show come back.
  #10  
Old 10-07-2016, 04:34 PM
MaxTheVool MaxTheVool is offline
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Quote:
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1) If anyone EVER trusts Malcolm Merlin again--or even goes along with one of his plans, I quit. Seriously dudes, he's been lying and manipulating things since season 1 and I'm bored with characters dumb enough that they can't learn that he's untrustworthy.
So far so good
Quote:

2) Ollie is allowed to say "...failed THIS CITY!" in his faux Batman voice no more than once every three episodes. Less would be better.
So far so good
Quote:

3) The guy with the accent--the drunk cop who's Black Canary's daddy has to pick a fucking side and stick with it for the whole season (or even two seasons. That would actually be better). Enough of the "Ollie you done good for the city. But now I hate you and must destroy you. After I hug you for saving someone." crap. I like the actor, but the character is schizo.
So far so good
Quote:

4) No More Flashbacks--they're getting weaker than the flashbacks in the second and third seasons of LOST (remember the "How the whiney doctor got his tattoo" episode? Yeah, we're approaching that level)
So far so good
Quote:

and

5) More villains. NEW villians
So far so good
  #11  
Old 10-07-2016, 05:58 PM
Terminus Est Terminus Est is online now
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And I felt bad for the actress playing Black Canary losing her gig last year, but apparently she's still on the show every week in flashbacks.
Katie Cassidy has the same deal this season as John Barrowman (Malcolm Merlyn) and Wentworth Miller (Captain Cold) - a recurring role across all four CW superhero shows. Whether she'll be playing the Laurel Lance we're familiar with or some other version of her remains to be seen.

Laurel apparently asked Oliver to go find another Black Canary. So why did Oliver spend the break NOT looking for a Black Canary? In fact, he was actively denying that he needed any help whatsoever. Is that any way to honor her memory?
  #12  
Old 10-10-2016, 02:09 PM
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Late to the party - but that statue of Black Canary was possibly as bad the iconic Lucy statue.
  #13  
Old 10-13-2016, 08:27 PM
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Episode 2 was underwhelming. Too much Arrow angst and subterfuge in recruiting the new team. Just get with the program, already! The best parts were seeing what Diggle's been up to.
  #14  
Old 10-20-2016, 02:32 AM
Terminus Est Terminus Est is online now
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Sonovbitch. I thought Deadshot being alive was another side effect of Flashpoint. I did not expect them to do the whole "it was all in his head" fake out. Especially not with Diggle.

I'm confused. Where were they doing the whole "toe the line" training if not in the Arrowcave?
  #15  
Old 11-14-2016, 10:54 PM
levdrakon levdrakon is offline
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I didn't see that revelation coming! Cool.

I'm a little bored with the new recruits and their "we don't trust you, you don't trust us, you keep secrets!" Geez.

Is the Flash taking a break or something?
  #16  
Old 11-15-2016, 03:06 AM
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Is the Flash taking a break or something?
There was some big event in America that pre-empted the show, about a man and a woman and a white house. It was all over the news, maybe you missed it?
  #17  
Old 11-17-2016, 09:00 AM
Fenris Fenris is offline
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With one huge exception, this season is so much better than S4 that it's almost like another show.

That said, jeez....just fucking KILL Quintin Lance. He sucks. He's useless. He sucks. He whines. He's a crybaby. He's a turncoat (on multiple occasions) and he always, always lets the heroes down*.

I'm starting to hate the actor, who's taking Quint's already-silly accent to "needs subtitles" levels, and I just wish he'd die. Quickly. On cam. Leaving behind a messy, DNA-laden corpse so that the medical examiner can say "Nope, it was him. Not a clone or a space-phantom"

One great bit in this episode was
SPOILER:

Black Canary III turning out to be a traitor. And the way the scene mirrored the Perez/Wolfman Teen Titans issue when Terra revealed herself. Down to the creepy smile. That was some good directing, right there



*Note a last minute heel-face turn where he changes sides and rescues them from some danger he created doesn't count as helping.
  #18  
Old 11-17-2016, 09:01 PM
levdrakon levdrakon is offline
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I just want to know how an old alcoholic with a heart condition turns into Prometheus. If he snuck off and "trained really hard" with the League of Assassins I'll scream.

The latest Black Canary was kinda boring and redundant anyway. Maybe she'll be more interesting now. Maybe. The theme of this week's flashback was betrayal, so that works.

I'd like to know more about the guy who dies for a living and impersonates people. I'm sure he's from the comics. He was kinda fun. Who is he, comics-wise?
  #19  
Old 11-17-2016, 09:06 PM
Fenris Fenris is offline
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I figured that the Quint=Prometheus thing was a red herring.

The impersonator is:
The "Christopher Chance" version of the Human Target (I didn't know there was another one.) He had a brief, mediocre TV show in the '90s.
  #20  
Old 11-17-2016, 09:16 PM
The Other Waldo Pepper The Other Waldo Pepper is offline
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The impersonator is:
The "Christopher Chance" version of the Human Target (I didn't know there was another one.) He had a brief, mediocre TV show in the '90s.
And an awesome one in '10.
  #21  
Old 11-17-2016, 09:26 PM
levdrakon levdrakon is offline
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I figured that the Quint=Prometheus thing was a red herring.

The impersonator is:
The "Christopher Chance" version of the Human Target (I didn't know there was another one.) He had a brief, mediocre TV show in the '90s.
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Originally Posted by The Other Waldo Pepper View Post
And an awesome one in '10.
Oh, I remember the Mark Valley one. I think I only caught a couple eps.
  #22  
Old 11-17-2016, 10:53 PM
D_Odds D_Odds is offline
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Oh, I remember the Mark Valley one. I think I only caught a couple eps.
I really enjoyed it. The main 3 were all top notch TV actors. Came before comic book shows were popular enough to last, only got 2 seasons (1.5 actually, I think).
  #23  
Old 11-18-2016, 12:35 PM
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Yeah, I really liked the Mark Valley 'Human Target' show. It was a lot of fun.

I did not see that betrayal coming. I did note that she looked pretty amazing in that red dress when she was acting as bait.

I agree that Deputy Mayor Lance needs to get it together or get off the show.
  #24  
Old 11-19-2016, 03:36 AM
Terminus Est Terminus Est is online now
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The Lance storyline exists solely so that we can appreciate how much Thea has grown as a character. Back in season 1, did you ever think that Thea would become the most responsible person on the show? She's pretty much running the entire city by herself, as best she can.

While I agree that the season so far has been much, much better than Season 4, there still seems to be something missing from the show. Oliver himself doesn't seem to have developed much as a character, and is retreading old ground with the "Kill or Don't Kill" angst that should have been settled ages ago.

Next week, the show takes a break for Thanksgiving. Then the show returns, for its 100th episode no less, for the big 4-way crossover. I've started a new thread, specifically for the crossover, here:
http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/...d.php?t=811347
  #25  
Old 11-20-2016, 04:38 PM
TBG TBG is offline
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Mr. Terrific's mask isn't (terrific). One of those costume bits that works on the page but not the screen (and I'm really tolerant of super costumes some others aren't, I'd much rather "silly" spandex everywhere than turning everything into leather jackets, looking at you X-men...) Motherfucker looks like a black guy wearing black face. I think it's that you can still see his eyes that really throws it off like that. Whatever it is they're doing too moosh down the actor's afro doesn't help the look much either.
  #26  
Old 11-21-2016, 12:42 PM
Mister Rik Mister Rik is offline
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Whatever it is they're doing too moosh down the actor's afro doesn't help the look much either.
I haven't managed to get a very good look at it, but at a couple angles I thought it looked cornrowed. And that made me think, Wait, wouldn't that be impractically time-consuming? I mean afro -> "Suit up!" -> cornrows. Not happening.
  #27  
Old 12-08-2016, 02:25 AM
levdrakon levdrakon is offline
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That was a weird episode. The theme was everyone Ollie touches suffers, but haven't we done that enough? Hard to follow too. I couldn't tell what was flashback and what wasn't. I guess they want me to pay closer attention than I normally do.

So what happened to Detective Lance? He checked into rehab but that's it? He isn't Prometheus?

Laurel? Again?

Bummer of a Christmas episode.

wild Dog is still irritating as hell. Wouldn't mind seeing him and Artemis gone.
  #28  
Old 12-08-2016, 05:56 AM
Terminus Est Terminus Est is online now
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I thought The Flash episode was dark, but this was a whole different level of darkness.

I, too, found it hard to follow which scenes were flashbacks and which were present-day, until I realized the flashbacks were the scenes where Ollie was killing dudes and in the present-day scenes, they were already dead. I don't think Ollie killed anyone in the present day until poor Billy at the end.

I find it ironic that in Arrow, which is supposed to be more rooted in the real world, no one ever seems to stay dead. Whereas in The Flash, which is more sci-fi based, the dead tend to stay well and truly dead, even if Barry attempts to revive them.
  #29  
Old 12-08-2016, 08:41 AM
Fenris Fenris is offline
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The bit with Billy was incredibly obvious to me. As soon as Prometheus kidnapped (rather than murdered) him and Ollie signed the "Shoot on Sight" order, I knew, knew that Billy was gonna die (I didn't predict Ollie specifically, I was thinking more along the lines of a cop shooting him). But I knew he was going to be gagged and have a gun stuck to his hand.

I agree that Wild Dog sucks. His name is dumb. His costume is dumb. His lack of any distinguishing powers are dumb and the character is dumb.

I don't see how they're going to fix the situation with Ollie's past. They kinda-sorta handwaved away all the murders that Ollie committed in S1 and I was ok with that. But going back and re-examining it? Bold move if they have a long-range plan, and I hope they do. But...how's he going to pay for the serial killings? (also a bold move to admit that he fit the pattern of a serial killer in the first season) He can't be in jail. The "Doin' time and fightin' crime" thing was stupid in the '90s when they made Green Lantern do it, and in a digital age, even less plausible. So how are they going to make it better? How does he pay for all the murdered people?

Last edited by Fenris; 12-08-2016 at 08:42 AM.
  #30  
Old 12-08-2016, 12:29 PM
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I did like Felicity's line about "It seems like every Wednesday someone we thought was dead really isn't" (paraphrase, duh) - and then Laurel shows up at the end.
  #31  
Old 12-08-2016, 04:45 PM
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I thought The Flash episode was dark, but this was a whole different level of darkness.

I, too, found it hard to follow which scenes were flashbacks and which were present-day, until I realized the flashbacks were the scenes where Ollie was killing dudes and in the present-day scenes, they were already dead. I don't think Ollie killed anyone in the present day until poor Billy at the end.

I find it ironic that in Arrow, which is supposed to be more rooted in the real world, no one ever seems to stay dead. Whereas in The Flash, which is more sci-fi based, the dead tend to stay well and truly dead, even if Barry attempts to revive them.
I noticed towards the end that Ollie was only wearing dark eye makeup in the flashbacks, but had his eye mask in the present. Still, the scene with Diggle asking him to reconsider whether killing people was the right way to do things to me just seemed an odd conversation to have in the present, but now I realize it wasn't.

Flash does have a loophole for dead characters. Alternate Earths. His dad is Flash in another universe, for instance.
  #32  
Old 12-08-2016, 06:53 PM
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The bit with Billy was incredibly obvious to me. As soon as Prometheus kidnapped (rather than murdered) him and Ollie signed the "Shoot on Sight" order, I knew, knew that Billy was gonna die (I didn't predict Ollie specifically, I was thinking more along the lines of a cop shooting him). But I knew he was going to be gagged and have a gun stuck to his hand.
The Joker did something similar (and even more twisted) in the Flashpoint comics.
  #33  
Old 12-09-2016, 03:40 PM
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It's not a comic book universe until everyone's died and come back at least once. Wonder if this is a faked death, an alternate universe counter part, clone, robot, or hallucination. Hallucination is too close to the alien VR thing, so I'm guessing (hoping) not that one.
  #34  
Old 12-10-2016, 03:00 PM
Fenris Fenris is offline
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It's not a comic book universe until everyone's died and come back at least once. Wonder if this is a faked death, an alternate universe counter part, clone, robot, or hallucination. Hallucination is too close to the alien VR thing, so I'm guessing (hoping) not that one.
There is an Earth-2 counterpart of Black Canary running around: Season 2 ep 22 has "Black Siren". And she's been locked in STAR Lab's basement for about a year now and along with a zillion other Earth-2 bad guys, been completely forgotten.
  #35  
Old 12-10-2016, 05:24 PM
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It's not a comic book universe until everyone's died and come back at least once. Wonder if this is a faked death, an alternate universe counter part, clone, robot, or hallucination. Hallucination is too close to the alien VR thing, so I'm guessing (hoping) not that one.
I'm going with faked - the rule of conservation of characters made Felicity's boyfriend my top pick for Prometheus and we still haven't seen his face. There's no reason for that unless we've already seen the guy.
  #36  
Old 12-10-2016, 05:43 PM
Fenris Fenris is offline
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I'm wondering what's up with whatshername--the reporter Ollie's boinking. The camera lingered too long on the vodka bottle for it to be a coincidence. She's clearly connected to the Russian mob flashback somehow
  #37  
Old 12-10-2016, 05:48 PM
levdrakon levdrakon is offline
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I'm wondering what's up with whatshername--the reporter Ollie's boinking. The camera lingered too long on the vodka bottle for it to be a coincidence. She's clearly connected to the Russian mob flashback somehow
I noticed that too. I expected the bottle to transition into a Russia flashback.
  #38  
Old 12-10-2016, 06:57 PM
TBG TBG is offline
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I'm wondering what's up with whatshername--the reporter Ollie's boinking. The camera lingered too long on the vodka bottle for it to be a coincidence. She's clearly connected to the Russian mob flashback somehow
Yeah, that had me thinking she's actually P. In that costume, complete with voice modulator, there's nothing saying he's not actually a she under there.

Or maybe its just a red herring or poor direction.
  #39  
Old 12-10-2016, 07:08 PM
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The reporter had a picture of Ollie in Russia during the time when he was supposed to be at the island, nothing came of that so far.
  #40  
Old 12-11-2016, 11:18 PM
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The reporter had a picture of Ollie in Russia during the time when he was supposed to be at the island, nothing came of that so far.
My thought is that she was waiting for their agreement to be up before she drops the bomb that he wasn't on the desert island the entire time, which will shock not just the public but his nearest and dearest, especially Thea (even more when he reveals he was in Starling City for a bit).

But yeah, I thought it was going to lead to a foreshadowing exchange like "Hey, I've had this vodka before." "Really? It's only sold in Russia - a friend brought some back for me. Where did you have some?"
  #41  
Old 01-26-2017, 06:05 AM
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Was anyone surprised that Laurel was actually Black Siren from Earth-2? Anyone? I was disappointed that she was so easily dispatched. At least she destroyed that godawful Black Canary statue. And Oliver finally was reminded of his promise to Laurel to find another Black Canary.

Prometheus is such a non-entity that I've forgotten what his motivations are. Does he even have a rationale for what he does, aside from being the Bad Guy and therefore must fuck with the hero?
  #42  
Old 01-26-2017, 09:50 AM
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Was anyone surprised that Laurel was actually Black Siren from Earth-2? Anyone? I was disappointed that she was so easily dispatched. At least she destroyed that godawful Black Canary statue. And Oliver finally was reminded of his promise to Laurel to find another Black Canary.

Prometheus is such a non-entity that I've forgotten what his motivations are. Does he even have a rationale for what he does, aside from being the Bad Guy and therefore must fuck with the hero?
Prometheus is the son of one of Arrow's first season kills and is seeking revenge. Prometheus' father's name was in the book - I don't recall exactly what he had done to deserve to be in the book. (medicine, not getting to people that needed them, pricing or something like that comes to mind)
  #43  
Old 01-26-2017, 02:05 PM
MaxTheVool MaxTheVool is offline
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Was anyone surprised that Laurel was actually Black Siren from Earth-2? Anyone?
One of the advantages of the amount of crazy shit that goes on in the Arrowverse is that fake-Laurel's story about being rescued by her time travelling sister isn't so far outside the bounds of possibility that it could be dismissed instantly. Also I had mostly forgotten about Black Siren
  #44  
Old 01-27-2017, 04:36 AM
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How does Prometheus know about the Waverider? And Star Labs?

Lexa Doig, cool!

New Black Canary: meh.
  #45  
Old 02-02-2017, 03:47 AM
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Which was the faster crossover, the Supergirl one on The Flash or The Flash on this show? I quite like these mini-crossovers. They help remind us that these shows are part of a wider multiverse. They're also quite reminiscent of the comic books.

Talia's accent seems overly posh. It sounds like she going to open Parliament or knight someone. I don't recall Nyssa being so hoity-toity.
  #46  
Old 02-02-2017, 09:31 AM
Fenris Fenris is offline
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I've lost track. I thought Green Arrow was back on his "No Killing Ever!" kick. So what was with him killing those folks in the helicopter and all the innocent people on the street below?
  #47  
Old 02-02-2017, 01:49 PM
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I really liked this episode, from the blink-and-you'll-miss-it Flash cameo to the "John Wick" styled gunfight sequence in Ollie's flashback.

I like the origin-story for this potential new Canary and how she got her powers. And that her nemesis has powers that are related to hers.

I like Diggle okay, but I just can't bring myself to care about his storyline right now. Is there some IRL reason that the character has been sidelined like this?
  #48  
Old 02-16-2017, 02:57 AM
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I get the feeling the writers are trolling us by giving the new Black Canary the name "Dinah Drake", which was the name of the original, Golden Age Black Canary. So when is she going to put on fishnets and a blonde wig? And then maybe Oliver can grow out his goatee.

Ever since Oliver became the mayor, I always thought the show should show more of him actually being the mayor. They finally did it with this episode, with Mayor Queen confronting the bad guy rather than the Green Arrow shooting him. I'm just not sure that gun control in an American city can be resolved so glibly. Maybe the should have started with a smaller issue, like revitalizing the waterfront or creating a farmer's market.
  #49  
Old 02-16-2017, 12:00 PM
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Hey, they solved the controversial gun control issue by passing some sensible city ordinances (that we don't get to see). Easy peasy!

Please.
  #50  
Old 02-16-2017, 12:03 PM
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I agree. I appreciate that they at least tried to present both sides of the issue, but I hate relevancy and the issue was too quickly dismissed. Especially an issue that boils down to "Gun resgistry: yes/no". This isn't a compromiseable issue. You have a registry or you don't. You can't sorta-kinda-half have one.

Last edited by Fenris; 02-16-2017 at 12:04 PM.
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