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  #1  
Old 10-14-2016, 09:59 AM
Terminus Est Terminus Est is offline
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Legends of Tomorrow Season 2

I guess I'm doing all the CW superhero shows.

This show doesn't waste any time making major plot developments. I'd say it's faster than even The Flash. Less than 10 minutes into the new season, the Legends are already frakking things up. I love it! Damien Darhk was more dynamic and better used in this episode then entire season 4 of Arrow. Then the frakken Reverse Flash shows up?! Finally the whole flippin' Justice Society of America. The writers are really not going to hold anything back, are they?
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  #2  
Old 10-14-2016, 10:23 AM
bordelond bordelond is online now
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Rex Tyler (of the Justice Society of America) showed up at the end of the Season 1 finale, addressing all of the Season 1 Legends sans Captain Cold. Whatever happened to that meeting?

Quote:
The writers are really not going to hold anything back, are they?
Nope -- I like the kitchen-sink approach to the early Arrowverse episodes so far. Though I hope they do find time for some anthology-ish episodes for Legends -- those were the strongest S1 episodes IMHO (e.g. the Jonah Hex Old West episode, the "Lost in the '50s" episode).

Are Hawkman & Hawkgirl meant to be gone for good? Or is that something we can never really say so long as the Waverider can still fires?
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  #3  
Old 10-14-2016, 10:37 AM
Terminus Est Terminus Est is offline
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Originally Posted by bordelond View Post
Rex Tyler (of the Justice Society of America) showed up at the end of the Season 1 finale, addressing all of the Season 1 Legends sans Captain Cold. Whatever happened to that meeting?
Wasn't he part of the JSA crew at the end? In any event, Mick mentioned that Rex had warned them not to travel to 1942. So of course they traveled to 1942.
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  #4  
Old 10-14-2016, 11:24 AM
bordelond bordelond is online now
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.. so long as the Waverider can still fires?
Supposed to say:

... can still fire up.
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  #5  
Old 10-14-2016, 01:36 PM
Fenris Fenris is offline
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Originally Posted by Terminus Est View Post
Wasn't he part of the JSA crew at the end?
I don't think so.

I recall

Commander Steel (probably-it might have been Hourman wearing the horrible '80s version of the costume his son wore. The color was off on my set and I couldn't tell)

Dr. Midnite (who they made black)

Star Girl (because...hey...Geoff Johns is involved)

Some black or Hispanic woman who's probably Fury since Wonder Woman and Black Canary are off the table.

Obsidian (with a very accurate but totally period-inappropriate costume. I mean, it looks great--exactly like the comics, but not for 1942)

And Steel/Commander Steel will be guaranteed to appear since you've got that Heywood guy running around.

I normally don't mind racially diverse casts, I prefer them, but for 1942? I dunno. I'd almost prefer a lilly-white team and have Jackson call them out on it. I'd like to see the mistakes of the past portrayed and dealt with, not just (pardon the pun) whitewashed.

Last edited by Fenris; 10-14-2016 at 01:37 PM..
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  #6  
Old 10-14-2016, 02:03 PM
E-DUB E-DUB is offline
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Not remembering what happened to "Hawkgirl".

But yeah, nice ep.
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  #7  
Old 10-14-2016, 02:15 PM
Happy Scrappy Hero Pup Happy Scrappy Hero Pup is offline
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Originally Posted by Terminus Est View Post
Wasn't he part of the JSA crew at the end?
????

How did I miss this? What did I miss?
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  #8  
Old 10-14-2016, 02:18 PM
The Other Waldo Pepper The Other Waldo Pepper is online now
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Some black or Hispanic woman who's probably Fury since Wonder Woman and Black Canary are off the table.
I heard it was Vixen.
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  #9  
Old 10-14-2016, 07:02 PM
Terminus Est Terminus Est is offline
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Originally Posted by Happy Scrappy Hero Pup View Post
????

How did I miss this? What did I miss?
The JSA accosted the Legends at the end of the episode. It was really impossible to miss.
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  #10  
Old 10-14-2016, 07:16 PM
Cartoonacy Cartoonacy is offline
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The JSA accosted the Legends at the end of the episode. It was really impossible to miss.
Yeah, especially when they said "We're the Justice... Society... of America!"
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  #11  
Old 10-14-2016, 10:30 PM
Terminus Est Terminus Est is offline
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Yeah, especially when they said "We're the Justice... Society... of America!"
Plus all the superhero poses. This season is going to be so full of cheese.
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  #12  
Old 10-14-2016, 10:47 PM
Happy Scrappy Hero Pup Happy Scrappy Hero Pup is offline
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Originally Posted by Terminus Est View Post
The JSA accosted the Legends at the end of the episode. It was really impossible to miss.
Dammit. I was trying to simul-watch it and "The Good Place."

Maybe I'll spring for that DVR after all.
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  #13  
Old 10-14-2016, 10:53 PM
Terminus Est Terminus Est is offline
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The next episode is entitled "The Justice Society of America", so I think you're going to see them again.
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  #14  
Old 10-14-2016, 11:13 PM
simster simster is offline
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Originally Posted by Terminus Est View Post
The next episode is entitled "The Justice Society of America", so I think you're going to see them again.
spoilers!!!!!!!

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  #15  
Old 10-15-2016, 09:41 PM
urban1a urban1a is offline
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What about Rip Hunter. Did he get another gig?

Bob
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  #16  
Old 10-15-2016, 11:34 PM
BeepKillBeep BeepKillBeep is offline
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I didn't like season 1 that much. It was ok, with moments of brilliance, but there was just soooooooo much bad.

I have to admit to being presently surprised by episode 1 of season 2. I really enjoyed it a lot. As stated above, they've hit the ground running and that's exciting.

I miss the hell out of Captain Cold though.
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  #17  
Old 10-21-2016, 09:01 AM
Fenris Fenris is offline
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I enjoyed last night's episode, but at the same time, it felt (culturally) sloppy. I can't believe that as much as I hated the "relevance"* movement in comics, I had some real problems with a JSA that's half "negro" and nobody commenting on it in 1942. They touched on the (especially from our point of view) casual sexism of the time and there was just a split-second when Steel just casually assumed that Doc Stein was the leader because he was the oldest white male that I thought Jax was going to speak up...but no. I don't want an entire episode about it, but this seemed too glossed over. I would have been happier to lose some of the grand-daddy issues for one good interchange between Jax (or Canary) and Steel.

Also, some of the uniforms/hairstyles were way out of place (Vixen(?!) did not have the right look at all for a black woman from 1942. She was smokin' hot, but way out of place. Ditto Stargirl's outfit. It didn't look '40s. Also, her staff should look like metal, not plastic)

All that said, I largely loved the episode. And with Rip gone, I'm enjoying this season a lot more than the last one.



*In the early '70s, there was a push for super heroes to deal with "real-life" issues. It was infrequently done well (the drug issues of Spider-Man) and often done ham-handedly (the O'Neill/Adams Green Lantern/Green Arrow). I hated "relevancy".
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  #18  
Old 10-21-2016, 09:04 AM
BeepKillBeep BeepKillBeep is offline
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Originally Posted by Fenris View Post
And with Rip gone, I'm enjoying this season a lot more than the last one.
Please let him and Hawkgirl be gone for good. They were the source of most of the bad in season 1, in my view anyway.
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  #19  
Old 10-21-2016, 09:16 AM
Fenris Fenris is offline
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Originally Posted by BeepKillBeep View Post
Please let him and Hawkgirl be gone for good. They were the source of most of the bad in season 1, in my view anyway.
I didn't hate Hawkgirl, but I totally hated Hawkman. And more than that I hated the Hawkgirl/Hawkman storyline eating relationship that took over every plotline. I wouldn't mind if they brought her back, as long as he stays dead and gone and there's no angst about it.
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  #20  
Old 10-21-2016, 10:02 AM
Terminus Est Terminus Est is offline
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The Justice Society of America

The first part of the episode was just comedy gold. I was laughing almost continuously from the moment the Legends got their asses handed to them by the JSA to the point where they tried to take on an entire nightclub full of Nazis. Loved Prof. Stein's singing and the Back to the Future reference. Speaking of which, apparently timeline changes on this show work like that movie, which seems different from how the Flash changes the timeline.

Reverse Flash is even more menacing without Barry Allen around to stop him. I literally gasped the both times he appeared. Poor Rex Tyler! What were his powers anyway? I don't think we actually got to see them.
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  #21  
Old 10-21-2016, 10:22 AM
Fenris Fenris is offline
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Originally Posted by Terminus Est View Post
Reverse Flash is even more menacing without Barry Allen around to stop him. I literally gasped the both times he appeared. Poor Rex Tyler! What were his powers anyway? I don't think we actually got to see them.
The powers are the reason they didn't show his powers. Tyler invented a drug called "Miraclo" which gave him super strength, invulnerability, enhanced speed for an hour. However, a hero who pops a pill to get supercharged for one hour isn't...it doesn't really work these days. It's been a problem since the '80s, actually. They've tried other workarounds--a ray that gives him powers for an hour, a patch (like a nicotine patch), etc.

As an aside, Vixen's comments to Atom were A) stupid, and B) really stupid in context. He's not a 'hero', the suit is the hero? Ok, then Stargirl isn't a hero, the Gravity/Stellar Rod is the hero. Hourman isn't a hero, the Miraclo is the hero. Dr. Midnight is just a blind guy. The goggles that let him see in infrared are the hero. Depending on which version of Steel they were using, Steel might not have been the hero, his metal skeleton was the hero. Oh, and um...Vixey? You're not a hero either. The Tantu(?) totem is the hero. Pretty much everyone on the team but Obsidian has powers that aren't naturally generated.
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  #22  
Old 10-21-2016, 10:40 AM
Terminus Est Terminus Est is offline
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Yeah, they even made the point of having Vixen lose her necklace. (Sarah, as usual, was on the ball and realized its significance enough to recover it.) Sure she can still kick ass without it, but Ray still has his mind and technical expertise, and the latter was the thing that initiated their escape in the first place.

I previously forgot to mention the visual effects. Usually they're serviceable, if not downright outstanding, like the Legends vs. JSA fight that started the episode. But Über-Kieger was just really bad CGI.
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  #23  
Old 10-21-2016, 10:52 AM
Reluctant A. Reluctant A. is offline
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Originally Posted by Fenris View Post
I enjoyed last night's episode, but at the same time, it felt (culturally) sloppy. I can't believe that as much as I hated the "relevance"* movement in comics, I had some real problems with a JSA that's half "negro" and nobody commenting on it in 1942. They touched on the (especially from our point of view) casual sexism of the time and there was just a split-second when Steel just casually assumed that Doc Stein was the leader because he was the oldest white male that I thought Jax was going to speak up...but no. I don't want an entire episode about it, but this seemed too glossed over. I would have been happier to lose some of the grand-daddy issues for one good interchange between Jax (or Canary) and Steel.
I noticed it, too, but once it became obvious that they weren't going to talk about it, I stopped thinking about it.
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  #24  
Old 10-22-2016, 01:55 PM
enalzi enalzi is offline
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Anyone notice that they've just gone ahead and started calling themselves "The Legends" with no real build-up? Reminds me on how on on Fringe, they just started calling themselves "Fringe Division" with no formal change.

Also, the episode really pointed out that there's a real lack of superpowers on the team now with Hawkgirl gone. Although I'm guessing the super serum is going to give that guy powers.
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  #25  
Old 10-22-2016, 03:26 PM
The Other Waldo Pepper The Other Waldo Pepper is online now
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Originally Posted by enalzi View Post
Also, the episode really pointed out that there's a real lack of superpowers on the team now with Hawkgirl gone.
Well, only because Stein pretty much spent the episode dickering over possibilities instead of simply Firestorming up.

But let's be honest: the elephant in the room is Ray Palmer. Near as I can tell, every episode should, by rights, involve (a) just sending him to solve the problem du jour, or (b) explaining why he can't just get sent in to solve the problem du jour -- and even then, it has to be a problem the team can't solve by building a plan around him.
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  #26  
Old 10-22-2016, 04:13 PM
enalzi enalzi is offline
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Originally Posted by The Other Waldo Pepper View Post
Well, only because Stein pretty much spent the episode dickering over possibilities instead of simply Firestorming up.
There were way too many episodes last year where Firestorm could have easily beat the bad guys, but Stein and Jackson were split up for some reason.
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  #27  
Old 10-22-2016, 08:06 PM
BeepKillBeep BeepKillBeep is offline
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I enjoyed episode 2 a lot. So far this season looks like it is going to be a blast. It looks like the theme for the season might be them coming together as a team. I like that the show really feels like it is taking place in the larger DC universe what with JSA and Eobard Thawne.
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  #28  
Old 10-23-2016, 12:00 AM
Fenris Fenris is offline
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As an aside, and yes I realize this will never happen, I wish they would stop treating Firestorm as a low-rent Human Torch and give him his actual powers of transmutation. He would be far cooler
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  #29  
Old 10-23-2016, 03:29 PM
Reluctant A. Reluctant A. is offline
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Well, they played with it in the Season 1 finale, when he turned the bomb into water, so there's a reasonable chance that we'll see more of it in Season 2.
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  #30  
Old 10-29-2016, 07:04 PM
Folacin Folacin is offline
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Originally Posted by Fenris View Post
The powers are the reason they didn't show his powers. Tyler invented a drug called "Miraclo" which gave him super strength, invulnerability, enhanced speed for an hour. However, a hero who pops a pill to get supercharged for one hour isn't...it doesn't really work these days. It's been a problem since the '80s, actually. They've tried other workarounds--a ray that gives him powers for an hour, a patch (like a nicotine patch), etc.
So, he's Underdog!
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Originally Posted by Underdog
The secret compartment of my ring I fill, with an Underdog super energy pill.
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  #31  
Old 10-30-2016, 10:11 AM
Alessan Alessan is offline
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Good God, Caity Lotz is amazing.
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  #32  
Old 10-30-2016, 02:11 PM
D_Odds D_Odds is offline
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Good God, Caity Lotz is amazing.
You and I must be watching her in different shows. Both Lance sisters make me (made me?) cringe. The only times they were good is when they were in scenes with Thea Oliver, but that is only in comparison.
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  #33  
Old 10-30-2016, 06:29 PM
Alessan Alessan is offline
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Personally, I think her acting is pretty good, and definitely better than it used to be, but I was actually referring to her action scene prowess. Did you catch that mid-fight flip she pulled off? That was no stunt double.

Besides, maybe it's just me, but the sight of a woman wielding dual katanas really does something to my chakras. I mean, whoa.
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  #34  
Old 10-30-2016, 06:57 PM
The Other Waldo Pepper The Other Waldo Pepper is online now
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Personally, I think her acting is pretty good, and definitely better than it used to be, but I was actually referring to her action scene prowess. Did you catch that mid-fight flip she pulled off? That was no stunt double.

Besides, maybe it's just me, but the sight of a woman wielding dual katanas really does something to my chakras. I mean, whoa.
Huh. So you're saying I'd have seen someone else, if I'd looked away from Vixen?
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  #35  
Old 10-30-2016, 08:04 PM
levdrakon levdrakon is online now
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I think she looks and acts stoned and drunk, although she was better in this ep and she makes a better team leader than old guy.
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  #36  
Old 10-30-2016, 10:09 PM
D_Odds D_Odds is offline
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Originally Posted by Alessan View Post
Personally, I think her acting is pretty good, and definitely better than it used to be, but I was actually referring to her action scene prowess. Did you catch that mid-fight flip she pulled off? That was no stunt double.

Besides, maybe it's just me, but the sight of a woman wielding dual katanas really does something to my chakras. I mean, whoa.
Wow, we really are watching different shows called Legends of Tomorrow. She's improving, slightly, but I find her fight scenes wholly unconvincing. Again, not as bad as Thea, and about on par with Laurel. The only female fighter whose action fighting stood out to me was Kelly Hu/China White (and, despite being ~20+ years older than Thea/Sara/Laurel, was significantly more attractive to me). There are probably others I've forgotten...there are likely others I've forgotten, as I can't remember any of the Huntress scenes off the top of my head...but the 3 main heroines have been poor both in acting and action. Obviously, YMMV, but I'm driving the brand-spanking new Tesla and you're in a 1985 Dodge Diplomat.

Last edited by D_Odds; 10-30-2016 at 10:10 PM.. Reason: Punctuation
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  #37  
Old 10-31-2016, 01:04 AM
Terminus Est Terminus Est is offline
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I previously had questions about Caity Lotz's acting ability. But, last season, when she acted opposite herself - playing the confused teenager vs the self-assured assassin - that erased all doubts. She may not win any Emmy awards, but she's a competent enough actress. Something about her diction doesn't sit right with me, but that's just the way she talks. I mainly her for the fights anyway. Plus she looks great whatever costume she's wearing in whatever time period.
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  #38  
Old 11-04-2016, 11:02 AM
Terminus Est Terminus Est is offline
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S02E04: Abominations

This episode is probably the closest this series will ever come to hard-hitting social commentary. Just like Nazis are an easy villain to hate, slavers are easy to hate. Also, no one is going to mind immolating or exploding Confederate zombies because, hey, they're not only Confederates but zombies to boot. Still, I have to commend the writers for giving us not only this portrayal of the horrors of slavery in America, but also a claustrophobic horror flick as well as a history lesson with Ulysses S. Grant.

BTW, whatever happened to Zombie 0? You know, the time pirate who crash landed and started the whole zombie apocalypse. Did they just forget about him and leave him behind to start a new horror show?
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  #39  
Old 11-05-2016, 11:26 AM
levdrakon levdrakon is online now
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Without his suit, he's a nobody, but give him a freeze gun and suddenly he's a super hero again. Meh. Palmer's on a futuristic time ship and he's a genius inventor so let him cobble together something new.

Good question about zombie zero, and just torching the escape pod wouldn't keep the timeline safe, I wouldn't think. Someone could still find it, dismantle it and figure out some future tech they shouldn't have.

Also, let's not forget that Mick became a trained time agent, didn't he? I'd like him to display some of that knowledge and training once in awhile instead of always being the dumb guy.
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  #40  
Old 11-10-2016, 10:37 AM
enalzi enalzi is offline
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Without his suit, he's a nobody, but give him a freeze gun and suddenly he's a super hero again. Meh. Palmer's on a futuristic time ship and he's a genius inventor so let him cobble together something new.
Also, the whole "It took me years to build that suit blah blah blah" doesn't really matter when you're on a time machine. Get dropped off somewhere in the future where you can build it even faster, and everyone else jumps forward to when the work is done.
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  #41  
Old 11-11-2016, 10:47 AM
Terminus Est Terminus Est is offline
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S02E05: Compromised

I said it before and I'll say it again: Reverse Flash is fucking scary without another speedster around to stop him. When RF spirited Dahrk away from his confrontation with Sarah, I felt like Diggle when he sees the Flash, "Dude is fast!"

Somewhere on the Internet, there has to be a Legends fuckup counter, which was off the charts this episode. Ray breaking Mick's bottles. Ray stealing Reagan's jellybeans. Ray crossing the streams. Nathan knocking out an old man. Sarah trying to kill Dahrk. Firestorm flying through the White House. Even when they aren't Legends yet, their younger selves can still fuck things up by, say, walking into a clandestine exchange between the Big Bad and a Soviet spy.

When Firestorm stopped that hail of bullets flying at him, was that just from the heat (Firestarter-style) or was that a previously unseen ability?
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  #42  
Old 11-11-2016, 11:52 AM
The Other Waldo Pepper The Other Waldo Pepper is online now
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Originally Posted by Terminus Est View Post
Somewhere on the Internet, there has to be a Legends fuckup counter, which was off the charts this episode. Ray breaking Mick's bottles. Ray stealing Reagan's jellybeans. Ray crossing the streams. Nathan knocking out an old man. Sarah trying to kill Dahrk. Firestorm flying through the White House. Even when they aren't Legends yet, their younger selves can still fuck things up by, say, walking into a clandestine exchange between the Big Bad and a Soviet spy.
Obsidian presumably wouldn't have gotten shot, if Vixen had just stayed out of it.
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  #43  
Old 11-11-2016, 05:32 PM
Dendarii Dame Dendarii Dame is online now
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A jar of jellybeans that big was presumably intended for more than one person.
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  #44  
Old 11-11-2016, 07:04 PM
cochrane cochrane is online now
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Originally Posted by Dendarii Dame View Post
A jar of jellybeans that big was presumably intended for more than one person.
Did Haig like jellybeans?
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  #45  
Old 11-11-2016, 08:03 PM
D_Odds D_Odds is offline
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Regarding Ray Palmer, hopefully this is leading to him really becoming the Atom and not a 3rd rate Iron Man. Other than the shrinking, which he rarely used, that armor would have fared poorly even against the Beetle.
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  #46  
Old 11-11-2016, 10:09 PM
levdrakon levdrakon is online now
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Pretty good ep. I have to laugh out loud whenever they say "we can't change history!" Here we go again.

What are Obsidian's powers exactly? Nice of them to stick a little social justice message in there, but it was almost blink and you miss it. Not the full treatment the slavery story got.
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  #47  
Old 11-12-2016, 01:11 AM
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Martin: "You're not thinking fourth-dimensionally!"

Ray: "Did you just go Doc Brown on me?"

Martin: "Who the hell is that?"

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  #48  
Old 11-18-2016, 09:18 AM
Terminus Est Terminus Est is offline
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S02E06: Outlaw Country

I was all set to again list all the fuckups the Legends committed this week, but there were surprisingly very few:
  • Nate charging without adequate planning into the posse to rescue Jonah Hex was arguably a fuckup, but that seemed to work out well.
  • Mick not starting a fight with Turnbull.
  • Hex simply barging into the saloon to arrest Turnbull was a definite fuckup, but then Hex isn't actually a Legend.
  • Mick going berserk and running out of bullets.
  • Nate stepping in front of a dwarf star bullet was possibly a fuckup, but he probably didn't know it was dwarf star material and and he definitely saved Mick's life.
Sara is sitting in the Captain's chair really well. She comes up with a plan and the Legends implement it, more or less, without a lot of dithering about. She says, "Jump!" They ask, "How high?" It's great!
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  #49  
Old 11-18-2016, 09:31 AM
holmes holmes is offline
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Stein's visions?

So do we think Stein's alternative timestream is due to something they did (the legends), or an effect of the flashpoint? Perhaps this is part of what ties the crossover together?
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  #50  
Old 11-18-2016, 09:55 AM
Terminus Est Terminus Est is offline
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So do we think Stein's alternative timestream is due to something they did (the legends), or an effect of the flashpoint? Perhaps this is part of what ties the crossover together?
I'd put money on the visions being a consequence of Stein interacting with his younger self. A Steinpoint, if you will. I'm guessing that the young woman is actually Stein's heretofore non-existent daughter.
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