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  #1  
Old 08-16-2010, 03:59 PM
US Bureau of Labor Statistics US Bureau of Labor Statistics is offline
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Person to have held the most citizenships.

Dual citizens are pretty much a dime a dozen. Triple citizens are also "common," and it wasn't even hard to find persons claiming to have quadruple citizenship on a Google search for the term.

Who was the person with the most national citizenships, and why did they have all of them?

I'm betting six, on account of two triple-citizen parents.
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  #2  
Old 08-16-2010, 04:17 PM
Giles Giles is offline
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I'm betting six, on account of two triple-citizen parents.
You don't necessarily get the citzenship of your parents: my mother was a UK-born citizen of the UK, but I'm not one. Whether you inherit depends on various factors, including whether they have resided in the country of citizenship, and the gender of the parent (which was the factor in my case).
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  #3  
Old 08-16-2010, 04:34 PM
Chronos Chronos is online now
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Is Elizabeth II considered a citizen of all the many places she's Queen of?
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  #4  
Old 08-16-2010, 04:40 PM
Captain Amazing Captain Amazing is online now
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Theoretically, someone born in Lvov in 1917 would have been born with Austrian citizenship, then in November of 1918, he'd be a citizen of the Western Ukrainian People's Republic, then in 1920, he would be a Polish citizen, and then briefly a citizen of the Galician Soviet Socialist Republic, then a Polish citizen again, then a citizen of the Soviet Union, then for a few days, a citizen of the free Ukranian state, then of the German occupied General Government, then after WWII, a Soviet citizen again, then, after 1991, a citizen of the Ukraine. All without ever moving.
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  #5  
Old 08-16-2010, 04:50 PM
psychonaut psychonaut is online now
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I asked the same question here seven years ago.. I didn't get an answer...
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  #6  
Old 08-16-2010, 05:10 PM
Giles Giles is offline
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Is Elizabeth II considered a citizen of all the many places she's Queen of?
No, she's not a citizen of anywhere. She effectively lost her UK citizenship in 1952.
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  #7  
Old 08-16-2010, 05:21 PM
Quartz Quartz is online now
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Is Elizabeth II considered a citizen of all the many places she's Queen of?
No, she's not a citizen of anywhere. She effectively lost her UK citizenship in 1952.
Really? She stopped being a British subject in 1952, but citizenship's a very different matter, surely?
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  #8  
Old 08-16-2010, 05:51 PM
Captain Amazing Captain Amazing is online now
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No, she's not a citizen of anywhere. She effectively lost her UK citizenship in 1952.
Really? She stopped being a British subject in 1952, but citizenship's a very different matter, surely?
Under Australian law, the Queen is neither a "citizen of Australia" or a "non-citizen of Australia". It's all very quantum.
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  #9  
Old 08-16-2010, 05:59 PM
Captain Amazing Captain Amazing is online now
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No, she's not a citizen of anywhere. She effectively lost her UK citizenship in 1952.
Really? She stopped being a British subject in 1952, but citizenship's a very different matter, surely?
According to the official website of the royal family, the Queen is "a national of the United Kingdom" and "a citizen of the European Union". She's also the 'Fount of Justice', which I'd think would hurt.

http://www.royal.gov.uk/MonarchUK/Qu...tTheQueen.aspx
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  #10  
Old 08-16-2010, 06:02 PM
US Bureau of Labor Statistics US Bureau of Labor Statistics is offline
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Queen Elizabeth II has got to be an easy win if she is a citizen of all her realms. Damn royals. Is there a published example of an average Joe going over four?

Captain Amazing: Niiiiiiiiiiiiiice.

Giles: Right, and some countries don't do jus sanguinus at all, but for those that do it has to be an easier path than just starting out as something lamebrains like being born to Canadians in Canada and then getting naturalized five more places from scratch.

e: Or not, WRT QEII.

Last edited by US Bureau of Labor Statistics; 08-16-2010 at 06:02 PM..
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  #11  
Old 08-16-2010, 09:23 PM
Duckster Duckster is offline
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Bonus question - How many people currently living have two passports from the same country? Hint - there are several thousand in the US alone.
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Old 08-16-2010, 10:27 PM
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Bonus question - How many people currently living have two passports from the same country? Hint - there are several thousand in the US alone.
Many people who hold diplomatic passports also hold regular passports.
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  #13  
Old 08-16-2010, 10:48 PM
ChrisBooth12 ChrisBooth12 is offline
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Bonus question - How many people currently living have two passports from the same country? Hint - there are several thousand in the US alone.
several thousand?
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  #14  
Old 08-16-2010, 11:26 PM
UDS UDS is offline
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Bonus question - How many people currently living have two passports from the same country? Hint - there are several thousand in the US alone.
several thousand?
Diplomats' spouses and dependants need to be counted as well.
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  #15  
Old 08-16-2010, 11:36 PM
Happy Scrappy Hero Pup Happy Scrappy Hero Pup is offline
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Indians on res, if they choose to accept the US passport?
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  #16  
Old 08-17-2010, 12:06 AM
Waffle Decider Waffle Decider is offline
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I think some countries are also willing to issue multiple passports if you have legitimate reasons to frequently travel to both Israel and countries that won't accept a passport with Israeli stamps in it.

Some countries also have multiple types of nationalities. Before the Chinese takeover of Hong Kong, I used to have two valid British passports at the same time, endorsed with different nationalities.
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  #17  
Old 08-17-2010, 12:31 AM
UDS UDS is offline
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I think some countries are also willing to issue multiple passports if you have legitimate reasons to frequently travel to both Israel and countries that won't accept a passport with Israeli stamps in it.
I think there are technically two copies of the same passport.
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  #18  
Old 08-17-2010, 07:00 AM
Peter Morris Peter Morris is online now
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Queen Elizabeth II has got to be an easy win if she is a citizen of all her realms.
The Empire/ Commonwealth was larger in her father's day.

When was it largest? Victoria, possibly?
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  #19  
Old 08-17-2010, 08:02 AM
kidneyfailure kidneyfailure is offline
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Before the Chinese takeover of Hong Kong, I used to have two valid British passports at the same time, endorsed with different nationalities.
Out of curiosity, what was the purpose of that? Would one not have been enough for both travel and identification?

Also out of curiosity: Do you now have both a British passport and Chinese HKSAR passport?
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  #20  
Old 08-17-2010, 08:06 AM
UDS UDS is offline
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Queen Elizabeth II has got to be an easy win if she is a citizen of all her realms.
The Empire/ Commonwealth was larger in her father's day.

When was it largest? Victoria, possibly?
Yes, but it didn't consist of different citizenships until (from memory) 1948. Prior to that everyone was just a British Subject.
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  #21  
Old 08-17-2010, 08:09 AM
Giles Giles is offline
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The Empire/ Commonwealth was larger in her father's day.

When was it largest? Victoria, possibly?
Yes, but it didn't consist of different citizenships until (from memory) 1948. Prior to that everyone was just a British Subject.
Yes, I was just a British subject until 26th January, 1949, when (without knowing it, because I was aged 3 and living in England at the time) I became an Australian citizen.
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  #22  
Old 08-17-2010, 08:22 AM
Aspidistra Aspidistra is offline
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I had a classmate who claimed to be eligible for six passports. IIRC the details were:

Born in Canada
One parent from ...hmmm... it was either Peru or Venezuela. Plus one there, and a potential Spanish citizenship too (I have no idea if this is an accurate interpretation of whatever rules may have applied, or if they still do)
Other parent from Northern Ireland.Potential passports - 1 British, 1 Republic of Ireland, one EU.

Take all that with a grain of salt, this is a 20-year-old memory here...
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  #23  
Old 08-17-2010, 08:26 AM
Giles Giles is offline
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Originally Posted by Aspidistra View Post
I had a classmate who claimed to be eligible for six passports. IIRC the details were:

Born in Canada
One parent from ...hmmm... it was either Peru or Venezuela. Plus one there, and a potential Spanish citizenship too (I have no idea if this is an accurate interpretation of whatever rules may have applied, or if they still do)
Other parent from Northern Ireland.Potential passports - 1 British, 1 Republic of Ireland, one EU.

Take all that with a grain of salt, this is a 20-year-old memory here...
The EU doesn't have citizenship or passports. An "EU citizen" is a citizen of one of the member countries, e.g., Irish, Spanish or UK citizen. So that only makes 5 (if you're right about Spain).
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  #24  
Old 08-17-2010, 08:38 AM
clairobscur clairobscur is offline
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I think some countries are also willing to issue multiple passports if you have legitimate reasons to frequently travel to both Israel and countries that won't accept a passport with Israeli stamps in it.
I think there are technically two copies of the same passport.

I don't know what they are technically, but indeed, a dozen years ago, France was willing to give me a second passport specifically for Israel (although Israelis officers are willing not to stamp your passport, the Egyptian stamp on the other side of the border was a gave-away). However, since then, probably following the terrorism scare, this isn't possible anymore, if I'm not mistaken.
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  #25  
Old 08-17-2010, 08:45 AM
Chronos Chronos is online now
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The EU doesn't have citizenship or passports. An "EU citizen" is a citizen of one of the member countries, e.g., Irish, Spanish or UK citizen.
So, then, if the Queen is a citizen of the EU, that implies that she must be a citizen of some nation, presumably (at least) one of her realms.
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  #26  
Old 08-17-2010, 08:51 AM
Giles Giles is offline
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The EU doesn't have citizenship or passports. An "EU citizen" is a citizen of one of the member countries, e.g., Irish, Spanish or UK citizen.
So, then, if the Queen is a citizen of the EU, that implies that she must be a citizen of some nation, presumably (at least) one of her realms.
There's probably some special rule about monarchs of EU countries. She still wouldn't get an EU passport, basically because there's no such thing. I believe that she can vote in elections for the European Parliament, though she probably does not exercise that right.
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Old 08-17-2010, 10:18 AM
psychonaut psychonaut is online now
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Bonus question - How many people currently living have two passports from the same country? Hint - there are several thousand in the US alone.
And there have got to be several tens of millions (or perhaps hundreds of millions) in Russia and those former Soviet bloc countries which issue separate "internal" and "external" passports.
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  #28  
Old 08-17-2010, 11:24 AM
Quartz Quartz is online now
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And someone working at the Vatican could have a Vatican passport too.
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  #29  
Old 08-17-2010, 11:41 AM
Little Nemo Little Nemo is online now
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Superman for the win. The United Nations once granted him citizenship of every country on Earth. Even if anyone else got that, Superman would still beat them because he also has his native Kryptonian citizenship.

Last edited by Little Nemo; 08-17-2010 at 11:41 AM..
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  #30  
Old 08-17-2010, 12:07 PM
Mr. Excellent Mr. Excellent is offline
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Really? She stopped being a British subject in 1952, but citizenship's a very different matter, surely?
Under Australian law, the Queen is neither a "citizen of Australia" or a "non-citizen of Australia". It's all very quantum.
This is also why the Queen keeps dogs (Welsh corgies) rather than cats.
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Old 08-17-2010, 12:12 PM
Mr. Excellent Mr. Excellent is offline
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Superman for the win. The United Nations once granted him citizenship of every country on Earth. Even if anyone else got that, Superman would still beat them because he also has his native Kryptonian citizenship.
But isn't that state defunct, on account of going boom?
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  #32  
Old 08-17-2010, 12:51 PM
Chronos Chronos is online now
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Nah, all Kal-El has to do is open an embassy to house the Kryptonian Government in Exile. Maybe he could rent out an office in the Sovereign Military Order of Malta's building.
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  #33  
Old 08-17-2010, 01:24 PM
Snickers Snickers is offline
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Bonus question - How many people currently living have two passports from the same country? Hint - there are several thousand in the US alone.
My brother, at least. He's a sergeant in the US Air Force and has both his military passport and his civilian one, both from the United States. When he's travelling to foreign countries with the military (he's been on deployment as part of UN forces sometimes, in addition to AF rotations), he uses the passport he got from the Air Force. When he's travelling on his own for vacation, he uses his personal one.

I'm guessing it'd be similar for other branches of the Armed Forces, too.

Last edited by Snickers; 08-17-2010 at 01:25 PM..
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  #34  
Old 08-17-2010, 08:18 PM
rbroome rbroome is offline
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tens if not hundreds of thousands of people hold two US passports. All federal employees who travel overseas (at least civilians) are issued official US passports. They are also encouraged to obtain private US passports.
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  #35  
Old 08-17-2010, 08:22 PM
UDS UDS is offline
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So, then, if the Queen is a citizen of the EU, that implies that she must be a citizen of some nation, presumably (at least) one of her realms.
There's probably some special rule about monarchs of EU countries. She still wouldn't get an EU passport, basically because there's no such thing. I believe that she can vote in elections for the European Parliament, though she probably does not exercise that right.
There is no special rule for monarchs; the only way to be an EU citizen is to be a citizen of an EU member state.

From the perspective of international law, the Queen is certainly a citizen of the UK. The UK government would undoubtedly extend its diplomatic protection to her were she to need it while outside the UK, and every other country would recognise its right to do so. Hence, she is a citizen of the UK, regardless of whether UK domestic law confers the title "citizen" on her or prefers a word like "national". Citizenship is not a label; it's a status comprising a number of rights and duties. In international law, nothing turns on whether domestic law prefers the term "citizen", "national", "subject" or something else as the name for this status.

Hence, she is also an EU citizen.
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  #36  
Old 08-17-2010, 08:39 PM
Waffle Decider Waffle Decider is offline
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Before the Chinese takeover of Hong Kong, I used to have two valid British passports at the same time, endorsed with different nationalities.
Out of curiosity, what was the purpose of that? Would one not have been enough for both travel and identification?

Also out of curiosity: Do you now have both a British passport and Chinese HKSAR passport?
It was just for historical reason. Originally, everyone born or naturalised there was a British Dependent Territory Citizen, or BDTC. (Actually, that was not true before 1983, but that's not important right now and is worthy of a pit thread on its own.) As the name implies, that would all be over on 1 July 1997. As a result, a new status called British National (Overseas), or BNO, was created so that those who wish to retain their British nationality beyond 1997 may do so and voluntarily register to become one. Registering as a BNO did not invalidate one's status as a BDTC, so for many years, many people held both passports at the same time.

I now hold only the British passport. I'm eligible for the HKSAR passport, but I refuse to apply for it just out of principle. At this point, I'm also eligible to apply for naturalization in the US if I wish, although I really don't feel like dealing with the INS all over again.
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  #37  
Old 08-17-2010, 08:41 PM
Duckster Duckster is offline
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tens if not hundreds of thousands of people hold two US passports. All federal employees who travel overseas (at least civilians) are issued official US passports. They are also encouraged to obtain private US passports.
Bingo! Me bad for not being clear the first time. I have two US passports, plus a third from somewhere else.
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