What was/is the appeal of Garcia and the Dead?

[Rilchiam]

Now, I don't mean that in a snarky way, where "What was?" means "What could possibly have been?". I'm just curious, and in fact, I can't snark because I have next to no knowledge of Grapefruit Bread. (As my friend used to call them. He was not a fan either.)

I don't know the band's history, for one. How did the tour cycle begin and thrive?

I don't know too many Deadheads. What elevated Garcia in their eyes?

I'm not familiar with the music apart from the unavoidable songs. On what level did it reach fans -- melodically, lyrically, other? My friend said he gave up trying to appreciate GD after the person who was pushing them told him "You kind of have to be stoned." Since he didn't kind of have to be stoned to appreciate Pink Floyd or Zep or Hendrix (although that never hurt), those remained his favorites of the era. But is that true to any extent? Did they keep producing albums throughout the years of touring, or was it the same songs every year? Were they classified as "acid rock"? Funny thing, I can't get enough of the minor-league acid rock bands, so it's odd, if GD was the best of the lot, that I can't get into them.

So if anyone can enlighten me. I'm 37, so I've been aware of the Deadhead phenomenon all my life. I have nothing against the band or their fans; I'm just in the dark here.

[msmith537]

I'm not a huge Dead fan or anything, but I imagine much of the appeal is the actual experience of being at a Dead show and the whole culture surrounding it.

The music itself is kind of chill. It's kind of a non-pretentous meandering folksy, bluesy light Souther rock sound. Kind of like a lighter version of the Allman Brothers. So people who go to see the Dead aren't there to rock out. They are there to wander around a muddy field in their tie die shirts, smoke some weed and just hang out.

I would characterize them more as a "jam band" than "acid rock". I think acid rock has a harder sound like Hendrix or Jefferson Airplane. That is to say they are known for long rambling solos and selling more concert tickets than albums.

It also paved the way for other "jam bands" later on like Phish, Dave Mathews Band, Blues Traveler, Rusted Root, O.A.R. and others.

[don't ask]

Originally Posted by msmith537

I'm not a huge Dead fan or anything, but I imagine much of the appeal is the actual experience of being at a Dead show and the whole culture surrounding it.

Got it in one. Go to Archive.org and you will find about 45,000 live performances available for download and 3,225 are The Grateful Dead.

[WordMan]

Originally Posted by Rilchiam

Now, I don't mean that in a snarky way, where "What was?" means "What could possibly have been?". I'm just curious, and in fact, I can't snark because I have next to no knowledge of Grapefruit Bread. (As my friend used to call them. He was not a fan either.)

I don't know the band's history, for one. How did the tour cycle begin and thrive?

I don't know too many Deadheads. What elevated Garcia in their eyes?

I'm not familiar with the music apart from the unavoidable songs. On what level did it reach fans -- melodically, lyrically, other? My friend said he gave up trying to appreciate GD after the person who was pushing them told him "You kind of have to be stoned." Since he didn't kind of have to be stoned to appreciate Pink Floyd or Zep or Hendrix (although that never hurt), those remained his favorites of the era. But is that true to any extent? Did they keep producing albums throughout the years of touring, or was it the same songs every year? Were they classified as "acid rock"? Funny thing, I can't get enough of the minor-league acid rock bands, so it's odd, if GD was the best of the lot, that I can't get into them.

So if anyone can enlighten me. I'm 37, so I've been aware of the Deadhead phenomenon all my life. I have nothing against the band or their fans; I'm just in the dark here.

I typically end up in the same place - not a fan, not inclined to be a fan, but really curious what could possibly engage so many fans. I have aged out of my need to dismiss things I don't like - it takes all kinds. I just don't get The Dead and haven't heard anything musically that encourages me to keep looking. As a guitarist, Jerry has a wonderful ability to play arpeggiated, melodic leads that are pretty.

I went to one Dead show - at the Shoreline with Bruce Hornsby on keyboards. Through connections, I had a limo to the show, backstage passes (got to hang out with Bill Walton, w00t!) - the whole bit. It was a fun experience and one I would consider doing again. But the thing that entertained me was the experience much more than the music (per msmith537). The music was almost Muzak - a well-suited background context for the activity at hand - in this case, hanging out with a bunch of like-minded DeadHeads. No disrespect meant by that - a cool nightclub needs the right soundtrack, as does an upscale clothing store. This particular event's soundtrack happened to be the Dead - but it functioned better as a soundtrack, IMHO, as opposed to being the point of the show...hope that makes sense...

My $.02

[Dinsdale]

We were talking about this at my house over the weekend. Wife was a fan, I was not. I always figured the drugs had to play a big part, but then I was the stoner and I couldn't bear the Dead. Went to a couple of concerts. Had a good time. But could never appreciate their tedious jamming that deadheads thrill over.

[silenus]

You had to be there, man.

The music, man. It was just........awesome, dude. Really. Jerry and Pigpen jamming, Bill doing his thing.....heh.......where was I?

[BwanaBob]

My sole GD experience was being at Candlestick Park Opening Day 1994 and hearing them do the National Anthem acapella.

[Cluricaun]

I'm a recovering Deadhead (meaning that I've not worn a tye dye in years and I only have 15 or so bootleg concert tapes left) and I remember the first time that the Dead "clicked" for me. If you wanted to search that Archive.org site and look for 05/19/74 from Portland Oregon and start with the Truckin in the second set you'll get a good example of what the Dead could do when they were on fire.

When they were on, they were the best bar band in the entire world. When they were off, and boy did that happen a lot, they were horrible. Like with a lot of other things you have to sift through the rubbish to find the diamond in the rough. I just liked that it took me 15 years (this was before the internet) to get a handle on the bands discography. Imagine a band that had a near infinate output and that never played the same thing the same way more than once. Good times.

[Caprese]

Originally Posted by Cluricaun

When they were on, they were the best bar band in the entire world. When they were off, and boy did that happen a lot, they were horrible. Like with a lot of other things you have to sift through the rubbish to find the diamond in the rough. I just liked that it took me 15 years (this was before the internet) to get a handle on the bands discography. Imagine a band that had a near infinate output and that never played the same thing the same way more than once. Good times.

Yes. I was a teen in their heyday. Well, I guess they had a long heyday, but I was 17, 18, 19 the times I saw them, which was the early 1970s.
What first attracted me to them was their countrified American Beauty sound.
Then there was the other fun stuff, like throwing pot from the stage.
IMHO, The Dead were alt-country before the term existed. They were sincere, but for better or for worse, did not take themselves too seriously.
Boulder Colorado 1972 was a good one.

[WordMan]

Originally Posted by Cluricaun

I'm a recovering Deadhead

But....but...but - I thought you were a metal dude, Dude? Or at least into shredding guitar, right? And if there's one thing Jerry did NOT do, it's shred...

[silenus]

Man, this thread has me going over set lists, trying to remember every time I've seen the Dead. There were some great shows over the years. Some total trash, of course, but it's the stellar nights that stand out. I never got into following the band, but I've seen them all over the West: Winterland, Anchorage, Irvine, Shrine, Swing....and more than a few I've forgotten. Truly good times.

[Wee Bairn]

The appeal is definitely not in the studio albums- maybe only Workingman's Dead and American Beauty would be considered above average albums.

[Cluricaun]

Originally Posted by WordMan

But....but...but - I thought you were a metal dude, Dude? Or at least into shredding guitar, right? And if there's one thing Jerry did NOT do, it's shred...

I know, but let me put it this way: Like lots of guys who grew up in the 80's/90's I was a punk rock kid. As I got to be a better guitar player I got tired of the traditional 3 chord songlist and became more of a metal guy, which I remain to this day. As my playing progressed, so did my horizons as to what was hip to my ears. Jerry Garcia might not "shred", but boy could he play the everloving shit out of the guitar, so I dig it. Any given day my CD changer can see a Dead disc, a Pantera disc, a SRV disc, a Mahavishnu Orchestra disc, and an Opeth disc. I just love guitar based music where the player plays with that certain fire. It's true however that every band I've ever been in was mostly a metal band and that's where the allegiance of my ethos lies to this day. I'm far more likely to throw the horns than a peace sign. I don’t get down with that hippie mentality quite so much.


As far as keeping my ethos in order, I consider the Grateful Dead to be the most punk rock band of all time. Punk is not a musical style as so much it's an attitude that you do things your way, all the time, without compromise. They were outlaws, pirates of the world. They played anywhere, any time for the sole purpose of expressing the idea that music can be a powerful force to change your life and any time is a good time to seek new converts for having a rock and roll epiphany. That’s pretty fucking punk rock in my book.

[WordMan]

Cluricaun - thanks; well-articulated and given your thinking, it makes sense. I see how you look at the Dead as punk, given your definition. I think I disagree using different criteria*, but that's not the point - it works for you and makes sense given what you look for in music.

[slight hijack]

Since you like "guitar based music where the player plays with that certain fire" may I suggest Virtuoso #3 by Joe Pass? If you like jazz guitar - not shreddy jazz fusion, which I put into a different category - more in line with be-bop and hard bop - then this solo instrumental CD is the tits. His technique is out front and completely mind-blowing, but the songs are smooth and musically interesting. It's like one long Eruption for straight-up jazz guitar - that goes down smooth...

[/slight hijack]

*a key to something being punk, to me, is it having an element of danger. While the Dead "lifestyle" is outside normal circles, it doesn't feel remotely dangerous to me - it just feels, I dunno, groovy...and musically, they aren't dangerous at all, IMHO - it's mostly roots music that could be played in front of unsuspecting grandparents back in the day...again, YMMV.

[kelly5078]

I saw the Dead once, in 1969; they played in the college gym, since it was a couple of years before we had a real concert auditorium. They had huge stacks of smallish speakers, in various colors, but all in what I guess could be called earth tones. Nonetheless, didn't play particularly loud. They played their own stuff, and tons of covers, all of which were well done. Although they jammed, they did not, as far as I recall (though it was a very long time ago) indulge in the very long jams that they became famous for. It was probably the longest concert I've ever attended, or at least my ass thought so, since the only places to sit were in the bleachers or on the floor.

They were nowhere near the best band I'd ever heard, but there was something about them. I seemed like there was hardly any distance at all between them and the audience. I have been to many shows by local bar bands that were less intimate than theirs was. I think that must be part of the appeal.

[Cluricaun]

Originally Posted by WordMan

a key to something being punk, to me, is it having an element of danger. While the Dead "lifestyle" is outside normal circles, it doesn't feel remotely dangerous to me - it just feels, I dunno, groovy...and musically, they aren't dangerous at all, IMHO - it's mostly roots music that could be played in front of unsuspecting grandparents back in the day...again, YMMV.

I think that in their heyday the Dead were dangerous. I wasn't there so I don't know first hand, but from what I hear they were hard blues playing acid rock dudes until the 70's and mischevious party monsters that rolled with the Hells Angels and that's dangerous in anybodys book. I know that towards the end when the mayor of the town they were playing in would come out to the show in a Jerry Garcia tie and hand them the keys to the city they weren't dangerous anymore, but when was the last time the Sex Pistols scared someones mom? As time passes it becomes something else that holds that danger, be it The Beatles or Marilyn Manson (who has passed his nadir as well) or whatever is now the scary band de jour.

Rock and roll is always a little bit dangerous to parents, it will always be too sexy or to drunk and high or too loud and that's a good thing. Dad might have smoked a doobie at a Doors concert back in the day, but he's still wont to pass his daughter off into the hands of <gasp> musicians.


ETA- I'll totally check out that record. I'm always down for someone who smokes on the axe.

[WordMan]

Originally Posted by Cluricaun

I think that in their heyday the Dead were dangerous. I wasn't there so I don't know first hand, but from what I hear they were hard blues playing acid rock dudes until the 70's and mischevious party monsters that rolled with the Hells Angels and that's dangerous in anybodys book. I know that towards the end when the mayor of the town they were playing in would come out to the show in a Jerry Garcia tie and hand them the keys to the city they weren't dangerous anymore, but when was the last time the Sex Pistols scared someones mom? As time passes it becomes something else that holds that danger, be it The Beatles or Marilyn Manson (who has passed his nadir as well) or whatever is now the scary band de jour.

Rock and roll is always a little bit dangerous to parents, it will always be too sexy or to drunk and high or too loud and that's a good thing. Dad might have smoked a doobie at a Doors concert back in the day, but he's still wont to pass his daughter off into the hands of <gasp> musicians.


ETA- I'll totally check out that record. I'm always down for someone who smokes on the axe.

That all makes sense - time and perception of danger evolves...

And yeah, check out Mr. Pass - I would love to hear your thoughts...

[jackdavinci]

Never been to a Dead concert, although I do remember where I was when I heard Garcia died. I actually had a friend in college named Jerry Garcia, poor guy. Someone told my other friend Colleen that Garcia had died and she started crying, thinking it was our mutual friend.

But I did go to a Phish concert after they were "passed the torch". Although the music was groovy in it's own way, it was more of a jammin live type thing than something I would run out to the record store to buy. It was definitely about the experience of being there, and the commonality of the people, all being nice to each other and sharing their groovy natures with each other. A big love in if you will.

/hijack/ has anyone taken up the torch after Phish?

[Cluricaun]

Originally Posted by jackdavinci

/hijack/ has anyone taken up the torch after Phish?

Not really. There are a few jam bands still making the scene as it were such as Widespread Panic and moe, but some recent visits to college campuses around here has demonstrated that hippies are a dying breed. I blame Dave Matthews personally, but then again I'll blame Dave Matthews for damned near anything.

[WordMan]

Originally Posted by Cluricaun

I blame Dave Matthews personally, but then again I'll blame Dave Matthews for damned near anything.

How can you say that? Haven't you heard them? They're much better than they sound!



(sorry, I love invoking that line - which I think I first got from another poster here - whenever I can...)

[Quercus]

My two roaches worth:
Sticking to the music, my opinion is the Dead in concert followed a rule of three: a third of the show was OK, a equivalent of a decent bar band doing covers; a third of the show was tiresome pointless jamming; and third of the show was musically transcendent.
What made the good parts good was a remarkable confluence of the creativity of psychedelic music with the grounded emotional truths of bluegrass/country, and a willingness and ability to improvise. Again, sometimes that improvisation didn’t work, but when it did, there’s really nothing better than hearing music successfully created on the fly.

I think many people found the long rhythmic jams less boring than I did. Chemicals may play a part in that for some.

Of course, there is the attraction of the scene. They’re pretty mainstream now, but for a long while, they really stood for something outside (at one point, seeing ‘a deadhead sticker on a Cadillac’ was actually worth noting).

[Little Nemo]

I think a lot of the appeal was following the band was a social event. It gave a group of people a reason to travel around and party together.

[msmith537]

Originally Posted by Cluricaun

Not really. There are a few jam bands still making the scene as it were such as Widespread Panic and moe, but some recent visits to college campuses around here has demonstrated that hippies are a dying breed. I blame Dave Matthews personally, but then again I'll blame Dave Matthews for damned near anything.

I think what happened in the 90s was that the jam band scene shifted from dirty, smelly hippie counterculture outsiders to the white baseball cap Abercrombie & Fitch upper middle class prep-school frat boy types. In fact, I tend to associate The Dead, Phish and DMB with my college fraternity days. Basically the type of music that the houses would play in the middle of the afternoon while barbequeing and drinking beer on a shitty old couch in the yard.

[Algher]

Originally Posted by msmith537

I think what happened in the 90s was that the jam band scene shifted from dirty, smelly hippie counterculture outsiders to the white baseball cap Abercrombie & Fitch upper middle class prep-school frat boy types. In fact, I tend to associate The Dead, Phish and DMB with my college fraternity days. Basically the type of music that the houses would play in the middle of the afternoon while barbequeing and drinking beer on a shitty old couch in the yard.

Hey - we did that in the 80s, dammit! We also went to the shows, so I guess that makes me part of the transition movement.

Listening to the Frost amphitheater show in 1989 right now.

[Barrington]

Originally Posted by Wee Bairn

The appeal is definitely not in the studio albums- maybe only Workingman's Dead and American Beauty would be considered above average albums.

It's only personal taste, but I'd disagree (although I do like those two albums too). Terrapin Station and Blues for Allah are sublime, in my ears.

Then again, I'm one of those musicians who focusses very much on the instrumentalists' performances, to the extent of barely hearing the lyrics. Maybe that's the difference.

[F. U. Shakespeare]

I've never been a big fan of the Dead, but they engender a kind of respect. They famously allowed their audiences to record their concerts*, on state-of-the-art media yet. (Grateful Dead fans were a major component of the digital audio tape market in the late 1980s). In this era of the draconian measures of ASCAP and the RIAA, such enlightened self-interest seems downright quaint.

A guitarist I once played in a band with said one reason people would go see them over and over was that unlike most bands, they didn't play the same songs every show. In fact, he claimed that in the three or four times he saw the Dead, they only repeated a handful of songs.

* This might account for the disproportionate number of Dead concerts available on archive.org.

[OneCentStamp]

I think a lot of the appeal of the Dead was the same as the appeal of, say, KISS or The Aquabats: they gave their fans a sense of belonging to something. That kind of club/army/communal spirit goes a long way towards making lifelong fans.

[Mister Rik]

My dad [allegedly] had an amusing encounter with one of the Grateful Dead, some time in the early '70s. Thing was, as a pure country music fan he had no idea who the Grateful Dead were at the time. He was working for the Washington State Patrol, at a weigh station on I-5 just north of Vancouver, WA, and the Dead's truck(s) had to cross his scales on their way north (probably traveling from Portland, Oregon to Seattle). For whatever reason, they needed to stop and present their permits. This is what makes me take Dad's story with a grain of salt, as his narrative implies that a member of the band was actually driving the truck (rather than a roadie/official driver). But his story of the encounter goes something like this:

Band member enters the weigh station and presents permits.

DAD: Grateful Dead, huh? What do you do, haul caskets?
GD MEMBER: Uh, no. We're a rock band.
DAD: Huh. Are you any good?
GDM: ... We're the best band in the world!
DAD: All right, your permits are good. Good luck to you, and have a nice day!

[WordMan]

Originally Posted by Phase42

This is what makes me take Dad's story with a grain of salt, as his narrative implies that a member of the band was actually driving the truck (rather than a roadie/official driver). But his story of the encounter goes something like this:

Band member enters the weigh station and presents permits.

DAD: Grateful Dead, huh? What do you do, haul caskets?
GD MEMBER: Uh, no. We're a rock band.
DAD: Huh. Are you any good?
GDM: ... We're the best band in the world!
DAD: All right, your permits are good. Good luck to you, and have a nice day!

Nah - if you are a long-time member of the band's crew, the concept of We enlarges to include you. The Dead were particularly known for having a huge family of friends, crew, lyricists, archivists, etc. I doubt it was a band member, but instead someone who felt entitled to think they were part of the gang...

[Biffy the Elephant Shrew]

Originally Posted by WordMan

They're much better than they sound!



(sorry, I love invoking that line - which I think I first got from another poster here - whenever I can...)

That's Edgar Wilson Nye's comment about Wagner (quoted by, and commonly attributed to, Mark Twain).

[Biffy the Elephant Shrew]

Originally Posted by Barrington

It's only personal taste, but I'd disagree (although I do like those two albums too). Terrapin Station and Blues for Allah are sublime, in my ears.

I'll second both of those (though I do think there are a couple of dodgy tracks on Terrapin) and add a shout-out for my favorite Dead album of all, [/i]Aoxomoxoa[/i].

[Rilchiam]

Okay, so it basically comes down to "You had to be there." Again, not being snarky. Still, I'd rather bang my head to Zep than sway to the Dead.

[RealityChuck]

The Dead were top-notch musicians and songwriters, which helped. If you download their music from archive.org, you can see they played a very wide repetoire of songs -- probably more than any other band. They played not only their own music, but music from many other groups, and would switch effortlessly from one to the next. It never looked planned, either.

Here's their setlist database. Give it a look.

But the Deadheads were more a social phenomenon than a musical one: you went to the concerts to go to the concerts, meet other Deadheads, and have a good time.

[Gatopescado]

Dope.

[Harmonious Discord]

I never went to a concert, but liked them for the music. I like other bands like Rush and Styx. I liked to sit in the dark with the album on and close my eyes, and relax. It was relaxing, and I wasn't doped up. You can't be taking cellphone calls and thinking of text messaging or other things like your email. Most people had some time where the pace was not hectic. You had no computers or consoles beyond Pong. There was a different mindset from now, because of the lesser demands on your time. Most music fits best at the time it is released, and that's because it's hard to get back into mind set of the times. Try laying in a dark quiet room and drift with the album.

[Larry Borgia]

Actually I think the fans can get in the way of the music. The Dead were a very talented and innovative band that drew on a lot of strains of American music: Blues, Jazz, Bluegrass, etc. They had a unique sound that's never been duplicated. Unfortunately, when people think of the Dead they just think of swarms of annoying college students, not the music.

Obviously, you may not care for their music, and that's fine. But their talent deserves respect. They weren't just a bunch of spaced out hippies.

[blondebear]

There was nothing like a Grateful Dead concert.

I thought they were boring until I developed a crush on a beautiful Deadhead-ette. Our first date was a show at The Greek in Berkeley. We got a spot up on the grass (so to speak), and set our blanket down. After a few songs, she said, "Let's go down front and dance!". We mingled our way through the crowd with no problem at all, people just let moved aside for us. It was there I got caught up in the vibe...totally different than any concert I had ever been to.

That vibe seemed to diminish as the demographic changed, most noticeably after "Touch of Grey" came out. That's when the yuppies started showing up because it was "cool" to be a fan. For me, that's when the vibe changed and it just wasn't as much fun anymore.

[Mongo Ponton]

Not a Deadhead. I didn't hate them or anything, they just never made me care.

But back in the day my friend was and he convinced me that we needed to stand in line so we could get 10 tickets each. This was outdoors, in the Northeast, in February. We got our tickets and I didn't feel a thing. The next day I went to his house to give him the tickets I got so he could resell them and some guys were there tie-dyeing shirts to sell. So I helped with that for a few hours.

He was blown away that I never had any intention of going to the concert or making money. I just had no interest. His crappy tapes were enough.

[SSG Schwartz]

My interest in the Dead was that they could make music that sounded something like what you have heard before, but comes out like nothing you had ever heard. To put it another way, suppose Tom Clancy decided to retell Stephen King stories tongue in cheek. They could also go into these great jams, but the segues were even more impressive. I am a big fan of a successful segue. See "China Cat Sunflower" into "I Know you Rider."

On a related note, what made the Dead successful was the genius of Jerry Garcia. He was not the hippie, peace, love and drugs guy that the fans would see. He sold what would appeal. Allowing bootleg tapes, selling tye-dies in the parking lot and constantly pushing the tour above all is what kept the Dead in the minds of the young people who would put money in the pockets of the band members. Anyone could duplicate the sound, but it is the marketing that made the Dead what they were.

SSG Schwartz

[eenerms]

The appeal? Got me..I fell asleep at one of their concerts. Wasn't even high.

[Kuboydal]

Heh, I fell asleep at one... and was... what a great night.
I would classify them partly as musical archivists preserving historic American music, even if they were currently producing it. I favor the luxurious sounds of Dead Set and still hold that U.S. Blues is one of the best punk songs of all time. Who could not respect a band that stepped back from the corporate to buld theor own label and hire their own people while basically saying that the live shows belonged to whomever would not profit from them?

I have some vinyl bootlegs pressed by fan clubs. Although the recording quality is a a tad rough (a source for future remastering, though) it still amazes me that fans would press their own vinyl and distribute, complete with homemade art, shows amongst their friends. It seems easy now in the digital era, but how often was this the case in the vinyl era?

[FoieGrasIsEvil]

The Dead were cool. I saw them twice, at RFK in 1993 when Steve Miller opened for them and Bruce Hornsby was active in the band.
I also saw them at Buckeye lake in Ohio the same year, apparently one of the meccas for live shows and tapers.
A few memories:
I tripped balls both times. A guy was arrested by narcs selling a plastic telephone bag full of mushrooms right in front of our group at the RFK show as we lounged in the hot summer day along the Potomac River during the Steve Miller segment.
Needless to say, the narcs were all dressed out in tye-dye gear and were relentlessly followed and pointed out by the other Deadheads as narcs as they left the scene. I had mushrooms and LSD in my system and was also hungover and sweating in the hot NoVA heat. I puked.
I also recall during that same show walking with my friend to somewhere, being lambasted by the constant cat-calls of veggie burritos and magic rocks when some guy came out of nowhere and hurled an unopened beer can at a trailing police cruiser.
Needless to say, it seemed as if the police were waiting for something like this to happen, as they immediately leaped out of their cruiser to chase this random dude.
What was funny was the catcalls that accompanied this, as everyone was like "Arrest that guy in the tye-dye!" as he disappeared into a crowd of, well, tie-dyed wearing folk.
The Dead were nothing if not interesting. I wasn't and still am not a big fan of their music, but the shows while under the influence were obviously designed to be a big mind-fuck, in a good way.
Jerry died while I was strolling the boardwalk at Virginia Beach on my Mom's birthday (Aug 9th) on vacation the next year and I'll bedamned if there wasn'tt a massive influx of "RIP Jerry" tye-dye shirts for sale not hours from the news of his death on that very same boardwalk.
The Dead shows were nothing if not the last bastion of free enterprise..."Two Balloons for 5 dollars!" "Veggie Burritos, One dollar" , the criers of salable goods went on and ON throughout the night.
It was a trip, literally and figuratively, and I believe that that was how they wanted it to be.
I'll never forget it.

[Argent Towers]

In terms of the genre of music, I think The Band was better than the Dead.

[Subterraneanus]

Originally Posted by Argent Towers

In terms of the genre of music, I think The Band was better than the Dead.

I don't see the similarities between the two bands' music at all, but, yeah, The Band were many times better than the Dreadful Grate.

[Argent Towers]

Blues and folk-influenced Americana rock, I guess. Not that much in common musically, but sort of part of the same genre.

Way heavier though, and better singing.

[WordMan]

Originally Posted by Biffy the Elephant Shrew

That's Edgar Wilson Nye's comment about Wagner (quoted by, and commonly attributed to, Mark Twain).

Really?! Cool - my ignorance is fought! Thanks Biffy!!

Yep - here it is: http://www.quotationspage.com/weblog/category/holidays/

As for two other comments in this thread:

Originally Posted by RealityChuck

The Dead were top-notch musicians and songwriters

and

Originally Posted by Argent Towers

In terms of the genre of music, I think The Band was better than the Dead...Blues and folk-influenced Americana rock, I guess. Not that much in common musically, but sort of part of the same genre. Way heavier though, and better singing.

I am inclined to go with Argent Towers on this one. This is clearly YMMV territory, and I mean no disrespect to RealityChuck or other folks who think highly of the Dead, but I just don't hear it. I have had friends - knowing I am both a guitarist and a geek who tries to really pick apart stuff and listen deeply - play a bunch of Dead stuff for me. The songs are fine, the performances - whey they are "on" - are solid enough, but I have yet to hear anything that makes me stop and say "whoa - they are musical geniuses!" I don't hear any:

- "individual musician technical genius" solos (you may hate the music of Yngwie - I do - but when he solos, I have to acknowledge his technical chops. There are countless other "roots/Americana" musicians who are technically superior than what I hear from the Dead...)
- new music style that pushes an envelope (you may hate Zep or the Ramones - I love both - but in both cases, they were clearly taking something familiar and pushing it into a whole new territory) - with the Dead, their Scene/sub-culture pushed an envelope, but I don't hear it in the music - it was just decent, jammy Americana stuff...
- Profound Band communication - I suspect this is the one where I will get the most disagreement, but this is my POV - even when the Dead lock-in and find something jam-bandy transcendant, I feel like they don't come close to bands like, well, The Band, in terms of sheer musicianship and musical communication. I hear Subterraneanus' comment about how the Band aren't like the Dead in terms of the whole sub-culture, but on a per-instrument throw-down basis (do we need another one of those threads?? ) The Band was so much more talented - and locked in as a band so much more musically and effectively to my ear...

Again - a Dead show was a happening, but I think there is a clear, obvious reason why so few of their albums don't endure as musical statements vs. bands like The Band...

[Cluricaun]

Just as an aside, the Band opened for the Dead at their second to last show at Soldier Field here in Chicago, and they weren't very good. The Dead weren't so hot either, but there you go.

[Darryl Lict]

As others have said, going to a Dead concert was more of a unique social experiment than just a concert. I probably went to 35 concerts or so. You were guaranteed to meet up with old friends who you hadn't seen in ages. I'm not a huge fan of doing hallucinogens in large crowds, but a Dead concert was the one place you would not feel out of place or self conscious.

I had as much fun at the camp out before and after the concerts as the concert itself. You'd usually set up a little camp in the parking lot and hang out for the entire 3 days of shows. In Ventura, we'd hang out at the beach and swim in the ocean while basking in our pre-concert buzz. There'd be people selling all types of mind altering substances, crafts, food and clothing. I'd always make sure to purchase a balloon or two of nitrous oxide. People would set up funky little cafes selling any kind of food you could imagine. They'd be tons of hot hippy chicks and all sorts of weirdos. Any time there was a Dead concert in the San Francisco bay area or So Cal, I could be guaranteed that at least some of my friends would be there.

The Dead would never repeat a set for all the concerts at a particular venue. The middle of the concert was always the hour long "Space Jam", a free form jam session with solos by each of the band members. I'm not particularly fond of the "Space Jam", but it was a good time to wander aimlessly and bond with people and play hacky sack.

One time a bunch of my friends were in Minneapolis for my friend's wedding. We saw a huge crowd at some venue and it was immediately recognizable as a Dead concert due to the obvious psychedelic "Dead" busses and hippy crowd. We actually had tickets in our hands, but I started to fell guilty and called my friend to tell him that we were blowing off the rehearsal dinner in order to see the Dead. Well, my friend wasn't really all that down with the concept and I managed to convince everyone that we really should go to the rehearsal dinner. I think my friends are still a little pissed at me.

The day Jerry died was the end of an era, and I knew that there'd never be anything to replace it. Damn, that was a bummer.

[Meurglys]

Well, I first heard the Dead when I was 13 and my older brother bought Skull & Roses when it came out and didn't like it - but I did! Growing up in the UK listening to chart music on the pirate stations and then Radio 1 meant I hadn't really heard much like it at the time.
I bought most of the official releases for a few years then my interest waned until years later I was in retail and realised that they were the perfect noodly 'shop-music' band! Not too offensive if you didn't like them, and great long jams if you did! And 'Space' for random weird interestingness...
Any time a record-fair was in town I'd end up going along for 1/2 hour and dropping maybe £100 on cds of gigs that looked like they might be good. Then somebody started copying tapes for me... Including one of the only time I saw them, back in 1981. I don't remember much about the gig, despite having a seat in the middle of the 2nd row, but I did enjoy it. Hearing the tape years later, it wasn't one of their better shows. (Playhouse Edinburgh Sept 30, 1981)
Drugs never really played a big part in my enjoyment of the Dead - it was getting into the jams and the buzz of recognition as they came back into the song/s.

I remember a poll in a music magazine years ago and one of the questions was 'band most likely to send you to sleep' and the results had to be split into two - the guy running the poll had meant it to mean a band you didn't like and found boring, but, as he said, if somebody voted for the Dead in the other 9 questions and voted for them again for this question, they probably meant it in a good way!

[Quercus]

Originally Posted by WordMan

I am inclined to go with Argent Towers on this one. This is clearly YMMV territory, and I mean no disrespect to RealityChuck or other folks who think highly of the Dead, but I just don't hear it. [...] The songs are fine, the performances - whey they are "on" - are solid enough, but I have yet to hear anything that makes me stop and say "whoa - they are musical geniuses!" I don't hear any:
- "individual musician technical genius" solos [...]
- new music style that pushes an envelope (you may hate Zep or the Ramones - I love both - but in both cases, they were clearly taking something familiar and pushing it into a whole new territory) - with the Dead, their Scene/sub-culture pushed an envelope, but I don't hear it in the music - it was just decent, jammy Americana stuff.
- Profound Band communication - I suspect this is the one where I will get the most disagreement [...]

Aside from the personal taste stuff, I think you're selling the Dead pretty short in the invention department (particularly if you're arguing Zep was more innovative). They were one of the main inventors of psychedelic music early on. They were also one of the first bands to combine rock (and psychedelia) and country/bluegrass, or as you put it 'jammy Americana'. Sure, 'jammy Americana' bands are everywhere now, but so are bombastic hard rock bands and semi-joking punk bands, but you think Zep and the Ramones were inventors.
Who else could have written (before the Dead showed it could be done) "China Cat Sunflower", "Eyes of the World" or "China Doll"?