The Straight Dope

Go Back   Straight Dope Message Board > Main > General Questions

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 01-27-2007, 03:19 PM
Love Rhombus Love Rhombus is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
What's the advantage of diffirent wing structures?

For example, what can a bat do that a bird can't? Or a bug? Or isn't there one and they all kinda got to the same place by diffirent routes?
Reply With Quote
Advertisements  
  #2  
Old 01-27-2007, 03:53 PM
Shagnasty Shagnasty is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: May 2000
Posts: 20,629
This is a pretty big question. Bats are highly maneuverable and can catch individual insects in flight. Vultures can soar like a sailplane with minimal effort on their part. Hummingbirds have small wings that beat many times a second. They can hover. Flying squirrels and flying fish can't truly fly but they can sail to help them in their niche. Wing design is extremely important to a given species.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 01-27-2007, 04:19 PM
Colibri Colibri is online now
SD Curator of Critters
Moderator
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Panama
Posts: 21,412
The very large differences in wing structure between bats, birds, and insects basically are due to differences that were found in the ancestors of these groups. These differences did not evolve due to the advantage of one of these basic designs over the others. However, these designs place limitations on the flight capabilities of each group.

Insects are obviously different. Their chitinous wings would not work at larger scales. Because of their size, insects can do some things that birds and bats cannot, and likewise cannot do some things that birds and bats can. But this is a matter more of size than of structure.

Bats cannot do some things that birds can, but it is uncertain whether this is due to limitations in the structure of their wings, or simply because they are less diverse than birds. Bats do not soar for any distance. Bats cannot perform the acrobatics that hummingbirds can (although some can hover). It is possible that bats have not evolved into some niches because birds already occupy them. If there were no birds, bats might be much more diverse.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 01-27-2007, 04:22 PM
Stranger On A Train Stranger On A Train is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: May 2003
Quote:
Originally Posted by Love Rhombus
For example, what can a bat do that a bird can't? Or a bug? Or isn't there one and they all kinda got to the same place by diffirent routes?
Wings are an example of convergent evolution; that is to say, several different classes or orders of animals independently developed wing or wing-like structures for flying. The question is really too general to answer, but as one example, save for hummingbirds (family Trochilidae) birds can't hover the way many flying insects do. Conversely, most insects can't really glide the way many birds can (hence the old saw about how a bumblebee can't fly).

Each wing structure has a particular advantage to its family or order of beholder in accordance with how it lets the animal be more effective in its peculiar niche. To say more would require a specific wing structure/species to discuss.

Stranger
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 01-27-2007, 06:05 PM
elelle elelle is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 1999
Here's a recent article about an intricate study on bat flight done at Brown University.
A bit from that article:

Quote:
Bat wings are highly articulated, with more than two dozen independent joints and a thin flexible membrane covering them. The videos, shot from four angles simultaneously and then synchronized, show how the complex movements of each wing stroke relate to overall flight speed, body position and angle of attack. Reflective markers placed on joints, along bones and at key points on the wing membrane allowed the researchers to accurately track the position and shape of bones throughout the wing stroke.

Birds and insects can fold and rotate their wings during flight, but bats have many more options. Their flexible skin can catch the air and generate lift or reduce drag in many different ways. During straightforward flight, the wing is mostly extended for the down stroke, but the wing surface curves much more than a bird’s does – giving bats greater lift for less energy. During the up stroke, the bats fold the wings much closer to their bodies than other flying animals, potentially reducing the drag they experience. The wing’s extraordinary flexibility also allows the animals to make 180-degree turns in a distance of less than half a wingspan
On the same Science Daily page (scroll down the sidebar) there are two other articles on similar studies with hummingbird and bee flight. New technology, high speed digital imaging, has been key in these studies. Pretty exciting stuff, not only for understanding Nature, but it will also lead to new developments in human flight.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 01-27-2007, 06:25 PM
Bosda Di'Chi of Tricor Bosda Di'Chi of Tricor is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Dogpatch/Middle TN.
Posts: 27,575
Quote:
Originally Posted by Colibri

Bats cannot do some things that birds can, but it is uncertain whether this is due to limitations in the structure of their wings, or simply because they are less diverse than birds. Bats do not soar for any distance. Bats cannot perform the acrobatics that hummingbirds can (although some can hover). It is possible that bats have not evolved into some niches because birds already occupy them. If there were no birds, bats might be much more diverse.
I'd quailfy that.

It is very difficult to observe bats in the wild at night, & making broad statements about what they can & can't do seems unreasonably hasty.
__________________
There's an Initiation Ceremony.
It involves a Squid and a Goat.
You're gonna be good friends with that Goat.
The Squid will not exactly be a stranger, either. ~~Me, on the SDMB Initiation
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:42 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.3
Copyright ©2000 - 2013, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

Send questions for Cecil Adams to: cecil@chicagoreader.com

Send comments about this website to: webmaster@straightdope.com

Terms of Use / Privacy Policy

Advertise on the Straight Dope!
(Your direct line to thousands of the smartest, hippest people on the planet, plus a few total dipsticks.)

Publishers - interested in subscribing to the Straight Dope?
Write to: sdsubscriptions@chicagoreader.com.

Copyright © 2013 Sun-Times Media, LLC.