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  #1  
Old 08-15-2007, 09:20 PM
xanthous xanthous is offline
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Why isn't there a law against dogs peeing/pooping in other people's yards?

It seems there are so many people that don't get the common sense of not letting their dogs pee/poop on other people's yards (because it happens 24/7), that there should be a law against it so as to clear up the matter.

(I'll state my position here: I am of a live-and-let-live mindset, and think of my lawn as what it is- an expanse of green plant matter, and I therefore could give a crap whether somebody's dog does same in my yard (cleaning it up woud be nice, but I don't bust a hemorrage when somebody doesn't), however I totally respect other people's property and do my best never to tread off the sidewalk when not in front of my house—mostly because of that one time shortly after I got my first dog that I was sure I was about to be attacked by someone who ran at me screeching "Get your dog, and get your dog's shit, off my lawn!"—I had no idea....)

Since this seems to be such a passionate topic (especially from the anti-dogpoop camp), and since so many people walk their dogs who eliminate in other people's yards, why not just clear up the matter, pass a law, and start busting people? Warnings/tickets/fines/what have you. Even if this would be a hard law to police, wouldn't the law itself, and a few visibly placed warnings (much like the No Parking Between 8a-6p signs) make people think twice and therefore not break it?

There are a million dog owners who think people that yell at them are being unreasonable, unfair, unkind, irrational. Their common sense says if their dog has to crap and they're in front of your yard, their dog's gonna crap in your yard, and if they're a decent sort, they'll clean it up. So why not a law to say clearly "no dog elimination in other people's yards"—and then it'd be settled?

I guess I'm just curious what the debate would be, so therefore, I ask of thee:

Discuss.
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  #2  
Old 08-15-2007, 09:35 PM
Miller Miller is online now
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Pretty sure it is against the law, in most urban/suburban jurisdictions.
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  #3  
Old 08-15-2007, 09:43 PM
groman groman is offline
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It's illegal to let your dog pee and poo in other people's yards. It's called "stay the fuck out of my yard" or otherwise known as trespassing on private property. If it is legal somewhere then it means that it's somehow explicitly made legal through law or precedent.
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  #4  
Old 08-15-2007, 10:07 PM
Aeschines Aeschines is offline
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Someone's dog just shit in my yard!
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  #5  
Old 08-15-2007, 10:19 PM
Thudlow Boink Thudlow Boink is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miller
Pretty sure it is against the law, in most urban/suburban jurisdictions.
That's what I thought.

If it isn't illegal in your area, take it up with your city council.

What do you want, an amendment to the U.S. Constitution?
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  #6  
Old 08-15-2007, 10:28 PM
Ravenman Ravenman is online now
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My understanding is that many places do in fact have laws against dogs relieving themselves on someone else's property. Personally, I think it is an absurd law. Dogs tend to be particular about where they do their business, and so long as someone cleans up the dog's waste, I think it is more or less nature taking its course. I'm reminded of the Old West axiom: if you don't want cattle on your land, put up a fence.

In other words, unless there's some nefarious conspiracy to deface an individual's lawn, the occasional yellowing of a front yard should be dismissed simply as an act of dog.
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  #7  
Old 08-15-2007, 11:07 PM
Odesio Odesio is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ravenman
My understanding is that many places do in fact have laws against dogs relieving themselves on someone else's property. Personally, I think it is an absurd law.
It's your responsibility to keep control over your animal. That extends to making sure he doesn't pee or crap in someone else's yard. What if someone's dog is peeing in a particular spot on your lawn and the grass begins to die? There's a guy on my street who just lets his dog out to go relieve himself in one of his neighbor's yard. While I've seen this dog relieve himself in other yards I never had definate proof that the pile of dog shit in my yard came from the same dog. I've see another guy in my neighborhood walk his little weiner dog across the street on a leash to let it relieve itself in his neighbor's yard. I walk my dog every single day and I don't let him pee or poop in someone else's yard. I even carry a little plastic bag to collect the waste off the street (we have no sidewalks).

Quote:
Dogs tend to be particular about where they do their business, and so long as someone cleans up the dog's waste, I think it is more or less nature taking its course.
It isn't that hard to control where a dog relieves itself.

Though to be truthful, in the past I've had more problems with cats pissing and shitting in my garden than I ever did with dogs.

Marc
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  #8  
Old 08-15-2007, 11:51 PM
Ravenman Ravenman is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MGibson
It's your responsibility to keep control over your animal. That extends to making sure he doesn't pee or crap in someone else's yard.
Well, yes, I understand what the law says. I'm just not agreeing with it.
Quote:
What if someone's dog is peeing in a particular spot on your lawn and the grass begins to die?
Quelle dommage. Unless there's some intent by the dog's owner to try to damage someone's lawn, I'd chalk up a bit of burnt-out lawn to the vicissitudes of nature, not something that an individual ought to face criminal and civil penalties for. The rather common obsession with a perfect lawn is, IMHO, more along the line of a neurosis rather than an endeavor deserving legal protection. If someone wants to insist on a lawn free from the interference from the natural course of animal life, then I think that extraordinary desire warrants extraordinary effort by the landowner; namely, he should fence off his yard.
Quote:
While I've seen this dog relieve himself in other yards I never had definite proof that the pile of dog shit in my yard came from the same dog. I've see another guy in my neighborhood walk his little weiner dog across the street on a leash to let it relieve itself in his neighbor's yard.
If the guy is letting the dog poop in the neighbors yard and not removing the offending article, I think that's extremely rude and probably deserving of punishment. I simply think that the law should allow animals a little latitude in deciding where to do their business, and humans should then take care that a nuisance doesn't persist.
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  #9  
Old 08-16-2007, 01:31 AM
Sublight Sublight is offline
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Now then, are there any laws against people peeing/pooping on other people's dogs?
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  #10  
Old 08-16-2007, 01:41 AM
Odesio Odesio is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ravenman
Quelle dommage. Unless there's some intent by the dog's owner to try to damage someone's lawn, I'd chalk up a bit of burnt-out lawn to the vicissitudes of nature, not something that an individual ought to face criminal and civil penalties for.
Whilte intent is important but we also punish people for negligence. Maybe they don't intend to mess up someone's lawn or to cause them any difficulties, like stepping in a dog turd someone else's dog left on your lawn, but it's still a nuisance and I don't think a small fine would be out of order. However, it's not like it's such a big deal that we need to pass additional laws. Rude neighbors nonwithstanding, I'm sure whatever laws we have on the books are enough.

Quote:
The rather common obsession with a perfect lawn is, IMHO, more along the line of a neurosis rather than an endeavor deserving legal protection.
I'm not a particular hard ass about preserving the sanctity of my lawn. So long as it's green and reasonably manicured I don't really care if it's perfect. However, other people care far more about their lawn than I do. I tend to respect other people's property which is why I take care to make sure that my dog does't relieve himself on their property. I honestly expect others to do the same.

Quote:
If someone wants to insist on a lawn free from the interference from the natural course of animal life, then I think that extraordinary desire warrants extraordinary effort by the landowner; namely, he should fence off his yard.
I don't think it's unreasonable in the least for an individual to insist that other people keep their domesticated animals off of his property.

Quote:
I simply think that the law should allow animals a little latitude in deciding where to do their business, and humans should then take care that a nuisance doesn't persist.
Having a little latitude doesn't mean giving the owners cart blanche to let their animals go anywhere they please. Quite frankly, I'm not ok with people even being in my yard without an invitation.

Marc
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  #11  
Old 08-16-2007, 01:45 AM
Kimstu Kimstu is offline
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The Master speaks:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cecil Adams
Dogs don't bug me, Etta, it's their idiotic owners. It's hard to believe you've gotten through life without noticing that dog urine can cause grass, shrubs, and other plant life to turn brown and wither. This charming phenomenon is called "urine burn." [...] The urine also makes the soil too acidic. The only cure is to dig up the ruined patch and reseed.

Well, you say, will just one dose wreck the local flora? It depends. One dose is certainly enough to do strange things to the grass. [...]

Male dogs have been known to do in bushes, hedges, and, in one case at least, a pine tree. So keep your mutts off other people's property. The dog may not have a clue, but it'd be nice if the owner did.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ravenman
If someone wants to insist on a lawn free from the interference from the natural course of animal life [...]
IMHO, "the natural course of animal life" is not quite the same thing as "the excretory habits of household pets". Yes, lawn owners should be prepared to share their lawns to some extent with local wildlife, and if they don't want to then they should put up a fence. However, the neighbors' pets are not local wildlife. Pet owners should take the responsibility for providing for their animals' needs, including their peeing and pooping needs, without letting them wander onto other people's private property.

And btw, IMHO communities also have a responsibility to provide areas of public property that (properly controlled and cleaned-up-after) pets can use. Pets should not be forced to stay within the confines of their owners' private property every minute of their lives, but neither should they be allowed to trespass on the private property of others.
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  #12  
Old 08-16-2007, 08:37 AM
MovingTarget MovingTarget is offline
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This is one thing that has always got my dander up. One of the things I hate most about mowing my lawn is having to dodge all the dog and cat shit in my lawn. I don't really care about the browning and such, but the nugget itself bugs the crap out of me (no pun intended). Now I DO know people who take very good care of their lawn. Mowing like 3 time a week, reseeding and aerating yearly, and so forth. And to them, it's no different than someone who takes very good care of their car, washing and waxing it weekly and such. Now, in some places, you CAN'T put up fences around your yard. fact of life. And we're supposed to just assume that since people can walk on it, they can destroy it. I call bullshit. What if someone let their dog walk all over your car and scratch the wax all to hell. Sure, you can just buff it out, and put some more wax on it, but I gaurantee it'd still piss off the owner. In the end it comes down to owner responsiblilty. If you have a pet, you should have someplace it can do it's business without bothering other people's property, if you don't have such a place, you shouldn't own a damn pet. Plain and simple. If I wanted dogshit on my lawn, and kitty pawprints all over my car, I'd own a frickin' dog and an outside cat. Keep your animals off my property, or I'll come over and crap on your front porch and pee all over your cars tires.

just my two cents

Last edited by Snipe1978; 08-16-2007 at 08:38 AM.. Reason: typos, probably still some there, it's still too early
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  #13  
Old 08-16-2007, 08:42 AM
Musicat Musicat is offline
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You want a law prohibiting others from giving you free fertilizer?
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  #14  
Old 08-16-2007, 08:51 AM
Lanzy Lanzy is offline
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Check your local laws carefully. My last place I lived had a poop law but considered pee perfectly OK. The dog poo law stated the shit had to be removed within 24 hours! So even when you actively caught someone letting their dog shit in your yard, it was perfectly legal for them to tell you, that they'd take care of it later. If you confront someone and they leave your property, and you continue to confront them, YOU can be arrested and/or fined for doing so depending on the verbal/physical escalation. Experience (not mine).
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Old 08-16-2007, 08:53 AM
MovingTarget MovingTarget is offline
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not so much the fertilizer, as the burnt spots and money cost to fix a lawn. I see no problem personally with having a law that prohibits it. It is after all trespassing. And if damages are incurred, could possibly considered vandalism. But seriously, how hard is it to keep your pet from crapping on other peoples lawns? Walk them around your OWN lawn till they do their business, the take a stroll around the block for christs sake. Unless you don't want them crapping in your lawn, in which case it's a safe bet other people don't want that either. Grow up and get some common sense people.
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  #16  
Old 08-16-2007, 09:09 AM
MTRG MTRG is offline
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What does the phrase "curb your dog" mean?

In a sidewalk situation, does this mean that you should have your dog use the "curb" (street) side of the sidewalk? Or do you just have to clean up after?
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  #17  
Old 08-16-2007, 09:59 AM
FlyingCowOfDoom FlyingCowOfDoom is offline
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I thought that the strip of lawn between the sidewalk and the street was the town's property, not the home owner's.



--FCOD
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  #18  
Old 08-16-2007, 10:02 AM
Dinsdale Dinsdale is offline
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Yeah, some dog poop or pee might cause a small patch of lawn to turn brown. Whereas the fertilizer and weedkillers applied by those in pursuit of a perfectly verdant lawn pollutes everyone's water...

I fully agree that pet owners should pick up their pets' poop. Having had rather large dogs for the past 25 years, I really have to wonder what is going on with the folks who experience significant grass/plant damage. I'm just wondering if the dogs in question have something odd about their diets or health, or if the pllants in question are especially fragile. Because my dogs have done their business primarily in my fenced backyards. While I readily acknowledge that my lawn would never be mistaken for a golf course, it looks pretty darned nice. There are a couple of bare/brown spots, but not necessarily where the dog usually relieves herself. So I don't know if they are due to dog mess, pests, weeds, human activity, or something else.

When I walk my dog, I ALWAYS pick up her poop. But I alternate the direction in which I walk her, so she is not always pooping or peeing on the same person's lawn/plants. Of course I don't let her root or dig around in anyone's gardens. I really doubt that her deposits are the cause of any noticeable damage to anyone's plantings. Just stating my quarter century of experience - nothing more.

In our area most property has a "parkway" - a strip of grass between the sidewalk and the street. My understanding is that the property owner has title over it and the responsibility to maintain it, but that to some extent there are public and utility easements over it. Would it satisfy you if dog walkers kept their dogs on that stretch of grass, rather than the lawn nearer to the house? Cause I'm regularly picking cigarette butts and other trash off of that strip of grass - way more troublesome than any apparent dog mess or urine damage. Not to mention the strip of grass that will never grow as the result of winter salt damage.

Heck, since I have a dog and she spends quite a bit of time out front with us, dogs passing by tend to give our property a little extra attention. Yet I have no problems with the grass, plants, shrubs, and trees out front. To the contrary, my wife and I like to garden, and most visitors would comment that our yards look above-average (tho far from picture-perfect).

Of course I have seen folks who are less responsible concerning their dogs. One guy walks his 3 large dogs along the same route while reading the paper, and makes no effort to clean up after them. If his route included my yard, I'd confront him and then file a complaint with the police. There is no excuse for that behavior.

So yes, there is a legitimate complaint about irresponsible pet owners. I agree that no one should have to pick up dog poop from their property other than that left by their own dog (if they have one). But my personal opinion is that is someone is upset about a leashed dog peeing on their property - well - I guess everyone has the right to get upset about whatever they wish. But this seems to me as tho it could well be quite far down the list of any rational person's priorities.
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Old 08-16-2007, 10:41 AM
Yllaria Yllaria is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyingCowOfDoom
I thought that the strip of lawn between the sidewalk and the street was the town's property, not the home owner's.
Depends. But whether the town owns it or just has an easement, it would be highly unusual for anyone but the property owner to have the responsibility of caring for it. And I'm pretty sure that leaving poop on town property is just as illegal as leaving poop on private property.

My best guess is that 'curb' means 'gutter', as in off of the sidewalk and in the street. But then I've never been in a city that had that rule.
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Old 08-16-2007, 11:03 AM
Cat Fight Cat Fight is offline
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I honestly thought the OP was referring to people who don't clean up after their dogs. Not picking up dog poop is despicable. I yell at people when I see them start to walk away. But I'd have a real problem with anyone sassing me as I stooped over, plastic bag on hand, after my puppy did her business at the edge of their grass (and if they got violent, I'd have the perfect weapon right there...).

As for peeing, my dog's a girl and gives me no signs of when she's about to go. Should I carry her away mid-tinkle? (for the record, she actually tends to go on public greenery. Most of the local dogs do, and it's just as healthy as ever. But she'll hold it in rather than go on pavement).
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  #21  
Old 08-16-2007, 11:28 AM
Dinsdale Dinsdale is offline
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Cat Fight - I guess some of these folk feel it should be (or is) illegal for you to walk your dog in a manner such that they step on anyone else's private property.

I remember 20-some years ago, soon after I had moved into my first house. I was walking my dog and he was taking a leak on a lawn 3 doors down from me. A guy whom I had not yet met came out of his front door hollering, "What is THAT?!" Thinking it a trick question, I responded somewhat querolously, "A dog urinating?" I thought (and still think) the guy was being a dick - and I'm sure he thought the same of me. But thereafter I made sure my dog didn't piss or shit on that jerk's lawn. (Well, at least when it was light enough out for the guy to see!)

Out of daily dog walks in residential areas over 20-some years, that's the only complaint I've heard about my dog pissing.
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  #22  
Old 08-16-2007, 12:13 PM
groman groman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dinsdale
Cat Fight - I guess some of these folk feel it should be (or is) illegal for you to walk your dog in a manner such that they step on anyone else's private property.
I'm all for making it explicitly legal when it comes to unfenced front yards, but any country that has any sort of claim towards allowing private property will have this defacto illegal
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  #23  
Old 08-16-2007, 12:19 PM
xanthous xanthous is offline
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In my own experience, I've got a couple things working against me: I have no strip of grass between sidewalk and street, and I've got multiple blocks between me and the nearest stretch of public grass.

My dog gets the "leave it" command, but if he can't help it and has to go, what am I to do? Stop walking him ever again in fear of trespassing in case of urgency?

I get that there are dicks who let their dogs do whatever, but why do I get a big serving of ire when I walk with a cleanup bag clearly visible AND a flashlight if it's nighttime? I'M the good guy! I'M the one that's trying to put a good face on dog walking and owner responsibility. (yes, I'm the one that even uses a flashlight and cleans up poop in the dark with a bag on a public piece of grass- I'm a good citizen, dammit!)

My main reason for bringing all of this up and also trying to get to the bottom of what all the debate is (because there is only a "clean up your dog's poop on other people's property" law in my city's municipal code): I've just started a dog-walking business (30 minute and 60 minute fitness walks) and to be honest, I'm petrified at the experiences I'm going to have with these dogs. Because they're not my dogs, in neighborhoods that aren't my own, and I've got to figure out how I'm supposed to make this happen, reasonably, without getting screamed at. It's definitely reasonable that dogs need exercise, it's reasonable that I've started a business to help people achieve that. But if I'm in the middle of house city and the dog in my care has GOT to take a dump, and I clean it up, and I still get screamed at: is that reasonable?

I just wish I knew which way it's gotta be. Maybe that's too much to ask
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Old 08-16-2007, 05:11 PM
AskNott AskNott is offline
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An urban legend says that sales of Toostsie Roll chocolate candy have picked up, because of a trick some dog owners use. A Tootsie Roll in a zippy bag, held in the leash hand, will create the illusion the the dog owner is a good citizen, who has picked up after the dog. Only the owner of the lawn where the dog actually craps is onto the ruse. It doesn't work for owners of big dogs that put out kielbasa-sized poop.

As for my own opinion, I'm staying out of this round of the frequent dog-poo-in-the-yard dance. It's going smoothly without me.
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  #25  
Old 08-16-2007, 05:23 PM
xanthous xanthous is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AskNott
As for my own opinion, I'm staying out of this round of the frequent dog-poo-in-the-yard dance. It's going smoothly without me.
Trust me, I'm not even sure why I'm putting myself through this. It's like a question without an answer. Well really it's a question with a million very different answers.
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  #26  
Old 08-16-2007, 05:44 PM
Ludovic Ludovic is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sublight
Now then, are there any laws against people peeing/pooping on other people's dogs?
Heck no! We work hard to put food on our familes! What is this, Soviet Russia?
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Old 08-16-2007, 06:00 PM
doreen doreen is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xanthous
In my own experience, I've got a couple things working against me: I have no strip of grass between sidewalk and street, and I've got multiple blocks between me and the nearest stretch of public grass.

My dog gets the "leave it" command, but if he can't help it and has to go, what am I to do? Stop walking him ever again in fear of trespassing in case of urgency?
We don't have a strip of grass between the sidewalk and the street in my neighborhood ,either. The law here requires that dog owners not only clean up the poop, but also "curb their dog", that is, have the dog pee or poop in the street (and then clean up the poop) rather than on the sidewalk or in my front yard. I don't really understand how people who were able to housebreak a dog can't also train the dog to use the gutter ( where people don't garden and children don't usually play).

My guess is the reason you're getting the ire is actually not completely due to the dog peeing/pooping. I get annoyed at people who let their dogs pee or poop in my front garden, but I also get annoyed at the delivery people who walk through it and the children who play in it and I'd get annoyed if you and a friend were standing in it talking. It's very clearly private property and separated from the sidewalk-you have to walk up a few steps to get to it. I presume you wouldn't feel free to let your dog use my backyard ( although one of my neighbors has). Why would my front yard be different?
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Old 08-16-2007, 06:57 PM
Magiver Magiver is offline
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They could make it a Federal offense punishable by eating the evidence and it wouldn't make a wit of difference. There isn't anyone who will enforce it. Seriously, you can't get a policeman to come out and investigate a stolen car stereo.

Go to your local warehouse club and buy an industrial can of cayenne pepper. Refresh the area as needed.
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  #29  
Old 08-17-2007, 06:44 PM
Contrapuntal Contrapuntal is offline
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My dog's breath smells like dogshit.
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  #30  
Old 08-18-2007, 05:08 PM
Kimstu Kimstu is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xanthous
My main reason for bringing all of this up and also trying to get to the bottom of what all the debate is (because there is only a "clean up your dog's poop on other people's property" law in my city's municipal code): I've just started a dog-walking business (30 minute and 60 minute fitness walks) and to be honest, I'm petrified at the experiences I'm going to have with these dogs. Because they're not my dogs, in neighborhoods that aren't my own, and I've got to figure out how I'm supposed to make this happen, reasonably, without getting screamed at.
Well, your best bet will probably be to keep the dogs off other people's private property as much as possible (ideally, to keep them off other people's private property entirely). Can you start your walks with a few minutes' strolling around the owner's property, to encourage the dogs in the habit of doing their business there before you take them out onto the streets?

And then perhaps you could keep the dog moving briskly along (it's supposed to be a fitness walk, after all) with some designated pauses on your route at sites where it's okay for the dog to take a pee or poop stop, like a dog park or some waste ground or a telephone pole, etc. IME most dogs can learn to recognize the preferred "places to go", with a little encouragement and reinforcement.

If the dog does trespass onto someone else's property for a bathroom break before you can stop it---well, I'd say just clean up the poop if there is any, move on, try to keep it from happening again, but don't subject yourself to agonies of guilt and remorse. If an irate property-owner spots it happening and screams at you (or even expresses mild displeasure), apologize politely and assure him/her that you hadn't meant to let the dog trespass, that you're always very careful about trying to keep the dogs off of private property, and you'll make sure it doesn't happen again.

Yes, you have a fine line to walk between the fact that many property owners don't like to have trespassing dogs excreting bodily wastes on their private property, and the fact that dogs don't understand the concept of private property and want to go when they gotta go. But politeness, respect, and good-faith efforts on your part will go a long way towards preventing and/or mitigating friction. Good luck in your new business!
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  #31  
Old 08-19-2007, 01:40 AM
Random Random is offline
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The word >curb< in the phrase >curb your dog< is not a reference to the concrete thing on the ride of the road pavement.

Instead, it is used as a synonym for >restrain<. In other words, the mandate is to keep your dog on a leash and under control.
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Old 08-19-2007, 01:41 AM
Random Random is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MTRG
What does the phrase "curb your dog" mean?

In a sidewalk situation, does this mean that you should have your dog use the "curb" (street) side of the sidewalk? Or do you just have to clean up after?

Neither.
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Old 08-19-2007, 02:23 AM
Kimstu Kimstu is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Random
The word >curb< in the phrase >curb your dog< is not a reference to the concrete thing on the ride of the road pavement.

Instead, it is used as a synonym for >restrain<. In other words, the mandate is to keep your dog on a leash and under control.
This may be the correct literal interpretation of the phrase "Curb your dog", but it is not in fact what the phrase means nowadays in ordinary use.

The most common meaning of "Curb your dog" as now used is "Pick up and dispose of your dog's poop instead of leaving it on the ground". It is also frequently used to mean "Don't let your dog urinate or defecate on other people's property".

Some examples:
Quote:
1. Do Your Doody - Curb Your Dog!

What a joy it is to be walking through a park or open field these days. The trees! The blue sky! The scenery! THE POOP? Oh yah! You know what I mean! [...]

I am ANGRY about the selfish dog owners who don’t “Curb their dog”, as we say in New York! I’m a dog owner, and my dog poops between 2-4 times a day, and we have a plastic bag ready to go at all times!
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2. Your Dog and the Law

The phrase "Curb your Dog" is enforced in most areas. Make sure you have a scooper or plastic bag with you while walking your leashed dog to avoid any unpleasant dilemmas.
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3. Random Rant: Curb Your Dog!

I was walking out of my building yesterday in DUMBO to see this woman walking her two little norfolk terriers. [...] She was pulling one of them by the neck to jump over the little gate around the tree outside my building so he could go urinate on the tree. [...] [T]he guy standing next to me in the lobby said "we need to put curb your dog signs up." [...]

Well, I told her I would appreciate if she didn't let her dogs pee on our trees and in case she didn't realize, the gates are there for a reason.
Any "strict constructionist" dog owners who think they have carte blanche to let their dogs pee or poop anywhere they like (and/or not clean up the poop afterwards), just because the word "curb" literally only means "restrain", are living in a fool's paradise. They will soon have irate neighbors loudly explaining to them what the phrase "curb your dog" means in current usage.
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  #34  
Old 08-19-2007, 03:10 AM
Random Random is offline
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Join Date: Sep 1999
Kimstu, I never claimed carte blanche to do anything, and am well aware of what local pooper scooper ordinances often say.

But people seem to think that an ordinance that requires owners to curb their dogs has something to do with a concrete curb, or delineates where a pet may be walked. That is not the case, even if you are able to cite a blog or two where someone mis-uses the term (in each case, fairly vaguely).

You seem to be claiming that there is some universal present-day understanding of what the term means. Please explain -- where may a dog be walked, if a local ordinance requires that he be "curbed"?

Last edited by Random; 08-19-2007 at 03:12 AM..
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  #35  
Old 08-19-2007, 03:43 AM
Kimstu Kimstu is offline
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Join Date: Dec 1999
Quote:
Originally Posted by Random
Please explain -- where may a dog be walked, if a local ordinance requires that he be "curbed"?
E.g., on sidewalks, in parks, and on all other public property where dogs are allowed (assuming he is properly cleaned up after).

Are there really people out there who think that the phrase "curb your dog" means dogs aren't allowed to walk on the sidewalk?

The only thing I can think of that could possibly give rise to such a misinterpretation is the original 1938 "Curb Your Dog" ordinance in New York City that was widely taken to mean that dogs should be kept off the sidewalk when defecating. But that was amended to the "pooper scooper" mandate way back in the 1970's:
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4 December 1938 [...] The ordinance demands that dogs be curbed. There are signs everywhere with the request, "Curb your dog." It means that owners cannot allow their pets to soil buildings, nor can a dog make a nuisance of himself on the grass of the parkway or on the sidewalk. [...]

20 August 1972 [...] Existing city law literally prohibits pet owners from permitting dogs to defecate on any public property; however, in the past this law has been interpreted to mean that defecating dogs should be "curbed" - kept off the sidewalk - and even this interpretation has not been rigorously enforced. So in what might be considered a response to public pressure, Jerome Ketchmer had chosen this Tuesday morning, May 16, to announce a proposal to amend Section 755(2) - 7.0 of the city's Administrative Code to require dog owners to pick up their pets' droppings or face a $25 fine.
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