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  #1  
Old 07-19-2007, 09:59 AM
pool pool is offline
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Is there a species of fish that is generally regarded to be the most intelligent?

Title pretty much says it all.

What about salt vs. fresh water.
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Old 07-19-2007, 10:36 AM
Jurph Jurph is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pool
Title pretty much says it all.
Title barely scratches the surface! Do you want to include all sea creatures, or are we excluding mammals? How about cephalopods like the octopus, which can open jars from the inside after watching people do it a few times? With "fish" I guess we can assume you mean just the scaly vertebrates.

I've heard fishermen talk about the cunning of particular types of trout and bass and catfish, but then fishermen talking about fish is about as reliable as a politician talking about what they'll do if elected. Goldfish can be trained to swim through hoops, but that's not much better than stimulus-response.

Groupers have been observed persuading moray eels to hunt with them, using a dance to communicate the location of the prey and offer to cooperate on the kill. That seems pretty smart to me, but I don't know where it would fall on the intelligence scale.
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Old 07-19-2007, 10:45 AM
pool pool is offline
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Quote:
Title barely scratches the surface! Do you want to include all sea creatures, or are we excluding mammals? How about cephalopods like the octopus, which can open jars from the inside after watching people do it a few times? With "fish" I guess we can assume you mean just the scaly vertebrates.
The last time I checked mammals are not fish but maybe I'm wrong. Your assumption is the correct one.
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Old 07-19-2007, 10:50 AM
carnivorousplant carnivorousplant is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jurph
the octopus, which can open jars from the inside after watching people do it a few times?
I've seen film of one opening a jar that had food in it, but not opening one from the inside. Is that to escape from a jar?
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Old 07-19-2007, 11:11 AM
Jurph Jurph is offline
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Originally Posted by carnivorousplant
I've seen film of one opening a jar that had food in it, but not opening one from the inside. Is that to escape from a jar?
I had heard about this apocryphally, and the motivation given was to escape, but I probably should have found a cite before stating it. I can't find one, so I'll reduce my claim to "they can open jars from the outside".
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Old 07-19-2007, 11:17 AM
garygnu garygnu is online now
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Cuttlefish are pretty damn smart, too. If you ever see the Nova episode on them, watch it.
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Old 07-19-2007, 11:39 AM
Dinsdale Dinsdale is offline
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One possible datapoint - when I walk past my aquaria, my angelfish come to the front and act excited, as tho they expect me to feed them. Other species - cories, tetras, rainbows, plecos, do not. Of course, this may mean the angels have better eyesight than the others.

I have heard many folk who keep oscars and piranha comment on their fish exhibiting personality and apparently learning - such as being able to be hand-fed, suggestive of intelligence.
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Old 07-19-2007, 11:54 AM
DSYoungEsq DSYoungEsq is offline
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It turns out fish are more intelligent that we usually think. Here is a link to an interview on NPR with Dr. Jens Krause, University of Leeds biology professor, who authored an article recently on fish intelligence. Also, for what it is worth, Here is a link to a web site that is devoted to fish intelligence.
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Old 07-19-2007, 01:27 PM
Thudlow Boink Thudlow Boink is offline
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Originally Posted by DSYoungEsq
It turns out fish are more intelligent that we usually think.
Well, they do travel in schools.

(I've been waiting since second grade to use that one.)
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Old 07-19-2007, 01:53 PM
Aioua Aioua is offline
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My danios learned after about two days that if they crowd next to my beta when I open the lid, they can steal his food, which is better than their smeppy spirulinia.
I swear, I have the wussiest beta ever spawned.
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Old 07-19-2007, 02:34 PM
carnivorousplant carnivorousplant is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jurph
I'll reduce my claim to "they can open jars from the outside".
Darn, I was thinking about The War of The Worlds radio broadcast, and the Martians unscrewing the hatch to their spaceship.
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Old 07-19-2007, 02:39 PM
Revenant Threshold Revenant Threshold is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dinsdale
One possible datapoint - when I walk past my aquaria, my angelfish come to the front and act excited, as tho they expect me to feed them. Other species - cories, tetras, rainbows, plecos, do not. Of course, this may mean the angels have better eyesight than the others.
My housemate's goldfish used to do that, too. Plus the whole "five minute memory" thing about them is untrue anyway, but I think they're reasonably smart.
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Old 07-19-2007, 02:58 PM
Stranger On A Train Stranger On A Train is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by garygnu
Cuttlefish are pretty damn smart, too. If you ever see the Nova episode on them, watch it.
Cuttlefish are not fish, they're invertebrate cephalopods like squid and octopus; this is a completley different phylum from fish.

Depending on how you define "fish", the layman concpetion of which is not encompassed by a single clade, you'll have a wide range of different behavior and environments. The intellectual capability of non-mammalian sea vertebrates is pretty limited, though; fish tend to be very highly specialized in what they eat and how they behave, so the sort of generalizing intelligence so useful in terrestrial environs doesn't seem to have developed among native marine vertebrates, though many members of class Cephalopoda have reguarly demonstrated high levels of learning, memory retention, and adaptation. I did once own an oscar, and he was certainly amenable to a limited amount of conditioned response, including recognizing my finger (probably by smell) and associating it with imminent arrival of live guppies, but I wouldn't go so far as to consider this cognitive intelligence in general form.

Stranger
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