Is bank robbing slowly dying out?

[griffon502]

The technology favors the bank, and the bank can easily afford these technology compared to bank robbers. We live in an eletronic age now. Even if the robbers are successful, it would be more difficult to use the cash. Banks deploy various techniques such as explosive balls filled with balls of unwashable paints, gps tracking of the trash, digital regisration of the cash etc. it seems to me bank robbing is now too high-risk and low-return and considering the punishment is still severe it just doesn't seem worth it any more. So the question is, has bank robbing reached a point in modern days that it is slowly dying out as a criminal profession? Any statistics on that proving this point?

[Krokodil]

I forget where I read this--it might have been the Straight Dope column--but few bank robbers clear more than about $30K/year, which is less than I've made most of my adult life. Once it loses the "easy money" allure, yeah, it's going the way of stagecoach robberies. Drugstores that sell the makings of crystal meth might be more bang for the buck, effort- and risk-wise.

[Senegoid]

Originally Posted by griffon502

Banks deploy various techniques such as explosive balls filled with balls of unwashable paints . . .

What tools do the female tellers get?

[Loach]

Here are the FBI reports on bank crime for the last few years. Bottom line, 5-6,000 bank robberies a year. Its not going away.

[ClevelandProud]

Here in Cleveland, Ohio there is a major bank that uses a set of double doors at one of their branches.

As a customer, you first have to press a buzzer that lets a banker know someone wants to enter the bank.

Then, you have to wait for the second door to be unclocked.

Otherwise, you are caught between a set of locked doors.

I am thinking that a potential bank robber sees that and they will set their sights on another bank to rob.

[IceQube]

Originally Posted by ClevelandProud

Here in Cleveland, Ohio there is a major bank that uses a set of double doors at one of their branches.

As a customer, you first have to press a buzzer that lets a banker know someone wants to enter the bank.

Then, you have to wait for the second door to be unclocked.

Otherwise, you are caught between a set of locked doors.

That sounds like every bank in my area. Even the small ones.

[Der Trihs]

Originally Posted by ClevelandProud

I am thinking that a potential bank robber sees that and they will set their sights on another bank to rob.

Possibly. However, these days the criminals who rob banks tend to be the stupider ones, so they might not.

[mhendo]

The Geezer Bandit appeared on the local news quite frequently here in San Diego from late 2009 through late 2011. He's robbed at least 16 banks, and hasn't been caught yet.

[aceplace57]

We have a few bank robberies every year. Usually the local news will report an arrest a few days later. It doesn't seem like they get away with it very often.

Instead, we're now getting even more disturbing robberies at restaurants. They rob the customers and the business. We had a bunch of those type robberies last year. They were in a nice part of town too. Pretty sure the same guys were doing it. They were finally caught. I don't recall the details.

[Vicullum]

Here's an interesting blog post where someone breaks down the numbers.

"Here, the FBI combines 5,014 robberies, 60 burglaries and 12 larcenies into its total of 5,086 bank crimes in the U.S. for 2011.

The total amount of cash that offenders stole from banks in 2011 was $38,331,491.85. For the total of all 5,086 bank crimes, the average take per crime was $7,536.67.

Of these 5,086 bank crimes, 4,534 resulted in the offenders making off with loot, or 89.2% of the total. "

Over 7 grand with a 90% success rate, per heist. I don't think bank robbery is going away any time soon.

[griffon502]

Originally Posted by Vicullum

Here's an interesting blog post where someone breaks down the numbers.

"Here, the FBI combines 5,014 robberies, 60 burglaries and 12 larcenies into its total of 5,086 bank crimes in the U.S. for 2011.

The total amount of cash that offenders stole from banks in 2011 was $38,331,491.85. For the total of all 5,086 bank crimes, the average take per crime was $7,536.67.

Of these 5,086 bank crimes, 4,534 resulted in the offenders making off with loot, or 89.2% of the total. "

Over 7 grand with a 90% success rate, per heist. I don't think bank robbery is going away any time soon.

That is NOT a"sucess rate". The 89.2% is about they taking away the cash, not about not being caught. A criminal taking money then get caught 1 hour later by the police would still be regarded as "making off with loot", does this sound "successful" to you?

In fact, your stats prove that bank robberies are in decline, i mean, $7000 on average? Compared with how many years they gonna have to serve it's totally pathetic. They are better off washing dishes in a restaurant and earning the $7000 legally instead of spending like 10 years and restricted freedom in a prison for $7000 robbery. I think i agree with the poster that today's bank robbers are dumb-asses.

[Senegoid]

Originally Posted by ClevelandProud

Here in Cleveland, Ohio there is a major bank that uses a set of double doors at one of their branches.
As a customer, you first have to press a buzzer that lets a banker know someone wants to enter the bank.
Then, you have to wait for the second door to be unclocked.
Otherwise, you are caught between a set of locked doors.
I am thinking that a potential bank robber sees that and they will set their sights on another bank to rob.

I wonder if the bank also has to balance that with how their bona fide customers will react.

I am thinking that a potential customer sees that and they will set their sights on another bank to do business with.

A certain bank in my city (as of several years ago) re-modeled to be like that. (You also got momentarily locked between the doors on the way out, too.) I promptly took my business just a few miles down the same street to another branch of the same bank that didn't do that.

ETA: I suppose I could name the bank, since they aren't around any more. It was WaMu.

[Xema]

Originally Posted by Senegoid

I promptly took my business just a few miles down the same street...

Seems as if it would be reasonably easy for the double set of doors to both remain unlocked - and thus untroubling to normal customers - except in a case where a robbery is in progress. When the "silent alarm" button has been pressed by a teller, outer doors lock immediately and inner doors lock as soon as someone makes contact (from the inside) with the outer doors.

[Baracus]

Originally Posted by Xema

Seems as if it would be reasonably easy for the double set of doors to both remain unlocked - and thus untroubling to normal customers - except in a case where a robbery is in progress. When the "silent alarm" button has been pressed by a teller, outer doors lock immediately and inner doors lock as soon as someone makes contact (from the inside) with the outer doors.

If the robber(s) notices the outer doors are locked before the inner ones close, you may turn a simple bank robbery into a hostage situation.

[MichaelEmouse]

I have a vague memory of reading that bank robbers are split into two categories. The organized and non-organized ones.

The organized ones often have guns, several people and some planning. They have a higher success rate and take off with more money.

The non-organized ones are mainly spur of the moment robberies done by lone addicts, often without guns, in need of a quick source of money to get their fix. It's just one step up robbing a convenience store.

I can see how the organized group could make a calculated decision concerning the amount of money, preparation required and risk and come to the conclusion that it isn't worth it anymore.

Junkies, on the other hand, aren't great at planning and calculating which risks are worth taking.

[Ferret Herder]

Originally Posted by ClevelandProud

Here in Cleveland, Ohio there is a major bank that uses a set of double doors at one of their branches.

As a customer, you first have to press a buzzer that lets a banker know someone wants to enter the bank.

Then, you have to wait for the second door to be unclocked.

Otherwise, you are caught between a set of locked doors.

I am thinking that a potential bank robber sees that and they will set their sights on another bank to rob.

Judging by news reports here in Chicago, it seems like some popular banks to rob are those bank branches located inside supermarkets. They lack those security features.

[kayaker]

Originally Posted by Der Trihs

However, these days the criminals who rob banks tend to be the stupider ones, so they might not.

A friend of mine is a bank teller. She was involved in a hold up. Years later she was involved in a second hold up by the same guy, wearing the same clothes. The second hold up was the day he was released from prison, wearing the same outfit he was in when arrested the first time.

[Vicullum]

Originally Posted by griffon502

That is NOT a"sucess rate". The 89.2% is about they taking away the cash, not about not being caught. A criminal taking money then get caught 1 hour later by the police would still be regarded as "making off with loot", does this sound "successful" to you?

I call it a success rate because that's the percentage that successfully committed a bank robbery. Getting away with it is a different matter. I don't disagree that bank robbery is a poor career choice where the risks outweigh the rewards.

[MichaelEmouse]

Originally Posted by kayaker

A friend of mine is a bank teller. She was involved in a hold up. Years later she was involved in a second hold up by the same guy, wearing the same clothes. The second hold up was the day he was released from prison, wearing the same outfit he was in when arrested the first time.

The bank will never expect it!

The cops will never suspect it!

The jury will reasonably doubt it!

Reverse psychology shall forever be my one and only master plan.

[aceplace57]

One kind of Bank robbery has been eliminated. Well, almost entirely.

That is breaking into the bank after hours. Either by tunneling or breaking through a wall from an adjoining business. The modern vaults with time release locks these days makes that nearly impossible.

I can't recall an after hours robbery (excluding ATM's ripped out of walls) in the U.S. in decades. Europe had one maybe 10 years ago where the thieves targeted the safety deposit boxes.

I recall a local story about an stolen ATM. The guy used a stolen piece of construction equip (backhoe, or something like that) to rip the ATM out of the wall. Cops found him and the ATM a few days later. The guy had tried everything and hadn't busted it open.

[clairobscur]

Originally Posted by ClevelandProud

I am thinking that a potential bank robber sees that and they will set their sights on another bank to rob.

All banks over here use this system. Still, there are armed bank robberies on occasion. That said, when I read a Paris local paper that report this kind of things, I'm puzzled at how little these people are robbing, considering the risks.

In fact, I'm generally puzzled by most local reports of crimes. Very occasionnally, I read about a smart crime (a freight car worth of designer clothes worth millions stolen) but it's immediately followed by the idiotic manager of a post office organizing with several accomplices the robbery of her own agency for a grand total of some dozen thousands euros (so, she didn't even have the excuse of not knowing of much money there was, she lost a secure, lifelong job probably correctly paid, and of course is going to jail over what, once shared with the accomplices, probably amounts to some months of her salary).


My LEO brother says that most criminals are idiots, including heinous ones (a murderer leaving his parking ticket with his name and adress on the crime scene, or letting in officers without a warrant when blood-covered cloths are spilled around his place, a guy killing his son's friend for € 1500 worth of pot and the whole thing being figured out by the enquiries of.....the victim's *15 yo friends*, before the body was even found).

[jtgain]

I assumed that banks would be easier to rob in this day and time with the "no resistance" policy. Slide a note to the teller stating that she is being robbed, fill up a sack with cash, and then leave. The teller is instructed to comply.

And now the robber, if caught, doesn't get an "armed" robbery charge.

If Jesse James handed a bank teller a note, the bank teller would have laughed and pulled a shotgun on him.

[pravnik]

Bank robbery is still a fairly popular criminal pastime. In the Houston metro area there were over 50 bank robberies by June this year, around a 50% increase over last year. One day there were three in a 90 minute period.

[md2000]

Originally Posted by kayaker

A friend of mine is a bank teller. She was involved in a hold up. Years later she was involved in a second hold up by the same guy, wearing the same clothes. The second hold up was the day he was released from prison, wearing the same outfit he was in when arrested the first time.

Originally Posted by MichaelEmouse

The bank will never expect it!

The cops will never suspect it!

The jury will reasonably doubt it!

Reverse psychology shall forever be my one and only master plan.

The "do you really think I'm that stupid??" defence. Be careful what you ask...

The explanation was that people rob banks "because that's where the money is". If it is easier to raid an establishment, hold up a whole bunch of people and then bugger off - then crooks will start doing that. I've seen the trend that one easy business after another is targetted - self serve gas stations, convenience stores, video rental stores, drugstores,liquor stores, cabbies, etc. As each business realizes the risk and hardens up, the crooks move on to another.

The danger of robbing a well-populated establishment, there's always the risk of someone who wants to fight; see the recent news footage of the 70yo pulling a gun and chasing some thieves in an internet cafe. (The scary thing is, there were bullets flying all over, and the only hit appears to be one thief in the butt... If you're going to shoot - aim.) Or watch the Pulp Fiction restaurant moment. The more people, the harder it is to control. Late night alone places are easiest, I suppose.

Between bank cards, credit cards, and time-lock safes, there's less actual cash in most businesses. The great thing about a bank is they have lots of cash, on purpose; and they tell the staff not to fight back but cooperate quietly. After all, in a place that makes millions a month, a $7,000 loss is a lot cheaper than even the worker's comp claim they might otherwise have to pay. Leave it to the police to chase the thieves.

[Rhaegar]

People still rob banks, they just do it electronically now.

[Rysto]

Originally Posted by kayaker

A friend of mine is a bank teller. She was involved in a hold up. Years later she was involved in a second hold up by the same guy, wearing the same clothes. The second hold up was the day he was released from prison, wearing the same outfit he was in when arrested the first time.

Maybe he saw the movie "Double Jeopardy" while in prison?

[Yllaria]

Originally Posted by kayaker

A friend of mine is a bank teller. She was involved in a hold up. Years later she was involved in a second hold up by the same guy, wearing the same clothes. The second hold up was the day he was released from prison, wearing the same outfit he was in when arrested the first time.

Was in a carpool, once, with a guy who did bank admin. He told a story about a robber who robbed a bank after failing to rob a donut store. Despite the gun, the donut store owner had told him to go to hell.

The guy probably would have been okay grabbing a big pink box of donuts off of the counter in pique, if he hadn't kept carrying it through the bank robbery and after. It was kind of hard to miss.

He was walking down the street, still holding the box, when the call went out about the attempted store robbery. A patrol car spotted him and the cops were having a little chat with him when the call came out about the bank robbery. There was no word on whether or not he had at least gotten to eat a donut.

[Xema]

Originally Posted by Baracus

If the robber(s) notices the outer doors are locked before the inner ones close, you may turn a simple bank robbery into a hostage situation.

It would be reasonably easy to make this unlikely/impossible.

[BigT]

Originally Posted by Rhaegar

People still rob banks, they just do it electronically now.

Well, robbery needs force or fear, which is much harder to do when you aren't there in person.

[t-bonham@scc.net]

Originally Posted by jtgain

I assumed that banks would be easier to rob in this day and time with the "no resistance" policy. Slide a note to the teller stating that she is being robbed, fill up a sack with cash, and then leave. The teller is instructed to comply.

And now the robber, if caught, doesn't get an "armed" robbery charge.

Are you sure?

I thought that in most states, the threat of a gun or displaying a fake gun was sufficient to get an 'armed robbery' charge.

[Bosstone]

Originally Posted by t-bonham@scc.net

Are you sure?

I thought that in most states, the threat of a gun or displaying a fake gun was sufficient to get an 'armed robbery' charge.

jtgain didn't say anything about a gun.

[Elendil's Heir]

Originally Posted by aceplace57

...we're now getting even more disturbing robberies at restaurants. They rob the customers and the business. We had a bunch of those type robberies last year. They were in a nice part of town too. Pretty sure the same guys were doing it. They were finally caught. I don't recall the details.

Maybe they saw Pulp Fiction.

The first bank robbery to ever be filmed was in Cleveland - this story was just in our local paper: http://www.cleveland.com/metro/index...y_was_fir.html

[bup]

According to these stats (7 years out of date), bank robberies are about flat, and rise and fall in line with other crimes, mostly as a function of the economy.

That's the best I can find, although I'd like to find stuff that shows they are slowly ebbing. I can't imagine 30 years from now it'll still be going on - who'll have cash?

[Acsenray]

Originally Posted by aceplace57

One kind of Bank robbery has been eliminated. Well, almost entirely.

That is breaking into the bank after hours. Either by tunneling or breaking through a wall from an adjoining business. The modern vaults with time release locks these days makes that nearly impossible.

I can't recall an after hours robbery (excluding ATM's ripped out of walls) in the U.S. in decades. Europe had one maybe 10 years ago where the thieves targeted the safety deposit boxes.

That would be burglary, not robbery. "Robbery" means that force was used to coerce a person. If you're just breaking into a building where there are no people and stealing, that's "burglary."

[electronbee]

Originally Posted by griffon502

That is NOT a"sucess rate". The 89.2% is about they taking away the cash, not about not being caught. A criminal taking money then get caught 1 hour later by the police would still be regarded as "making off with loot", does this sound "successful" to you?

In fact, your stats prove that bank robberies are in decline, i mean, $7000 on average? Compared with how many years they gonna have to serve it's totally pathetic. They are better off washing dishes in a restaurant and earning the $7000 legally instead of spending like 10 years and restricted freedom in a prison for $7000 robbery. I think i agree with the poster that today's bank robbers are dumb-asses.

Going by that FBI page, a clarification has to be made. 89% of the crimes involved something being taken. So, that's not really a success rate nor does it allude to one. However, as one reads further, 20% of the loot was recovered, partially or in full. But, wait, there's more! 54% of the perp's were identified! That pushes the success rate down to 46%.

6088 people were involved, 54% identified. Let's assume, they were ID'd and then caught. That leaves 2825 people at large with the remaining 80% of the loot which is $30,674,801.57. Divide that by 2825, and you have a per capita take home of $10,858.34. So, a 46% chance of success, for $10k. If you fail, 10 years of prison. Not really worth it. I mean, you can drive around and pick things up via Craigslist for free and sell them and make that, if not more, legally.

What's interesting though, is that of the ID'd people, 37% were narcotics users, 18% had priors. So, that leaves 46% (?!) of people who are not drug users and have no priors. Weird. Of the original group of 46% who got away, as in never ID'd, that sounds like an "organized" crime to me.

[kayaker]

Bank Robbery, A Dying Art.

[Mr. Slant]

Originally Posted by MichaelEmouse

I have a vague memory of reading that bank robbers are split into two categories. The organized and non-organized ones.
SNIP

I used to have a job that involved looking at video surveillance from bank robberies.
I would get to see police, bank and new reports of these robberies.
This would have been US banks, mostly in southern states, and in the decade from 2000 to 2010.
It seemed like the hauls clustered around idiots who only got $700 and real pros who scored $7000.
I'm not doubting the FBI stats quoted before; perhaps the banks (or the criminals victimizing them) I was employed by were atypical in some fashion.

[Rigamarole]

Originally Posted by kayaker

Bank Robbery, A Dying Art.

Indeed. I miss the good old days of bank robbery, when all it took was a pistol and some chutzpah. Nowadays, you practically need to have a PhD to get through all the security systems and whatnot.

[Elendil's Heir]

Butch Cassidy: What happened to the old bank? It was beautiful.
Guard: People kept robbing it.
Butch Cassidy: Small price to pay for beauty.

[Fotheringay-Phipps]

I think the old type of bank robbery is pretty much dead - or at least close enough to it that I don't recall hearing of any instances in recent years. And by that I mean where some guys with guns come in and force the bank employees to open the safe/vault and give them all the money in the bank.

What you have nowadays is people robbing individual tellers of a few hundred dollars, or maybe a few thousand. That's not the same thing.

[Mr. Slant]

Well, if that is your definition, then bank robbery ended with the invention of vault doors that had time-delayed locks.
That was quite some time ago.

[aldiboronti]

Only the dumb robbers try to physically take the cash from the bank these days. The clever ones can siphon millions of dollars from a bank in New York from thousands of miles away in Russia in the blink of an eye. Times have changed and the art of bank robbery has changed with them.

[Fotheringay-Phipps]

Originally Posted by Mr. Slant

Well, if that is your definition, then bank robbery ended with the invention of vault doors that had time-delayed locks.
That was quite some time ago.

When was that? And crucially, did any of the celebrated big-time bank robbers post-date that invention?

(Most recent big-time bank-robber I can remember was Willie Sutton.)