I understand that the reason OJ doesn’t eminate a ton of gases is because all the microbes in there have been killed off by the treatments (pasteurized). This is great so that it lasts longer in the fridge, but what other living things (besides the microbes) are in the OJ that have been killed off? Phytochemicals? Enzymes? I have been juicing (in my mouth) oranges and grapefruits instead of buying the juice because of a lack of info on this subject… I would love to just purchase the juice and do it the easy way, as long as I don’t compromise the biological value of my fruits and such…
Fruit juices don’t have much biological value to begin with, basically water and fruit sugar. The amount of vitamins and other trace minerals are pretty trivial to begin with, save for Vitamin C, which processed juices have a lot of. Fruit juice is really about as healthy as soft drinks with sugar.
Why bother juicing it? Eat the fruit. That’s where the most benefits come in, in terms of getting a decent amount of fiber.
Have you ever heard of “Not from concentrate”? Apple juice, Orange juice, pineapple juice, ect. I guess I won’t drink those anymore because they aren’t healthy!
I’ll answer your question, if it really is one? I don’t care to eat tons of grams of fiber every day, while I still want to consume lots of healthy fruits. So, I put the orange slice in my mouth, squeeze the juice out and drink it, and spit the pulp out. This is the logical thing to do, the way I see it.
Suit yourself. But it’s not much different from taking a mouthful of orange soda pop, from a nutrition standpoint.
Fiber is the healthiest part of the fruit.
I hope I can be honest here: If I didn’t know any better (that you were a respected member here and indeed worthy of that status) I would think you were the most insane person I have ever spoken to after saying something like that last post. Just being honest. So, either I am deficient in my understanding of diet or you are being narrow-sighted, with scientific blinders fixed on your head. Again, just being honest.
I just need to clarify something before we go any further: You mean to say that the juice of an orange has no nutritional value beyond Vit. C? What about phytochemicals and enzymes? Do those things exist or are they an apparition created by the non-medical community?
Are you assuming that science has definitively uncovered all the information possibly available about the contents of raw fruits? yes. Are you then assuming that science has definitively uncovered all the info possible on the effects of the contents of raw fruits on a human body in every possible combination of physiological status and all variables taken into account? Yes. Just clarifying.
Thanks for your honesty. But in my opinion, you are deficient in your understanding of diet and nutrition.
Orange juice is basically water, fruit sugar, and some vitamin C. Phytochemicals and enzymes exist, but frankly rigorous scientific evidence that they are of benefit is pretty much lacking. Evidence that fruit juices are more nutritious than an equal amount of sugar and water is quite lacking too. Now many people will make claims about the healing powers of their juices and concoctions, but what they cite as “scientific evidence” definitely is not.
No, not all has been discovered. But it’s not my job to disprove that drinking fruit juice will keep you healthy and make you live to be 200. I can only cite actual, factual evidence that points out that such claims are not currently very credible.
QtM, what’s your view on anthocyanins? (not from orange juice, obviously, but suppose we’re talking about purple grape juice or something containing blackcurrants)
Well, they certainly have anti-oxidant properties. Whether or not said properties confer any real or lasting clinical benefit remains to be seen. Lots of people hawk them as miracle supplements, I’m not convinced by their claims.
It’s like with Vitamin E. When studies came out touting its anti-oxidant effect, everybody started popping vitamin E pills. Then a megastudy was done which indicated that such supplements were not helpful, and actually might be harmful. The benefit from vitamin E was actually the benefit from eating foods rich in vitamin E. Along with the fiber and other stuff like complex carbs and minimal fats.
It’s not that complex. Current evidence indicates its better to eat less saturated fats, salt, sugars and starches, and more whole fruits and vegetables and grains and fibers.
So are there benefits to eating fruit besides fiber? Do you get any other nutrients, vitamins, minerals etc. that you don’t get from juice?
Thanks for the tip, QtM. After I finish this Carton of OJ I’m switching to whole Grapefruits for Breakfast.
First of all, phytochemicals and enzymes aren’t alive to begin with, so they can’t be “killed”. They can, of course, degrade or suffer destruction.
What’s wrong with the fiber? Are you getting so much otherwise that the additional fiber from fruits would cause a problem?
Frankly, as I get older I find I need more fiber to … um… er… keep things moving along, as it were.
Well, OK - but it seems a little peculiar to some of the rest of us.
Well, sure, fruits do have things other than water, sugar, and vitamin C… but in very, very small amounts. Other foods are much better sources of these nutrients. Also, what little bits there are of these things in fruit when it’s first picked degrades over a matter of days, so unless you’re eating oranges immediately after you yourself pluck them from the tree you’re getting little of them, if any. This is why properly frozen foods sometimes have more nutrition than “fresh” - the freezing process halts much of the degradation, particularly that due to enzymes in the food whereas “fresh” might mean “unprocessed, but having spent the last two weeks in shipment.”
You are indeed deficient in your understanding of diet. This is something that seems to shock a lot of people, but fruit juice ain’t that great for you. (I also wonder how much of the vitamin content is trapped in the pulp of the fruit, but I don’t know if it’s a significant amount.) Why don’t you want plenty of fiber every day? That’s a rather bizarre thing to avoid.
It’s fine if you wish to follow some sort of new-agey, unproven diet, but it’s not really fair to call people “insane” when they point out that science doesn’t support you. If you wish to do so without science’s support, go right ahead. But fruit juice just isn’t particularly healthy. And it’s extremely sugary.
I don’t mean to be insulting here, but I suspect that only you would see it that way.
They are largely of no proven benefit. That’s not to say they don’t provide a benefit, but the benefit may be more than offset by the substantial amount of sugar present in fruit juice. Sugar, whether in refined or natural forms, isn’t good for you in excessive quantities. If you read the label on a bottle of orange juice, you’ll be shocked at the amount of sugar present.
Most of these miracle chemicals found in plants are not proven to have any positive impact on health. They are hyped by the media (both mainstream and alternative) on the basis of very small studies, or studies with serious methodological flaws, or simply on the basis of research that hasn’t been confirmed by other scientists. Like I said, it doesn’t mean they aren’t beneficial, but just that there’s no strong reason to think they are. The alternative medicine community seems to be more inclined than mainstream science to either latch onto unproven ideas, or to hang on to concepts long after they’re shown to be ineffective. Which isn’t to say that alternative medicine is without value, but it must be used in the context of a certain skepticism because there are those willing to make extremely bizarre, unproven claims about potentially dangerous (and often expensive) therapies and supplements.
Well, it comes down to philosophy, eventually, doesn’t it? There is very real harm that comes from a diet too high in sugar - this is something well-known and well-illustrated. There is a possible benefit to be obtained from certain heretofore unknown nutrients, but past experience shows that this benefit often disappears with subsequent study. Vitamin E, mentioned above, is an excellent example, as is the previous nutritional darling, beta carotene, which also is not beneficial in high doses, and increases lung cancer risks in smokers.
It goes to show that the media hype over nutrients is very often wrong, and if you take it too seriously, you run the risk of doing yourself substantial harm while chasing whatever phantom of improved health a magazine has created.
So is the danger of adding excess sugar to your diet outweighed by the definitely-overblown and possibly nonexistent benefits of the latest nutritional craze? That’s for you to decide. Just don’t demand science go along with you on your decision.
:smack:
Metastudy! Not megastudy! And from my dear old Alma Mater, too. How humiligrating!
I dunno, looking at the label of my Tropicana not-from-concentrate orange juice, it says that it contains not only Vitamin C, but Vitamin E, Riboflavin, Bitamin B6, Magnesium, Thiamine, Niacin, and folate.
Looks like more than sugar water to me.
How many of those occur naturally and how many are added during processing?
I mean, look at the calcium-added orange juice out there - there’s nothing wrong with it, but you won’t get that calcium simply by sucking on unmodified orange pulp.
The container I’m referring to has one ingredient: orange juice.
And I imagine if I’d bought the kind that has “pulp,” which I hate, I’d have gotten some fiber, too.
I’m with you on commercial apple juice, though. Many of us have given it to kiddies, believing it was healthy, but it really IS not much more than sugar water with, if we’re lucky, vitamin C added.
Real orange juice – either fresh squeezed or even from concentrate – has lots of good stuff in it that is NOT processed in. Ditto good tomato juice and even grape juice.
One thing that puzzles me is that pomegranate juice has been touted as being super good for you, and yet the nutritional info says it has virtually nothing in it. It’s *very expensive * sugar water, as far as I can tell.
You could get those from eating oranges too, though. And oranges fill you up better than orange juice - give a kid access to an orange juice container and they’ll suck it down and consume a ton of sugar in the process. Give them oranges and I’d be surprised if they could eat more than a few - plus they get lots of good fiber in the process.
I was drinking juice in a misguided attempt to eat healthier, until I checked the label versus soda. Lots of calories in juice, plus people will typically drink more of it figuring they’re being “healthy.” Frankly, you’re better off drinking water and eating an orange. If you’re all that worried about missing a couple vitamins, take a vitamin pill or something.
What Ferret Herder said. Also, you don’t need very much of all those things listed up there. The American Ideal, “If some is good, more is better” really is not applicable. Especially since you’re gulping a ton of sugar to get the stuff.
Now, things like Tomato juice, and the various vegetable juices don’t have nearly so much sugar, but rather more complex carbs that don’t spike the blood sugar, along with a lot of soluble fiber.
As for grape and pomegranite juice, they’re rich in anti-oxidants. But as I noted earlier, whether or not said anti-oxidants do one enough good to outweigh the enormous sugar load in those juices has not been demonstrated.
I thought the American Ideal was, “Nothing succeeds like excess.”
I meant to ask about this last night, but spaced it. I like V-8. I know it’s got a ton of salt in it, but I get the impression that overall it’s actually pretty good for me. Did you just confirm that?