Ask the Air Force Guy, again.

Great Debates
1

There has been VAST ignorance displayed on the SDMB re: the military in general, and the Wars on Terrorism and Saddam (Provisional, as yet), and it’s time to get a few facts out there to contribute something to the debate.

As an Air Force non-commisioned officer with almost 17 years of faithful service, and as an intelligence specialist on Iraq, I’d like to further the SDMB’s stated mission of fighting ignorance in at least a couple of areas that I know a little something about.

CAVEAT: In matters of opinion, I will express my own, and it should not be taken as official AF policy. Also, I will not get into classified information to provide a cite. I may have one I can’t use, but I’ll have to rely on my friends in here to tell you that I hold my honor higher than my need to win a point on the SDMB. So, you may just have to accept that.

I am aware, more and more every day, that most Americans have no military experience, and have no idea what the military is all about. (And to a much, much greater extent, non-Americans, ditto.) The people are almost entirely divorced from their Armed Forces, and the picture painted by popular culture is usually not flattering, even when it tries to be. (Which is almost never; the influences that portray the military to the public tend to be hostile, or badly mis-informed about what we do, how we think, the way we live, and virtually EVERYthing that has to do with our world.)

And that’s BAD. It has led to misunderstandings and some of the servicemember’s feeling that we are cut off from an ungrateful public that we strive to serve, possibly at the extremity of our own lives. That’s not accurate, and neither is the public’s perception that we’re beetle-browed, barrel-chested, knuckle-dragging sadistic jungle creatures out to destroy the world.

If there is anything you’d like to know about my beloved Air Force or me or my job, ask the Air Force Guy. Again.

2

" and the picture painted by popular culture is usually not flattering, even when it tries to be. (Which is almost never; the influences that portray the military to the public tend to be hostile, or badly mis-informed about what we do, how we think, the way we live, and virtually EVERYthing that has to do with our world.)"

You must be watching different TV than me. I get the impression that you are all stoic shining knights(except for a few bad apples that JAG roots out). But anyway…

I’m curious about Joe Airforce’s feeling about the Kandahar friendly fire episode. Are the pilots getting railroaded? What’s the deal with the amphetimines that are apparently in standard use?

Up in Canada it was getting a lot of airplay, I’m curious how much it showed up on the average airman’s radar.

3

—It has led to misunderstandings and some of the servicemember’s feeling that we are cut off from an ungrateful public that we strive to serve, possibly at the extremity of our own lives—

I think half the problem is that the armed forces serve “the public” only indirectly. They certainly cannot claim to serve all and only the interests of every member of the public at once: that’s just impossible. Individual people will be grateful when you do things that they actually think serve their and the nations interests, and cynical when the opposite is true. So if you feel that “the public” is ungrateful, consider that a) it’s not “the public” because there is no such unitary entity and b) that’s just the way things are and will always be in a truly pluralistic society.

4

If I may answer, Bluesman. I hope I’m not stepping on your toes. :slight_smile:

About the friendly fire episode, yes, I personally think they are getting railroaded. However, they did make some mistakes and some assumptions probably led in some part to the accident. In any event, what it boils down to is that in combat people die, and this mistake is something that should be learned from. There is nothing gained by charging these pilots with murder. There was enough tragedy without disgracing two men who were trying to do their jobs.

As for the amphetamine use, well, I am aircrew, and while I don’t know about specific instances, I can say this: the OPS-TEMPO right now is incredible, and the Air Force in general is undermanned, so people are working much harder than ever before. In addition, no flyer will go to see the Flight Surgeon unless the situation is dire, for fear of being DNIF’d. If the mission must get done, and you’re sick or tired or whatever…see what I’m getting at? I’ve not personally seen it happen, and I would definitely have a few words with a pilot if I did see it, Airman or not, but I’m pretty sure that amphetamines aren’t in “standard use”. Something like that would be noticed and taken care of if it were that rampant, because that is a very serious safety of flight issue.

My two cents, of course. Just like Bluesman, I only speak for myself, not the whole Air Force. And his caveat goes for me, as well.

5

Oh, and a question: When are you going to be a First Shirt? :wink:

6

Christopher Hitchens has recently blasted leftists who’ve been using the term “armchair-hawks” or “chicken-hawks” with reference to people who are pro-committing troops, but whom via various shady means avoided service back when the nation had a draft. His argument is that the idea that you must have served in the military to be qualified to know when to call upon it politically is, to put it mildly, misguided: that it neglects the whole point of the American tradition of civilian command over the military.

What is your take on this controversy, and the take of other servicemen? Do you respect less people who avoided service back when they were called upon, or think they should have limited authority? Or do you agree with Hitchens that such actions, despite being abuses of privelege (abuses, by the way, which are not new: they are a tradition of priveleged people avoiding their draft calls that date back to the Revolutionary war), should have no bearing on people’s fitness to command?

7

So Airman, what do you make of this Global Security article (re: uppers)?

Speaking as a Canadian (though obviously not on behalf of all Canadians) I certainly don’t think they should be charged with murder, burning scapegoats doesn’t prevent future deaths. The Canadian anger was a little misplaced IMO; if you don’t want soldiers to die then don’t send them to warzones. I also think that if the same number of people had been killed at a Ford plant it would have been forgotten(by the media) in 2 days.

Thanks for the answers.

8

Yeah, JAG has most of us as handsome/beautiful movie stars and gets most of the other details wrong, too. :slight_smile:

I don’t feel like the pilots are getting railroaded, because I believe ‘weapons release’ authority is such an awesome responsibility that no doubt should exist prior to fire. If you’ve fired into a friendly, then SOMEthing must’ve convinced you to make that erroneous decision. And that will have to be explained.

Having said that, most of us also feel like there are “damned if you do, damned if you don’t” situations, and the pilots may have felt like they were there that night. If you fly on back to Boondock Airbase with bombs aboard, and during the post-mission brief you hear that a friendly element heard you overhead while they took 90% casualties from the tracers that you remarked on seeing during the flight…you get the picture.

You want to be ACTIVE in helping your buddies on the ground; passivity is not how to move the ball, and in their zeal to take it to the bad guys, they shot the friendlies…well, we can all see how that happens.

But more often than not, our forces go to enormous lengths to see that we don’t shoot the wrong things. I commented on this in my original thread: a video of a bomb in Kosovo being pulled off a target after it was dropped, but before impact. The crew decided at the last moment they weren’t sure, so they dumped the bomb in some trees, knowing that the Serbs would defend the target for the next raid, and either that same crew or their friends would have to come back and face those defences. THAT is friggin’ heroic.

So, the piper has to be paid for the sin of lighting up some good guys, but that’s why officers get more money than me - they are held accountable for their decisions.

As for the amphetamines, much has been made of this, but frankly I don’t think it will ever be in use. The military runs on that good ole South American stimulant - coffee -, so Juan Valdez is our connection, and not Pablo Escobar.

9

How many times have Allied Aircraft retaliated in the No Fly Zones of Operation Northern Watch and Operation Southern Watch after either being illuminated or fired upon by the Iraqis in the last ten years? This is mentioned in passing in the news, so I assume it is not classified, and I think it is a much greater number than most people realize.

10

I could always ask my Aerospace Science Instructor (Col. Gary Praesel, retired USAF) any of these questions, but eh. But:

-Does the AF currently have any program where a laptop is given in reward for pursuing education, like the Army?

-The people who operate stealth bombers. How does one become them?

-How long is basic? Is it just 6 weeks?

-Atheism. Is it tolerated? To what extent?

-How much say does one get in their base?

Thanks in advance.

Cadet 2Lt Arterbury

11

Daoloth: Freedom of Religion (or lack of religion) is a personal issue and is one of the rights everyone in the US has. The military doesn not “tolerate” or “not tolerate” any particular religion. Matter of fact, on my last ship, the USS Independence, the Wiccan group was allotted time and space every week for their services.

12

Perhaps you could tell us about the indoctrination programs that are used to get people to believe things such as the above. Whatever it is, it is very effective.

13

Huh?

14

Bluesman made a statement, i.e. that the popular culture is usually not flattering and often hostile to the armed forces. Since this is the exact opposite of the truth, I was wondering what kind of indoctrination processes are used to get people to believe it.

15

My step-father once told me that he was field stripped in Italy during World War II for failing to salute the rank insignia on the flag on General Patton’s jeep. He said that the General’s lieutenant, who was the driver, spotted him, and that after about ten seconds, the jeep turned around and came back. Patton then said, “Did you fail to salute my stars, boy?”

What I want to know is, how likely is it that that might really have happened?

16

He’s a super lefty. Look at his name. Noam Chompsky.

As usual, Chumpsky asserts you are all tools of the Evil Imperialist-Capitalist American state. You are probably here, in his view, because you were ordered by your superiors on a propoganda mission. After all, its not possible for all those “psycho military generals” and “blind Stormtroopers” in American movies to be fake, now, is it!? :wink:

He’ll never cite anything, never give any reasonable evidence, and he’ll never justify his position, either. Look at few of his other posts if you can stomach them (I try to in the early morning, before breakfast).

17

Well, this IS placed in Great Debates. Bluesman was this your intent? Or GQ?

18

CarnalK, the article makes a declaration, and then proceeds to say “I believe” for the rest of the time. I saw no actual evidence. Self-medication is completely against the rules, and if it were common, it would be caught. Flight Surgeons don’t screw around.

No. But I wish they did. :slight_smile:

I actually asked a pilot that a few weeks ago. You have to have about 4 years of experience, and then you apply. Apparently there is a shortage of stealth pilots, because that program is a black hole. Once you’re in, you can’t ever get out. So hey, if you want to do it, go ahead. But be prepard to never see daylight again. :slight_smile:

Yes, it’s six weeks. Sorta. I was there from November 27 until January 14. that’s 49 days. How, you ask? Thurns out they don’t count Zero Week. Ahhh, Zero Week. The hardest week of BMT. Lotsa fun.

Same as any other religion. Wiccan services, for instances, are openly advertised, so there’s no real taboos as far as religion like one would imagine.

Depends. If you go into BMT with an open contract, very little. If you have a job and Tech School assigned already, you have a pretty good chance of getting what you want. It also depends on your job. Most of the people in my career field go to Tinker or Robins, and that’s well known ahead of time. There are other options, but they’re kinda rare.

So, what’s your job, sir?

19

Yo Bluesman, at the danger of raining on your parade, I hope you would reconsider talking too much.

I see your location and people there should not talk.

Sorry to be a spoilsport.

20

Very likely, actually. It happened to me at Keesler with a Colonel. We were taught to salute the car, just in case. I just missed the rank insignia for some reason. Sounds funny, but they earned the rank and we’re obligated to respect it, so there you go.