Where's my fucking affordable health care, you fucking fuck? [lame]

The BBQ Pit
1

My wife recently had to quit work due to a degenerative neurological condition-slash-brain deformity. For the curious, she’s got seven-year-old, basically untreated RSD progressing on one side of her body, and the back of her brain is hanging out the bottom of her skull. This has made it increasingly more difficult for her to work. In January, we decided it was better that she stay home, rest, recuperate, etc, and try to lead some semblance of a fufilled life than put herself through the agony and shame of attempting to lever herself out of bed every morning to make it in to the office, and only make it half the time.

We figured that I’m making enought for the two of us to live on, she’s probably eligable for disability, and once I’m done with school, I should be making more than enough for her to look for a satisfying carreer that she can physically handle. In the intervening couple of years, her only job is to try to get better.

The only thing we were concerned about is health insurance. See, she worked for a large public agency that, while currently underfunded and laying people off, is big enough to negotiate a relatively sweet deal for the employees. Sure, the out-of-pocket has doubled in the past three years, but compared to what everybody else is getting, it’s not too bad.

I work for a company with less than twenty employees. While the straight-up pay and up-front tuition is nice, they’re getting absolutely KILLED on insurance costs. Understandable, of course. Our pissant little business can’t really bring a lot of pressure to bear on any of the three local insurance providers to get a better deal.

So anyway, I went to get my wife’s monthly prescription refills yesterday. I paid $342.something in co-pays. $342!!! I realize that a lot of people have it a lot worse, and maybe the fact that this is a particularly tight month is exaggerating the effect, but come-on, that’s a metric shit-ton of money.

I’m going to see a shrink this week to take yet another stab at dealing with my ADD. This guy is in-network. One of the maybe dozen in my metro-area of a million plus that’s actually on the plan. Guess how much the copay, for a med maintenance visit is?

Fifty. Fucking. Bucks.

I know it sounds like I’m whining. A lot of people have to deal with a lot worse. We’re not starving or selling blood to get meds. We have cable and several magazine subscriptions. We probably eat out more than we should.

Still, close to 25% of our net income is currently going to health care costs. And that’s not counting my contribution to the premiums, which is another $150/month.

But all this bitching isn’t necessarily apropos of self-pity or frustration. It has more to do with two little snippets of info that I read / didn’t read this week. Combined with the sticker shock at Walgreens, they really started me steaming:

[ul]
[li]Paul Krugman’s recent couple of columns on health care in the NYT. Here’s and executive summary. Basically, we spend about 160% as much as other industrialized countries on health care, per capita and as a percentage of the GDP, for much. much crappier care.[/li]
[li]Presiden’t Bush’s campaign pledge for an initiative to allow small businesses “collective bargaining” powers in health insurance negotiations. Not my ideal solution; I’m a social democrat, so I love me some proletarian revolution, but I can see how the notion could help. So I checked out his web site to see how everything is moving along.[/li]
Guess how much work they’ve done on the whole deal since he got inaugurated?

You guessed right: Jack. Shit.
[/ul]

Motherfucker can come home from fucking vacation early to “save” a nearly-dead Medicaid recipient who didn’t want his help, anyway? Shithead can go barnstorming around the country letting people that the sky is gonna come tumblin’ down on Social Security sometime in the next twenty-to-ten-million years angd we gotta fix it nownownow? But he ain’t got time to do ONE STINKING FUCKING THING about the real problem that every non-stupid economist agrees is the biggest impending social welfare disaster we’re looking at?

Well…

…shit. I’m so worn out from being worried and tired and working my fucking ass off that I don’t have the energy to properly express my impotent rage. Point: Bush.

2

First, my sympathy for you and your wife. My husband requires tons of expensive medications - at times it has been quite a financial burden.

Second, save all of the receipts. Health expenses above 7% of your income are tax deductible.

Third, blaming Bush is futile. Our problems with health care have taken decades to develop.

The U.S. has higher health care costs per capital because we have more and better technology. You don’t have to wait 8 months to get an MRI because there are only two in the entire country. Malpractice costs, exacerbated by the American Trial Lawyer Cartel, don’t help the case any either.

Bush is going to take on SS before tackling Medicare. It is an easier problem to solve and good practice for the bigger one.

For a good read on the looming budget crisis due to SS & Medicare, I highly recommend Peter Petersen’s “Running on Empty”.

3

See? We have better and more stuff. Yeah, you can’t afford to even go into the radiology lab and LOOK at it, but it’s better. And we have more of them. See?

My, aren’t we the optimist?

4

And yet, all those countries with less and worse equipment have longer life expectancies and lower infant mortality rates than us. Huh.

5

Health care is not a right. It consists of goods and services that others produce and for which they deserve compensation.

Perhaps if the average total tax burden (fed, state, SS, property, sales etc.) on the median American family had not doubled since the 1950s, more people could afford health care.

What do you suggest - that doctors and nurses have wage controls enforced by the government? - that medical technology providers have priced caps enforced by the government?

Personally, I’d rather see individuals be able to pool their resources into consumer coops, completely independent of their source of employment, in order to by castrophic health insurance. Health emergencies are a big driver in total expenditures - and the single biggest factor in personal bankruptcies. For coverage in this area, I would be willing to pay for all of my routine care out of pocket - just like people used to do.

Another thing to think about is how much is spent on the last few weeks of a terminally ill person’s life. Living wills are one way to avoid these extraordinary and futile expenses. But such a decision to refuse care should only be decided by the individual. If they want the life support to continue, then let them pay higher insurance premiums in advance to provide for it.

6

That sucks. Sorry, and thanks.

Done.

True. I blame everybody who voted, called into Rush, wrote a letter to the editor, or ranted against Hillarycare. If it weren’t for those greedy/stupid/hysterical peices of shit, we wouldn’t be in this situation right now.

If that matters, then why do we have such a shitty health care system? Our infant mortality rates are higher than most of the rest of the industrialized world.

Nice bullshit excuse. Trial lawyers make up a miniscule portion of our health care costs. A vastly larger percentage goes to the industry’s unconscionable profit margins.

Frankly, I’d rather he use some of that reserve of steadfastness and resolve everybody seems to have such a hardon for to take on the actual dire problem first. You know, the one where people are getting fucked over right now?

“My fellow Americans; I know you’re suffering under the weight of an unworkable health care system, and many of you will go broke or perhaps die because of it. But I don’t really know what the hell I’m doing here, and I need some practice, so let’s do Social Security first. Or maybe bomb Iran.”

Sorry for biting your head off. But this pisses me off, and I no longer have the slightest bit of patience for the same old excuses and bullshit I’ve been hearing for almost fifteen years.

7

But the tough problem of a broken medical system will be ever so much easier for our president to deal with once he’s holding his ass in his hands over SS privitization.

8

They are miniscule compared to many countries - and the factors affecting them are rather complex. One could argue that better nutrition and health care enables babies that would have been miscarried to survive the birthing process.

It’s not a bullshit excuse. Malpractice insurance and the subsequent drama of dealing iwth claims has had an impact on the supply of doctors. Supply-Demand imbalances drive up prices. Did you read about the OB-GYNs in (West) Virginia (can’t recall which one) that went on strike because of malpractice insurance? Any parasite which feeds off of a host excessively reduces the viability of the host.

[qyote]Frankly, I’d rather he use some of that reserve of steadfastness and resolve everybody seems to have such a hardon for to take on the actual dire problem first. You know, the one where people are getting fucked over right now?

“My fellow Americans; I know you’re suffering under the weight of an unworkable health care system, and many of you will go broke or perhaps die because of it. But I don’t really know what the hell I’m doing here, and I need some practice, so let’s do Social Security first. Or maybe bomb Iran.”

Sorry for biting your head off. But this pisses me off, and I no longer have the slightest bit of patience for the same old excuses and bullshit I’ve been hearing for almost fifteen years.
[/QUOTE]

I don’t take it personally. This is just a message board. It would help for you to consider the politicis involved in reforming entitlement programs. SS is not known as the third rail of politics for no reason. The AARP lobby is very active and nasty. Medicare is even more untouchable than SS. We have to start somewhere. I’ll be happy to see any progress in reducing government spending.

9

First of all, I’m sorry to hear about your families present difficulties and hope you’ll get everything worked out to your satisfaction a.s.a.p.

Secondly do you have a cite to support the claim below?

I’m not saying I don’t believe you but if you’ve got a cite handy I’d be very interested in seeing a breakdown of our health care costs and the % amount which goes on malpractise insurance. If not, then don’t worry.

10

Only because we choose not to make it so.

Or maybe if we had a sensible health policy in the country.

Did I say any of that? What the hell are you babbling about?

Right, let’s go back to the good old days. Back when the infant mortality rate was 26/1,000 instead of the 6.8/1,000 it is now and live expectancy was 69 years instead of the 77 years it is now.

11

Buggery. Can’t construct posts for shit today. :mad:

12

I am of course referring to my post 9 and not Neurotik’s post 10 :slight_smile:
[sub]These two extraneous posts brought to you courtesy of the only board on the internet without a bloody edit function![/sub]

13

black455, I think the lack of universal healthcare (either through a socialist state-run program OR health care that’s at least “universally affordable”) is one of our countries biggest problems, and I hope that 20 years from now we look back on all the needless suffering with a feeling of shame. In the meantime, I don’t know what else to say but that I hope your wife’s situation improves.

One thing I’ve learned hear is that doctors can take ability to pay into account when prescribing medications–have you let your wife’s doctors know how much it’s costing you? Sometimes they can pick older, off-patent medications that are easier on the pocket book. I obviously have no clue if that would apply in your situation, though.

14

Who pays for the positive rights you decide belong to you? The Bill of Rights is a document of negative rights (the rights to be left alone). Every time you assert a positive right (the right to something produced by someone else) you are infringing on others’ rights to be left alone.

And what would that be? Please descrive a sensible health policy.

It is the reductio ad absurdum of thinking you can get something for free or below cost.

Then what are you complaining about? Our health care system must not be so bad given the improvements in lifespan and infant mortality.

15

No direct cites, but I have two. One from a PriceWaterhouse study on what’s causing healthcare costs to increase. They found that total healthcare costs increased 13.7% from 2001-02, while litigation and malpractice costs only increased 1%. So, essentially, those fiendish trial lawyers were only resposible for about 7% of the total increase.

And from the Congressional Budget Office (Warning! PDF) on malpractice costs:

Trial lawyers are a bogeyman that conservatives throw around to shift blame off of their own failed policies and those of the health care industry they cater to.

16

As of the World Health Report 2003, the USA’s average life expectancy was exceeded only by Japan, Italy, Norway and Britain. The World Bank also has the USA pretty much matching the rest of the industrialised world as of 1998 (I can’t find anything more recent at the moment). The rate is indeed higher than quite a few other industrialised nations, but not exactly shockingly so.

I’m not trying to make any sort of point about healthcare provision, by the way, but it’s not really true that the USA has a worrying rate of infant mortality or an unusually low life expectancy.

17

Last year, while I was working for a different employer, I was told our small company’s health insurance was going to go up by $100 a month, a little less than 1 1/2 times what it had been. I went to one of the owners and told him if that happened, I could not afford health insurance and would have to do without it. I was lucky. He went back to our provider and negotiated a smaller, more manageable increase.

A couple of months ago, the newspaper reported that the company which provided that health insurance had tripled their profits last year.

I’m in excellent health. The only things I’ve used health insurance for during the past year are birth control and a particularly nasty case of flu. Nevertheless, health insurance is the second biggest expense in my budget, behind only mortgage payments.

There must be a better way of doing things.

CJ

18

Plan on staying worn out for the remainder of the lying bastard’s term. This isn’t the first time he’s outright lied about his intentions with regard to healthcare reform. If people had either been paying attention, or gave a shit about this issue or his lies about it, we might’ve avoided his entire presidency after he puked his lies in the 2000 debates. I posted details here, way back when. As I said, plan on staying worn out for the duration.

I’m sorry about your wife’s condition. I looked it up, and it sounds excrutiating. I hope she can find relief soon.

19

The trade-off, of course, is that a certain percentage of the country can’t get one ever.

20

Nothing can be right in America until we fix health care. It is the biggest problem our nation faces, and it is only because of sheer pig-headedness and I’ve-got-mine-ness that we are so far from fixing anything.

Our health care system doesn’t work. Face it. It’s broken. It’s fucked up. It kills people. It drives people broke who have done nothing wrong. It causes no end up uneccesary human misery- in this, America, richest land on earth. Even people who work, pay their insane premiums, and do all that they can get screwed over and over again. And there are huge swathes of working people and children who simply cannot get any health care at all.

And none of this has to happen. For the same money we can have a system that works. Dozens of nations do. They are laughing at us. They thank god they live in their frozen climbs and don’t have to worry about this bullshit. They arn’t complaining about waiting lists or worried about some impending doom. They are happy with their system and can’t see why their otherwise levelheaded neighbor is acting so goddamn stupid about this.

Fuck it. I hate it. I hate every single one of you that fights against fixing health care. I don’t see that it will ever be fixed, because the health care business is to big to fight and too many people would rather give $100 to those bastards instead of sparing $1.00 to the government.