Weeds in driveway, well water nearby – best herbicide?

[Rhythmdvl]

We have weeds popping up all along our gravel driveway. It’s about 300’, so hand-weeding is a Herculean task, especially with other encroachments into all our gardens. I want to indiscriminatorilly devastate all plant life in the driveway, but I don’t want to poison our water supply (we’re on a well) or the environment in general.

Also, given that the area to cover is easily about 4,500 square feet, it has to be as cheap as possible (i.e., RoundUp is out for toxic reasons and expense). Any suggestions? Should I go out there with a nice Balsamic and have at it? Have I finally found a good reason to invest in a flamethrower? Should I move back to the city and give up?

Thanks,

Rhythm

[Harmonious Discord]

You could try bleach I suppose. Your restrictions leave me with no idea of anything else.

[Gorsnak]

Roundup is pretty much the least toxic conventional herbicide out there (and is dirt cheap if you buy it the way farmers do). Unless you plan on dumping any unused spray down the well, I doubt you're going to contaminate ground water any more than it already is with a bit of spraying on a driveway.

[twickster]

Use a flamethrower. Seriously. There are gadgets for burning off weeds.

[AskNott]

I'm told Bernz-O-Matic makes a good flame weeder. It uses a small gas canister the size of a wine bottle.

Cheap white vinegar kills weeds, but I don't know how long-lasting the effect is.

[Harmonious Discord]

Great grandma used to dump boiling salt water on the thistles after she was done cooking. I worked for one to three at a time. She also patched her pots with bolts and washers when they wore a hole in them.

[Napier]

One day I sprayed a four foot high pokeweed plant in the driveway, a great heavy healthy little tree of a weed, with a good healthy dose of Roundup.

That afternoon Mrs. Napier made a salad out of the plant, and served it at dinner without telling me what it was.

Although I found the situation a little worrisome, we never felt the slightest ill effect.

[Myglaren]

I'll second the flame gun proposition. No chance of water contamination there.

[Finagle]

Originally Posted by Rhythmdvl

Have I finally found a good reason to invest in a flamethrower?

Yes.

[Rhythmdvl]

Ohhhh yeah.... I bet anyone who marketed a BFG model flame weeder would make a bundle.

How long does a typical 20 lb propane tank last for this. Remember, I've a hell of a lot of square footage to cover.

Um, Napier, had you just changed life insurance policies? Egad! I've used RoundUp in small patches here and there, but something about using it over such a large area and amount creeps me out. Am I being irrational? Have I let the specter of agri-business and movie-related big-bad-corporations unduly cloud my judgment? Seems so... so... off.

I'd love to take Great Gramma's recipe book out there, but the time/energy involved in boiling that much water and getting it to the right place is astronomical. G'Gramma is spry, but not that spry!

[Gorsnak]

At about $10/acre, I seriously doubt that you're going to find anything else that will match Roundup or some generic brand glyphosate-based herbicide for cost effectiveness, ease of application, or even negative environmental effects. Just find an ag supplier to buy from, cuz the little pre-mixed bottles at the garden centre are massively overpriced.

[Rhythmdvl]

Originally Posted by Gorsnak

At about $10/acre, I seriously doubt that you're going to find anything else that will match Roundup or some generic brand glyphosate-based herbicide for cost effectiveness, ease of application, or even negative environmental effects. Just find an ag supplier to buy from, cuz the little pre-mixed bottles at the garden centre are massively overpriced. (emphasis added)

That's the second time Roundup has been referred to as environmentally benign Can anyone help with some relevant cites? I keep getting thumbs up from those trying to sell it to me, and horror stories from anti-business and advocacy groups.

[Szlater]

Originally Posted by Rhythmdvl

That's the second time Roundup has been referred to as environmentally benign Can anyone help with some relevant cites? I keep getting thumbs up from those trying to sell it to me, and horror stories from anti-business and advocacy groups.

Glyphosphate is inactivated by binding to soil particles. Cite (PDF)

Glyphosphate can also be broken down by bacteria found in soil. Cite (PDF)

[Gorsnak]

Originally Posted by Rhythmdvl

That's the second time Roundup has been referred to as environmentally benign Can anyone help with some relevant cites? I keep getting thumbs up from those trying to sell it to me, and horror stories from anti-business and advocacy groups.

I wouldn't say it's environmentally benign. I would say it's probably less dangerous when properly applied than most anything else that's likely to kill 4500 sq ft of vegetation. I base this on my observation that fewer handling precautions are required using Roundup vs virtually any other commonly used agricultural herbicide. If Granny's magic recipe for killing weeds really works, chances are it contains some toxic chemicals that aren't environmentally benign as well. We've had bleach, salt water, and white vinegar suggested in this thread. Are those going to be environmentally benign when applied in concentrations sufficient to achieve the desired effect? I highly doubt it.

[Tuckerfan]

Organic Gardening magazine has a section on dealing with weeds. As does Mother Earth News.

I've tried everything (save flamethrowers and large amounts of salt) and found that all of it (including RoundUp) are all about the same in effectiveness. They work in the short term, but a couple of months, or even a year later, you're right back where you started, if they do much good at all (some weeds are tough to kill).

[Napier]

>Um, Napier, had you just changed life insurance policies? Egad! I've used RoundUp in small patches here and there, but something about using it over such a large area and amount creeps me out.

Large area? I sprayed one plant. But I think people do large areas frequently with it; not sure though.


>...Roundup has been referred to as environmentally benign...

Well, environmentally benign in some ways, perhaps. It does kill plants, after all.

[GaryM]

Originally Posted by Finagle

Yes.

I have that flame unit and it works pretty well. It is a PITA lugging a 20# propane tank, which weighs close to 40# when full.

I'd consider getting a smaller tank, or someone to carry it for you.

You don't need to actually burn the weeds, just toast them some.

[John Carter of Mars]

Roundup. Use it according to the label and get rid of your weeds. I keep the area around our well weed-free with roundup and nobody has died yet.

Roundup can be used on vegetation at a pond's edge and vegetation growing in a pond without harming fish.

Really, I own & live on a farm, and of all the pesticides and herbicides I've used over the years, Roundup is among the most benign.

[Sailboat]

Can't you enslave/finagle/bribe a teenaged relative or something?

Sailboat

[Rhythmdvl]

Originally Posted by Sailboat

Can't you enslave/finagle/bribe a teenaged relative or something?

Sailboat

Sure, but who will keep the coal furnaces running?! Actually, we moved out to the sticks and away from potential free labor -- which is really taking a toll on the main gardens.

It seems I owe Monsanto an apology. I get that it's incredibly toxic to plants on application, but didn't realize that the long-term consequences weren't as dreadful as I thought. I figured that one or two applications wouldn't be so bad (not really fearing imminent death at its hands), but twenty years of spraying two or three times a season would leave something of a buildup. I'll be spending a few days with the PDFs posted upthread, and will go from there.

Of course, in the meantime, there's the flamethrower to get...

[Myglaren]

Originally Posted by GaryM

I have that flame unit and it works pretty well. It is a PITA lugging a 20# propane tank, which weighs close to 40# when full.

I'd consider getting a smaller tank, or someone to carry it for you.

You don't need to actually burn the weeds, just toast them some.

Strap it to an old sack barrow or similar.
Yep, standard method is to just let the flame lick over the weeds on first application then when they die and dry out after three-four days, hit them again and let them burn away.

[Carson O'Genic]

Guess I'll be the lone voice to re-quote "Consult the genius of the place ". Those weeds will likely be there longer than you unless you sub-divide and develop.
Another thought is to plant something that chokes them out. Around here two rotations of buckwheat will eliminate poison ivy and all others, but that does involve labour. More or less than weed patrol is hard to say from the screen here.Eventually a perennial cover is planted.
Glyphosate is essential for some weeds (take that, polygonum cuspidatum!) but cites notwithstanding judicious use is advised.

[Jackmannii]

Note: Salt, bleach and boiling water are not biologically benign. All three (I'm not entirely sure about the bleach) would work as indiscriminate killers of soil life, not just the weeds. Salt has a long-term effect and could leach into surrounding soil.

You don't have to lug around a 20 pound propane tank to use a "flamethrower". There's a lightweight rod that attaches to a small propane canister that weighs under a pound, and is very portable. I've found you do have to perform repeat appllications more frequently than if you used Roundup. I have respect for Roundup's abilities and don't use it all that often, but my feeling is the associated hazards are exaggerated; unless you're an agricultural worker who doesn't pay attention to precautions, the potential for harm to you and/or the environment from several careful applications a year over a limited area is probably scant.

[bordelond]

Originally Posted by Jackmannii

Note: Salt, bleach and boiling water are not biologically benign. All three (I'm not entirely sure about the bleach) would work as indiscriminate killers of soil life, not just the weeds. Salt has a long-term effect and could leach into surrounding soil.

Clueless over here: is salt unsafe in well water?

[CalMeacham]

I use boiling water on my walkway to kill weeds. We have an herb garden nearby, so I don't want to use anything that will kill or affect them. Boiling water works fine. I don't care if leaches into anything, or kills anything under the walkway. There are no linghering efects to worry about, and it kills down into the root (which a flamethrower might not).