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  #1  
Old 05-10-2009, 08:01 PM
gonzomax gonzomax is offline
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OK ,Now Tiger Woods domination is over

People have suggested before that Tiger was fading. I always disagreed. I think I am ready to give up. Twice in a row things fell into his lap and he failed miserably. This week ,he was barely followed by the TV cameras after a while. These courses were very tricky. You had small targets on the greens. But Tiger used to produce when playing the toughest courses. Now he seems ordinary. He failed to make putts that mattered. He could not hit fairways.
Is it over?
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  #2  
Old 05-10-2009, 08:43 PM
John DiFool John DiFool is offline
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His driving is crap, as is his putting; it's obvious that he is still recovering from his injury/surgery. Golfers tend to see a significant performance decline between ages 35 & 40, and Tiger is 33, so he doesn't have an infinite amount of time to get that career majors record he wants. But I'm not about to write him off, even if we'll never again see the guy who tore apart four straight majors in 2000-01. People did that with Jack Nicklaus, only to have him win one more multi-year Slam from ages 38-46.
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Old 05-10-2009, 08:51 PM
DSYoungEsq DSYoungEsq is offline
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Originally Posted by gonzomax View Post
People have suggested before that Tiger was fading. I always disagreed. I think I am ready to give up. Twice in a row things fell into his lap and he failed miserably. This week ,he was barely followed by the TV cameras after a while. These courses were very tricky. You had small targets on the greens. But Tiger used to produce when playing the toughest courses. Now he seems ordinary. He failed to make putts that mattered. He could not hit fairways.
Is it over?
Well, some perspective, please.

He finished last week in 4th place.

He finished this week in 8th place.

He finished the Masters tied for 6th place.

He won the Bay Hill Classic.


Those are his last five tournaments. That's not exactly a bad set of results!

Indeed, I'd be willing to bet that, for those 5 tournaments, he has the best aggregate result. By far.


Having said that, he is decidedly un-Tiger like. I watched him in person last Sunday at the Quail Hollow tournament, and he was hitting shots all over the place. Were it anyone other than Tiger, he'd have shot something in the upper 70s, not the even par round he managed (IIRC). It's a measure of how good Tiger has been that, when I watched from behind him on the tee at 13 last weekend, and saw him hit his shot to 20' right of the flag, I immediately considered it a particularly bad shot, even though easily over half the field would have taken it right then and there and moved on.

He clearly is having trouble with hitting fade/slices. We saw that all today, and he was doing it last weekend, too. Of course, last weekend he also hit some pulls as well, so it's not just one thing.

But I noticed something both last weekend and this that I found most interesting: Tiger isn't concentrating as well as he usually does. He's somewhat easily distracted. More importantly, he's not staying focused through his play. Example: Last week, he drove the green on the par 4 14th hole, a mighty drive indeed. Needing at least a birdie, he proceeded to three-putt. His first putt was driven well past the hole, and his downhill second putt wasn't really close. Tiger three-putting in that situation seems to me an indication of not quite being mentally tough, mentally all there.

For Tiger, which is saying a lot.
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  #4  
Old 05-10-2009, 09:04 PM
K364 K364 is offline
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Previously his swing was smooth power, now it's an ugly vicious slash. No rhythm at all.
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Old 05-10-2009, 09:42 PM
Ravenman Ravenman is online now
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My thoughts the last few weeks are about all the Tiger criticizers who note that Nicklaus had so many more top 10 finishes, aside from all his victories.

Obviously, Tiger's recent inability to win, yet place in the top 10, means he is now a better golfer!

But seriously, all I can say is that I think he may still be recovering, but don't forget Tiger has had a few off years sprinkled in between his truly dominant streaks. My guess is that he's going to come back with at least one more major, sustained streak of wins before too long.
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Old 05-10-2009, 10:21 PM
gonzomax gonzomax is offline
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He will pop the mystique bubble pretty soon. The other players choked a lot in the past. He is giving them much less reason to be afraid.
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  #7  
Old 05-10-2009, 10:29 PM
notfrommensa notfrommensa is online now
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Don't send him out to zoo yet. TPC Sawgrass has historically given him problems.
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  #8  
Old 05-11-2009, 03:48 AM
DKW DKW is offline
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It's a pretty safe bet that the era of mind-blowing super-ultrahuman out-of-the-galaxy slash-and-burn domination is over. No more 13-stroke Masters wins, no more coming back from 8 holes down to win 4 and 3. Shouldn't really be all that surprising; it had to end at some point, just like it did for Bill Elliott, Mike Tyson, and Roger Federer.

Domination over? Don't be so sure. The thing is, while there's usually at least one player every week that has his number, almost none of them can follow it up next week, or the week after that. Nearly every serious rival to Tiger has either fallen by the wayside (Vijay Singh) or reverted to his normal state of mediocrity (Retief Goosen, David Duval, Sergio Garcia). How slim are the pickings? The #2 player in the world is Phil Mickelson. 'Nuff said.

He is getting up there in years, so if he's going to make a serious run at Nicklaus' supreme record, it's going to have to happen now. Even if he doesn't make it, though, he won't go down without a fight, and you can continue to count on lots of 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, and 6th place finishes.

Anyway, why not just watch and see? All we can do is speculate at this point, and he may surprise us yet; wouldn't be the first time.
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  #9  
Old 05-11-2009, 09:20 AM
John DiFool John DiFool is offline
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Some stats, courtesy of the official PGA site...

He's 142nd in driving accuracy (56%), and he's lost some distance too, 37th with 292 yards. Even more worrisome than that is that he's 102nd in greens in regulation, which for him historically is horrible; he was 1st only 2 years ago. 65th in putts per green-in-reg. His scrambling rank of 4th (saves par 68% of the time) is indicative of how much he is fighting the rest of his game.
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  #10  
Old 05-11-2009, 09:30 AM
gonzomax gonzomax is offline
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I have not been one who thought Tiger was fading before. But his putting was terrible. His driving was average . His scrambling abilities were not impressive. The things that saved him before were missing. The players used to be mentally beaten when they faced him. If that stops ,he will have to battle to get the records he chases.
Tough courses were Tigers forte. How often would you hear the announcers say ,nobody has been close to the hole from this spot on the green all day, and Tiger would sink it. He had the speed and could read greens better. He was way off the last couple weeks.
I am not writing him off because winning a couple quick tournies could make the fear come back. But ,if he does not ,it could be gone forever.
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  #11  
Old 05-11-2009, 11:46 AM
Labrador Deceiver Labrador Deceiver is online now
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Originally Posted by gonzomax View Post
before. But his putting was terrible.
I thought I heard the announcer say he was 100% inside of 8 feet. He may have missed a bunch of longer ones, but that doesn't sound "terrible".
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  #12  
Old 05-11-2009, 12:22 PM
gonzomax gonzomax is offline
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Tigers stats at TPC
Driv. Accuracy...31st
Drving Dist.......T 32
GIR................T40
Putts per rd........32
Sand saves........T16
Where's the dominance?
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  #13  
Old 05-11-2009, 12:28 PM
Diogenes the Cynic Diogenes the Cynic is offline
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He's coming back from a majory surgery and a year off the tour. He doesn't care about non-Major tournaments anyway. He treats them as practice rounds. Don't write him off yet. He'll probably win the US Open next month and things will be back to normal. That kind of talent and lifelong ambition doesn't just fall off the table overnight.

Last edited by Diogenes the Cynic; 05-11-2009 at 12:29 PM..
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  #14  
Old 05-11-2009, 12:38 PM
Lamar Mundane Lamar Mundane is offline
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He did not swing a golf club from last year's US Open until January. He had a seven month layoff in a sport which the top players rarely miss a day of practice. He's been back at it for three and a half months.

It's a miracle that he's playing as well as he is. He will be back in top form - it might not be until next year, but rest assured he'll be back.
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  #15  
Old 05-11-2009, 12:43 PM
John DiFool John DiFool is offline
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Originally Posted by Labrador Deceiver View Post
I thought I heard the announcer say he was 100% inside of 8 feet. He may have missed a bunch of longer ones, but that doesn't sound "terrible".
On Thursday he was missing a bunch of putts in that range, from the reports I read.

I'll reserve judgement until after this year's PGA.

Last edited by John DiFool; 05-11-2009 at 12:44 PM..
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  #16  
Old 05-11-2009, 12:54 PM
critter42 critter42 is offline
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See, here's why I wouldn't worry - he had his first knee surgery as a pro in Dec 2002. Here are his starting 2003 stats:

Tournament Place
Buick Invitational 1
Nissan Open T5
Bay Hill Invitational 1
The Players Championship T11
The Masters T15
Memorial Tournament T4
U.S. Open T20
Buick Classic T13

So a period like this is NOT unusual for him.

Other facts:
1) He has not been out of the top10 in stroke play since 2007, a 12th place at the British Open
2) He has not been out of the top 15 in stroke play since a few tournies earlier than that - namely a 37th place finish at where? TPC
3) He won the TPC in 2001 - his results since then? T14, T11, T16, T53, T22, T37, and T8 (he missed the 2008 tourney due to the initial surgery in April, but I don't think he cried too much about it ) - so this is his best result at this tournament in 8 years!
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  #17  
Old 05-11-2009, 01:36 PM
Ravenman Ravenman is online now
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Originally Posted by gonzomax View Post
Tigers stats at TPC
Driv. Accuracy...31st
Drving Dist.......T 32
GIR................T40
Putts per rd........32
Sand saves........T16
Where's the dominance?
For all the valid criticism that his driving has been terrible, his putting streaky (I'm being generous there), his irons lackluster, his short game off; he has still finished top ten in his last 5 tournaments (including 1 win).

Fundamentally, if every aspect of this guy's game is off, and he still finishes like that, the talent is still there. If Tiger keeps on bringing his "D" game and finishing top 10, I'd think that his "B-" game is still going to be pretty dominant.
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Old 05-11-2009, 01:44 PM
MadTheSwine MadTheSwine is offline
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Originally Posted by Diogenes the Cynic View Post
He's coming back from a majory surgery and a year off the tour. He doesn't care about non-Major tournaments anyway. He treats them as practice rounds. Don't write him off yet. He'll probably win the US Open next month and things will be back to normal. That kind of talent and lifelong ambition doesn't just fall off the table overnight.
He Doesn't care? Has he said this?

I doubt he will win a major this year.
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Old 05-11-2009, 01:58 PM
critter42 critter42 is offline
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"doesn't care" may be imprecise. Not to speak for Diogenes, I think he means that while Tiger goes into every single event with the determination and intention of winning, if you were to offer him the choice of A) Winning every non-major tournament of the year but not winning any of the majors or B) Winning a single Major and not winning any non-Major tourneys, it's pretty clear that he'd take B) every time.
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Old 05-11-2009, 02:33 PM
Diogenes the Cynic Diogenes the Cynic is offline
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I think he views a lot of the non-Majors as mere preparation for the Majors.
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  #21  
Old 05-11-2009, 02:49 PM
astorian astorian is offline
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I am FAR from ready to say Tiger is fading. After all, he's not missing cuts, and he's not finishing 15 strokes back. He's been playing very well by anybody's standards but his own. And it won't surprise me a bit if he recovers, wins a bunch more majors, and makes his doubters look foolish.

BUT...

I'd like to point you to a column by Joe Posnanski, one that asks a few good questions.

A year ago, if you'd asked most golf fans, they'd have told you that Tiger Woods was SURE to surpass Jack Nicklaus' record for major tournaments won. It was a matter of WHEN and not IF. Indeed, I'd have been one of those fans saying so. Nicklaus has 18 majors, and Tiger currently has 14. MOST of us assumed, not long ago, that Tiger Woods was absolutely certain to win at least 5 more majors.

Well, says Posnanski, that may be true. But think about this: Nobody else on the PGA tour today has won 5 majors! Nobody! We've been taking it for granted that Tiger Woods will easily do something that NONE of his contemporaries have managed to do.

Moreover, there's only one golfer in PGA history who has won 5 majors after his 33rd birthday. Exactly ONE! That's Jack Nicklaus.

We've been taking it for granted that Tiger will do something only ONE other golfer in history has done.

There's a REASON Nicklaus' record has lasted a long time, and it's not just that Nicklaus was great. It's that it's hard to stay competitive at a high level for a long, long time. Tom Watson, in his prime, was as good as Nicklaus... but he NEVER won a PGA tournament after he turned 34.

Tiger is 33, which SEEMS awfully young to many of us. If he were a lawyer of banker or executive, he WOULD be very young. But in sports, 33 is not young at all. Tiger is better tained and better conditioned than his rivals, so he MAY very well overcome all obstacles. Just remember that, great though he is, he starting to get "old" (I feel weird, as a 48 year old, calling a much younger man "old"!), he's starting to have physical problems, and he's starting to square off now against younger golfers for whom HE set the standard.

I think he'll remain the best in the world for some time, and he WILLbe great again, but he's not likely to DOMINATE again.
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  #22  
Old 05-11-2009, 02:54 PM
DSYoungEsq DSYoungEsq is offline
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Originally Posted by Diogenes the Cynic View Post
I think he views a lot of the non-Majors as mere preparation for the Majors.
Of course, he has also been quoted as saying that the TPC (Now called "The Players") is the fifth major. That might indicate he's motivated to win it more than, say, Bay Hill or the various Buick Opens.

And he purposefully played last week at Quail Hollow in large part to tune up for Sawgrass.
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  #23  
Old 05-11-2009, 09:10 PM
John DiFool John DiFool is offline
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Moreover, there's only one golfer in PGA history who has won 5 majors after his 33rd birthday. Exactly ONE! That's Jack Nicklaus.
Nitpick: Hogan won all 9 of his majors past age 33; Sam Snead 6.

That said, I am [mostly] in entire agreement with your post. I did a study awhile back, where it was clear that the general chances of a given player winning a major dropped off rather steeply past age 35. In contrast with the two gentlemen I mentioned above, Arnold Palmer won his last major at 34. But I am not about to count out a person who is probably the most gifted golfer ever; he's managed to reinvent his swing several times and come back just fine once he's worked out the kinks.
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Old 05-11-2009, 09:58 PM
Lamar Mundane Lamar Mundane is offline
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Nitpick: Hogan won all 9 of his majors past age 33; Sam Snead 6.

That said, I am [mostly] in entire agreement with your post. I did a study awhile back, where it was clear that the general chances of a given player winning a major dropped off rather steeply past age 35. In contrast with the two gentlemen I mentioned above, Arnold Palmer won his last major at 34. But I am not about to count out a person who is probably the most gifted golfer ever; he's managed to reinvent his swing several times and come back just fine once he's worked out the kinks.
Vijay Singh won all three of his after age 35. Angel Cabrera's won two after 37. Padraig Harrington's won three after 35. I don't think, with the increases in nutrition and fitness, that this is as big an issue as it was in the days where the golfers would booze it up every night after playing.

Gary Player, the first real fitness nut on tour, won four majors after age 37.
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  #25  
Old 05-12-2009, 04:10 PM
astorian astorian is offline
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Nitpick: Hogan won all 9 of his majors past age 33; Sam Snead 6.

That said, I am [mostly] in entire agreement with your post. I did a study awhile back, where it was clear that the general chances of a given player winning a major dropped off rather steeply past age 35. In contrast with the two gentlemen I mentioned above, Arnold Palmer won his last major at 34. But I am not about to count out a person who is probably the most gifted golfer ever; he's managed to reinvent his swing several times and come back just fine once he's worked out the kinks.
That's not a nitpick- if you're right, that's a major flaw in Posnanski's argument.
(I quoted him, without researching whether his numbers were correct.)
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  #26  
Old 05-12-2009, 08:08 PM
gonzomax gonzomax is offline
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I just think the numbers reveal problems. He was not getting up and down. He was not saving with the putter. He was not pulling off shots that only he could. I never saw a tournament where Tiger looked like he was beaten before. he was not dangerous.
On the other golf glove, I would not be surprised if he turned it around and won a bunch of tournaments and majors.
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Old 05-12-2009, 09:15 PM
John DiFool John DiFool is offline
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That's not a nitpick- if you're right, that's a major flaw in Posnanski's argument.
(I quoted him, without researching whether his numbers were correct.)
Well, Hogan and Snead did this more than half a century ago, before we had a strong international contigent, before the popularity of the sport really took off and became affordable for many, before the deep fields we now see on the Tour. The exceptions (along with Jack) which prove the rule.
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  #28  
Old 05-13-2009, 06:18 AM
DSYoungEsq DSYoungEsq is offline
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Maybe, but as also noted, Gary Player had four majors after 37. I maintain that the fact that no modern player has had 5 after 35 is nothing more than a minor statistical anomoly, under the circumstances.
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  #29  
Old 05-13-2009, 11:26 AM
Dinsdale Dinsdale is offline
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I firmly expect him to regain most of his prior form within this season.
Of course, I certainly am enjoying golf more with him not dominating - but I have no hope that it will last. Was sweet to see him in the final group on Sunday, with the network trying to figure out how to justify giving him airtime as he hacked his way around the course!
Even if he does not regain his past form, he has a substantial cushion between where he used to be and where everyone else is.
No question he gets 5 more majors.
I'd happily wager that he averages 1 major per year for the next 5 seasons in which he competes in all 4 majors.
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  #30  
Old 05-13-2009, 12:36 PM
The Other Jeffrey Lebowski The Other Jeffrey Lebowski is online now
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IMHO, Tiger Woods is still recuperating from major surgery and his competing as well as he is in these events with his current skill set is remarkable; maybe it takes him all year to rediscover his game. It's a bit premature to have this conversation at this time - I wouldn't entertain the thought for another year or more.
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  #31  
Old 05-13-2009, 12:45 PM
John DiFool John DiFool is offline
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And Jack actually won 6, if anybody's still counting.
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  #32  
Old 05-14-2009, 09:08 AM
gonzomax gonzomax is offline
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Jack was not real big on fitness. That gives Tiger a boost for the future. If his knees stay strong ,he can compete for a long time.
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  #33  
Old 05-14-2009, 11:26 AM
DSYoungEsq DSYoungEsq is offline
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And Jack actually won 6, if anybody's still counting.
After 35? Or after he turned 35? I believe in his case, that's an important distinction.
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  #34  
Old 05-14-2009, 02:23 PM
Theodore Striker Theodore Striker is offline
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The other factor in play is that Tiger has been playing a very long time under a very intense spotlight. Very few players in any sport can maintain the degree of domination he had for any substantial length of time with all of the demands that are bearing down on them. The most comparable dominant athlete to me would be Michael Jordan, and even MJ had his baseball hiatus.

I don't think Tiger will be the force he once was, he has physically, mentally, and emotionally been through the wringer through a good portion of his life. That being said, he will probably still be a top 3 golfer for the next 5-7 years, and will win at least 5 more majors.
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  #35  
Old 05-14-2009, 09:17 PM
John DiFool John DiFool is offline
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After 33, not 35, as per the conditions outlined in post #21.
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  #36  
Old 05-15-2009, 09:47 AM
gonzomax gonzomax is offline
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The reason I started this thread was because several people started similar ones in the past. At those times ,I thought it was way too early. He was not showing chinks in his game. But this time there is some question. He is dropping in all facets of his game. He is not real long any more. His putting is dropping off. He was always a great scrambler and found ways to win. He was not very scary.
Is he dropping to the pack? I am not sure ,but the next couple tournies he enters will be significant.
As bad as he played ,he was still in the top ten. So he does not to fix everything at once.
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Old 05-15-2009, 03:46 PM
Jackknifed Juggernaut Jackknifed Juggernaut is online now
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Did anyone catch Johnny Miller's comment that Tiger's biceps may have gotten too big? It's funny, because prior to Miller's comment, I mentioned to my friend that his biceps looked bigger than I'd ever seen them. Miller followed it up by saying that none of the great golfers in history had big biceps.
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Old 05-16-2009, 11:10 AM
gonzomax gonzomax is offline
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Until Tiger, none was black. Miller could have said that about blacks a few years ago. His conversation does not count as proof of anything.
A few years ago golfers did not cross train. We joked about their conditioning . Now a lot of golfers are very fit. His arms went from 15 inches to 15 1/2 ,now he cant play well any more. He has been lifting his whole career.
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  #39  
Old 05-16-2009, 01:10 PM
Ravenman Ravenman is online now
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Until Tiger, none was black. Miller could have said that about blacks a few years ago. His conversation does not count as proof of anything.
While Johnny Miller isn't an expert on race relations, I think he knows a thing or two about the golf swing.

His questioning whether bulking up for golf makes sense, makes sense to me, even if that particular argument ("it has never been done before, therefore is bad") is a very poor one indeed.
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Old 05-16-2009, 01:54 PM
gonzomax gonzomax is offline
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Miller was a very good golfer for a short time. He knows something about golf. He knows nothing about the impact of weightlifting and the golf swing. Most of the young pros of today are lifting. they are hitting longer than the old days. They are better athletes.
I see no evidence that Tiger has changed his swing .
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  #41  
Old 05-16-2009, 02:47 PM
Ravenman Ravenman is online now
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If you don't know that Tiger has changed his swing, either you're not an expert on the golf swing or you haven't been paying attention to the coverage of what he's done.

http://www.golf.com/golf/gallery/art...881733,00.html

Look through the whole sequence and read how he's changed his swing to relieve tension on his knee.

Color me in complete disbelief that adding muscle cannot change your game for the worse. It's obviously good to a point, and it is equally obvious that at some point, more muscle will change your swing and change your game. The only question is at what point.
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  #42  
Old 05-16-2009, 05:42 PM
DSYoungEsq DSYoungEsq is offline
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Miller was a very good golfer for a short time. He knows something about golf. He knows nothing about the impact of weightlifting and the golf swing. Most of the young pros of today are lifting. they are hitting longer than the old days. They are better athletes.
I see no evidence that Tiger has changed his swing .
Then you are not looking very hard at all. His swing plane and his follow through now compared to last year are significantly different.
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  #43  
Old 05-16-2009, 08:30 PM
gonzomax gonzomax is offline
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Then you are not looking very hard at all. His swing plane and his follow through now compared to last year are significantly different.
Due to his knee not an extra half inch on his arms. When you hurt a knee you make adjustments to diminish the pain.
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Old 05-16-2009, 08:41 PM
gonzomax gonzomax is offline
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http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/blog/...me=sobel_jason Here's an ESPN article saying exactly that.
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  #45  
Old 05-17-2009, 08:19 AM
DSYoungEsq DSYoungEsq is offline
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Originally Posted by gonzomax View Post
Due to his knee not an extra half inch on his arms. When you hurt a knee you make adjustments to diminish the pain.
Which is it? First you said his swing hasn't changed at all. Now you assert that it's changed only because of the knee. Well?

And how can anyone possibly tell what effect upon his swing having larger biceps has had? Did the analysis you linked attempt to address the issue? How could they address the issue without having had some group of similarly biceped golfers to compare to? And what subtle changes would it create? Not to mention that the analysis would have to be of swing flaws, not the swing itself.

Try again.


Note, I'm not asserting the biceps have had anything to do with it. I'm simply saying you're off base with your analysis here.
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  #46  
Old 05-17-2009, 09:38 AM
gonzomax gonzomax is offline
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He favored the screwed up knee to diminish the pain. The knee has been fixed. Therefore he can swing like he used to. It is not about weight lifting.
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  #47  
Old 05-17-2009, 02:24 PM
DSYoungEsq DSYoungEsq is offline
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Boy, you really aren't getting it. Tiger's swing NOW is protecting his operated upon knee. Not his swing from before the injury. His swing NOW.

Get that?

And that's not to say that the biceps aren't impacting the swing.

Last edited by DSYoungEsq; 05-17-2009 at 02:24 PM..
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  #48  
Old 05-17-2009, 08:36 PM
gonzomax gonzomax is offline
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He used to swing with no knee pain. Then when it got hurt and floated ,he changed his swing to lessen the pain. His knee is now OK. He has resumed his old swing. The biceps are irrelevant.
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  #49  
Old 05-17-2009, 10:04 PM
Ravenman Ravenman is online now
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Good lord, you don't know what you're talking about. You're reminding me of an old boss of mine who once said that he had "never swung a golfing-stick." Except he didn't put on airs that he knew anything about swing mechanics!
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  #50  
Old 05-18-2009, 04:25 AM
DSYoungEsq DSYoungEsq is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gonzomax View Post
He used to swing with no knee pain. Then when it got hurt and floated ,he changed his swing to lessen the pain. His knee is now OK. He has resumed his old swing. The biceps are irrelevant.
You don't even know what you are talking about. Tiger has had at least three different swings prior to the debacle with the knee last year. And the article you linked to from Jason Sobel didn't talk about the new Tiger swing other than to include a comment from Tiger saying how nice it was not to have bones moving about, which could easily be a reference to how it felt in 2008 when he was swinging with a destroyed ligament.

But the analysis linked to previously by Ravenman shows that the new swing is designed to protect the knee from further damage. This is probably based upon a realization that the old swing (swing #3) was inflicting damage upon the knee in a slow process.

In sum, Tiger's current swing is not the same as what he was swinging in 1997, when he had swing #1 and won the Masters, or swing #2, which he used to destroy the 2000 U.S. Open, or swing #3 which he used to mop up the world in 2007. Get it?
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