Temporal Lobe Epilepsy and Spiritual Prophets

Great Debates
1

Within the past year I watched a show about Temporal Lobe Eplilepsy on PBS
which has sparked my curiosity about this topic. I’m afraid I cannot
remember the show, but Google is ripe with various perspectives on this
condition.

A sample:

Did Joseph Smith Suffer From Temporal Lobe Epilepsy?

From The Storm Artists with Temporal Lobe Epilepsy

Did Ezekiel Have Temporal Lobe Epilepsy?

Epilepsy ‘found in biblical prophet’

On the show I can’t remember, a young man with the condition and his father were discussing
their experiences with the young man’s seizures. His testimony was that
when he is having a seizure, among other things, everything around him
becomes so painfully beautiful and connected, that he is overcome with
emotion and brought to tears. When asked if he would attempt treatment if
one were available, he said that he would not sacrifice the intensity of
emotion and connectedness with the world around him which come with his
seizures.

One medical explanation provided was that during the electrical storm that
occures during an epileptic seizure of the temporal lobe, a cascade of
chemical reactions are sparked, similar to that which occures in the
chemistry of your brain when you look at a photograph of your parents.
The neurochemical cascade causes that same emotional signifigance that one would
place on the image of loved ones, to be applied to anything within the
epileptic’s perception.

It has been proposed that certain prophets and historical figures may have
exhibited symptoms of Temporal Lobe Eplilepsy, and that their prophetic
messages and orations may have been consequences of this condition, appart from being
supposed messages from God or the voice of revolution.

I’ve already betrayed my own religionless views, but I do feel that all of existance is united, and I do not think any views should be ignored, but rather applied by those who wish to, when they wish to.

With that being said, I am curious what
spiritual folk and others think.

Would it matter to you, as a follower of a prophetic faith, if there were
physical factors influencing a prophet’s visions? Would a condition like
Temporal Lobe Epilepsy be considered a disease or a “gift from God?” Would
a physical origin erode the signifagance of the message in your eyes?

2

Not trying a hijack but I think there’s a connection here to sleep paralysis, which I used to get on a regular basis. Studies I have seen in scientific documentaries in the UK on TV showed that it also has something to do with stimulation of the temporal lobes.

There are records of people suffering from sleep paralysis and seeing visions, going back hundreds of years.

Very scary the first few times you get it, VERY scary, but then get to a stage when you can almost ‘control’ it, as you get to know the signs of it starting. Difficult to describe what happens really, but its like your body is turning into a huge power transformer, buzzing like hell.

I found I could ‘escape’ by making sure I left a finger free to wiggle (so no going to sleep with hands under the pillow for example). when the buzzing and paralysis hit, the harder you try to move, the more it takes hold, but if you concentrate like hell, just on putting all your strength into moving that finger, you can eventually pull out of it.

Also, if you are prone to it, NEVER sleep on your back, as you’re asking for trouble.

As for visions, I sometimes had the ‘feeling’ there were others around me, or talking in the next room, or just behind the door (I lived alone at this point).

Very spooky.

After a few years, it started to die away, and now I hardly ever get it any more.

Sleep paralysis is also thought to be the main cause of the ‘UFO kidnap’ events suffered by so many people.

3

There is a wonderful novel, Lying Awake by Mark Salzman, that deals with the subject. The quote is from the NYT:

A compelling, meaningful read.

4

I’ve heard this theory applied to Paul as well. To wit, his experience on the road to Damascus may have been an epileptic seizure. I find it interesting but not necessarily invalidating. If an experience brings insight, joy and wisdom, what difference does it make what causes it?

5

The standard–and very valid–reply is that the simple fact that there is brain activity that is correlated with religious experiences doesn’t say one bit about the truth or nature of that which causes it. There’s brain activity correlated with seeing an apple, that doesn’t mean the apple’s not actually there–then again, neither does it say it is.

6

This topic of what Maslow referred to as “peak experences” has fascinated me for twenty years. I had no idea what Maslow was referring to and didn’t care – until it happened to me, but only one time.

The OP and the responses have been so beautifully open. I believe that it is possible that such experiences are a glimpse of other levels of reality. I don’t want to be the resident Bliss Bunny, but I’ve seen what chemistry can do to perception of reality. Believe me, chemicals are affecting what you perceive as reality as you read.

There is also the possibility that my experience was in reaction to rounds of “electric shock therapy” forty years ago. Maybe that jump-started (the technical term) my ability to experience what I did.

It would not bother me a bit that prophets might have had temporal lobe epilepsy. That seems like such a clinical term for an overpoweringly awakening experience. But – “That which we call a rose, by any other name would smell as sweet.”

honeydewgrrl, thanks for broadening my reading in this area by putting a name to it.

Would I want to be “cured”? No way!

7

—The standard–and very valid–reply is that the simple fact that there is brain activity that is correlated with religious experiences doesn’t say one bit about the truth or nature of that which causes it.—

While true, having a biological explanation certainly undercuts the idea that we simply cannot explain these experiences in any other way than insights into alternative realities. While there’s no way to rule it out… there’s no longer any necessity for it either.

And what about the people who seem to have these experiences WITHOUT such biological events?

There’s an interesting essay on this (the contributions of mental illness) sticky question in the collection of essays called “The Trouble With Testosterone” by… erg I can’t remember. His point is not to dismiss religion as mental illness (as people always seem to take this issue whenever it comes up): indeed his point is that many religions have had to struggle with whether to accept or reject the insights of people that seem mentally ill, but also seem to connect their symptoms with religion. This has, historically, been a very complex relationship.

He does make a pretty telling case, for instance, that Martin Luther was OCD (obsessive hand-washing, constant checking, obsessive confession, etc.), and indeed describes something I’d never heard about: a Catholic proceedure (and there’s a similar one in Judiasm) where people who obsessive about rules and self-punishment are not just absolved from having to follow all the rules, but actually required NOT to do so until they follow them for reasons other than sheer obsession and repitition.

8

This is similar to what happens in the near death experience. The person sees a great light and feels loved and wonderful, also visions of things more beautiful than can be described.

Now, science is going to look at this as biological in nature, but those who experience them look at it as spiritual. When we leave/try to leave our physical bodies, things like this happen.

Any time the focus of the consciousness changes from looking outward to looking inward this happens, or some elements of it.
Drugs can cause some of it, meditation, day dreaming, extreme fear, or the things discussed above. The amount and intensity of the experience will follow the amount and intensity of the change in focus.

I think I will stop here for the opinions of others.

9

Gods of gaps tend to inevitably be squeezed, sure enough. Their own fault for being so cottony soft!

Was this book the one holding the essay you referenced? It sounds fascinating.

10

I agree.

The relationship between mental/biological “abnormalities” and “heightened” abilities and/or perceptions definitely piques my interests.

If you will allow me a rather subjective argument, one has to suppose that people such as John Nash have been contributing to the collective knowlege base since the dawn of human kind. One also has to suppose that individuals in every walk of life have been and are positively impacting the world around them due to direct consequences of their “abnormalities”… whether they’re aware of it or not. Just like “abnormalities” can contribute to crime and negative impacts on existence.

While socieity is relatively comfortable with the concept that a mentally ill murderer may not be conciously responsible for his/her own actions, I think that applying the same reasoning to academic breakthroughs and testimonials of enlightenment is akin to throwing the baby out with the bath water. What is gained by dismissing the perspectives of non-violent, non-criminal, non-“normal” minds?

11

Yep, that’s the book: Robert M. Sapolsky. I especially liked the chapter on Steven Hawking.

12

If any UK dopers are interested, there is a Horizon programme about temporal lope epilepsy and spiritual prophecy tonight at 9.00pm on BBC2.

13

It was cancelled due to the war reports…nevermind.

14

I think this is an interesting issue to consider (and a great thread, so far!) - does it damage a prophet’s credibility if his/her visions are found to be caused by a seizure disorder? Personally, I doubt it. I think Drastic makes a very important point, in saying that the neural activity of a seizure does not necessarily devalue the spiritual experience. It is worth noting that temporal lobe epilepsy is so poorly understood by science, that even with modern diagnostics, an organic cause often cannot be found. Thus, there would be no evidence to contradict a person one who feels the activity is being caused by contact with a higher being.

If you’ll humor me, I’d like to add a personal note (largely unrelated to the debate at hand, but my ego o’erwhelms me):
I have had temporal lobe seizures occasionally for most of my life, and I have found mine to be extremely uncomfortable - not at all what I would imagine a religious vision to be. In my case, seizures consist of a very odd feeling of dissociation - the only way I can describe it is to say that it feels as though I’m watching the world on television, and that I can have no part in what is going on around me. There’s no apparent problem with my brain, so the cause was never defined (my neurologist supposed it’s probably a tiny congenital lesion too small to be imaged on MRI). Fortunately, the seizures, which were so frequent while I was in college as to be near-constant, have spontaneously decreased now to the point that I haven’t had one in months. Yay!
… Of course, the nature of complex partial seizures is such that they vary enormously from patient to patient, so while mine are unpleasant, Ezekiel or Paul may well have had much nicer, more beautiful ones.