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  #101  
Old 02-12-2019, 11:17 AM
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I find the above interesting. Why do you want Jennings in your Ashes team?
It's funny that you should bring up the 90s England in your earlier post, and their habit of finally turning up to a series once it's been lost, because I think the current problems with the England setup are similar to the problems we had back then. We're not letting anyone settle, players aren't in the team because they know that the selectors back them and know they are good enough, but because they are the lastest cab off the rank in a desperate search for the next Alistair Cook.

It's not just the openers. Here is a graphic showing the England middle order (3-8) and their positions they've played in the previous three series. Look at what's happened to Bairstow, Stokes and Buttler in particular, but none of them (with the sole exception of Joe Root) are settled.

It's not so much that I want Jennings in particular in my Ashes side, more than I want this team, in this order, in my Ashes side, to let them gel as a side, with players in known roles and positions.

I don't think Jason Roy is the answer, and I don't think his name would have come up (as it hasn't, really, until now) if he wasn't simply one of the few openers we haven't chucked in yet. As you say, he doesn't open in County Cricket.

Last edited by Teuton; 02-12-2019 at 11:20 AM.
  #102  
Old 02-12-2019, 12:17 PM
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I think, in general, there is a lot of sense in what you're saying. We don't want to be chopping and changing the team or the batting order as much as we have been doing and this is, probably, at least part of what is causing inconsistency in our batting performances. About the only constant is Root at 4 at the moment and everybody shuffling around trying to solve our issues at 3, is having a deleterious effect on the form of guys in the lower order. We should hit on a team and stick to it and I would say that:

Burns, Jennings, Denly, Root, Buttler, Stokes, Bairstow, Ali, 3 seam up bowlers

Is probably about right.

BUT

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/eng...s;type=batting

That is Keaton Jennings Test match performance over the course of his career. He averages 17.7 in matches in England over 18 innings - he can't play the moving ball and he has been shown up here as struggling against pace. Starc and Cummins are going to eat him alive. He looks like someone that I'd be happy to have go to the sub-continent but facing seam up bowling, he's going to struggle unless he fixes some fundamental technical flaws. For me, the general ethos of what you're proposing is right (particularly if you can be sure you've identified the right players) - but I think you can bed in the remaining 10 players in the team in the right places in the order, and still say, "he's not good enough - let's see if we can find someone else".

Now - my get out of jail free card. England's next test isn't until the end of July (against Ireland) and there will be a lot of county cricket to be played. Jennings doesn't play ODIs, so he should get as much red ball time as we can give him in the early season. If he starts scoring some runs and is the best of the options available to us, I'm not against him sticking. On the other hand, that's also a lot of red ball cricket for other guys - Holden, Gubbins, Bell-Drummond, even recent discards like Stoneman, to also score a lot of runs. I'd hold the #2 position open in the side for the moment and select whomever performs best for us, rather than be wedded to Jennings in the name of consistency.

Roy for me is an utter non--starter but better judges than I, at least people I have some time for in the press, are talking it up which is usually an indication that someone in the England selection camp is talking it up as a possibility or they're seeing something that I am not.

104-5 in the Caribbean. England are going to win this comfortably, barring an act of God (either via weather or a West Indian partnership being touched by him).
  #103  
Old 02-12-2019, 02:23 PM
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Windies cricketer Shannon Gabriel charged by ICC over 'homophobic' comment to Joe Root http://news.sky.com/story/windies-cr...-root-11635725


Good, tired of the homophobia in sports. I don’t mind players getting a mental edge by telling someone their game is weak, but using ‘gay’ as an insult has got to stop.
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  #104  
Old 02-13-2019, 11:19 AM
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So, yeah. This was not great. Gabriel has been banned for 4 (largely meaningless) one day matches starting from next week. Seems about right given the ban meted out not a month ago for racial remarks in the Pakistan/South Africa series.

Seeing some of the tin foil hat brigade in the cricketing internet community talking about how the stump mics should be turned down and this stuff left on the field. Not for me. Turn the buggers up and make sure all of this gets stamped out. The best sledges go down in history ("Tickets please!", "When in Rome dear boy", etc) and show some evidence of wit and intelligence - not battering on in horrific fashion using racism, homophobia or elsewise. Maybe if the players know they're being properly monitored they'll only say stuff that's worthwhile - or perhaps just shut up with sledging/abuse altogether.

England won. Rather one-sided. Not much else to discuss. It's now the long drag into the World Cup - the IPL will get underway soon too. Is it right that the Big Bash still hasn't finished yet? Feels like it went on forever.
  #105  
Old 02-13-2019, 12:51 PM
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As to the second question: everyone seems to be pointing at Jason Roy to open. Which seems to me like pouring oil on the fire. He doesn't open down at Surrey and he'll be in on the grounds that he opens in ODIs and should be able to tee off. But isn't our problem at the top of the order lack of obduracy?
Yes, but I think the theory is that if you're going to be out within 35 balls anyway due to lack of technique, you may as well pick someone who might use those balls to score 50 occasionally, rather than someone who gets 7. Not saying I agree that's the right approach, but it does have some logic behind it.

As for Jennings, really enjoyed George Dobell's comment on Cricinfo: "worse driver than Prince Philip".

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Originally Posted by Cumbrian View Post
So, yeah. This was not great. Gabriel has been banned for 4 (largely meaningless) one day matches starting from next week. Seems about right given the ban meted out not a month ago for racial remarks in the Pakistan/South Africa series.

Seeing some of the tin foil hat brigade in the cricketing internet community talking about how the stump mics should be turned down and this stuff left on the field. Not for me. Turn the buggers up and make sure all of this gets stamped out. The best sledges go down in history ("Tickets please!", "When in Rome dear boy", etc) and show some evidence of wit and intelligence - not battering on in horrific fashion using racism, homophobia or elsewise. Maybe if the players know they're being properly monitored they'll only say stuff that's worthwhile - or perhaps just shut up with sledging/abuse altogether.
"Every time I fuck your wife, she gives me a biscuit."

Does anyone know what Gabriel actually said? Agree 100% that Root and the ICC took the right stand.
  #106  
Old 02-13-2019, 12:56 PM
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So, yeah. This was not great. Gabriel has been banned for 4 (largely meaningless) one day matches starting from next week. Seems about right given the ban meted out not a month ago for racial remarks in the Pakistan/South Africa series.
Well, Gabriel was apparently slated for a return to the ODI side for this series in the run up to the world cup, so this ban could put a serious dent in his hopes for playing in that. The ban isn't just for this, though, like the Jason Holder ban earlier, it's an accumulation of points. It appears as though the major problem with this points accumulation system is that people, even journalists, don't seem to realise that getting 3 points for an infraction and putting yourself over 20 points for the period doesn't actually mean you got the ban for the 3 point transgression.

You're right, Cumbrian, that there is a lot of county cricket to go before the Ashes, and indeed a Test match at Lords against Ireland to get past. Atherton in the radio commentary made a point that a top three of Cook, Trescothick and Bell was more likely than the current top three making it to the Ashes, and I don't think he's far wrong (in that they are both equally unlikely).
  #107  
Old 02-16-2019, 07:38 AM
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Amazing win just now for Sri Lanka in their first test v SA. Perera with 153* and 78 for the last wicket to win it. Given their results v England at home and Australia away plus the fact they were chasing 304 in the final innings, a real turn up for the books.

Last edited by Cumbrian; 02-16-2019 at 07:42 AM.
  #108  
Old 02-16-2019, 08:14 AM
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Those sixes in the last couple of overs.... that's the sort of game that kids dream of having, and Perera is living that dream. He scored 6 sixes in the game - 5 in the second innings, one in his first - and everyone else in the game managed one between them.

Not only chasing 300, but chasing 300 in a game where the highest previous score was 259.
  #109  
Old 02-16-2019, 03:02 PM
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Wow I'd written Sri Lanka off after their miserable Australasian tour.
  #110  
Old 02-22-2019, 10:05 AM
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Is anyone watching SA-SL 2nd Test? I've not seen any of it and am just looking at the scorecard now. It's the end of the second day and the match is already over 3/4s over. SL need 197 to win and 60/2 at the end of the day. Is the pitch a minefield, the bowling brilliant or are the batsmen idiots?

Predictably, given the low scoring nature of the match, the scorecards are an absolute mess. SA's first innings was 222 all out - 4 ducks and 3 more out for single digits - yet Markram got 60 and De Kock 80+ at basically a run a ball (which might have been a "fuck it, I'm getting you before you get me" innings). Similar story in the SA second innings - 3 guys get double digits, no one else scored more than 6...

Last edited by Cumbrian; 02-22-2019 at 10:06 AM.
  #111  
Old 02-23-2019, 03:29 AM
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I haven't been following at all, but checked the score this morning. SL are now 158/2, and they only need another 39 runs. Fernando and Mendis both in the 60s and looking comfortable, beetling along at 4.5 an over. The pitch suddenly doesn't look so bad.
  #112  
Old 02-23-2019, 04:04 AM
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When Australia was finishing off Sri Lanka a few weeks ago one of the guys at work said that it was nice to be winning again. I said that "The Sri Lankans are so bad that beating them doesn't count as winning." So put me down as absolutely amazed.
  #113  
Old 02-28-2019, 04:43 AM
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Bangladesh are playing NZ in their first Test of a series down in NZ at the moment. After Day 1, Bangladesh were all out for 234 to which NZ are already 86/0 in reply. Of note, Tamim Iqbal hit 126 off 128 balls. Fantastic knock. Obviously given the final total, he was provided bugger all support. Bangladesh were 121-1 at one point and then Neil Wagner blitzed them with short stuff and took a 5-fer. I watched a small amount of this before going to bed but the bulk of the action took place long after I'd had enough. Tamim was pretty good mind - drove well with power, and wasn't especially reckless for the part of his innings I saw at least.

England's ODI series in the Caribbean has wound on. Records falling all over the place for numbers of 6s scored. In two of the games, the pitches have been relentlessly flat, and it is proving very difficult for bowlers to be anything other than cannon fodder. They genuinely might be better off with a bowling machine at either end. Yesterday, Buttler hit 150 off 77 balls. Gayle followed suit with 160ish off fewer than 100 deliveries. The game was in the balance until the 48th over, when Rashid took 4 in 5 balls at the death.

England can be got, particularly if the bowlers can't generate penetration, but as with yesterday, they seem to have a line up that will put up a big score. The 2nd ODI, that England lost, provides the blueprint for beating England. Strangle their fluency with the bat and you can ramp the pressure up. England have lost only once since the last World Cup in ODIs when they have lost fewer than 7 wickets, so you need to get into the tail of the line up to beat them. Honestly, going into the World Cup, no one should be afraid of anybody - all the sides have their flaws.

There's also some T20 happening in Australia - where the home side have beaten India 2-0 in the mini-series. Glenn Maxwell won Australia the second match - there's a guy I know not much about except he seems to be the perpetual "should we play him, should we not" selection. Probably worth playing him the limited overs stuff at least...

Last edited by Cumbrian; 02-28-2019 at 04:45 AM.
  #114  
Old 03-02-2019, 03:42 AM
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Final game of the ODI series between England and WIndies today, and it'll be interesting to see where it'll go. England have shown themselves to be a batting powerhouse in two of the games, coming up curiously short in the second game having been set a target they would have expected to chase.
Gayle has shown himself to still be a power in cricket and, after taking flak in the first game for not running other people's singles and being a generally selfish player, seems to have bucked his ideas up a bit through the series. In that first game, he got a run a ball hundred (135 off 129, actually) having started his innings very slowly and catching up, before Jason Roy (125 off 85) shown him how it's done these days. Gayle's innings in the fourth innings was much better, getting going much quicker, and whilst he didn't turn many ones into twos, he did at least run.

Been following a bit of the NZ/Bang test match, although it doesn't really seem one for the neutral. NZ going to win by an innings and plenty after putting on over 700, harking back to the early days of Bangladeshi test cricket.
  #115  
Old 03-02-2019, 05:41 AM
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I love how NZ sent in a nightwatchman (Wagner) at 449-4! I assume BJ Watling had wandered off to the bar already or something.
  #116  
Old 03-02-2019, 01:10 PM
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And the final ODI - a batting collapse by England, another chance for Gayle to show how good he still is (and is still is good), and an easy win for the home side, forcing a probably fair drawn series.

There's some more t20 stuff after this.
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Old 03-02-2019, 02:02 PM
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There’s also some T20 happening in Australia - where the home side have beaten India 2-0 in the mini-series. Glenn Maxwell won Australia the second match - there's a guy I know not much about except he seems to be the perpetual "should we play him, should we not" selection. Probably worth playing him the limited overs stuff at least...
They are in India for this series. Reverse of the India winter tour. But no tests this time.
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  #118  
Old 03-02-2019, 07:39 PM
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And the final ODI - a batting collapse by England, another chance for Gayle to show how good he still is (and is still is good), and an easy win for the home side, forcing a probably fair drawn series.

There's some more t20 stuff after this.
I thought England tried to deny Gayle a century in his last match by crashing out for 113. Then it looked like he might score one anyway for a while.
  #119  
Old 03-03-2019, 03:40 AM
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So, NZ beat Bangladesh, which isn't surprising, but there were some positives for the visiting side, with a couple of big tons from the middle order (although they both fell just short of 150), going from 126/4 to 361/5. Unfortunately, apart from a decent showing from the openers, no one else managed double figures, and NZ still bowled them out 52 short.

Currently watching the first ODI between SL and South Africa. I'd expect SA to boss these games, but I thought they'd boss the tests as well, so we'll see. The run up to the World Cup this year gives everything an extra edge!
  #120  
Old 03-03-2019, 03:43 AM
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Talking of the world cup, does anyone have tickets?

I've got tickets for the 4th ODI against Pakistan just before it, in Bristol, and I'm kinda hoping to get tickets for the Afghanistan-New Zealand group game, but they aren't on general release yet, and I don't know if they game will sell out - it's one of the few games at Taunton, and I think the only one on a saturday.
  #121  
Old 03-05-2019, 06:28 PM
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Over in this thread are lists of greatest teams of all time.

The thread is dominated by the usual suspects but Cumbrian bravely ventured forth into the near closed universe of baseball, basketball and NFL to post his cricket best of all time and of his own.

In more familiar environs I thought is merited athe opportunity to draw more comment so ....


1 Jack Hobbs (Matthew Hayden)
2 WG Grace (Alastair Cook)
3 Don Bradman (Ricky Ponting)
4 Sachin Tendulkar (Brian Lara)
5 Viv Richards (Kumar Sangakkara)
6 Garfield Sobers (Jacques Kallis)
7 Alan Knott (Adam Gilchrist) - both to keep wicket
8 Wasim Akram (Imran Khan)
9 Shane Warne (Curtly Ambrose)
10 Malcolm Marshall (Waqar Younis)
11 Glenn McGrath (Muttiah Muralitharan)


Bradman's . . . PT's
1. Barry Richards [South Africa] . . . (Kane Williams [New Zealand])
2. Arthur Morris [Australia] . . . (Viv Richards [West Indies])
3. Don Bradman [Australia] . . . (Ricky Ponting [Australia])
4. Sachin Tendulkar [India] . . . (Virat Kohli [India])
5. Garry Sobers [West Indies] . . . (Jaques Kallis [South Africa])
6. Don Tallon [Australia] . . . (Adam Gilchrist [Australia])
7. Ray Lindwall [Australia] . . . (Wasim Akram [Pakistan])
8. Dennis Lillee [Australia] . . . (Shane Warne [Australia])
9. Alec Bedser [England] . . . (Joel Garner [West Indies])
10. Bill O'Reilly [Australia] . . . (Michael Holding [West Indies])
11. Clarrie Grimmett [Australia] . . . (Dennis Lillee [Australia])

Last edited by penultima thule; 03-05-2019 at 06:29 PM.
  #122  
Old 03-06-2019, 04:28 AM
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They are in India for this series. Reverse of the India winter tour. But no tests this time.
Good spot - I obviously didn't read that closely enough. India currently doing well in this particular series. Kohli just continues to pound out the runs - he's averaging basically 100 with the bat at a run a ball in ODIs since the start of 2016. 55% of his innings since then feature a score of 50 or above. Man's a freak.
  #123  
Old 03-06-2019, 04:29 AM
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Talking of the world cup, does anyone have tickets?

I've got tickets for the 4th ODI against Pakistan just before it, in Bristol, and I'm kinda hoping to get tickets for the Afghanistan-New Zealand group game, but they aren't on general release yet, and I don't know if they game will sell out - it's one of the few games at Taunton, and I think the only one on a saturday.
I have failed to get organised (or on reflection, have enough money) to get along to one of these - though if there are cheap tickets going somewhere within striking distance of home, I might well see if I can drop in late. As ever, I blew my money on 4 days worth of tickets at The Oval for the Test match there. Ashes this year, so the tickets cost about 20% more than for any other series too...
  #124  
Old 03-06-2019, 04:38 AM
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Over in this thread are lists of greatest teams of all time.

The thread is dominated by the usual suspects but Cumbrian bravely ventured forth into the near closed universe of baseball, basketball and NFL to post his cricket best of all time and of his own.

In more familiar environs I thought is merited athe opportunity to draw more comment so ....


1 Jack Hobbs (Matthew Hayden)
2 WG Grace (Alastair Cook)
3 Don Bradman (Ricky Ponting)
4 Sachin Tendulkar (Brian Lara)
5 Viv Richards (Kumar Sangakkara)
6 Garfield Sobers (Jacques Kallis)
7 Alan Knott (Adam Gilchrist) - both to keep wicket
8 Wasim Akram (Imran Khan)
9 Shane Warne (Curtly Ambrose)
10 Malcolm Marshall (Waqar Younis)
11 Glenn McGrath (Muttiah Muralitharan)


Bradman's . . . PT's
1. Barry Richards [South Africa] . . . (Kane Williams [New Zealand])
2. Arthur Morris [Australia] . . . (Viv Richards [West Indies])
3. Don Bradman [Australia] . . . (Ricky Ponting [Australia])
4. Sachin Tendulkar [India] . . . (Virat Kohli [India])
5. Garry Sobers [West Indies] . . . (Jaques Kallis [South Africa])
6. Don Tallon [Australia] . . . (Adam Gilchrist [Australia])
7. Ray Lindwall [Australia] . . . (Wasim Akram [Pakistan])
8. Dennis Lillee [Australia] . . . (Shane Warne [Australia])
9. Alec Bedser [England] . . . (Joel Garner [West Indies])
10. Bill O'Reilly [Australia] . . . (Michael Holding [West Indies])
11. Clarrie Grimmett [Australia] . . . (Dennis Lillee [Australia])
Nice. Don Tallon is a new one on me. Obviously you rate him - what was he like/what did he do?

Also, Warne in your reserves? Maybe it's me being English but I could never watch him with the ball without thinking "here comes a wicket". He was literally the first name I selected.

I thought my most contentious pick might be McGrath but I consider him to be the most accurate bowler I think I have ever seen, never letting the batsman away, despite not being as hostile as some of the other contenders.

Just as an addendum on mine, the main names were essentially trying to be somewhat dispassionate about the exercise and got into numbers. All the names in brackets were selected from people I have actually seen. Of all of them, Kumar Sangakkara is probably the one I would go to bat for (so to speak) the most. Comfortably the best bat I have seen in the flesh (Tendulkar underperformed when I saw him), capable of elegance and brutality, watchfulness and free flowing stroke play. His numbers are pretty astonishing too - if he'd never played the Test matches in which he kept wicket, he'd have scored 9200 runs at an average north of 66, which is top drawer by anyone's measure.
  #125  
Old 03-06-2019, 12:36 PM
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2 WG Grace (Alastair Cook)
WG is a giant of the game, obviously, but I'm not sure he really belongs on lists like these.

The lists given are strong, although I'd be tempted to try and squeeze Graeme Smith in somewhere, and I think Steve Smith will, in years to come, be a regular feature of these lists (as will Kohli, and maybe even Root).
  #126  
Old 03-06-2019, 02:50 PM
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WG is impossible to evaluate because the game has changed so much. He dominated his contemporaries - but was he great or was the standard low? Numbers mean nothing because no modern is expected to play on the sort of pitches he faced routinely and because few 19th-century cricketers were half as athletic, coached or conditioned as a modern county player.
And if you put in Grace, why not Sydney Barnes, or Trumper, or Lohmann?

Sticking to players I've actually seen:

Sunil Gavaskar
Gordon Greenidge
Sachin Tendulkar
Viv Richards
Jacques Kallis
Steve Waugh
Adam Gilchrist
Ian Botham
Shane Warne
Malcolm Marshall
Waquar Younis

If the pitch is going to turn, put in Murali for Waqar; if it looks hard and bouncy, Curtley Ambrose.

Omitted with regret: Alastair Cook, Virender Sehwag, Allan Border, Brian Lara, Kumar Sangakkara, Ian Healy, Imran Khan, Richard Hadlee, Graeme Swann, Glenn McGrath, Courtney Walsh
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Old 03-06-2019, 03:40 PM
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I removed some context which didn't explain my two lists properly.

The left hand column is the team picked by Don Bradman in:
https://www.booktopia.com.au/bradman...552171991.html

The RH column is mine XI, I don't have reserves.

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Originally Posted by Cumbrian View Post
Nice. Don Tallon is a new one on me. Obviously you rate him - what was he like/what did he do?
Don's choice, and The Don really though his '48 side was as good a cricket ever got.
Tallon played 21 Tests from 1946-53. He was aged 30 on Test debut. Made his 1st class debut for Queensland 13 years before. But for WWII probably should have been Australia Test keeper from 1937-1953.

Tallon was a much better gloveman than Gilchrist, not as good a bat. More classical style batsman, less bludgeoning. Capable of opening at Test level.
(His brother Bill was a fast bowler for Queensland and tells one of the best yarns going round about dismissing Bradman)

Kumar was the last one I cut from my list.
I had him opening and switched in Willliams.
  #128  
Old 03-07-2019, 08:09 AM
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Originally Posted by merrick View Post
WG is impossible to evaluate because the game has changed so much. He dominated his contemporaries - but was he great or was the standard low? Numbers mean nothing because no modern is expected to play on the sort of pitches he faced routinely and because few 19th-century cricketers were half as athletic, coached or conditioned as a modern county player.
And if you put in Grace, why not Sydney Barnes, or Trumper, or Lohmann?

Sticking to players I've actually seen:

Sunil Gavaskar
Gordon Greenidge
Sachin Tendulkar
Viv Richards
Jacques Kallis
Steve Waugh
Adam Gilchrist
Ian Botham
Shane Warne
Malcolm Marshall
Waquar Younis

If the pitch is going to turn, put in Murali for Waqar; if it looks hard and bouncy, Curtley Ambrose.

Omitted with regret: Alastair Cook, Virender Sehwag, Allan Border, Brian Lara, Kumar Sangakkara, Ian Healy, Imran Khan, Richard Hadlee, Graeme Swann, Glenn McGrath, Courtney Walsh
I'm not qualified to make my own list, but I think you're going to have to argue pretty hard to convince me that Healy and Swann belong with the others in the pantheon. Top players, yes, but not among the gods of the game like all the other names you listed (of which I would say Cook, Ambrose, and Sehwag are also somewhat second tier - great players, but with more rough patches in their careers than the others, IMVHO).
  #129  
Old 03-07-2019, 01:01 PM
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I'm not qualified to make my own list, but I think you're going to have to argue pretty hard to convince me that Healy and Swann belong with the others in the pantheon. Top players, yes, but not among the gods of the game like all the other names you listed (of which I would say Cook, Ambrose, and Sehwag are also somewhat second tier - great players, but with more rough patches in their careers than the others, IMVHO).
Well. you'll note I didn't include them
Swann is a push, I'll grant you - but I was really struggling for a spinner in my 2nd XI. After Warne and Murali, how many truly great spinners have there been in the last 40 years? The obvious name is Anil Kumble, but he was much more effective in India than elsewhere (and he never did well in England, so I never saw him at his best).
As for Healy, he was named keeper (ahead of Tallon and Marsh) in Australia's official Team of the 20th Century - and while neither he nor anyone else could bat like Gilchrist, I don't think anyone's kept better in the last few decades. And since he's going to be coming in at 8 after Imran & Hadlee, I think I can afford him a bit of slack in the batting.

More generally, I'm picking my players at their peak (hey, I have a time machine, so why not?) rather than averaged over their careers. So I've got the Botham of 1980, when he was the best swing bowler in the world as well as a dangerous lower-order hitter, rather than the shadow that lingered too long into the '80s, and the Cook of the Strauss era, when he looked like he might be the only man ever to have a legitimate shot at Tendulkar's records. Ambrose could be up and down, but at his best he was the most destructive bowler I've ever seen - when he was on fire, the collapse was only ever one ball away.
Openers is the other slot where I had lots of very good candidates but not so many stand-out greats - Haynes of course, but I already had Greenidge. I wouldn't blame you for taking Hayden or Mark Taylor or Graeme Smith, but I don't think any of them could mess up an attack quite like Sehwag.
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Old 03-08-2019, 01:13 PM
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Anyone else here watching Cricket Fever on Netflix? I'm enjoying it a lot. It helps that I don't follow the IPL at all so the outcome of each match is a surprise for me.
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Old 07-18-2019, 03:27 PM
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And so, after the excitement of the World Cup in its in own thread, we return to your regularly scheduled Cricket rolling thread.

Ireland is "touring" England next week, with a single Test at Lords starting Wednesday. England have announced the squad, with Roy coming in to open opposite Burns, so hopefully we can leave the likes of Keaton Jennings and James Vince way behind. Some surprises with the bowling, with Somerset's Lewis Gregory getting into the squad, and Anderson being picked to bowl - I did think he might be rested for injury after the side strain.
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Old 07-18-2019, 05:10 PM
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Presumably they want to see how Anderson goes as a warm up for the main event. If he hits form, it's a good chance to get his name on the board again, I would think. If he breaks down, more time to think about a replacement.

As a Somerset man born and bred (and still living here) I have been vaguely following their run at the County Chanpionship this year. Gregory is not a name that's been particularly prominent to me, but I did say "vaguely".

Agree about Roy - as I said previously, I'd much rather have someone who might score 50 at a run a ball or get out early, than someone who might score a good looking 19 off 42 balls before nicking off, or get out early.
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Old 07-18-2019, 05:49 PM
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Meanwhile in the one off Test in womens multi-format Ashes, England seeking to get back in the competition wanted a raging turner to aid their spinners and served a second hand wicket replete with footmarks from a CWC19 fixture 6 weeks ago.

But a track has so far been OK with a bit of bounce and not much lateral movement nor pace for that matter.Then by winning he toss and batting the visitors did most to negate the expected deterioration by the end of the 4th day.

At the end of day 1 Australia 3-265 Healy 58, Lanning 57, Perry 84no and Hayes 54no.
A good session with the bat and one with the ball and the Aussies will have the Ashes secured.

The recent development in cricket bat technology (lighter, bigger sweet spots etc) have helped the batters in womens cricket immensely. At the moment the bowling generally has not taken the similar lift in standards.

A curiousity:
Alyssa Healy and Mitchell Starc are a couple.
Healy made her Australian debut in 2010. Starc made his debut in 2011.
Starc has played 51 Tests, Healy, who's played in every Womens Test since debut has 4.
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Old 07-19-2019, 12:14 AM
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That last stat is interesting, but given we struggle to fill stadia for five days for a men's test, perhaps not too surprising.

How exactly has the manufacture of cricket bats changed?
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Old 07-19-2019, 01:08 AM
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How exactly has the manufacture of cricket bats changed?
A lot thicker and mositure is removed, makibg more of the weight and volume solid wood.
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Old 07-19-2019, 03:58 AM
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I've been reading back through this thread a bit, and I'd kind of forgotten how awful our batting has been in Tests.

The objections to Roy opening in tests are still there - we don't actually need a swashbuckling 30 off 30 at the top for getting out, we need someone who can hang about and make things easier for Joe Root to come in and turn his inevitable 50 into more 100s.

Last edited by Teuton; 07-19-2019 at 03:59 AM.
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Old 07-19-2019, 04:07 AM
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Just to add a couple of things - Anderson's injury is a calf tear, not a side strain.

https://www.ecb.co.uk/england/men/ne...-injury-update

Mark Wood has a side strain and is supposedly out for 6 weeks. Jofra Archer also has a side strain but it's supposedly not as bad as Wood's.

https://www.cricket.com.au/news/jofr...hes/2019-07-18

England's squad v Ireland looks very imbalanced. We're likely to be playing 6 bowlers (including all rounders) in this game, which is too many for my money.

Somerset were looking like they were going to win the CC this year - and I think most neutrals are willing them on, since they've been very close over the last few years and they're one of only three counties to never have won the County Championship as it is currently recognised (Northants one of the others and Gloucestershire who were "acclaimed" as "champion county" three times in the 1870s - wiki says this was an unofficial seasonal title sometimes proclaimed by consensus of media and historians prior to December 1889 when the official County Championship was constituted. Although there are ante-dated claims prior to 1873, when residence qualifications were introduced, it is only since that ruling that any quasi-official status can be ascribed). Lewis Gregory has been a key member of that side (along with Leach and Bess, already capped by England). This season, Gregory has taken 44 wickets at 13.88. He deserves his chance but you can't see him continuing in the side in the short term, except as now in the case of injuries. Maybe he'll be around in the post-Anderson era, which is hoving into view.

As a member at Surrey, I have seen Roy bat in red ball more than most, I imagine. I am concerned. He has talent, clearly, but he has opened very little in this format at county level and has usually scored his runs at 5, after the shine has been knocked off the ball. In the absence of any better ideas in the black hole that constitutes England's top 3, he's worth a go but don't be surprised if he doesn't succeed. Rory Burns hasn't scored 50 in his last 12 CC innings either - be prepared for the opener carousel to turn once again either during this series or immediately after it.

Quote:
That last stat is interesting, but given we struggle to fill stadia for five days for a men's test, perhaps not too surprising.
A few things here: I can't think of anyone selling out Day 5 of any Test anywhere in the world, since no-one can be sure that there will be a game on Day 5. England sells out more days of its Tests than anywhere else in the world, largely because of its small grounds and large immigrant populations - difficult to get tickets for the India tests last year for instance, and I've been to packed houses at The Oval against them, Pakistan, South Africa and Australia over the last 4 years. And finally, if the "we" here is the royal we (i.e. the whole of the cricketing world) I'm struggling to understand why sparse crowds for the women's Tests would mean that you wouldn't hold more of them - clearly it's not a bar to putting Tests on for the men. It's more likely that the main reason for few Tests for the women is that, until recently, a lot of them were balancing their cricket with making money in a paying job - so you can't very easily have long tours, encompassing lots of Test matches. As a result, the women's game has developed differently, with more emphasis on white ball cricket. It may be difficult to turn this around now, even if the women's game wants more Test matches, simply because of the way the sport has evolved.

Australia are going to hammer England in the women's Test.

Last edited by Cumbrian; 07-19-2019 at 04:08 AM.
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Old 07-20-2019, 06:04 AM
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Women’s Ashes Test
Drinks, 1st session day 3, AUS 6-388 off 148 overs and looks like there is only one team who can win, and even they aren’t really trying that hard. It’s not a great advertisement for brighter cricket.
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Old 07-20-2019, 06:54 AM
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AUS declare 8-420, probably an hour late.
The window for ENG to win from here is highly improbable.
It will take ENG 100 overs to post a competitive score and there are about 150 left in the Test.
Not sure that, with any application from the batters, there is time to dismiss them twice.
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Old 07-20-2019, 08:01 AM
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150 overs is a long time to bat, even twice. I think Aus chances are much higher than you suggest!
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Old 07-21-2019, 05:45 AM
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ENG 7-238 needing 33 to avoid follow-on which might draw the Test but lose the Ashes.
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Old 07-21-2019, 07:25 AM
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ENG make the follow-on target and declare.
Most positive tactical move of the Test.
Asking the AUS to set a target that can be chased.
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Old 07-21-2019, 11:27 AM
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This might actually be interesting! Or it might go for a dismal draw.
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Old 07-21-2019, 04:55 PM
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Looked from the highlights like it was never in the thoughts of the Aussies to declare, and with the Ashes on the line I can't say I blame them. Imagine the outcry if they did and the miracle happened for England. No, certainty in sport is a rare thing and should be milked for all it's worth when you have it. Unfortunately it did make for a game that was pretty dull even when made into a highlights reel, with the only point of interest being Perry looking for a century, and she apparently wasn't able to score quickly enough to even get close. So yes, not the best advert for the game but they can't all be like the recent cup final.

I have to say the slow scoring rate (and the series being over as a contest) rather put me off looking at tickets for the T20. And not being a close follower of the game, I was surprised by the number of full tosses being served up by both sides, is this usual? Basically some of the batting looked pretty good, the bowling less so (with a few notable exceptions). Then again, I guess you could say the same about most men's matches too.
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Old 07-22-2019, 10:19 PM
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Maybe you cluey Northern Hemisphere types can enlighten an antipodean

OK, we are about a week from the opening Ashes Test.
Anticipated, locals as slight favourites. Just what I need to bugger my sleep patterns fro another couple of months.

AUS have had an A squad over there for a while, playing county sides of varying quality.
We also have a couple of prospects who are playing with county sides. All of these supplement the CWC2019 squad.
To separate the sheep, the black sheep, the goats and pretenders they are playing a intra squad match, the Haddin XII vs Hick XII (yep 12 a side and AUS have Graeme Hick as their batting coach, like we need another sub Test standard flat track bully).

For their warm-up ENG are playing IRE.
What the hey? Ireland? Really?
Haven't the ten Test status nations just been playing over there in Blighty?
The ECB doesn't have the dosh to get a Pakistan or New Zealand, Bangladesh or Afganistan to hang around for a week for a trial against test standard opposition?
Or a Possibles v Probables?

Ireland?

Am too confounded to compose a coherent question.
  #146  
Old 07-23-2019, 02:29 AM
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First Irish test againt England, and only their third overall. Its been a long time coming. An ENgland v Afghanistan might be interesting, but seriously playing Pakistan v England or NZ for the 400th time won't be a good post WC hangover cure.

Plus arranging even a couple of tests against established nations off the cuff is problematic. Nobody wants to be the appitizer to the Ashes, I know Pakistan and or NZ won't want to be, and thats before dealing with the complicated issue of sponsorship and broadcast rights.
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Old 07-23-2019, 03:08 AM
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Re: Ireland.

The World Test Championship is starting, so there is a schedule to keep (in which every series has to be 2 matches long at minimum - Ireland and Afghanistan are currently exempt from this I believe, whilst they ramp up their Test match status); this match is almost literally being shoe-horned in. England played Pakistan and India last year, so there's not much appetite for that. In 2005, England' played Bangladesh in a one off match as a warm up for The Ashes, This fits into that pattern and doesn't mess the schedule up as any other opponent bar Afghanistan would warrant 2 matches in the series.

We only play 7 Tests at maximum per English summer and the World Cup got in the way this year, so there's only really time for one match given the 5 match nature of the Australia series (this year's Ashes is already finishing later in the English summer than it ever has done).

Also, money. The biggest ex-pat community in this country is Irish. I'd imagine that they're hoping to sell out by getting a rivalry going between the two countries and marketing to the Irish community. It remains to be seen how successful this will be - I was being marketed tickets at the back end of last week through my email, suggesting that there are plenty available. Starting on a Wednesday doesn't help - they should have tried for both weekend days (but that then has knock on effects as to when The Ashes can start).

Ireland might wind up giving England a bit of a scare. The team is a mix of first and second string, the top 3 aren't secure and Ireland have Tim Murtagh, who plays for Middlesex, knows Lord's like the back of his hand as a result, and takes his wickets in the CC at a very low average. He's your classic 80 mph at best seamer, the likes of which tend to do well in English conditions. A potential banana skin for the batsmen, but you'd think that England should have too much firepower with the ball for an Irish batting unit that will need to play fairly far above itself to put up a big score. Ireland will want to make it a low scoring shootout, I imagine.

Re: Hick - his record wasn't good but I sometimes wonder what England's batsmen in the 90s would have done in another era. He had to go into every match facing Ambrose and Walsh, or Warne and McGrath, or Wasim and Waqar or Donald and Pollock. Atherton, for instance, has the worst average of anyone to score 6000 Test match runs, largely because he kept facing the likes of this lot. Meanwhile, England were putting out people like Angus Fraser, Peter Martin, Dominic Cork and Alan Mullally to share the new ball with Andrew Caddick (Caddick and Gough would share the new ball if the latter were fit, but he got injured quite a lot). Anyway, I don't see why a player's Test match record is a bar to them being a good coach - otherwise the likes of Trevor Bayliss, Tom Moody and John Buchanan wouldn't be good coaches.

Last edited by Cumbrian; 07-23-2019 at 03:09 AM.
  #148  
Old 07-23-2019, 04:07 AM
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I'm trying to get my head around the World Test Championship. Thankfully there's two years to figure it out I guess. At least the final tie break rules seem pretty clear.
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Old 07-23-2019, 09:01 AM
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I'm trying to get my head around the World Test Championship. Thankfully there's two years to figure it out I guess. At least the final tie break rules seem pretty clear.
Hopefully there will be no ludicrous case like a team getting through to the next round vide some mathematical formula despite being whipped senseless by the other team.....
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Old 07-23-2019, 09:47 AM
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https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/...ii-tour-match-

Team Haddin got dismissed for 105. Team Haddin seemed to comprise of the second string bats plus David Warner though - the batting line up for Team Hick looks far the stronger. Team Haddin seems to have the bulk of the front line bowlers with the exceptions of Lyon and, possibly, Pattinson though, so now it will be interesting to see how the first string bowlers go against the better bats. To be honest, this is probably the most interesting thing about the game.

Of the 105, the one guy playing County Championship - Marnus Labuschagne - got 41. It's almost like doing proper preparation for red ball matches works.

Last edited by Cumbrian; 07-23-2019 at 09:48 AM.
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