I know we’ve debated this before, but I couldn’t remember if anyone ever cited a case in which someone ended up being arrested rather than just bugged at the door or on the sidewalk outside.
If Michael Righi is telling the truth, both happened to him. A quick summary: Righi purchased a game for the Wii and a surge protector, then ignored the guy who asked to check his bag, saying “No thanks.” The bag-checker followed him to his car outside (his dad had pulled to the curb to wait for him) and called for his manager to follow. Righi got in the back seat, but one of the employees stood between the open door and the car, preventing Righi from closing the door. The other stood in front of the car. Righi asked the employee to state the law allowing him to check his bag, and the employee couldn’t but still insisted he had the right. Righi said to either let him go, call the police on him or let Righi himself call the police. The employee didn’t move, so Righi called the police. The officer agreed with Circuit City, and asked Righi for his receipt and driver’s license. He turned over the receipt, but there being no law requiring him to turn over the license, he didn’t. He did give the officer his name. Righi says the ordinance the officer arrested him under was:
His case comes up Sept. 20.
My thinking is that the the “public official’s lawful duties” don’t include demanding the driver’s license (since he wasn’t driving the car), but not being a lawyer I could of course be wrong. I guess it also makes it pretty clear it’s not illegal to walk right by the guys checking the bags, since he would have been charged with that too, right? Or is there something here I’m missing?
“Obstruction” is often used as a catch-all “charging them with something” device in the code, to deal with “troublemakers”. Which is probably how Officer Respect Mah Authoratee saw Righi; * “Jesus Christ, I have to take time from real work to respond to a call about someone so anal about his oh so precious rights that he won’t just comply with a silly store rule and be done? And now he’s going to pull that on ME when I ask him to identify himself?”* . Refusing to provide the ID gave the Officer an opening to disregard the original issue – that Circuit City employees were carrying out a detention under false prestenses, if indeed there is no law that says you have to obey them – and instead charge him for wasting his time over trifles, where the only evidence in issue will be whether or not Righi was being cooperative.
ORD:525.07: Obstructing Official Business (M-2)
(a) No person, without privilege to do so and with purpose to prevent, obstruct or delay the performance by a public official of any authorized act within the public official’s offical capacity shall do any act that hampers or impedes a public official in the performance of the public official’s lawful duties.
The arrest was false based upon the charge. The gentleman in no way prevented, obstructed or delayed the performance of the officer. The performance was to investigate stealing, best I can tell. The bag and receipt were turned over for inspection to the officer, duty complete. at what point is the identity of the man needed ? Even more, at what point beyond giving his name, is failure to supply a drivers license a crime ?
"False arrest is a common law tort, where a plaintiff alleges he or she was held in custody without probable cause or without an order issued by a court of competent jurisdiction. "
“A police officer, or a person authorized by a jurisdiction’s police powers act, may arrest anyone whom the officer has reasonable and probable cause to believe has committed any criminal offence.”
From the information we have here, I see no probable cause for an arrest. Did the officer think he was lying about his identity ? Why ?
He broke the law. That is why he was arrested. The officer was doing his lawful duty by requesting identification, and Righi obstructed that by refusing to do so.
I believe you’re wrong. Ohio’s stop and identify statute says you’re not required to do anything but provide your name, address and date of birth.
Also note that this only applies if the officer reasonably believes you committed an offense or observed a felony, which it’s questionable applies to Righi.
Here’s my question on this. There is, apparently, no legal obligation for US citizens to carry ID. So how can a US citizen be arrested for failing to provide something they had no obligation to have in the first place?
Well, I can’t disagree, but why is something which is not a crime grounds to haul a person off in handcuffs?
I mean, failing to provide ID can’t be a crime if there’s no requirement to have ID in the first place. As I understand it, no US citizen is required to have ID just because they exist.
Actually, all US citizens are required to have an identification within 6 weeks of birth. It’s called a birth certificate and you must have one by law for the simple reason that you exist.
Furthermore, this was not, as far as I can tell, a Terry Stop. There was no reasonable suspicion of the man committing a crime.
Really, Iknewit? I do hear of people in Cali who don’t get born in hospitals. They’re American citizens, too.
Hm
New York says I don’t actually have to identify myself, even if the peace officer demands it. And obstruction must be physical in nature.
The cops here don’t act like that’s true, I tell you that much.
Reading the article and it’s comments it appears he was unlawfully detained by the store employees, unless he just drove away slowly and told them he was doing so. My guess is they would have moved.
It also appears the cop was wrong to arrest him for not showing ID. After they checked his bag it should have ended there.
Still, In an age when theft is a serious loss for stores I don’t think stores checking receipts is such a horrible thing. If you really object don’t shop there. In a community I’d be more concerned about helping the merchant prevent loss than making an issue over this. While you’re in the store you’re still on private property.
I wonder what this guys suggestions are for stores to prevent loss.
No, no…you are required to carry it to get a SS#, which gets you a license which when combined with the others will get you your national ID card, which will then be required to be carried at all times and later, if your national ID card does not say “Republican”, you will be shot on sight. Plan complete.
I’ve posted in that thread. I am strongly opposed to any form of national ID cards.
And no, I can’t answer your Social Security question. I didn’t realise that one could be denied employment for failing to register in a voluntary program.