At the counter...(Warning: racist)

I have had to meet people behind the counters all my life; at the banks, to book tickets, at the grocery store, at the driving licence office, etc. And I have noticed, every time I have a bad experience or a LONG delay, it was inevitably a colored person behind the counter.
The driving licence experience was particulary bad. The woman didnt know typing; she was just using two fingers. It took her something like 10 minutes to type my name and address out. She kept munching something that looked like M&Ms and thus soiled my id and other papers. She was positively rude to me as if I was wasting her time. But all I could do was bottle up my frustration and hope to get my licencs.
I am just pissed off with these people. why dont they look at their co-workers and learn? I am NOT saying all blacks are rude. I have MANY blacks who were positively nice to me and wanted to me out; but I am yet to have a bad experience with a non-black person behind the counter.

PS. I live in Baltimore.

[C K Dexter Haven]

I live in Illinois, and I can guarantee you that my experience here has been that it depends on the situation. At K-Mart, for instnce, all the checkout people are slow as molasses, regardless of race, creed, or nationable origin. At the grocery store where I shop, the check-out people are all quick and efficient, again, regardless of skin colour or background.

I think it has more to do with the employer's attitude towards the customer, than with the employee's personal situation.

[Athena]

It's hard sometimes NOT to get ideas based on race. Where I live, the largest minority is Hispanics. For every good experience I have (and I've had some INCREDIBLY good service from a Mexican man who installed my sprinkler system), I have ten bad experiences. I don't know why that is, but I wonder sometimes.

By far, though, the WORST service I get on a regular basis is from the teenagers who work at my local Blockbuster Video. If there was another video store within a few miles, I'd never go to my local Blockbuster EVER. Invariably, I go to check out my movie, and there's 3 giggly teenagers gossiping at one end of the store, 1 forlorn looking teenager working at a register, and a line with ten people waiting to check out. ARGHGGHGHHG!

I agree with Athena here. Its hard NOT to get such ideas based on race.
Usually I try to cool down and think objectively about it. But when the other person is being callous I cant help cursing under my breath. Several minutes later after I have cooled down I am always amazed at how nasty I was.

[VegForLife]

I have MANY blacks who were positively nice to me and wanted to me out;

You might want to re-word this. . .

Rich

[Mr.Zambezi]

I would guess that this is a self fulfilling prophecy. I hear people say this to me in Colorado where hispanics are the majority minority. I never have this problem.

But I have studied spanish for years and I love central american culture. So I expect to meet a nice, helpfull person.

You may be sending off a bad vibe. Or they may be expecting that you are going to be a jerk to THEM because of their race.

[Wonko The Sane]

you were getting your drivers liscense! The person behind the counter was a state employee! That is why the person was slow! It had nothing to do with melanin content. State employees are slow, rude, and act incompetant (sp?) the reason is, the state employees have fantastic job security, and the state agency has no competition, and therefore can have hideous customer service, and rude workers. Of course, if you were being a jerk, if I was the clerk, I would do an intentional slowdown just to drive you nuts. (I bet you were muttering in line about how slow the service was etc. The sound travels both ways across the counter.)

[Drain Bead]

My main problem is when people think I'm racist, when I'm only trying to do my job. I've had two black women accuse me of racism--one because I was going around the lab to make sure that nobody was eating or drinking and when I saw her with a pop, I told her to put it on the window ledge outside the door. She went off on me because I "singled her out" (nobody else had visible drinks or food at that point, and there were only two other people in the lab anyway). Mind you, there are signs posted all over every lab saying "No Food or Drinks Allowed," and I was WELL within my rights to actually boot her from the labs for breaking the rules, but I never do that. The other came in right as I was opening the labs, and I hadn't booted up any of the computers. I started up the computer she chose before starting up any of the other ones, and so I didn't have to come back to hers to log it in, I told her that the computers didn't need a password to get on the network even though they asked for one. She accused me of thinking she was stupid because she was black. Mind you, I do think that 99% of the people who come into the labs don't know how to operate those particular computers as well as I do, but that's a color-blind assumption. I was just trying to be helpful, and save both of us the time.

I wish I knew what to do in those situations. I don't at all understand what it's like to have such a big chip on my shoulder that I assume that everyone of a certain race is out to get me.

[Dirty Devil]

Verra13, I grew up in San Francisco. With the exception of New York City, SF is probably the most diverse city in the country. I have been helped by "behind-the-counter" people of every racial/ethnic/gender combination you can think of. About half are good at what they do. The other half stink at what they do. Of those that stink, the whites were as bad as the blacks, who were as bad as the spanish, who were as bad as the orientals, who were as bad as the disabled lesbians, who were as bad as...I think you get the idea. Are you sure you're just not noticing the whites that don't do a good job? Or maybe, by the tone of your original, and VERY racist, post, you already have this idea fixed firmly in your head, so you expect it to take longer when you see a black person behind the counter.

[ChiefScott]

As we (supposedly) move to a more service oriented economy, it seems that the word service has been erased from the lexicon of today's work force. I detest having to repeat myself when being waited on, giving my order or asking for assistance. Service personnel incompetence is equally frusting. The single biggest factor in my choosing a store, gas station or even a restaurant is the quality of service. I can only take my business elsewhere when I am dissatisfied. When I'm pleased, I complement the worker, notify the manager and often, when appropriate, over-tip. Servers at my favorite resaurants know who I am and what I like.

Smaller businesses are by far more attentive to their customers' needs. Their employees are trained to do a job and, more often than not, they do it. Larger businesses seem to hold their employees to a much lower standard.

Who's to say why?

Just take your gripes to the boss and your money down the street if things don't change.

[Gr8Kat]

Are you sure you're just not noticing the whites that don't do a good job? Or maybe, by the tone of your original, and VERY racist, post, you already have this idea fixed firmly in your head, so you expect it to take longer when you see a black person behind the counter.

That was my take on the OP. And, as Mr. Zambezi said, it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.

I agree with Drain Bead, too, that it's hard to know what to do when accused of being racist when that was the furthest thing from your mind. The main focus of my homepage is genealogy, and so far in my research I've found mostly European and Native American ancestors. And I (foolishly?) stated that on my page. Was that racist of me? Someone thought so because a week or so ago they posted on my message board accusing me of only looking for European and Native American ancestors and being "in denial" about my black ancestors. I was horrified at the accusation! The thought of hiding any part of my heritage like that had never occurred to me. Since I haven't found any black (or Asian, Latino, Jewish, or Australian Aboriginal) people in my family tree yet, should I add a disclaimer saying something to the effect that, though no blacks have been positively identified, the possibility cannot be and has not been ruled out? I didn't do that, though, instead I added "AWANBILEYERHEID!" which I think fits because, so far as I can tell, I am much more likely to have Scottish blood in me than African. However, the possibility cannot be and has not been ruled out!

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"I hope life isn't a big joke, because I don't get it," Jack Handy

[Gr8Kat]

State employees are slow, rude, and act incompetant (sp?) the reason is, the state employees have fantastic job security, and the state agency has no competition, and therefore can have hideous customer service, and rude workers.

As a state worker who assists the public, I take exception at that remark. Those remarks. Whatever. My point is, that's a gross overgeneralization. In my agency, we are held accountable for our actions, and every one of us is required to do some kind of phone duty. I know for a fact that if I was rude or disrespectful to a customer, I'd be taken to task for it.

One of the things that frustrates me (and I've ranted about this before so I'll be brief) is customers who expect us to bend or break the rules for them. We didn't make these rules up just to inconvenience people, some of the are to protect our customers' rights. But when you're dealing with people who already feel like they've been jerked around by the system, and EXPECT you to jerk them around too, it's hard to get through to them at we can't just twist our timeframes around so they can go on vacation or buy a new car RIGHT NOW. (Granted, a lot of people who call that are desperate for their money having something more pressing than that, like a house payment, they need the money for, but the really irritating people are the ones who call and say, "We're not going to get to go camping for the 4th of July because you won't release our agreement early.") Boo hoo, the law says we can't, go camping NEXT weekend. That's what I'd like to say but I can't and don't because I'm a good state worker. One of many.

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"I hope life isn't a big joke, because I don't get it," Jack Handy

[Nickrz]

(and I've had some INCREDIBLY good service from a Mexican man who installed my sprinkler system)

I dunno if I should joke about "wetbacks" or just keep my mouth shut..

[Persephone]

Gr8kat, I am with you! I am a municipal employee. My title is "customer service clerk." Most customers are okay, but far too many come in just expecting to be jerked around. They don't want me to help them--they just want to see if they can beat City Hall, regardless of whether or not they are actually right. I and my co-workers do our best to see that the customers needs get met, and we do occasionally bend or break rules to do so. I treat all my customers equally, to a point. If a customer comes in trying to run a line past me (and after years in this business, you can spot them a mile away), I will bend no rules. I will not be deliberately mean or antagonistic to a customer, but I will not jump through hoops for them. I try to be very nice to the service people I deal with outside of work, too. Service work is not easy, whether you work for McDonald's or the government.

As for race, well, I've gotten bad service and good service from pretty much all genders & nationalities. No particular group stands out...but I do agree on the abovementioned point about the teenagers at the video store. Geez...if they're old enough to be in the workplace, they need to take it seriously!

[Satan]

Well, the thing in the initial question that struck me was the seemingly innocuous ending which mentioned her residing in Baltimore.

Dare i say, that is the key to this little quandry.

In New York City, everyone was everything. You had your cool black folk, and you had your assholes. Same thing for every groupo and even us honkeys. Growing up in this environ was great since I really learned to judge the character of a person.

Then, I moved to Washington DC. All bets were off!

We are talkinga city that reelected Marion Berry here! With a population that swore it was all a plot by the white man. Yeah, I know I could really go from upstanding to hanging with prostitutes offering me crack just because I was offered the stuff...

An overwhelming percentage of the black population in DC (and, says my brother in Baltimore, there as well) acts as if whitey owes them something. The rudeness, laziness and classness of these people was shocking to me.

I'm still all for accepting people who who they are not the color of their skin. But some cities lend themselves towards racism IMHO, and racism comes in all sizes, shapes, and yes, colors too...

VegForLife ""I have MANY blacks who were positively nice to me and wanted to me out;"
You might want to re-word this. . ."

Err... I certainly would. towards the end of the mail I wasnt exactly double checking what I was typing. That should read "I have MANY blacks who were positively nice to me and wanted to help me out"

About ALL governement employees being incompetent or rude, I must disagree. The dame at the tax return office was trying her best to clear things up (she didnt but who can possibly be simple when it comes to IT); the person at the SSN office was also nice,maybe a bit lethargic, but she WAS NOT RUDE and OR INCOMPETENT!! Thats my point.

Satan said" Well, the thing in the initial question that struck me was the seemingly innocuous ending which mentioned her residing in Baltimore."

I would like to clear up soemthing here; that too of slight importance. me Male. Thanks.

I have had pretty bad experiences in Boston also. I dont think the city is the only reason (even though it does play a part.)

[VegForLife]

VegForLife ""I have MANY blacks who were positively nice to me and wanted to me out; "You might want to re-word this. . ."

Err... I certainly would. towards the end of the mail I wasnt exactly double checking what I was typing. That should read "I have MANY blacks who were positively nice to me and
wanted to help me out"

Umm. . . You might want to look again. . .

Rich

Vegforlife:
You are positively perverted.
I have nothing else to say.

[ChiefScott]

VegForLife --

What's the hubbub? Didn't Thomas Jefferson have "manny" blacks who were positively nice to him and wanted to help him out?
Veera, a regretable, but nontheless hilarious ommission.

[VegForLife]

You are positively perverted.

Only occasionally. This isn't one of those times.

I have nothing else to say.

Well, that should improve your standing here.

Rich

ChefScot

A regrettable but hilarious omission.

That about sums it up.

[HeadlessCow]

[[As we (supposedly) move to a more service oriented economy, it seems that the word service has been erased from the lexicon of today's work force. I detest having to repeat myself when being waited on, giving my order or asking for assistance.]] Chiefscott

I work at D'Angelo's and as hard as we try we sometimes forget parts of an order. We try not to ask about more sandwiches than we can remember but because almost everyone has a different way that they want their sandwich sometimes we need to have an order repeated. Unfortunately some people are offended or downright rude to us when we ask. And your comment seems to put you as one of those people. We're asking again because we don't have anything better to do, we're asking because we're trying to give you the best, correctly made sandwich we can. Would you rather that you repeated it or that you got a possibly wrong sandwich.
Anyway, since this isn't really on subject I'll stop ranting now. But if you want to open a topic a topic in the pit and I'll be there.

[Nimue]

Veera, I come from Baltimore originally and I haven't really noticed any difference in the way I've been treated by different races of people. That said, I greet everyone with a friendly smile, tend to ignore the odd unfriendly comment, and have rarely had any memorably bad experiences. I have to say that MVA's are just generally unpleasant places -- long queues of frustrated and impatient people and bored employees who have to deal with them. I'm assuming the one you went to was the one downtown, starts with an M, can't remember it's name sorry. I have to admit that one is particularly bad, but there are people of all races working at the other ones so I don't think it has too much to do with that. I'd recommend the Express MVA in Towson if it's not too out of your way. I've never seen it crowded and even though the employees (of whatever race) can be a bit unpleasant at least you're out of there fairly quickly. If that's too far, try the one in Glen Burnie off Ritchie Hwy. I, for one, am finding that one of the benefits of living (permanently) abroad is that I can renew my license by post and not face any MVA again!

[Satan]

My brother who lived in Baltimore was surprisingly mellow with his reply:

"To answer your question. unfortunatly there are plenty of bad experiences of this sort, but I do have to admit I have had almost as many with other backgrounds. One possibility is of course, to this person it seems like it is always a black person might be because in Balitmore there are just that many more blacks working in general."

[Jett]

First of all, I'd like to thank you for posting this. It seems as though you want someone to help change your mind on this issue. That's good.

Now, let's go back to the original post: In it you refer to the people you are complaining about as "colored" and then you specify "...but I am yet to have a bad experience with a non-black person behind the counter" (Grammatical errors were reproduced to support my point). So for you, "colored" = "black", correct? This seems outdated - I have not heard the term "colored" in contemporary usage since Archie Bunker went off the air. Maybe your racism is overt enough that it is causing you to recieve this kind of treatment when being assisted by a "colored" person.
I noticed you use the spelling "licence", which is not correct in this country. Are you British ("driving licence" would be the correct term across the pond), or is it that you are simply a bad speller and typist? If indeed your typing is not excellent (it's not), you should retract your statement about the "colored" woman at the counter not knowing how to type ("The woman didnt know typing", big deal, you don't know punctuation). It seems as though you could use some brushing up in the areas of spelling and proofreading.

What I am getting at is this: Generalization based upon one impression of a person is not usually accurate. I am guessing that you have a bias against "colored" people that existed long before you faced a black person across a counter, but I could be wrong, all I have is a couple of emails upon which to judge you.

Expect the worst and you'll probably get it.

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Some mornings, it's just not worth chewing through the leather straps.
-- Emo Phillips

[threemae]

Never had to deal with a slow stupid white person behind the counter? You REALLY need to get out more.

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"The first thing a man will do for his ideals is lie."

--Joseph A. Schempeter

I feel trying to get at a person based on his spelling skills is not substantial (If it were loverock, I will make an exception) And yes, I was taught English the British way (colour et al). I am from India (I dont care if you think I am not justified to judge people from this country).
"If indeed your typing is not excellent (it's not), you should retract your statement about the "colored" woman at the counter not knowing how to type ("The woman didnt know typing", big deal, you don't know punctuation). It seems as though you could use some brushing up in the areas of spelling and proofreading. "
I would like to make a small distinction between that woman and myself. My profession is NOT to sit in front of the computer and type out data. If it were, I promise you I will learn typing atleast by practice; I wont use my two soiled index fingers alone.
And about my punctuation, joke, right? As long as I get my point across clearly, I dont (sic) see how you can say its a fault of mine.
About my using "colored" and "black" I have usually noticed people generally dont like words repeated in a small piece of text. so, instead of repeating "black" or colored again and again I just alternated between them.

"What I am getting at is this: Generalization based upon one impression of a person is not usually accurate." - Please read my first post again. I list three instances there. I could go on, but Ihope you get the idea.

"Expect the worst and you'll probably get it."- After my first experience probably I am biased. I will give you that.

Ps. Somehow I detest your condescending tone.

[JoeBlank]

Sorry guys, but I have to help end Veera's needless suffering. Based on her last post, she is apparently saying english is a second language to her. Let's give her a break. (That said, I laughed out loud at Veg's first attempt to point out the error.)

Veera, you said "I have many blacks." I think you meant I have met many blacks, or something of that nature. Having the blacks of which you speak seems to imply ownership, and the fact that you made this error while attempting to avoid racism as an explanation for your experience did make it a little funny.

Oops! I REALLY screwed up didnt I?

And, for the last time, I am a man!! I am going to change my handle.
Sheesh!!
Adios to veera13!!

I had a summer job at a drivers license bureau in Chicago 20 years ago (called the Secretary of State's office). The (all-white) people who worked there were some of the most miserable, chip-on-their shoulder harridans I've ever had the displeasure of dealing with. A few years later, I was gratified to see that many of them were fired because of a scandal involving selling drivers licenses.

An incident: A few years ago, we went to a Bennigans in downtown Chicago. We were told there was a 20 minute wait for a table. During a 30 minute wait, we saw a group of black people come in and get seated after a 5-minute wait. We got angry and suspicious that we were being discriminated against because of our race (our family is predominantly caucasian) by the black people in charge of seating. After complaining, we left angry.

The point? First, public service employees often develop an attitude problem, and it has nothing to do with race. I would implore those public service employees to have an open mind about their customers. They are John Q. Public, NOT necessarily someone who's there to give you grief.

Second, black people do get discriminated against, and some of them get angry and bitter toward non-blacks as a result. I have only 1 example when it appeared I was being discriminated against because of my race; for most blacks this is commonplace. So, please take this into account.

In you example, veera13, I think you would be justified for complaining about the soiling of your documents, however.

[Jett]

Actually, the documents in question were the property of the DMV and remain so. They have the right to soil them any way they want. This isn't really the issue, is it?

I asked about the British issue due to an idea that I have formed about prejudice in British society - apparently there is a whole lot of racism in the middle and lower (and probably upper) classes in Britain. Read _No Irish, No Blacks, No Dogs_ by Johnny Rotten, it gives good insight on prejudice precipitated by immigration (and it's a damned good book!).

I noticed that you refer to another government employee as "a bit lethargic". Was she white? If she was black, would you have labeled her as "slow" rather than "lethargic"? So, it's okay for someone to be slow as long as they are nice? And white, I suppose.

It is unfortunate that when someone is at a disadvantage for any reason the tendency is to blame other influences (bias, racism) rather than one's own motivation or ability, but bias is real. It exists. It exists in your mirror, go look.

As for my "condescending" tone, if you can't take the heat, stay out of the BBQ pit.

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Some mornings, it's just not worth chewing through the leather straps.
-- Emo Phillips

[Byzantine]

I agree with Gr8Kat: I worked for the State of Utah as an accountant for over 8 years and I saved tax payers millions of dollars by finding and eliminating waste (or fraud). Many times call were switched to me by accident and rather than dump them around (some had been dumped over 20 times) I took their number, found the answer or the right person and then switched them. I may have been an accountant but I also took seriously the fact that I was a public employee and worked my butt off to help people.

As far as race goes: My dad once said that, "assholes come in all colors" and I took that to mean that just because someone is slow, rude, or whatever, it has nothing to do with their race. I've met, worked and loved many people of all races: some were good experences some not. But I don't think I could single out just one race as being "bad" or whatever. I mean the biggest jerk I know is my uncle so I guess I could hate all white men that I'm related to or just mark him off as a jerk and move on.

[EnigmaOne]

{{{it's hard to know what to do when accused of being racist when that was the furthest thing from your mind. }}}---Gr8Kat

I guess that one is easier for me to tackle than most--I usually get that from one of two students per semester (usually in response to the grade they earned).

I show them family photos, and then explain the definition of transferrence. I normally sum it up with profound disappointment in their being so ethnically biased as to accuse me of "racisim."

It works beautifully with non-students as well.


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--Kalél
(The Original EnigmaOne)
Common ¢ for all ages.

[Lew]

Point to all...Veera announced his racism with the title of this thread. I doubt that we can change his attitude here. But I am happy to be reminded that so many of us feel the same about this issue. Racism is everywhere and effects us all. I can assure you that Veera (being from India) would find life difficult in one of the cities neighboring my community. Does this mean that he is a bad person? If so, does that mean all people from India are? I think not...You can pull a wild hare out of anybody's hat, doesn't mean the hat's no good. The only way I know to confront these problems is like others have suggested. Meet each person as an individual and a human being. I, too have worked in schools all my adult life in rural as well as urban areas. There is ALWAYS someone ready to accuse you of prejudice because they are black, latino, Vietnamese, Indian, and yada, yada, yada. It always makes me wonder if they feel inferior. I know they say it is because their people have been oppressed, but not by me. I meet all with the same expectation..mutual respect. If I don't receive it, it is difficult to return it.
BTW..until I moved to my present community, I would have echoed all the complaints about government workers. If I go into the town to the south of me (the one Veera doesn't want to move to) that life long lesson is confirmed. If I go to the town north of me, the DMV, SSA and Social Security workers are, almost without exception, some of the most kind, helpful people you could ask for. The difference? The nicer town has a different racial make-up (fewer Indians, more Vietnamese) !!!KIDDING!!!
Who knows...maybe the dregs from all races move to the south of me. Which, come to think of it, is better than me being down-wind from them.

Be kind


------------------
Lew
"Man, the 60's must have been real good for you!"
George Carlin..."Outrageous Fortune"

"Toto, I don't think we're in Kansas anymore"
Dorothy..."The Wizard of Oz"

[middsy]

For a multi-racial society you Americans are so racist!

Middsy, Bath, England

[BELN]

Oh, dear this is most, most unfortunate. To whatever idiot remarked on racism in England, I would say this; be very careful. Firstly, do not rely on the biography of an aeging punk as your primary source of evidence, secondly, while there is unquestionably racism in the UK, the implication that someone might be more inclined toward racism because they are English rather than American is utter nonsense. We did not have segregation by law well into the second half of this century. England is not the home of armed white supremacist militia groups who appear to be tolerated by the government. England is not the country which threw up the KKK. Your country is. And England was the first of the imperial powers to try to abolish slavery (while also being one of its major players, of course).

My country is not wothout fault. Historically it has been responsible for terrible immorality and cruelty, and modern England has many problems too; but you are way out of line in your suggestion that a more serious problem with racism afflicts us than it does you. This looks like trying to pass the buck "Oh, hey, there may be a racist remark on this this board, but see, it was made by a Limey."

Fool.

Oh, and by the way, while I have never visited your country, I do have considerable regard for its culture and people.

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Uh-oh. Fish.

[middsy]

BELN,

I presume you are English from your previous message, and to be honest you sound like the reason English people are sterotyped in American films, using quotes from history to promote your view and your distinct snobbish attitude.
I am from a working class background in Bristol,England and obviously I would be quite nieve to assume no racism exists, though do we lynch black men for having a relationship with a white girl? In Tennesee I am told this still goes on!
English people are the best in the world, and most interesting but you my friend sound very pompous.

[BELN]

Why are you so concerned with establishing your class credentials? As it 'appens I am the first in my family to attend university and am first generation lower middle-class; father - apprentice at 17, then engineer, mother –nurse after training in middle age. So what?

If one does not use examples and evidence to back up a point, one is only making usupported statements. Something this board, for all its good points, has too many of already. To ATTEMPT to be accurate and specific is vital for good debate. And good invective.

Oh, and I don't think I am your friend yet. Though I don't rule it out as a possibility for the future.

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Uh-oh. Fish.

[Big Iron]

[[English people are the best in the world]]

I'm sure that's what they've always maintained in, say, India, Africa, Ireland, China ...

[Egads Ron]

So for you, "colored" = "black", correct? This seems outdated - I have not heard the term "colored" in contemporary usage since Archie Bunker went off the air. Maybe your racism is overt enough that it is causing you to recieve this kind of treatment when being assisted by a "colored" person.

You've not heard of the NAACP lately, Jett?

+Ron

[okatym]

I hate to admit it but, Veera's post verbalizes thoughts I've had while visiting Baltimore/DC. After several yearly summertime visits, I've concluded the problem is NOT the race of the people working, it is the weather. The weather in Baltimore, DC, and the area, is so horrid and humid that people move like they're walking through water. They get used to moving like that and rarely feel the need to change. Veera, if you looked around at her coworkers, I'll bet you would have seen the trademark momentum we call, 'the baltimore crawl'. My advice to you is to move west before it affects you and your family.

[Jett]

Thanks Egads, have heard of the NAACP. They were formed in 1909 when nomenclature was totally different. Also, they are not just working for the advancement of black people, but people of all colors, thus for them black is not necessarily synonymous with "colored".

If you want to split hairs, I have not heard of the NAACP referred to by it's full name in more that ten years. It's the N-double-A-C-P to me, bucko.

Also, I'd like to point out that I didn't mention the factors that lead to rampant racism in this country, I was just addressing what may have contributed to veera's impressions. I spent some time speaking with a British friend before posting the message about racism is Britain and he was in full agreement. One of his close friends in Britain is a pediatric surgeon from Sri Lanka and he says that not a week goes by that someone doesn't call him "Paki" in a derogatory manner - Pakistan is another major source of immigration into Britain that seems to be resented by the lower classes. See "My Beautiful Laundrette" for details on this one. In my mind, looking at someone from Sri Lanka and deciding that they are from Pakistan and they deserve to be punished for that is a double dose of racism. 2 intolerances for the price of 1.

I certainly don't deny that racism exists here, and did not quantify whether there is more or less in the US or UK. I was just making an observation based on veera's linguistic habits - and I was right, wasn't I?




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Some mornings, it's just not worth chewing through the leather straps.
-- Emo Phillips

[Jett]

Oh, and isn't anyone from Tennessee going to flame middsy?

[Doobieous]

I would be quite nieve to assume no racism exists, though do we lynch black men for having a relationship with a white girl? In Tennesee I am told this still goes on!

Be very careful about hearsay. I have not heard of this at all in the 21 years of my life living in the US. Perhaps it happens, but i wont say for sure that it does, like you seem to be saying.Also, we have these large racist groups because, well we have over 270 million people, so we are going to have very large and prominent organizations. I have even heard of Pakistani immigrants being threatened in England by racist groups (From the ITN news service on PBS. it's been a while so i am forgetting a lot of the details). ANY place the locals feel threatened by immigrants, racist groups often pop up.

[/quote]English people are the best in the world, and most interesting but you my friend sound very pompous.[/quote]

Hmm well i hate to break it to you, but everyone on this planet thinks their countrymen are the best and most interesting (Ask any Japanese, Chinese, Lao, Hmong, Hutu, Hausa, etc. person on the planet ).


On the original topic, since i live in what is one of the most diverse cities in the US, i have met quite a few service people from all ethnicities. I can tell you i have had crappy service from all creeds, and ethnicities. Some of the best service is had in mom and pop stores, or in small businesses. Some of the slowest service is in large chain stores. often the rude and lazy behavior of employees reflects the attitude of the employer ( i should know, i worked in a stationery store, and the owners were hardly around so everyone there got quite lazy on the job. We were good to the customers however ).

[Byzantine]

To sum up most of the points I've read:

Don't judge people on what they look like; skin color, weight, height, age, clothing, affects. Don't judge people at all!

Accept. Understand. Appreciate. Move on. Sometimes a banana is just a banana.

We're all in this together. So let's just do our best to get along!

This message has been brought to you by the "let's just cut the crap council of life."

Thanks!

To trash me personally please click on my e-mail!

------------------
The moon looks on many flowers, the flowers on but one moon.

[speakeasy]

Yow!

The primary characteristic of a stable and robust network is that it is fault tolerant.

There are about 875,000 police in the US to keep an eye on us 270,000,000 teeming masses spread across 3,500,000 square miles of territory. Do the math & then have a squint out the front window. If 99% of your fellow citizens weren't just plain nice folks, your neighborhood would currently be on fire. If it is, then stop reading this and run!

My roomate several years ago was black, and overall I am proud to call him my friend. His family's pretty good people too. Good thing, he's 5'8" / 255 lb of gristle and whalebone. He's also a university level scholar and an athlete. Knows how to throw quality dorm parties. (Only guy I ever met who could carry a keg of beer up four flights of stairs, quietly....)

I've also been on the recieving end of some serious discrimination involving getting my ass kicked repeatedly over a period of years. And I'm about as whitebread as you can get, I like girls not boys, etc. Right here in America. Guess away, I see no constructive purpose in pointing fingers now. Having been there done that, I can say that you start to work up a 'tude after awhile.

The people with heart tend to get over it, but I don't have it in me to hate those of us who aren't that strong.

As long as they aren't shooting at me, that is. Besides, I'm bigger than all that now (I carried the ice for that keg....)

Vaya con dios -

Hey middsy ("...in Tennessee it(lynching) still goes on...") Where do you get your information? I assure you it does NOT still go on. That would be big, big news.

This will anger some, but I would also submit that Tennessee is the least redneck of the Southern states. Remember, it was the last state to join the Confederacy and the first to rejoin the Union. Also, TN cast the tie-breaking vote that ammended the Constitution to grant women the right to vote.

As a poor white Southern Appalachian, I suppose I should be outraged at the lies perpetrated about me. I'm not. Ignorance is everywhere.

Oh, and one more thing:

GO VOLS

The biggest rudeness/efficiency factor I've seen is the place itself, as others have observed. The second biggest is definitely age. Not that I'm ageist, either. There are plenty of nice teenagers out there. But there seem to be quite a few who don't want to work, don't need to work, and thus act like they are doing me a big favor by getting paid to serve me. I don't blame them; I was probably a jerk in my own ways.

I think that we notice negative behavior in people who are different from us more readily. We subconsciously attach their looks to their behavior. When it is someone we are comfortable with, we will write off bad behavior as attributable to some outside cause.

Back in 1980-82 I went through a "punk" phase. Mohawk, multiple piercings (before they were common), offensive buttons, torn clothing, etc. I was treated very rudely by mainstream folks, even though my own behavior had not changed: a polite guy, really. Now, I got a kick out of it all...but had I experienced that sort of treatment my whole life (for a trait I was born with) I bet I would've developed a hostile attitude of my own.

P.S. Yeah, I'm still not well-accepted by mainstream folks, but people are much more tolerant in the 90's than any other decade I can remember.

[GOD]

There is only one race. The human race.
Get over it.