Tennis 2012 Thread

[abbeytxs]

Good job Andy! Fantastic final.

[AK84]

Well, I was wrong. well done to Andy Murray. The monkey is well and truly off his back now.

[Lochdale]

A great win. Well done Murray. Lendel has to get a little credit as well.

[Novelty Bobble]

Good man, he's the only one of the other players who can live on regular basis with the top three. I never doubted he had the game, it was always the mental step that was missing. Lendl seemed to fix that and a Wimbledon final, olympic gold and a major are the result.

He would've been bar far the best player never to win one, no need for that stat now.

And the winners of the four majors this year? Djokovic, Nadal, Federer, Murray. I bet Andy feels he properly belongs to that list now.

[PunditLisa]

Such a great finals for both men and women. So thrilled for Andy Murray on his first major. Even though his body language was negative at times (he so reminds me so much of Pete Sampras), his mental fortitude was very impressive. When Nole pours it on, it's nearly impossible to stop him.

Can't wait for the Aussie Open and the hopeful return of Rafa. Love watching these battles of the titans.

P.S. Oh, and taking a massage timeout when you're opponent is one game away from sealing the match? Bad form, Novak. Bad form.

[Mahaloth]

Originally Posted by Novelty Bobble

He would've been bar far the best player never to win one, no need for that stat now.

Who is the best player to never win one now? Todd Martin, maybe?

[Marley23]

Originally Posted by Mahaloth

Who is the best player to never win one now? Todd Martin, maybe?

Marcelo Rios was the first one to come to mind for me, since he's the only guy to get to #1 and never win a major.

[Cumbrian]

Originally Posted by Marley23

Marcelo Rios was the first one to come to mind for me, since he's the only guy to get to #1 and never win a major.

Wasn't Rios a one surface guy? I'd imagine someone like Tim Henman would beat him most of the time except on clay, where Henman would have been whomped.

Well done to Andy Murray - bastard just lost me a bet though. Back when Henman was struggling I bet a mate that the next British men's GS Tennis Champion had not yet been born. Looked a decent enough bet at the time, as we weren't exactly developing champions through the system. Unfortunately for me, Murray stepped out of the system to get good...

[amarone]

Originally Posted by Cumbrian

Wasn't Rios a one surface guy? I'd imagine someone like Tim Henman would beat him most of the time except on clay, where Henman would have been whomped.

Rios was 2-2 against Henman on non-clay (all hard-court matchs).

[Tom Scud]

Originally Posted by Cumbrian

Wasn't Rios a one surface guy? I'd imagine someone like Tim Henman would beat him most of the time except on clay, where Henman would have been whomped.

Not really, 7 hardcourt titles, 2 carpet, 9 clay. Best result was the aussie open finals.

[Cumbrian]

I stand corrected. Good knowledge from one and all.

[Dead Cat]

I guess that match shows that if you're going to choke, best to do it early in the match rather than at the end - a truism, perhaps, but having had limited experience of this sort of thing myself, I think throwing a set away early on that you should have won can make you stronger in the endgame. Great effort from Andy, though of course if anything it will just increase the pressure on him next year, at Wimbledon at least.

[Marley23]

Originally Posted by Dead Cat

Great effort from Andy, though of course if anything it will just increase the pressure on him next year, at Wimbledon at least.

It would've been a lot worse if he had just lost another major final. One of the interesting question at the 2013 majors is going to be whether Murray can relax a little bit and what that might do for his game. There is even more reason to think he could win Wimbledon next year - and even if he'd lost this one, he made the Wimbledon final and won the Olympics - but the expectations won't be coupled with that "is he ever going to win one?" thing or all of the talk about how Britain hasn't had a man win a major title since before World War II. I'm sure British fans want to see him win Wimbledon more than any other event, but it won't be all pressure. Imagine what the fans are going to sound like when he takes the court for the first time next year.

In case anyone was wondering about the rankings: Federer opens up a slightly bigger lead on Djokovic, and Murray has moved ahead of Nadal to get to #3. The only other change in the top 10 is that Berdych is now 6th and Tsonga is 7th instead of vice-versa.

I never got around to offering a final thought on Roddick and I've talked about his career at length in other threads, but in passing, the guy had a seriously great run. He had one of the hardest and most accurate serves in the history of the sport, won a Grand Slam event, reached three other major finals, was one of the youngest players to become #1 in the world, finished his career by winning at least one title in 12 straight seasons, was in the year-end top 10 for nine years in a row, and also had a very strong Davis Cup record, including the U.S.'s last championship in 2007. While he could come off as a jerk at times, I think he deserves credit for being honest and funny as well. The Wimbledon 2009 final and his 2003 Australian Open quarterfinal against El-Aynaoui were both amazing. He did everything in his capability to adapt and expand his game as the sport changed.

[etv78]

IMO Murray will break out, like Mickelson did after he won his 1st major.

[Covered_In_Bees!]

If I have to be subject to any more Andy Murray than I already have been, I'll be watching a lot less tennis.

[Mahaloth]

Originally Posted by Covered_In_Bees!

If I have to be subject to any more Andy Murray than I already have been, I'll be watching a lot less tennis.

Is he somehow overexposed? I wasn't aware.

[RedFury]

Originally Posted by Marley23

Marcelo Rios was the first one to come to mind for me, since he's the only guy to get to #1 and never win a major.

In my mind, prime David Nalbandian could (and did) beat the best in the world and make them look silly while doing so.

Such a waste of talent. I blame McDonald's.

---

Kudos to Andy for finally getting the monkey off his back. Well deserved. Sets up quite an interesting and level 2013 season...provided we get Rafa back.

[Marley23]

Originally Posted by RedFury

In my mind, prime David Nalbandian could (and did) beat the best in the world and make them look silly while doing so.

He'd have to be on the list too, although I think that's an exaggeration of how good he was. He has 11 career titles and finished in the top 10 five times, although he never finished a year higher than sixth. Nalbandian was a very strong player for a while, but he never made another major final after Wimbledon in 2002. He's actually a few months younger than Federer is. Basically he didn't win anything of consequence after he turned 26 because he couldn't keep up with Federer and Nadal and the others, and his results were tailing off a little even then.

[Novelty Bobble]

I think when you start looking at the past 6 years and totting up what the top 4 have done in terms of major finals, qtrs, semis, and title wins, there are few others out there even in the same league.

[Mahaloth]

Originally Posted by Novelty Bobble

I think when you start looking at the past 6 years and totting up what the top 4 have done in terms of major finals, qtrs, semis, and title wins, there are few others out there even in the same league.

Indeed, and David Nalbandian, while good, was nowhere near as talented as Federer, Djokovic, and Nadal. And I guess Murray as well.

Tsonga is definitely heading toward "great, but no majors" as well. I love the guy, but he has yet to win one despite going very deep a few times.

Now the majors are over for the year, here is another discussion point:


Outside Thomas Johansson, who is the "worst" player to win a major? Men and women, if you like.

And yes, please state if you think they are worse than Johansson.

[Marley23]

Tsonga is very talented and exciting but he's struggled to play seven quality matches in a row against the best players in the world. He's come close a few times; that loss at Wimbledon this year was really tough. He's going to be 28 next year and it's hard not to think his opportunity is fading.

[RedFury]

Originally Posted by Marley23

He'd have to be on the list too, although I think that's an exaggeration of how good he was. He has 11 career titles and finished in the top 10 five times, although he never finished a year higher than sixth. Nalbandian was a very strong player for a while, but he never made another major final after Wimbledon in 2002. He's actually a few months younger than Federer is. Basically he didn't win anything of consequence after he turned 26 because he couldn't keep up with Federer and Nadal and the others, and his results were tailing off a little even then.

I blame it on his fat ass. He was all talent, no work. But if you watched the '07 Master Series in Madrid* & Paris when he was in one of his best moments ever, you might remember just how good he could be -- beat Nadal & Fed in consecutive semis and finals. Only man to do so until Djoker did it last year.

Check this out: Roger Federer vs David Nalbandian -- Paris 2007 Highlights

So no, I don't think I exaggerate. In fact, I wasn't a fan of his, but couldn't help but marvel at his game. Specially the insane angles he could create off of his exquisite backhand.

*on carpet back then.

[iamnotbatman]

Originally Posted by Marley23

I never got around to offering a final thought on Roddick and I've talked about his career at length in other threads, but in passing, the guy had a seriously great run. He had one of the hardest and most accurate serves in the history of the sport, won a Grand Slam event, reached three other major finals

For the record, he reached four other major finals (losing all four to Federer).

[AK84]

Originally Posted by Mahaloth

Outside Thomas Johansson, who is the "worst" player to win a major? Men and women, if you like.

And yes, please state if you think they are worse than Johansson.

There was some Aussie who won the Australian Open while being ranked about 200. He has to be worse.

In addition to Johansson, who did not win his major as much as Safin lost it.

1) Gaston Gaudio? Never amounted to much. Never got past the 4th round besides that final victory. Johansson at least reached Semis and Quarters of other majors.
2)Petr Korda. He was a mediocre player, though he did reach two slam finals. He was also a druggie to boot.

3) Alberto Costa. Never won anything except on clay.

Besides that; Carlos Moya? Nah, was world number 1. Although that was in 1999, when I could have been world number 1, the way the ranking bounced about that year was ridiculous.

Richard Kraijek? He reached several Semi Finals in his career. Was unlucky to often have to play great players in tournaments.

[Mahaloth]

Someone is threatening to kill Federer in China "purpose of tennis extermination".

Read about it here.

[Marley23]

It's probably just some crank on the internet, although the security people will have to make sure they do an A-plus job regardless. Murray and Djokovic are back in action this week and Shanghai will be Federer's first tournament since the U.S. Open. Nadal's camp is saying he may start practicing again soon, but they're sending very mixed signals about when he might be ready to play a tournament. He is supposed to play Djokovic in an exhibition match in (I think) December.

[Mahaloth]

Originally Posted by Marley23

It's probably just some crank on the internet, although the security people will have to make sure they do an A-plus job regardless. Murray and Djokovic are back in action this week and Shanghai will be Federer's first tournament since the U.S. Open. Nadal's camp is saying he may start practicing again soon, but they're sending very mixed signals about when he might be ready to play a tournament. He is supposed to play Djokovic in an exhibition match in (I think) December.

I'm hearing Nadal will be back December 27 at the Mubadala World Tennis Tournament, followed by the Australian Open.

[Cicero]

Originally Posted by AK84

There was some Aussie who won the Australian Open while being ranked about 200. He has to be worse.


.

Are you thinking of Mark Edmonson? The last Australian player to win the Open? He did beat John Newcombe although he was probably at the end of his career.

[AK84]

Originally Posted by Cicero

Are you thinking of Mark Edmonson? The last Australian player to win the Open? He did beat John Newcombe although he was probably at the end of his career.

Yes. That would be it. But the Australian Open was often poorly attended then.

[Mahaloth]

When is Lleyton Hewitt going to retire? 2013 Australian?

[Mahaloth]

Federer lost to Del Potro and is pulling out of the Paris Masters to focus on the year-end championship.

He loses the #1 ranking to Djokovic for doing so, but I honestly don't blame him. "It's just too much," he said.

Tennis does require way too much from these guys and I think he made the right move.

[Mahaloth]

Djokovic celebrates his #1 year-end ranking security by bageling(6-0) Same Querrey in his first match since he learned he would be #1 this year.

Then loses the match. Final score:

6-0, 6-7(5), 4-6


Very funny.

[Novelty Bobble]

D'oh! Novak had one of those rare off-days I think.

Anyhow, we are now at the end of a long season and I think we can forgive the top guys for taking their eyes of the ball (ha!).

It'll be interesting to see how it pans out at the O2 tournament in London. It is one that they tend to save themselves for in a last hurrah and looking at the form going I reckon you have to fancy Murray for it. Home crowd, favoured surface, an excellent second half of the season, his fitness looks good. He could do well.

As for the others, there is no doubt that Federer is starting to wind down (as he fully deserves) Novak is looking a little erratic and poor Rafa is having a world of trouble with his knee. I mentioned it earlier in the thread but I really think we have seen the last of him as a major force. I just don't see how he can play his astonishingly dynamic game on dodgy knees.

[Mahaloth]

Murray is out as well, now. What and odd tournament. Roger should have joined in and he might have just walked through to a victory. Or not, I doubt he cares.

Anyway, Murray lost to Jerzy Janowicz, the rare player I have zero memory of. Good for him.

[Mahaloth]

Spain David Ferrer
Czech Republic Tomáš Berdych
France Jo-Wilfried Tsonga
Serbia Janko Tipsarević
Spain Nicolás Almagro
Switzerland Stanislas Wawrinka


Forgive the messy pasting, but that is who is left of our seeds. Who will win? I think it will be Wawrinka or Ferrer.

[Marley23]

Del Potro also lost. This tournament is making a very loud "the season is too long" argument.

[Mahaloth]

Originally Posted by Marley23

Del Potro also lost. This tournament is making a very loud "the season is too long" argument.

No kidding. I think it is more likely that Federer is just home laughing about the whole thing.

[Mahaloth]

Originally Posted by Mahaloth

Who will win? I think it will be Wawrinka or Ferrer.

And....it was Ferrer, winning his first Masters tournament.

[Mahaloth]

Federer vs. Djokovic for the year-end final.

[Marley23]

Originally Posted by Mahaloth

And....it was Ferrer, winning his first Masters tournament.

Ending a streak of 17 straight Masters events won by the Big Four. The last guy outside the top four to win one of these was Soderling in Paris at the end of 2010. I hope Soderling comes back at some point.

[Novelty Bobble]

Originally Posted by Mahaloth

Federer vs. Djokovic for the year-end final.

Hands up who predicted that?

Ah, about half of you.

Hands up who predicted Murray v Djokovic?

Ah, the other half.

I have to say that, though I predicted a Murray win Federer played some frankly unbelievable tennis yesterday. Really rather special. I suspect the little break he had has done him good.

[Mahaloth]

Originally Posted by Marley23

Ending a streak of 17 straight Masters events won by the Big Four. The last guy outside the top four to win one of these was Soderling in Paris at the end of 2010. I hope Soderling comes back at some point.

Despite this(or perhaps because of it), I do consider this the golden age of tennis. Those four guys are just so much above the rest. Good on Ferrer, Del Potro, and Soderling for even cracking in once in awhile.

[Marley23]

It's a remarkable time for tennis. Next year shouldn't be any less interesting. Murray has a Slam victory to build on, there's the mystery of what Nadal's comeback will look like, and I think del Potro is still getting better.

[Mahaloth]

Very interesting final. It's on ESPN2, folks.

[Mahaloth]

Novak wins the year-end final. Good for him.

[Marley23]

Federer had a chance to extend that one to a third set, but Djokovic turned it on at the right time. Great last point, too. That firms up his lead in the rankings going into next year. Don't blink and miss the offseason!

[Mahaloth]

Originally Posted by Marley23

Federer had a chance to extend that one to a third set, but Djokovic turned it on at the right time. Great last point, too. That firms up his lead in the rankings going into next year. Don't blink and miss the offseason!

No kidding. The Aussise Open is in two months. This is about all the break these guys get.

[Dead Cat]

I watched most of last night's match and it really was some incredible tennis. If Djokovic wasn't so good you could almost say Federer choked - he gave away a winning position in the first set with unforced errors, and in the second set I felt his heart wasn't really in it - it was almost like he was burned out already, and thinking that he really didn't quite want to take it to a third. After he won that amazing point where he tracked back and hit a cross-court pass where the ball was almost behind him when he struck it, he should have moved on and won that game and the set. The difference was that when Djokovic broke back at the end of the second, he smelled weakness and realised that if he took a little bit more risk, he could capitalise and kill the match there and then - and he duly did so.

But I am loading very high expectations on to Federer, of course. I think you can easily make the argument that at this level, there is virtually no such thing as an unforced error (Djokovic's volley that went out by a yard with almost the whole court to aim for excepted ) - you know that unless your groundstrokes are within 2 feet of the baseline and 2 inches over the top of the net, the other guy will capitalise, possibly with an immediate winner. As such, is clipping the top of the net or being out by an inch really an unforced error?

Also, I do appreciate the schedule is punishing, but having two months off (well, probably one month if you want to be in decent condition for Oz) doesn't sound too bad to me for the amount they get paid. I'm not saying they don't deserve their pay, just that I find it hard to be sympathetic!

I wonder why they don't move the whole calendar forward by a month so that the players can relax and enjoy Christmas a bit more? I guess it would be too difficult now to change the dates of all the events.

[Mahaloth]

This year's winner of the Davis Cup?

The Czech Republic

Gotta' love that. Good for them.

[Marley23]

An update on Robin Soderling, who hopes to get back on tour but accepts that it might not happen. Earlier this month a player a little younger than Soderling, former doubles world #1 Gisela Dulko, announced her retirement.