Why aren't there more pagans in the Marvel universe?

[Little Nemo]

In the Marvel universe, Paganism is a provably true religion. Thor and Hercules aren't mythical figures - they're people you can walk up to on the street and shake hands with. And their powers are obviously real. You'd think their presense would have led to a major revival of Paganism.

[Cisco]

1. I think most people don't believe Thor is who he says he is, apart from maybe some relatively recent storylines where he tried to take an active role in being a "god" on Earth
2. Hercules is 3rd string player who has gotten relatively little attention until World War Hulk (I know he was an Avenger and has had a couple miniseries but he's never been a hugely popular Marvel character)
3. It's a comic book. If you start asking logical questions, there will be no bottom to the rabbit-hole.

[Jragon]

Originally Posted by Little Nemo

In the Marvel universe, Paganism is a provably true religion. Thor and Hercules aren't mythical figures - they're people you can walk up to on the street and shake hands with. And their powers are obviously real. You'd think their presense would have led to a major revival of Paganism.

If I had to guess - probably due to all the OTHER people with powers falling out of their face-hole that could give Thor et al at least a pretty tough time if they tried hard enough. After seeing people on the news every two weeks who can beat your God to a pulp, well, you might as well worship the one who at least hasn't been disproven omnipotent.

[Cisco]

Originally Posted by Jragon

If I had to guess - probably due to all the OTHER people with powers falling out of their face-hole that could give Thor et al at least a pretty tough time if they tried hard enough. After seeing people on the news every two weeks who can beat your God to a pulp, well, you might as well worship the one who at least hasn't been disproven omnipotent.

I don't think Thor is meant to be omnipotent, and he is probably the most powerful Marvel "hero" (excluding cosmic entities like Galactus, Eternity, etc.) Silver Surfer and Hulk can give him a run for his money, but I don't think they can beat him, and surely not to a pulp.

[Sr Siete]

In a way, it makes more sense that in the Marvel universe there should be less paganism. Religion tends to be about worshipping the intangible, and Thor or Hercules would be too real.

[Lightray]

Even more so, religion tends to be about getting some benefit from the worshipping, and... Thor and Hercules have absolutely no power to answer worshippers' prayers. Odin, maybe; but not the other Asgardians or "gods".

Sure, Thor might come beat someone up if you're his worshipper, if you manage to run into him on the street, and if you're wanting him to beat up Ultron or something. But, heck, She-Hulk might do the same under the circumstances... and we don't really expect Marvel pagans to start worshipping She-Hulk.

[furryman]

Originally Posted by Lightray

Even more so, religion tends to be about getting some benefit from the worshipping, and... Thor and Hercules have absolutely no power to answer worshippers' prayers. Odin, maybe; but not the other Asgardians or "gods".

Sure, Thor might come beat someone up if you're his worshipper, if you manage to run into him on the street, and if you're wanting him to beat up Ultron or something. But, heck, She-Hulk might do the same under the circumstances... and we don't really expect Marvel pagans to start worshipping She-Hulk.

I do!

[jayjay]

Originally Posted by furryman

I do!

C'mon, Lightray! You had to know THIS would be a response around here...

[dzeiger]

Didn't the 2099 universe have Thor-worshipers as a major faction?

[Peter Morris]

Originally Posted by dzeiger

Didn't the 2099 universe have Thor-worshipers as a major faction?

Yes, and Thursday was renamed Thor's day. (or maybe returned to it's original name)

[Lumpy]

It's because in real life the editors and writers responsible for the comic's content live in a primarily Christian (or agnostic or atheist) USA and don't need the hassle of being accused of promoting paganism.

Within the continuity of the comics, the general idea seems to be that the Asgardians are sort of "retired" gods, still honored in myth and story but no longer seeking active worship. There was one story where the last true worshiper of the Norse gods- the last survivor of a lost colony of Vikings- died and was escorted to Valhalla and it was generally accepted that that closed the book on further recruits. In another story Thor needed some living worshippers to augment his power and he had to go time traveling to recruit them. And in another storyline some neopagans wanted to be Thor's followers and he seemed more embarassed by it than anything, especially because a Christian minister went apeshit about it.

[Cisco]

Originally Posted by Lumpy

It's because in real life the editors and writers responsible for the comic's content live in a primarily Christian (or agnostic or atheist) USA and don't need the hassle of being accused of promoting paganism.

Oooh, that reminds me. Earlier this decade, when I was reading Thor on a regular basis, there was a bit of a fuss in the letters column about Thor being called a "god". To the point that Quesada, I believe, actually kind of sort of apologized and they wrote a little thing into the story about "the one who is higher than Odin" or somesuch. I'm probably getting most of the details wrong but there was some pretty overt Christian-appeasing going on. Look around The Mighty Thor Volume 2 issues 25-35ish if you've got 'em. I do, but they're packed away at the moment.

[drastic_quench]

Even with no hope of getting prayers answered, you'd think quite a few atheists and agnostics would go ahead and believe in Thor and Hercules, purely because they verifiably exists.

[Lightray]

Originally Posted by jayjay

C'mon, Lightray! You had to know THIS would be a response around here...

Occasionally, I toss out a straight line. My way of giving back, and all.

[Little Nemo]

You'd think having Christian authorities spend several centuries telling everyone that paganism is completely false and just a myth, having Thor show up in person would be a blow to their credibility. I'll admit if Xenu showed up, demonstrated his superpowers, and said that he actually had been the leader of a Galactic Federation and killed a billion people in a volcano, I'd have to seriously rethink my opinions on Scientology.

[Jihi]

Originally Posted by Jragon

If I had to guess - probably due to all the OTHER people with powers falling out of their face-hole that could give Thor et al at least a pretty tough time if they tried hard enough. After seeing people on the news every two weeks who can beat your God to a pulp, well, you might as well worship the one who at least hasn't been disproven omnipotent.

I've asked this question of fellow local comic fans and this is the answer I get the most often, and the one that makes the most sense. When you've got a dozen different people with god like abilities and one claims to be the *actual* Thor, god of thunder, your natural response is going to be that he's a science accident with a gimmick.

[Cisco]

Originally Posted by Jihi

I've asked this question of fellow local comic fans and this is the answer I get the most often, and the one that makes the most sense. When you've got a dozen different people with god like abilities and one claims to be the *actual* Thor, god of thunder, your natural response is going to be that he's a science accident with a gimmick.

That's pretty much what I was getting at in post #2, point #1. I recall some storylines wherein even his fellow Avengers explicitly state that they don't believe he's really Thor.

[BrainGlutton]

Probably for the same reason that Reed Richards Is Useless.

[furryman]

Originally Posted by BrainGlutton

Probably for the same reason that Reed Richards Is Useless.

Sometimes life really does imitate art. I can't help being reminded of a recent news story about some child super-genus who's decided to study a field of mathematics so abstruse that only 10 other people in the world understand it.

[Candyman74]

Originally Posted by Little Nemo

In the Marvel universe, Paganism is a provably true religion. Thor and Hercules aren't mythical figures - they're people you can walk up to on the street and shake hands with. And their powers are obviously real. You'd think their presense would have led to a major revival of Paganism.

Eh? Since when did Norse mythology get co-opted by paganism?

[The_Peyote_Coyote]

Lumpy touched on this, Lightray, but in Walt Simonson's version of Thor, it was stated explicitly that Thor could respond to worshippers if he wanted to.

[Miller]

Originally Posted by Candyman74

Eh? Since when did Norse mythology get co-opted by paganism?

Some time around the fourth century, I believe.

[cmkeller]

I thought it was made pretty clear in the Marvel Universe Handbooks that the Marvel Universe public knows that the "gods" of Olympus and Asgard are merely an extremely powerful extra-dimensional race of beings who were mistakenly worshipped as dieties during encounters with humans in the ancient world, and consider it more proper to be worshipping the more modern, monotheistic deity who was actually responsible for creating the universe.

[jayjay]

That sounds more like the Eternals, cmkeller.

[Lumpy]

Originally Posted by jayjay

That sounds more like the Eternals, cmkeller.

This may be obolete because of a retcon or two but at one point the "gods" were supposed to have been formed out of a sort of primordial god-force and shaped by the beliefs of human worshippers. In one story there was actually a battle between the Eternals- the superbeings that had inspired belief in the Greek pantheon- and the actual Greek pantheon that had formed as a result.

[DocCathode]

Having been a huge fan of Spidey 2099 and Doom 2099, I'm upset this was already addressed. In the 2099 earth, Thorism is just another accepted religion. There are splinter groups. There are neighborhood churches.

Spiderman is also worshipped as a god. He hates it and keeps trying to get people to stop.

A small cult, Knights Of The Banner, worships the Hulk.

[mswas]

Didn't Storm have her own cult in Africa for a time?

[DocCathode]

Originally Posted by mswas

Didn't Storm have her own cult in Africa for a time?

Yep. IIRC

Storm is born in Egypt. At a young age, she's caught in a building collapse that kills both her parents and gives her claustrophobia. She lives for a while as a pickpocket. Then, somehow she makes her way to Africa where a local tribe of farmers worship her as a weather goddess.

[jayjay]

Originally Posted by Lumpy

This may be obolete because of a retcon or two but at one point the "gods" were supposed to have been formed out of a sort of primordial god-force and shaped by the beliefs of human worshippers. In one story there was actually a battle between the Eternals- the superbeings that had inspired belief in the Greek pantheon- and the actual Greek pantheon that had formed as a result.

See, that's more what I remember from my 80s-version Official Handbook.