Anyone watch "Johnny Carson" on PBS American Masters?

[Beware of Doug]

Originally Posted by Eve

Well, no. Not all of us do that.

You may be the exception that proves the rule (if you believe an exception proves a rule).

[Esox Lucius]

Originally Posted by aceplace57

Johnny was a very complicated and private guy. He obviously was strongly influenced by a mother that never seemed to acknowledge or praise anything he ever did. Having a cold & remote mom like that would effect any kid growing up.

Apparently, he was the same with his own kids, even though he cared for them (judging by his reaction when one of them was killed in a car accident). He just didn't have the ability to express it to them, which is a special kind of tragedy all its own.

[Voyager]

Originally Posted by Zeldar

I always thought -- still do -- that that was a planned thing. All of it. If you get a chance to see it again, notice how rigged it looks.

Definitely rigged. The Rickles show was CPO Sharkey, and especially back in those days you didn't drag cameras down the hall with no warning. I suspect it was part fun, part respect for Rickles, and part plugging Rickles' show which needed plugging.
I watched it, loving the guy, but it wasn't very good.

[Voyager]

Originally Posted by StusBlues

I really need to see this.

Some of my favorite Carson shows were when he got serious. He burned Uri Geller badly one night, making it very obvious that the supposed "psychic" was a bottom-feeding fraud; sadly, this gained little traction with the general public.

Besides this, he did a lot for science education having people like Carl Sagan on. He was interested in astronomy and never did the "poor old stupid me" bit. Colbert has scientist on, but Carson was a pioneer. He always seemed like a very smart guy to me.

[Leaffan]

Originally Posted by Leaffan

Hmmm.... Won't play, but I don't know if that's a work firewall or a Country issue.

"The selected item is not currently available."

Followed by:

"We are experiencing technical difficulties that prevent us from playing the video at this time. Please check back again soon."

I'm still not sure if it's a country-related issue, which, if it is, pisses me off since I have contributed to PBS in the past. (Sending moolah, I mean.)

[cochrane]

I missed this, but fortunately PBS is rerunning it on Sunday, so I set my DVR and can't wait to see it. I loved Johnny and as David Letterman said when he died, "Johnny was the true King of late night. All the rest of us are pretenders to the crown." The Monday after Johnny passed, Jay Leno had Ed McMahon and Bob Newhart as his guests on the Tonight Show and they spent the whole show paying tribute to Johnny.

[Sampiro]

Originally Posted by Voyager

Besides this, he did a lot for science education having people like Carl Sagan on. He was interested in astronomy and never did the "poor old stupid me" bit. Colbert has scientist on, but Carson was a pioneer. He always seemed like a very smart guy to me.

Sagan gave Carson shout-outs in a couple of his books; he respected him both as a supporter of the sciences and a very well informed amateur astronomer. Though he did say he got tired of the "BILLIONS and BILLIONS" imitation of him that people did which was actually an imitation of Carson imitating Sagan (so, very meta).

Jon Stewart is as close as any hosts come to Carson today imho in terms of making the guest look good, effortless humor, and obvious intelligence. Though because he's so political he's obviously not that close. Carson never pandered and while I'm sure he had strong political views I have no idea what they were, which is the way it should be. (To my knowledge Leno keeps his views to himself, but I can't imagine they're that informed as he sees primarily completely self absorbed, while Letterman just seems like he wishes all these kids would go the hell home so he can get some sleep.)

[Robot Arm]

Originally Posted by Sampiro

Trivia:

He hated prop comics. When Gallagher was the Number 1 comedian in the country he was only on The Tonight Show on nights Johnny wasn't. When his agents tried to get him on with Johnny, promising "he'll do straight stand-up, no props", Johnny still said no.

Is that true? Gallagher's fast-talking huckster for the Sledge-O-Matic isn't a million miles away from Carson's fast-talking huckster Art Fern ("keep driving until you get to the fork in the road!", with a map showing a huge fork). And I remember Carson having props on the show, upcoming Christmas toys, and such.

The film The Aristocrats was dedicated to him as well because, per the producers, that was apparently his favorite joke.

One review I read said it was a shame that Buddy Hackett didn't get to be in the movie. I've seen some old Hackett clips from The Tonight Show. He could have killed with that joke.

[Zeldar]

Originally Posted by cochrane

I missed this, but fortunately PBS is rerunning it on Sunday, so I set my DVR and can't wait to see it. I loved Johnny and as David Letterman said when he died, "Johnny was the true King of late night. All the rest of us are pretenders to the crown." The Monday after Johnny passed, Jay Leno had Ed McMahon and Bob Newhart as his guests on the Tonight Show and they spent the whole show paying tribute to Johnny.

It may have been that same show but on one tribute program Doc (and I believe Tommy Newsom) played "Here's That Rainy Day" and mentioned that it was Johnny's favorite. It was so moving to hear Johnny playing guitar and singing it in the PBS programs. Tears flowed.

[Sampiro]

Originally Posted by Robot Arm

Is that true? Gallagher's fast-talking huckster for the Sledge-O-Matic isn't a million miles away from Carson's fast-talking huckster Art Fern ("keep driving until you get to the fork in the road!", with a map showing a huge fork). And I remember Carson having props on the show, upcoming Christmas toys, and such.

Well, per Gallagher it is, but then it might just be Carson couldn't stand Gallagher and Gal prefers to say it's prop comics.

One of my favorite Carson moments was when he decided to just say what he was thinking to Dolly Parton.

[Hippy Hollow]

My son is four years old, and I occasionally throw on some YouTube clips for nostalgia. He knows Iron Eyes Cody and the Maize... You call it corn Mazola ad. I put on some Tonight Show clips and now if he hears the tune, he says, "Here's Johnny!" very McMahon-like.

I'm pretty proud of that.

I DVR American Experience (what a great series!). Can't wait to see this one.

[Sampiro]

One of the student workers at the library where I worked when Johnny Carson died asked me "Who exactly was he?", which seemed to me about like asking "Who was this Ronald Reagan guy they keep mentioning?", but it's explicable considering this kid would have been in first grade or so when Johnny left the air. Now there's a generation of college students who weren't born when he retired.

Johnny's last appearance on TV- a walk on cameo on the David Letterman Show. I would guess that Jay Leno went down a hallway pulling out heart plugs the next day.

[Llama Llogophile]

The PBS show was excellent. I used to be in the entertainment business and know several of comedians who made it onto the Tonight Show. When asked what the experience was like, one of them said, "I was all there. You do your act long enough and you sometimes do it on autopilot. But that night it had my full attention. I mean, that was Johnny Carson over there watching me!"

[Voyager]

Originally Posted by Sampiro

Sagan gave Carson shout-outs in a couple of his books; he respected him both as a supporter of the sciences and a very well informed amateur astronomer. Though he did say he got tired of the "BILLIONS and BILLIONS" imitation of him that people did which was actually an imitation of Carson imitating Sagan (so, very meta).

I suspect that Carson doing Sagan sold a lot of books. I saw them, it was definitely a compliment.

Carson never pandered and while I'm sure he had strong political views I have no idea what they were, which is the way it should be. (To my knowledge Leno keeps his views to himself, but I can't imagine they're that informed as he sees primarily completely self absorbed, while Letterman just seems like he wishes all these kids would go the hell home so he can get some sleep.)

Carson covered this in his Playboy interview. He said he didn't feel it was his place to say on camera "we should get the hell out of Vietnam." (Not an exact quote, but close I think.) Stewart's whole show is political, so it is different. Though Stewart makes a tremendous effort to read and understand the books (second only to Teri Gross) I don't think he is comfortable enough with science to do as good a job as Carson did.

[Kimballkid]

Originally Posted by Sampiro

Ed McMahon was interviewed a lot when Johnny died, and I think people were surprised to learn that they really weren't that close. He said they had spoken on the phone several times but hardly ever saw each other. They were basically co-workers.

That's not what the PBS special said. They pretty much said that Ed and Johnny went out all the time and when Johnny got drunk and belligerent, Ed was the one who diffused the situations.

[Marley23]

Originally Posted by Sampiro

Ed McMahon was interviewed a lot when Johnny died, and I think people were surprised to learn that they really weren't that close. He said they had spoken on the phone several times but hardly ever saw each other. They were basically co-workers.

Originally Posted by Kimballkid

That's not what the PBS special said. They pretty much said that Ed and Johnny went out all the time and when Johnny got drunk and belligerent, Ed was the one who diffused the situations.

The special implied they spent less and less non-work time together as the years went on. One of the themes of the program was that over time Johnny withdrew into a smaller and smaller world.

[AuntiePam]

I read some of those interviews, about Ed and Johnny not being close. Maybe it's somewhere in the middle -- they didn't really like each other, but hung out because Johnny felt comfortable with Ed, and needed someone to watch over him.

There were a lot of times on the show where it seemed like Johnny was barely tolerating Ed, an undercurrent, but sometimes open. And times when Ed didn't seem to like Johnny teasing him about his drinking.

[Sampiro]

Originally Posted by Kimballkid

That's not what the PBS special said. They pretty much said that Ed and Johnny went out all the time and when Johnny got drunk and belligerent, Ed was the one who diffused the situations.

Perhaps they stopped when he retired. He was apparently very reclusive in his retirement.

I read someplace that Chevy Chase (generally considered one of the least likeable men in Hollywood), Carl Reiner, and Steve Martin were regular poker buddies of Carson. Were any of them interviewed in the documentary?

[Marley23]

Steve Martin was interviewed.

[NDP]

Originally Posted by Sampiro

I read someplace that Chevy Chase (generally considered one of the least likeable men in Hollywood), Carl Reiner, and Steve Martin were regular poker buddies of Carson. Were any of them interviewed in the documentary?

Martin and Reiner were but not Chase.

[spifflog]

In the special, McMahon's daughter address this. She said at one point they were very close, and went out drinking together - a lot. But they may have spent too much time together, and they tired (I think that was the word she used) of each other and grew apart.

Not dissimilar to the relationships I have (or lack thereof) of some of my college and early friends. Spend a ton of time together and then want time apart, and that sticks.

[Sampiro]

I remember in 1989 they had a big "35th anniversary" special for The Tonight Show, and for the special they brought on Jack Paar. It was a surprise when he was being interviewed that Jack Paar and Johnny Carson had never met; you would just assume that two consecutive and popular hosts of The Tonight Show would know each other, but Paar left the show before Carson took over so there was no transition and, as Carson would do, once he retired he stayed out of the limelight, so they didn't move in the same circles. Upon meeting, they hit it off okay but didn't bond or anything, each went their own way.

Johnny did know Steve Allen but they didn't get along. A lot of people didn't get along with Steve Allen; he apparently had one of the most overdeveloped egos in a city known for huge egos and was very offputting. (I think Letterman liked him, though.)

[carnivorousplant]

I watched it last night. I'd forgotten how good he was.

[Greekfreak]

He was a prick of a human being and a great entertainer; such is the lot of many an actor/singer, etc.

On an episode of "Dinner For Five", Burt Reynolds talked a great deal about the Tonight Show "Blacklist" which was pointed out to him by producer Freddy De Cordova.

Anybody got links to this now-archaic piece of entertainment history? I'm certain Oliver Reed was on that list.

[Zeldar]

I have developed a habit of periodically backtracking the offerings in the Fresh Air archives, rather than trying to catch each daily (or weekend) show.
That's why I just heard the David Bianculli review at May 14's lineup.

You can get to the audio directly here.

Pretty good analysis, I think.

[terentii]

Originally Posted by StusBlues

Michael Landon came on the show when he was dying of pancreatic cancer. That's the only time I can remember Carson honestly struggling to find the proper tone, but once he realized that Landon was there to play for laughs, they went with it. I'm sure it was satisfying for Carson to be able to join Landon in blasting the tabloids for their irresponsible reporting; it was a rare instance of the general public being able to see how those vultures destroyed lives.

It was Landon's appearance on the show, and his subsequent passing, that finally put Johnny in the frame of mind to retire. I wonder at which point he really began to suffer the effects of emphysema?

[River Hippie]

Originally Posted by Greekfreak

He was a prick of a human being and a great entertainer; such is the lot of many an actor/singer, etc.

On an episode of "Dinner For Five", Burt Reynolds talked a great deal about the Tonight Show "Blacklist" which was pointed out to him by producer Freddy De Cordova.

Anybody got links to this now-archaic piece of entertainment history? I'm certain Oliver Reed was on that list.

If I'm recalling correctly, Reed was a notoriously ill behaved an often shit-faced talk show guest. Could it be that this blacklist was just sucky guests?

[Greekfreak]

Originally Posted by River Hippie

If I'm recalling correctly, Reed was a notoriously ill behaved an often shit-faced talk show guest. Could it be that this blacklist was just sucky guests?

Yep. But it also included those that cancelled for no good reason, if they were dicks (like the infamous Mandonna/Letterman appearance), if they talked to him during the breaks shilling something, etc.

Basically Carson wielded a lot of power in those days and if you were on his shit list, you has almost no shot of making it.

[alfonzos]

What happened to all those old Tonight Shows? They have been cataloged. I believe you can order individual episodes from www.johnnycarson.com.

Drew and Doc were the only one to be shown crying on camera. Others may have moved to tears but may have would up on the cutting room floor (as they used to say).

One can't fit every detail in a documentary, but I noticed there was no mention of Skitch Henderson (Johnny's original bandleader) and Paul Anka (Johnny's theme composer).

Anyway, good show. I enjoyed it.

[Irishman]

I have no problem with a host having a blacklist of people that he doesn't wish to deal with. Especially if they get added to the list by their own actions.

"Wow, that was a disaster, let's not do that again."

[Kimballkid]

Originally Posted by alfonzos

One can't fit every detail in a documentary, but I noticed there was no mention of Skitch Henderson (Johnny's original bandleader) and Paul Anka (Johnny's theme composer).

What about Tommy Newsom?