Q: How many poor, black Katrina victims does it take to equal one rich 9/11 victim?

A: we’re still counting.

The Constitution tells us one black man is 3/5 of a white man, so if you estimate 40,000 refugees in New Orleans (99% of whom are black), we have roughly the equivalent of 24,000 white refugees. The Constitution doesn’t draw distinctions between average whites and rich whites, but apparently the government does.

Now I’d love to blame Bush, I really would. And if the shoe fits…I mean this crap has “brought to you by the creators of post-war Iraq” written all over it, if you ask me. But the scale of ineptitude is simply beyond the power of one man, even the POTUS. I mean, I don’t think Bush could have mismanaged things this badly even if it was his goal to do so. It’s simply inconceivable these people are dying like this nearly five full days after the fact.

Tuesday, I thought, it’s a major disaster. It’s going to take a day or two to get in there.

Wednesday, I thought, it’s an unprecedented disaster. But I’m sure we’ll be all over it tomorrow.

Thursday, I thought, how can it be getting worse? How can there be helicopters flying all over the city just watching these people die? National Guard troops are in the city, all right; the victims can only wave to them as they drive by.

Here we are today, and it’s not any better. The absolute outrage of it is the spin coming from the President straight on down the line about how “magnificent” the relief effort is. I saw Senator Landrieu on CNN yesterday praising the then two-hour-old results of Presidents Clinton and Bush Sr., at which point Anderson Cooper commented that it was hard to listen to politicians slapping eachother on the back while he watched a woman’s corpse being eaten by rats. Landrieu didn’t even blink. A child of New Orleans, daughter of a former mayor–how can you *NOT BE OUTRAGED? *

So I’m watching the coverage, like everyone else, and I’m noticing the one overwhelming common denominator: all these people are black, probably mostly poor. A terrorist in Afghanistan sneezes, and within 24 hours we’re dropping pamphlets in Arabic with our response. A brain-dead woman in Florida gets her feeding tube removed and Congress convenes on a Sunday night to “save” her life. But we can’t drop food and water on New Orleans??! You’re telling me that Harry Connick, Jr. can DRIVE himself into downtown New Orleans but the military can’t?

I’m not sure which conclusion is worse: that our government is inherently inept or inherently racist. Four years after 9/11, after the efforts expended in Iraq, after the efforts expended after the tsunami, I’m forced to conclude that we simply don’t value poor black people enough to put ourselves in harm’s way to save them. “Well, you can’t save people while you’re being shot at” Really? Because I thought that happened in war all the time. Or are we simply waiting for them to just kill eachother off?

One thing I am sure of: the one thing the ENTIRE Federal government can do with complete co-ordination and consistency is LIE. They’re lying to us right now. You can’t look at the pictures and then listen to their words and not conclude that they aren’t lying. You can’t call it “spin;” you can’t even call it “malicious prevarication.” When it’s politician-vs-politician, it’s spin. When it’s politician vs. reality, policitian vs. helpless dying victims, it’s lying and we should recognize that.

And the world takes note: this is what it means to be poor and black in America. To be on a rooftop surrounded by rising water. To live in squalor and crime and be left to die. And the government says they’re doing the best they can. I can only echo a sentiment I heard yesterday: this isn’t my country. This isn’t my government. I’ve never been more ashamed to be an American.

I think this will work better in the BBQ Pit (where you may eventually find it merged with similar threads.

[ /Moderator Mode ]

(While I agree that the government (at pretty much all levels) have failed the people, in this instance, I would suggest that unless you have seen massive aid arriving in the rich neighborhoods of Gulfport and other Mississippi cities, your specific claim of racism may be misplaced.

Everyone screwed up–but they have screwed up everywhere.)

OK, but please tell me it was my tone or diction or something I did wrong in the OP.

Please don’t tell me that poor people left to die by their government isn’t a topic worthy of the label “Great Debate.” Please don’t tell me it isn’t worthy of more than one thread.

I’m looking at the news, and I’m telling you: coastal Mississippi is getting the aid. They’re getting the troops. They’re collecting the bodies. New Orleans has seen NONE of that yet. They’re still pulling living people off rooftops. They just “found out” about the convention center yesterday? WTF? I knew about it before FEMA?

I hope I’m wrong about my premise. Give me another explanation, besides “we’re doing the best we can.” I’m all ears.

Don’t let the door hit you in the ass on the way out.

Debate? Are you looking for someone to disagree with your position?

I don’t think there are many people who think we’ve done a good job, here.

As to the number of threads: they are spreading like floodwaters over the whole board. If your topic stands out as significantly different from other threads, it will not be merged. If we find lots of the same posts repeated in multiple threads, people tend to get confused as to where they have seen information to which they wish to return.

There was nothing wrong with your OP. I just felt it would pick up more of the attention it deserved (both in quantity and variety) in the Pit.

I’m shocked by this whole situation.

First, we didn’t even try to evacuate them. Public transportation our of town shut down when they gave the evacuation notice. There were no busses out of town. There was no attempt to find places for evacuees to stay. Basically we told people “get in your car and rent a hotel out of town” and didn’t give a fuck if they didn’t have the means to do either. Our only plan was to save the rich.

Then after we left the poor and the eldery to fight the hurricane, we just left the survivors there. Where are the food drops? Where are the tent cities? These people have been there for days- no food, no sanitation, dead bodies floating by. And they have no idea if we are ever going to come for them.

And then, when they get crazy and desperate and hell starts breaking loose among the dirty, starving, ragged survivors who have lost all hope in the empty ruined city, we watch them on TV and reassure ourselves that they were bad people to begin with.

It’s shameful.

Cite?

Coastal Mississippi has multiple North-South roads leading to an area from which the water has receded. New Orleans has had all but one of its (too few) access roads destroyed and the (foolishly unexpected) flood has hampered all efforts to get in or out.

The Convention Center debacle occurred because people were told to go there by someone who was not connected to FEMA who then did not report to FEMA that they had made that order.
Stupid? Tragic? Absolutely. A clear sign of incompetence? Yes. Racist? Not yet proven.

I wouldn’t expect anyone to disagree with the idea that the relief has been a miserable failure (well, I would, but I don’t think it’s even worth debating). But there are people all over this country who think racism isn’t a problem. I’m saying look at this, look at 9/11–how can you tell me all citizens of this country are valued equally by their government?

Oh, and Ashtar, your response was about as predictable as it is inane. With skills like that, you should run for office.

Cite: 30,000 people at the superdome alone

Not including the convention center and the rest of the city.

So, the governmental response in New Orleans is making you feel all proud and puffy, Lord Ashtar? :dubious:

I’m happy to have not disappointed you.

tomndebb how can you prove such a thing? There’s not going to be memo floating around. This is going to have to be one of those look into your heart moments.

Do you believe if the residents were white, would it have made a difference? Is it just a matter of classism and unfortunate that the majority of people in NO are black?

I don’t know the answer to that, save it makes me sick to see this happening and have the doubt as to the reason why.

Sorry, I guess I should have posted in one of the (many) other threads.

No, not proven, but certainly debatable.

Well, I’ve never had a Pit thread before, so at least there’s that…

I saw that exchange with Anderson Cooper.

Even after he critcized her and her cronies for back slapping, she went into a spiel about how good a job the president was doing.

When she related her “outrage”, he asked her specifically who she was outraged at. She answered like a politcian.

I heard an interview with Chertoff on NPR yesterday. When the interviewer told him that there were 2000 people at the Convention Center without food or water with dead bodies lying around, the guy basically said, “nope, that’s incorrect.”

The interviewer says, “one of our reporters is there”. Besides, I’d been seeing it on the internet during the day.

I hate to criticize. I can’t even imagine the scope and the planning of the relief, but it sure doesn’t seem like there are people there who understand distribution of resources at all.

Sequent, you aren’t the only one: Mayor tells feds to “Get off their asses.”

I’m not going to defend the FEMA, I’m not going to defend the politicians one damn bit for reasons as you so eloquently stated that they’re congratulating themselves while the situation is still out of control–they basically have their heads up their asses. They always have, always will.

But I’m not down there. I’m not involved in the recovery. But I will say that I take the media with a grain of salt, thinking that they’re focusing solely on the devastation for ratings, effect, “journalistic view”, whatever. In the 24 hours I’ve been watching the news, I have yet to see any shots of relief coming in, any pictures or videos of the military mobilizing to help (despite the fact one of my sister squadrons is mounting up to deploy to Keesler AFB to help around there), any Red Cross offices setting up, nothing. It’s all about how bad things still are.

The media (from what I’ve seen so far) has been focusing on how bad things are, and not showing what progress has started. I say it’s time for the media to get off it’s collective ass, and start showing what support is finally arriving. Both for the comfort of the victims that help actually is getting there, and to show the rest of the country that yeah, we can actually respond to this–even if it takes time.

Tripler
Fucking media.

This clinches it. Anything that happens anywhere and is bad that involves any number of black people is automatically racism. It must be the truth because you claim it to be the truth. :rolleyes:

If it exists, prove it. If not, SHUT THE FUCK UP.

Disgustingly, Michael Brown, soon to be the former director of FEMA, had this to say:

The people who “chose” not to leave had no way to leave. Were this guy on the SDMB, that kind of bullshit would get him banned.