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  #1  
Old 01-03-2006, 01:26 PM
CalMeacham CalMeacham is offline
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Time Travellers on the Titanic

Recently my daughter MilliCal said she'd like to go back in time and help the people on the Titanic. This was inspired by one of the chapter books she's been addicted to, "The Magic Tree House" series has one devoted to the Titanic tragedy (along with a companion book of facts onm the Titanic). This got me thinking -- the Titanic seems to show up as a popular destination for Time Travellers. If Time Travel were a real possibility, I suspect the decks of the Titanic would be the #2 destination, right after the Crucifiction (#1, As Robert Silverberg and others have suggested).


1.) Magic Tree House

2.) Time Bandits

3.) The ABC Tv Series "The Time Tunnel" (Pilot episode, no less!)

4.) Jack Finney's novel "Time and Again"


I'm sure there are others, and that people will suggest them. Another trend -- Time Travelers can't seem to prevent the accident (or else it un-happens, then happens, as in Finney)



Any other Titanic Time Travelers?

Any other frequently-visited events?


Me, I think people need to learn more historty -- there are plenty of other, interesting events to see without crowding a few "big draws"
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  #2  
Old 01-03-2006, 01:41 PM
lieu lieu is online now
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This begs the question though "Why do time-travelers suppose they could say anything to change the Titanic Captain's mind, considering he'd already disregarded the advise of at least one other ship Captain's warning?"

What comes to mind first for me wrt the ability to avert a tragedy was the Challenger.
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Old 01-03-2006, 01:46 PM
CandidGamera CandidGamera is offline
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Seems like there was some computer game involving the Titanic and time travel - can't think of it, though.

And there's at least one othe rmovie with a Titanic visit besides Time Bandits, too.

The only concrete thing I can offer is the brilliant non-collectible card game, Chrononauts, which involves time travel as its central theme. I believe one of the 'flux points' that can be changed is the Titanic.

Time Travel - other popular spots might include Lincoln's assassination (It's in Chrononauts, and I've seen it elsewhere) and the Roswell crash (used in Futurama and Deep Space Nine, if memory serves).

The Kennedy Assassination is another good one, used to great effect in Quantum Leap.
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  #4  
Old 01-03-2006, 01:50 PM
SSG Schwartz SSG Schwartz is offline
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How about sailing with Columbus? Imagine the scene:

You have been at sea for months. The men are tired, ill, and hungry. Land is sighted. When you reach the shore you see people of a race you had never imagined. It would be almost like traveling to Mars and finding that there are humans there.

Anyway, if you show me where I can get a time machine, that is where you will find me.
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  #5  
Old 01-03-2006, 01:52 PM
RealityChuck RealityChuck is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CalMeacham
4.) Jack Finney's novel "Time and Again"
Scratch this off. In Finney's book, the time traveler went to 1880s NYC. The only change he made was to prevent the inventor of time travel from ever being born.

Perhaps the sequel, From Time to Time, had the Titanic; I haven't read that.

The Time Tunnel episode was probably the best of this sub-sub-genre. Memorable from the time traveler going up to the captain (Michael Rennie) and saying: "There's something important you need to know. This is the Titanic!"

Rennie's reaction was priceless.
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Old 01-03-2006, 01:54 PM
silenus silenus is online now
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The first thing that came to mind upon reading the Silverberg observation was from BtVS:

Spike: "Oh, please! If every vampire who said he was at the crucifixion was actually there, it would have been like Woodstock. I was actually at Woodstock. That was a weird gig. I fed off a flowerperson, and I spent the next six hours watching my hand move."

If I wasn't trying to change anything, I'd try to see Shakespeare at the Globe. I'd stay far, far away from groups of angry people with pointy things.
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  #7  
Old 01-03-2006, 01:58 PM
ElvisL1ves ElvisL1ves is offline
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The first episode of "Time Tunnel" was based on Tony and Doug visiting the Titanic, to meet a scientist who had known Nikola Tesla and knew his secret to an unlimited power source from the earth's magnetic field or some such crap. When the guy twigged that the continuum was safe from the time travelers' interference because he was about to die anyway, he told the ship's officers, who had Tony and Doug locked up, so the Tunnel had to be used to extract them, and so forth.

We're still burning fossil fuels, of course.
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Old 01-03-2006, 02:11 PM
CalMeacham CalMeacham is offline
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Scratch this off. In Finney's book, the time traveler went to 1880s NYC. The only change he made was to prevent the inventor of time travel from ever being born.

Perhaps the sequel, From Time to Time, had the Titanic; I haven't read that.
My mistake then -- it was the sequel From Time to Time.
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  #9  
Old 01-03-2006, 02:16 PM
lexi lexi is offline
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I (think I) remember an episode of "Voyagers!" that the Titanic.
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  #10  
Old 01-03-2006, 02:19 PM
Push You Down Push You Down is offline
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There's a Harlan Ellison short story about a group of people who travel through time causing disasters that had been averted. The Titanic safely misses the iceberg so they detonate an explosive attached to the hull and cause the ship to sink.
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  #11  
Old 01-03-2006, 02:25 PM
priapus priapus is offline
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All of this begs the question of how did Mr Peabody and his boy,Sherman miss the Titanic?
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  #12  
Old 01-03-2006, 02:26 PM
Page Fault Page Fault is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lexi
I (think I) remember an episode of "Voyagers!" that the Titanic.
Yes, it was a season Finale I think. Or maybe a two-parter. Some kind of 'important' episode. There was another Voyager on the boat, if I recall correctly, and some issues with retrieving the little watch. As always.
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  #13  
Old 01-03-2006, 02:30 PM
bouv bouv is offline
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Originally Posted by CandidGamera
Time Travel - other popular spots might include Lincoln's assassination (It's in Chrononauts, and I've seen it elsewhere) and the Roswell crash (used in Futurama and Deep Space Nine, if memory serves).
I think it was Voyager, not DS9. I know there was a Voyager ep where a time ship from the 29th(?) century crashes in 20th century earth, and is responsible for the microchip revolution. it's how the Doc got his mobile emitter (yeah, way to completly ignore the temporal prime directive on that one, Janeway. )
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  #14  
Old 01-03-2006, 02:31 PM
Page Fault Page Fault is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lexi
I (think I) remember an episode of "Voyagers!" that the Titanic.
Yes, it was a season Finale I think. Or maybe a two-parter. Some kind of 'important' episode. There was another Voyager on the boat, if I recall correctly, and some issues with retrieving the little watch. As always.
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  #15  
Old 01-03-2006, 02:32 PM
AmericanMaid AmericanMaid is offline
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Not necessarily time traveling but Richard Peck's book "Ghosts I Have Been" features the Titanic heavily through past lives and ghosts.
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  #16  
Old 01-03-2006, 02:34 PM
Exapno Mapcase Exapno Mapcase is offline
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If it weren't for all those extra hordes of stinkin' no good time travelers, there would have been enough lifeboats for everyone!

Curse you, time travelers!
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  #17  
Old 01-03-2006, 02:39 PM
cmkeller cmkeller is offline
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This is pretty obscure, but two friends of mine had a story published in Shooting Star Comics Anthology # 4 in which two "time meddlers" run a get-rich-quick scheme through time travel, and the Titanic is one of the places they pop in to during the story.
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  #18  
Old 01-03-2006, 02:42 PM
Sampiro Sampiro is offline
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I'd love to have a few submachine gun wielding fiercely loyal Time Travelling folks to travel with me and right wrongs throughout history as The Knights Tempora. Places I'd love to go and kick some ass:

-The Tate/Polanski residence (kick some ass there and you won't need to visit the LaBiancas)

-Philadelphia, Mississippi- the Cheney/Goodman/Schwermer murders (let's see how brave you KKK boys are when some well armed other fellas in white robes come out of the woods)

-The Bier Hall Putsch- blow Hitler, Göring, & Co. Away (then go back in 10 years to see what other evil took over)

-The St. Bartholomew's Day Massacre

-The Battle of Thermopylae

You get the idea.
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  #19  
Old 01-03-2006, 02:47 PM
CandidGamera CandidGamera is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bouv
I think it was Voyager, not DS9. I know there was a Voyager ep where a time ship from the 29th(?) century crashes in 20th century earth, and is responsible for the microchip revolution. it's how the Doc got his mobile emitter (yeah, way to completly ignore the temporal prime directive on that one, Janeway. )
Thought it was Quark and co that were interrogated by the US Government..
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Old 01-03-2006, 02:52 PM
Bricker Bricker is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lieu
This begs the question though "Why do time-travelers suppose they could say anything to change the Titanic Captain's mind, considering he'd already disregarded the advise of at least one other ship Captain's warning?"

What comes to mind first for me wrt the ability to avert a tragedy was the Challenger.

How?

I mean... OK, boom. You're on the streets of Washington DC, and it's January 27th, 1986. Or, to give you some time, let's say it's Christmas Day 1985.

What do you do?
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  #21  
Old 01-03-2006, 02:59 PM
Scumpup Scumpup is offline
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Originally Posted by Sampiro
I'd love to have a few submachine gun wielding fiercely loyal Time Travelling folks to travel with me and right wrongs throughout history as The Knights Tempora.

Funnily enough, I fantasize about a similar organization I call The Knights Tempura. We would travel through the corridors of time introducing Japanese-style deep fried food to all the iterations of reality.
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  #22  
Old 01-03-2006, 03:01 PM
Sampiro Sampiro is offline
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Originally Posted by Bricker
How?

I mean... OK, boom. You're on the streets of Washington DC, and it's January 27th, 1986. Or, to give you some time, let's say it's Christmas Day 1985.

What do you do?
Sell the Cabbage Patch dolls and walkmans I brought with me and buy Intel and Microsoft stock.
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  #23  
Old 01-03-2006, 03:04 PM
JohnT JohnT is online now
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Foggy, thirty+ year-old memory coming up. And it's not even about time travel!

I seem to recall an old Twilight Zone or Outer Limits episode (it was definitely in B&W) where the story revolved around an older man telling a couple about his last boat ride, forty years in the past, that shook him so badly that it wasn't until his fifties that he got on another ocean-going ship again. The boat he was talking about was, of course, the Titanic. Anyway, the story ended with the older man joking, saying something along the lines of "What are the odds of my being in two shipwrecks in a row?" or something equally damning. The couple laughed, they all walked away to reveal a ring bouy with "ANDREA DORIA" stenciled on it. (Or another famous wrecked ship, like the Morro Castle or something).
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  #24  
Old 01-03-2006, 03:06 PM
ElvisL1ves ElvisL1ves is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bouv
I think it was Voyager, not DS9.
Nope, DS9, ep title "Little Green Men".
Quote:
A mishap sends Quark, Rom, and Nog back in time to Earth of 1947 in Roswell, New Mexico, where military forces mistake them for alien invaders.
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  #25  
Old 01-03-2006, 03:09 PM
ElvisL1ves ElvisL1ves is offline
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Originally Posted by JohnT
Anyway, the story ended with the older man joking, saying something along the lines of "What are the odds of my being in two shipwrecks in a row?" or something equally damning. The couple laughed, they all walked away to reveal a ring bouy with "ANDREA DORIA" stenciled on it.
That was the seminal "Twilight Zone" episode. Rod Serling is said to have been inspired by the tall tales told by a retired seaman named Frank Towers, who claimed to have survived the sinkings of the Titanic and Lusitania as well as the Empress of Ireland.
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  #26  
Old 01-03-2006, 03:17 PM
Der Trihs Der Trihs is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CandidGamera
Thought it was Quark and co that were interrogated by the US Government..
Seperate episodes. In one, Quark co end up in Roswell. In the Voyager episode, Voyager is attacked by a psycho from the future who blames them for destroying the solar system; both are thrown into the past.

I've seen at least two stories ( Up the Line by Robert Silverberg, and a short story who title I don't remember ) about time travellers who go to ancient disasters as tourists.

For the ultimate in rescue work, Spider Robinson has written several stories involving time travellers whose goal in to implant undetectable devices in the brains of every human who ever lived; upon death, these devices send the data comprising the mind to the future. There, they can be given new life; the goal is to literally save everyone who ever lived. Also, in his Callahan series several time travellers show up to prevent disasters ( at least two that would destroy humanity, and one that would destroy the universe ).
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  #27  
Old 01-03-2006, 03:18 PM
JohnT JohnT is online now
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That's it! Lusitania!

Thanks!
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  #28  
Old 01-03-2006, 03:21 PM
Sampiro Sampiro is offline
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Originally Posted by Scumpup
Funnily enough, I fantasize about a similar organization I call The Knights Tempura. We would travel through the corridors of time introducing Japanese-style deep fried food to all the iterations of reality.
Least useful to sufferers is The Knights Templeton, an order that travels to the 14th century and teaches the plague rats to imitate Paul Lynde.

I believe it was Steven Wright (though I could be wrong) who made a comment to the effect of "There'd really only ever need to be one convention for time travellers."
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  #29  
Old 01-03-2006, 03:23 PM
Sampiro Sampiro is offline
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PS- I'd go back and take automatic weapons to Nat Turner as well, but in so doing I'd probably blink my ancestors (and therefore myself) out of existence.
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  #30  
Old 01-03-2006, 03:30 PM
Marley23 Marley23 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sampiro
I believe it was Steven Wright (though I could be wrong) who made a comment to the effect of "There'd really only ever need to be one convention for time travellers."
They actually had one at Harvard a year or two ago. Nobody showed up then, but maybe they will have later.
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  #31  
Old 01-03-2006, 03:50 PM
UncleRojelio UncleRojelio is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lieu
This begs the question though "Why do time-travelers suppose they could say anything to change the Titanic Captain's mind, considering he'd already disregarded the advise of at least one other ship Captain's warning?"
There are a few options:
1) Conk Fredrick Fleet on the head befrore he gets to the crow's nest. Let the Titanic hit the berg head-on. Would have lots of injuries but prolly wouldn't have sunk.

2) Bring a pair of binoculars aboard and give them to the lookouts. The ship's pair had been misplaced.

3) Run screaming into the pilot house two minutes before the iceberg was spotted. Two minutes was all they needed to miss the whole damn thing.
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  #32  
Old 01-03-2006, 04:06 PM
ninevah ninevah is offline
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Originally Posted by CandidGamera
Seems like there was some computer game involving the Titanic and time travel - can't think of it, though.
You could be thinking of Douglas Adam's Starship Titanic which came out in 1998.
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  #33  
Old 01-03-2006, 04:21 PM
FisherQueen FisherQueen is offline
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I remember the computer game- I think it was just called "Titanic." Wandering around the ship exploring was itself pretty cool. I think I rescued from the wreckage some mediocre paintings by an aspiring artist named Adolf Hitler, and the subsequent publicity averted WWII.

The newest Dr Who has visited the Titanic, not in an episode but mentioned as having happened.
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  #34  
Old 01-03-2006, 04:25 PM
Little Nemo Little Nemo is offline
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The plot of John Varley's novel Millenium was that a bunch of future time travelers were gathering people from the past. They wanted people whose disappearance would have no effect on history so they went to go to events like plane crashs and grab all the passengers right before the crash and replace them with life-like dummies. There was a passing reference in the book to them having grabbed the Titanic after it went under water (this was written before the wreck site was discovered).
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  #35  
Old 01-03-2006, 04:29 PM
Sampiro Sampiro is offline
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Originally Posted by FisherQueen
I remember the computer game- I think it was just called "Titanic." Wandering around the ship exploring was itself pretty cool. I think I rescued from the wreckage some mediocre paintings by an aspiring artist named Adolf Hitler, and the subsequent publicity averted WWII.
I remember this game. I never played it but I knew people who did and they found the Hitler paintings as well. (My problem with it was that Hitler, while certainly a better freehand artist than I am or than probably most people are, was no artistic great; his work was Ramada Inn or Starving Artist Sale quality.)
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  #36  
Old 01-03-2006, 04:36 PM
MLS MLS is offline
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Of course I can't remember the title OR the author, but I read a time travel novel in which a group of racist, apartheid-loving South Africans opened a time portal to the United States during the Civil War and provided endless supplies, including AK47s, to the Confederate troops. The book was pretty good up until a very, very contrived ending in which the Confederate leadership decided that slavery really wasn't such a good idea, after all, and the conflict ended amicably.
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  #37  
Old 01-03-2006, 04:41 PM
Baldwin Baldwin is offline
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I've seen at least two stories ( Up the Line by Robert Silverberg, and a short story who title I don't remember ) about time travellers who go to ancient disasters as tourists.
I think the short story would be "Vintage Season" by Lewis Padgett.

Quote:
Of course I can't remember the title OR the author, but I read a time travel novel in which a group of racist, apartheid-loving South Africans opened a time portal to the United States during the Civil War and provided endless supplies, including AK47s, to the Confederate troops. The book was pretty good up until a very, very contrived ending in which the Confederate leadership decided that slavery really wasn't such a good idea, after all, and the conflict ended amicably.
That was Guns of the South, by Harry Turtledove. The ending does seem contrived, although you could certainly posit that the Confederacy would have eventually abandoned slavery for economic reasons.
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  #38  
Old 01-03-2006, 04:47 PM
silenus silenus is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Der Trihs
Also, in his Callahan series several time travellers show up to prevent disasters ( at least two that would destroy humanity, and one that would destroy the universe ).
And one shows up(Conservation of Pain) just to save a blues singer from a life of suffering.
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  #39  
Old 01-03-2006, 04:54 PM
MLS MLS is offline
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That was Guns of the South, by Harry Turtledove. The ending does seem contrived, although you could certainly posit that the Confederacy would have eventually abandoned slavery for economic reasons.
Yes, that was it. Agreed, but not in the time frame that the book covered. I loved the part where somebody found the structure containing the secret location of the time portal, and it was full of things they didn't understand. Strange round objects that glowed by themselves. Glowing screens with associated trays with letters of the alphabet only out of order, so they were dubbed "Qwertys."
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Old 01-03-2006, 04:56 PM
detop detop is offline
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Originally Posted by Der Trihs
I've seen at least two stories ( Up the Line by Robert Silverberg, and a short story who title I don't remember ) about time travellers who go to ancient disasters as tourists.
The short story is Vintage Season by C.L. Moore, filmed under the title Timescape.

On preview I see that Baldwin provided a partial answer.
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  #41  
Old 01-03-2006, 05:04 PM
Revenant Threshold Revenant Threshold is offline
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I think the computer game you're thinking of might be Titanic: Adventure Out of Time - You start the game being blown up by a bomb attack in WWII, and are sent back in time to complete a mission you failed (which I never really understood while playing it, 'cept you were supposed to find the Rubayat, or something like that). Winning sent you back, changing time in that both WW's didn't happen - but if you failed (or left the boat in liferafts early, something you could do regardless of your mission) there were several different endings - Germany having already conquered Britain being the easiest one to get, which ended with the SS knocking on your door and machine-gunning you, having found your past as a spy out.

The hitting of the iceberg happened about two thirds through the game, and you couldn't change that - there wasn't any way you could avert it, just the events afterwards.
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  #42  
Old 01-03-2006, 05:19 PM
CandidGamera CandidGamera is offline
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I think probably people have nailed the game I was thinking of - wasn't one I'd played, but had read about. Text-adventure, perhaps?

There is of course Pearl Harbor, as recounted in the Final Countdown.
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  #43  
Old 01-03-2006, 08:12 PM
Skywatcher Skywatcher is offline
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Originally Posted by CandidGamera
The Kennedy Assassination is another good one, used to great effect in Quantum Leap.
And "Red Dwarf".
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  #44  
Old 01-03-2006, 08:18 PM
Lumpy Lumpy is offline
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The syndicated comic strip Robotman had the title character and his sidekick Monty go back to the Titanic. Their efforts to prevent the tragedy failed, and they only survived because they had brought a large rubber inflatable pool toy with them.
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  #45  
Old 01-03-2006, 09:10 PM
Baldwin Baldwin is offline
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Quote:
The short story is Vintage Season by C.L. Moore, filmed under the title Timescape.

On preview I see that Baldwin provided a partial answer.
We were both slightly incorrect; the story is credited to Laurence O'Donnell. Like Lewis Padgett, O'Donnell was a collaborative pseudonym used by Ms. Moore and her husband, Henry Kuttner.
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  #46  
Old 01-03-2006, 10:08 PM
FriarTed FriarTed is offline
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Originally Posted by Sampiro
Least useful to sufferers is The Knights Templeton, an order that travels to the 14th century and teaches the plague rats to imitate Paul Lynde.

"A Ren Faire is a verrrrr-itable smorgasbord, orgasboard, morgasbord- oh, what a ratly feast!"
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  #47  
Old 01-04-2006, 07:16 AM
Miss Mapp Miss Mapp is offline
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I remember a sketch on an old Saturday-Night-Live-type comedy show in the early '80's (I think it was called "Fridays"), in which a number of time travellers from different eras kept popping into the balcony of Ford's Theater to try and prevent Lincoln's assassination.

Abe Lincoln was played by Paul Simon and Mrs. Lincoln by his then-wife Carrie Fisher.
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  #48  
Old 01-04-2006, 10:27 AM
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I played the PC game that had you as a time traveler on the Titanic.

I would think Dealy Plaza in November of '63 would be a popular destination for time travelers. Even if you couldn't stop it you could postion yourself to record definitive evidence that rules out the wild theories.


Of course if time travel was really possible I would just keep going to one certain point and keep asking out Cindy Lockwood in different ways till she said yes.


Sort of like Groundhogs Day but not.
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  #49  
Old 01-04-2006, 11:03 AM
Clothahump Clothahump is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bricker
How?

I mean... OK, boom. You're on the streets of Washington DC, and it's January 27th, 1986. Or, to give you some time, let's say it's Christmas Day 1985.

What do you do?
Well, the first thing I would do is open a high-interest savings account and deposit a couple of grand in it. I then go and buy some shares in a variety of companies, such as Microsoft.

Then I go find some NASA folks.
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Old 01-04-2006, 11:23 AM
saoirse saoirse is offline
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Join Date: Feb 2001
Quote:
Originally Posted by MLS
Yes, that was it. Agreed, but not in the time frame that the book covered. I loved the part where somebody found the structure containing the secret location of the time portal, and it was full of things they didn't understand. Strange round objects that glowed by themselves. Glowing screens with associated trays with letters of the alphabet only out of order, so they were dubbed "Qwertys."
That sounded so much like a story I read once in Analog. It has neo-neo-nazis showing up at Appamattox to give Lee automatic weapons, so the US won't be able to defeat Germany. Lee decides that the South was meant to lose, and goes and surrenders.
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