Vatican claims to have found Apostle Paul's sarcophagus

BBC
Telegraph

The inscription is certainly a compelling piece of evidence. This might really be the old tentmaker himself but I don’t know how it could ever be proven conclusively. I guess an ancient fake reliquary can’t be ruled out. I hope they crack open that box, I’d love to know what’s inside it.

Tres cool. I really want a complete examination of the remains now. Early Church history is so interesting. If they confirm the dates and such, it will be amazing. The Telegraph article seems to have the most info, so far.

Very interesting. No doubt St Paul outside-the-Walls will become even more of a pilgrimage site than it currently is.

Next time bury him deeper. Holy saint, founding figure, yeah, I know, but still think he was kind of a dick.

Maybe we will be treated to a “Raiders of the Lost Ark” style face melting, fry everyone within a hundred yards good time.

“Well, over here, the more colorful pools of goo, those are yer bishops, yer archbishops, yer cardinals, and so forth. The part that looks like molten penguins, those are mostly nuns…”

An approximate date of 390 AD would place the sarcophagus roughly the same distance in time from Paul as we are from the Salem Witch Trials. That’s not terribly close but it was when Christianity would have had enough following for somebody to falsify a sarcophagos to gain currency and it would have been a really really convenient time to find some relics as sects battled for supremacy and vied to impress Constantine’s heirs (less Julian). I’m highly skeptical.

However, if they were to open it and find a decapitated man from three centuries earlier (can they date remains that precisely?) it would be a lot more convincing. I wonder how Jewish Paul’s interment would have been- most of the Jews had been expelled from Rome but I’m sure there were some rabbis or enough faithful around who could properly prepare the body. Would there be any tell-tell signs of a Jewish burial from that time?

You could test for the age of the bones but even a 1st century skeleton wouldn’t be proof positive (the decapitation comes from tradition which may or may not have any validity.

I think the 390 date is a terminus ad quem for which the sarcaphogus had to have been placed. That was the time that the medieval basilica was first built over the site, so the box couldn’t have been put there any later.

The location was allegedly believed to have been the burial site of paul since the 1st century, though, and a small shrine existed there before any of the successive churches or basilicas were built.

It should be said, however, that the first real church built over the site was built by Constantine – someone who was not above fabricating holy sites and relics – and the possibility of a Constantinian fake cannot be ruled out.

But if it really was a site of pilgrimage and veneration for generations before Constantine then the possibility of authenticity can’t be ruled out either.

For that matter, both possibilities could be true – maybe it was the known burial site of Paul from early on AND Constantine made himself a big fake reliquary when he built the first church over it.

I guess we’ll know more if we ever get a look at what’s in the box.

I’d like to know if they have ever looked inside the silver bust that is purported to contain the heads of St. Paul and St. Peter?

I think skepticism is due - not so much about the site but that any remnant of Paul is there.

I would not be SHOCKED if the site were known and correctly remembered if only because [apparently he was a Roman Citizen and would have been allowed to be buried, had semi-wealthy patrons and some kind of Christian followers in Rome from the time of his death until Constantine made it legal] What I cannot believe though is that people being who they are, along the way some Emperor, Pope or Medici or Grave Robber or Church Builder around him - whoever in the intervening didn’t start walking away with peices of him or burying kin with him in the ~1940 years since he was planted there. I mean is there anyone here who wouldn’t quickly pop that box open as soon as scientifically acceptable (like hopefully today if possible). Would a Medivial Potentate of some sort leave it at that and just close the box up and throw dirt on it? I gotta doubt it


Besdides the age of the bones if there were teeth they could also pinpoint, in a general area, where he grew up. If it is Cilicia/Turkey or even then I don’t think bingo but maybe hmmm. I would expect our understanding of DNA to progress enough over the next few decades that they will eventually be able to say these genes are consistent with a 1st Century Jewish Population - but it will never be as exact as the teeth (I would guess).

Worse yet, a celibate dick! :wink:

Who isn’t, from time to time?

Saint Augustine, he got to be a saint
so if I get to be one too, Ma, don’t you faint.

-Bokonon

Paul the Apostle was a whole bunch of things - everything from mystic to asshole, and a debater, evangelist, organizer, and theologian in between.

I’m inclined to give Paul some slack for his worst moments, on account of his best moments being quite amazing indeed. It’s the evil men who used his words as weapons against others, and who had few if any good moments of their own, that I have the serious beef with.