In this entertaining thread, the story is repeated by several Canadians that they won the War of 1812, including burning the White House. This assertion is quite puzzling to those of us Americans who are more in tune with the notion that British marines, sent ashore from the ships that failed to destroy Fort McHenry, did it as an act of spite. Canada’s portion of the war is told to us in history class as having offered up Toronto, then called York, for invasion and capture, with the American troops soon leaving out of apparent boredom. The war otherwise, in our version, consisted of some ass-kickings of British ships by Old Ironsides, and the Battle of New Orleans.
So what is the basis for this odd bit of Canadian folklore? Why do they think they were even in the War of 1812, much less the victors?
The war was pretty much a draw. Generally, (meaning that there are several prominent exceptions), the U.S. won on its soil and the Brits won on their soil (which quite a bit later became Canada).
The Brits successfully took Detroit and later won a decisive victory at the River Raisin.
Each side traded Mackinac Island.
The Yanks were initially successful at York and were very successful at the Battle of the Thames where Tecumseh died, leaving a gap in the leadership of the Eastern Indians.
Later attempts to invade Canada were repulsed and the British did not even attempt further invasions of the Northwest Territory.
Similarly, while the USS Constitution had a marvelous record of victories and Perry did well on the Great lakes, the U.S. also suffered several defeats at sea, notably the Frigate Chesapeake.
The only ones who actually lost the war of 1812 were the indians who were not included in the peace negotiations and whose lands were divvied up with no consideration of their presence.
Yeah, that was a really bad account of the war, but I defend its accuracy as summing up what most Americans think they know about it. And that, I assert, is more accurate than what Canadians think they know about it.
But thanks for pointing out that the war wasn’t “won” by anyone, much less Canada.
I’m Canadian, and I was taught pretty much the same thing. I think the logic goes like this - Since the American’s “started it” and failed to conquer Canada (or, British territory that would become Canada), they lost. Since they lost, “we” won.
The idea of applying current borders to the past isn’t a concept unique to Canadians. A lot of pre-annexation Texas history is considered American history.
Saying Canada won the war of 1812 is like saying that France won the First Punic War. It’s stupid, and Canadians only brag about things so stupid because they’re jealous of us. I actually hear this a lot from Canadians, and included is a moronic “Ha! Vietnam is the only war the U.S. has lost? Think again.”
I am Canadian, and I don’t recall anyone telling me that “Canada” won the war of 1812. As a matter of fact, I don’t think I even heard of this phenomena before I met the SDMB.
Personally, I believe the only people that say this are Americans trying to sabotage us by trying to make Canadians look like idiots. You know the ones… the kind of Americans that sew Canadian flags on their jacket when they go overseas so they don’t get the shit kicked out of them?
I shouldn’t go out on a limb like this without better sources, but I think U.S. had a fairly obvious and well-articulated ambition to grab much if not most of the St. Lawrence watershed, driven by the western Members of Congress who aligned with the War Hawks, including Henry Clay.
Three separate incursions into Canada by Americans were repulsed, largely by local troops–nascent Canadians. Canada’s territorial integrity was preserved, and that territory eventually became and remains their own today, so in that sense it was quite a fine victory, indeed, won on largely equal terms.
Sofa King: I don’t think it’s accurate to say that the Americans were repulsed “largely by local troops.” I think “with the assistance of local troops” is probably accurate. (I think there are some references in the second link.)
Canadians have strong opinions about the war, Americans a bit less so. Brits seem to remain silent on the entire subject, possibly because to them it was an unimportant footnote to the Napoleonic Wars.
I like Canada alot. Let’s try to take it again. Just convince Bush that there is a ton of oil up there and…wait, there is a ton of oil up there. What are we waiting for?
Canada existed in 1812, just not in the form of the post-1867 confederation. In 1812, Canada was a British colony equivalent to what is now Ontario and Quebec. There were separate British colonies in New Brunswick, Nova Scotia, and Newfoundland.
From the perspectives of the Americans and British, the War of 1812 was a draw. Each side won when on the defensive–the British/Canadians repulsed invasions of Canada, and the Americans repulsed invasions of the United States. (The American victory at Fort McHenry, by the way, took place after the sack of Washington.
From a Canadian perspective, however, this could be considered an outright victory. Most Canadians didn’t care about the larger imperial British war aims, such as reducing the United States to neo-colonial status and establishing an independent Indian confederacy in the American Midwest. They were happy as long as they were allowed to remain independent from the United States. So Canadians can count the War of 1812 as a win, but only because of lower objectives and expectations. A metaphor, perhaps, for . . . no, I won’t finish the thought.
Today one can travel to Queenstown Heights outside Niagara Falls and see the “Brock Monument”, which must surely rank as one of the few monuments in the world built to celebrate an American defeat. (Perhaps there are others in Vietnam.) It makes for a rather humbling and unfamiliar experience for an American to visit.
There’s also an interesting monument on the site of the Battle of Crysler’s Farm. The monument has two different plaques. The first one, erected in 1895, glories in the British Empire’s defeat of the Yankee invaders. The second, erected in 1961, regrets the unfortunate misunderstanding between two close friends. Interesting contrast there, and a lot of history between the lines.
The Battle of Crysler’s Farm, by the way, was one of the decisive land battles of the war:
It really makes me giggle when folks put 1812 to U.S. victory or a draw.
Let us say that South Carolina got it into its head to go invade North Carolina. North Carolina successfully repels the invasion, fights a number of battles deep into South Carolina and even burns down the S.C. governor’s mansion. North Carolina eventually returns its troops to within its original borders and the war is over without the South gaining one inch of territory. The North won right? It didn’t want a war, but when it got one, it repelled the invaders. The defenders defeated the invader’s plans of conquest. Never having the intention of invading the South, the North had only to keep all of its territory intact in order to win. Just like Canada.
Coffeeguy, your analogy tears itself to shreds on the historic fact that the Brits also invaded the U.S. with the intent to reclaim land lost (or left unresolved) at the Treaty of Paris. Had the war in the Northwest Territory and Upper Canada been purely defensive, you might have an analogy. It was not–by either side.
