raw cocoa beans really raw or will they ruin?

I would like to buy some raw cocoa beans just as they are when taken from the fruit. This site http://livesuperfoods.com/cacao/LSF007.html claims to sell them raw but also notes they are well fermented.

I found other sites that claim their cocoa beans are unfermented but I worry whether this will be true. Do unfermented unheated cocoa beans turn rancid rapidly as oats do? Does anyone know how long they will last? If this is a problem why don’t they freeze the beans?

I would love to have some cocoa beans with all the nutrients/chemicals that the Kings of the Aztecs enjoyed.

Thank you to anyone that can help me with this.

What makes you think the Mesoamericans didn’t ferment their cacao?

Ancient people routinely used fermentation to process plant materials to free up nutrients and remove toxins to transform otherwise inedible plants into food.

I may be wrong in assuming how they made their chocolate. Regardless I would like them untreated.

I eat the majority of my food raw and believe that heating food makes them less nutritious.

So does anyone know?

lol The advertisement below my post is “Cocoa Beans For Sale - Quality Raw Cocoa Beans…”

Sorry if I came across blunt. I am almost always a reader and seldom post so have little practice at this.

I’m very curious though about whether the raw beans are preheated before delivery.

Thanks for any help…

You may want to try some at a health food store before buying, This implies the flavor is intensely bitter.

Here is what appears to be an academic paper on the subject

Heating may destroy some of the nutrients. However, unless you thoroughly pulp/chew/mash/process vegetables, you will not get much, if any, more in the way of nutrients by eating them raw. Your body does not break down cellulose well/at all, thus you won’t get the nutrients locked inside unruptured cells.

Also, fermentation is a natural process, and often creates/unlocks nutrients you would not otherwise get.

You can’t reason a person out of a position he didn’t reason himself into, you know.

My understanding is that the stupid thing about the belief of some fundamentalists that Jesus drank grape juice instead of wine is that for ancient peoples it was easier to make wine than NOT to make wine - fresh foods that are given to fermentation ferment all on their own without any help, and the hard thing is keeping them fresh, not otherwise.

And if you want cacao the way the Aztecs used to make it, it would be something more like this: Tejate - Wikipedia

Mesoamericans invariably made cacao into a drink of some sort, with the addition of all sorts of ingredients but almost never with sweet tastes predominating.

I don’t trust wiki at all. They are controlled by big money or at least have a large group of lawyers/professionals paid to argue the many lies in big money’s interest. Have any of you heard of Randell Mills and realize what he could do for the world if given a patent. The absurdity of global warming being caused by CO2 increasing to 386 parts per million of the atmosphere while water vapor is a stronger global warming gas per molecule and is 10,000 to 50,000 parts per million of the atmosphere, ect ect But I’m obviously wasting my time. I guess some of you accomplished your goal of facing a dangerous topic that is so misunderstood.

what… the… fuck

unfermented cocoa beans?

Whackjob nutrition. Look, our forefathers didn’t spend millenia hitting rocks with other rocks just so you could decide you don’t need fire.

Here… from the perfidious wiki Raw foodism (or rawism)

dammit, astro, you KNOW that article was written by big money lawyers. are you getting a kickback by quoting it?

Hush up Dubinsky or my wiki patrolwill pay you a visit.

I’m going to ignore the completely random burst out of you, and address your actual question. Yes, they were certainly heated during drying. However, the very first google hit for “raw cocoa beans” (the only one I looked at), makes a point of claiming theirs were dried at a low temperature.

In general, you will probably not be eating that many cocoa beans to get much nutrition from them either way, so don’t worry about it. Stick to your fresh vegetables for that. Also, nuts are valued for their mineral content more than their vitamin. Minerals do not degrade.

Damn, there are times of the year when I am almost a raw foodista - I love a lot of fruits and veggies, and I love crudites [raw veggies with or without a dip], love certain forms of sashimi, and have a source for raw dairy [i like to make cheese and yoghurt, actually]

Actually, yesterday the only thing I ate that was cooked was the rice in the scattered sushi, and the egg omelet- my scattered has egg, tuna, salmon, urchin roe and some pickled veggies [daikon made by fermenting it in rice bran, and ginger pickled in rice vinegar which is fermented rice with a natural yeast mother]

the big noise with cocoa beans seems to be their epicatechin content, as present in the flavanols (green tea also has this, but in much lower quantities). what bothers me is that none of the sites selling their cocoa beans (fermented or cold-pressed) can give me any nutrient figures wrt epicatechin – which should be their major selling point.

green tea sites will list their catechin contents for various “super” green teas, etc. – maybe this will catch up with the cocoa world. the guy i talked with at sunfoods said it will be ten thousand years before we understand foods and how they affect us. maybe i should’ve mentioned to him that we can already get the catechin content figures for green tea? (not meant as a major ding towards sunfoods - i will probably buy their cold-pressed cocoa beans if i can’t find a vendor that lists their nutrient content).

in the meantime, there are studies that definitely show that fermentation significantly removes the epicatechin and flavanol content of the bean vs the untouched bean. unfortunately, i can’t find any studies reflecting where “cold-pressed” beans lie in this debate (cold-pressed as being heated at low temperatures).

i guess the best thing to do, if you’re wanting to pursue the flavanol/antioxidant health benefits of cocoa beans, is to treat it the same as other cold-pressed foods. e.g. if you, as a raw foodie, use cold-pressed olive oil, then this would be a similar type of thing, eh? there are lots of studies that show that cold-pressed foods retain much of their nutrients/antioxidant properties.

if, however, you do not include cold-pressed foods in your diet, then you’ll want to shy away from the cocoa bean thing – apparently without the processing, they tend to be a substrate for all kinds of fungus and such (unless you’re lucky enough to be there and pick the bean yourself when you want to have a healthy brew).

the whole kuna indian study is pretty impressive (when they move to mainland, they stop drinking the cocoa and their health numbers rise to reflect the norm re: the 4 major disease groups). if anybody locates a site that indicates epicatechin content of cold-pressed vs untreated, i would be very much appreciative (i don’t have a great desire to part with a bunch of yen for a product that has been significantly cleared of its health benefits). i’m hoping that cold-pressed works well with all food groups re: retaining their food value.

also, i read (somewhere) that the flavanol activity/benefits is much revved up when you drink the cocoa warm, rather than cold – which is the same for green tea – the flavanol/catechin content of green tea goes down significantly if you let your tea cool before ingesting it.

the funny thing is my ex-pat/conspiracy theory brother is thinking of moving to panama. i just hate that he might get healthier than me, simply by being in the correct proximity to the real thing. lol

What Kuna study? When they move from the islands to urban areas, I’m sure a lot of their diet changes in addition to whether or not they drink cocoa.

I have news for you. Although cacao is grown for export here, cocoa of any sort isn’t a particularly popular beverage.

How does this make any logical sense whatsoever? How is the nutritional or chemical content of a food or drink going to “go down” by it’s cooling after being heated? This is nutritional babble-speak.