Visit from His Holiness

[Leaking Boot]

Although not religious in any way, I suppose I'm very tolerant of others' beliefs. Live & let live.
But should I have to pay for them?
Here in the UK we are going through financial turmoil. The new government has decided they need to do something about the 500 odd billion we owe, so there are massive cut to all public spending, including education, healthcare and child benefit. My own job is under threat.

Last week, the Pope came to visit England for 4 days.
It cost the taxpayer £12million.
Twelve. Million. That's 3 mil per day.

We are not a Catholic country. Only 8% of the population are Catholics.

How come we have to shell out for this? Did they ask us where they could spend our taxes? NO! Did we ask the Pope to visit? NO! Did his visit alter a single thing in this country, did he help the sick and infirm or bring alms to the poor? No, no and hell no!
And just out of interest - the Vatican isn't poor! They have untold millions in art treasures and Nazi gold alone.

[Captain Amazing]

The Vatican ran a deficit of 4.1 million euros this year, with revenues of 250.2 million euros and expenses of 254.3 million. So it's not like the Vatican is rolling in money either. Besides, if the British government really didn't want the pope to come, they could have said no.

[Rhythmdvl]

Originally Posted by Captain Amazing

Besides, if the British government really didn't want the pope to come, they could have said no.

Maybe they weren't, you know ... expecting him.



I'm not sure I understand the rant. Don't you have kings and queens and whatnot? Aren't useless expenses for less-than-useful nobility par for the course? (Note, I'm not saying anything about the Pope's intrinsic usefulness.) Can't most expenses be balanced by increased traffic, revenue, and local economic activity? Don't you all get cool souvenir Poperings?

[Thudlow Boink]

Originally Posted by Rhythmdvl

Maybe they weren't, you know ... expecting him.

The Pope dropped by my apartment unannounced the other day. The dude used my landline to make three long distance phone calls, ordered a pizza which I paid for, and drank five of my beers. And I don't know what he was doing in there, but he used up practically a whole roll of toilet paper. And he didn't even offer to compensate me by giving me some of that Nazi gold. What a douche.

[Paul in Qatar]

So if someone you liked (say Lady Gaga) came to do some shopping, would the British government provide crowd control and security to maintain the peace? Would Lady Gaga be billed for this service?

[Shodan]

Originally Posted by Paul in Qatar

So if someone you liked (say Lady Gaga) came to do some shopping, would the British government provide crowd control and security to maintain the peace? Would Lady Gaga be billed for this service?

The Pope needs more protection while shopping, since he has better taste in clothing.

Regards,
Shodan

[The Flying Dutchman]

Originally Posted by Leaking Boot

Although not religious in any way, I suppose I'm very tolerant of others' beliefs. Live & let live.
But should I have to pay for them?
Here in the UK we are going through financial turmoil. The new government has decided they need to do something about the 500 odd billion we owe, so there are massive cut to all public spending, including education, healthcare and child benefit. My own job is under threat.

Last week, the Pope came to visit England for 4 days.
It cost the taxpayer £12million.
Twelve. Million. That's 3 mil per day.

We are not a Catholic country. Only 8% of the population are Catholics.

How come we have to shell out for this? Did they ask us where they could spend our taxes? NO! Did we ask the Pope to visit? NO! Did his visit alter a single thing in this country, did he help the sick and infirm or bring alms to the poor? No, no and hell no!
And just out of interest - the Vatican isn't poor! They have untold millions in art treasures and Nazi gold alone.

Man you guys got off easy. Last summer we in Canada hosted your prime minister and the leaders of 18 other wealthy countries and it cost us 600,000,000 quid, or
33 million quid for your prime minister alone.

[Vinyl Turnip]

Originally Posted by Thudlow Boink

The Pope dropped by my apartment unannounced the other day. The dude used my landline to make three long distance phone calls, ordered a pizza which I paid for, and drank five of my beers. And I don't know what he was doing in there, but he used up practically a whole roll of toilet paper. And he didn't even offer to compensate me by giving me some of that Nazi gold. What a douche.

Sure it wasn't Palpatine? Sounds more like his style.

[Enderw24]

Originally Posted by The Flying Dutchman

Man you guys got off easy. Last summer we in Canada hosted your prime minister and the leaders of 18 other wealthy countries and it cost us 600,000,000 quid, or
33 million quid for your prime minister alone.

Be thankful it's just a case of quid pro Bro'.

[Thudlow Boink]

Originally Posted by Vinyl Turnip

Sure it wasn't Palpatine? Sounds more like his style.

Well, he said he was the Pope.


The Popemobile is a 2003 Impala, right?

[Dog80]

Originally Posted by Leaking Boot

Last week, the Pope came to visit England for 4 days.
It cost the taxpayer £12million.
Twelve. Million. That's 3 mil per day.

Those numbers are always artificially inflated. For example, there were 1,000 policemen guarding the Pope, each policeman is paid 50 pounds per day so 1,000 policemen x £50 x 4 days = £200,000

Of course this is bullshit because the policemen would get paid anyway regardless Pope visited or not.

So I would be very curious to see a breakdown of that 12 million.

[detop]

Originally Posted by Rhythmdvl

<snip> Don't you all get cool souvenir Poperings?

Have you ever had a Chocolate pope ? They taste like shit. And the less we talk about Pope-on-a Rope the better.

[Diogenes the Cynic]

Originally Posted by Thudlow Boink

The Pope dropped by my apartment unannounced the other day. The dude used my landline to make three long distance phone calls, ordered a pizza which I paid for, and drank five of my beers. And I don't know what he was doing in there, but he used up practically a whole roll of toilet paper. And he didn't even offer to compensate me by giving me some of that Nazi gold. What a douche.

You better check your cable bill too. When he was at my place, he ordered a bunch of pay-per-view porn. He also got into my pot stash. He denied it, but there was at least an 8th missing out of my bag, and he ate a whole bag of pizza bites. I never should have trusted him alone there while I was at work. The guy is a huge mooch.

[Really Not All That Bright]

Originally Posted by Leaking Boot

How come we have to shell out for this? Did they ask us where they could spend our taxes? NO! Did we ask the Pope to visit?

Actually, you probably did ask the Pope to visit. Foreign dignitaries don't just pop in unannounced, especially heads of state.

The Foreign Office almost certainly "extended an invitation" (whether or not in response to a Papal request for them to extend an invitation).

Now, while you might not care about the Pope, and not want to spend any money on providing security for him, you're basically obliged to. Foreign relations with any number of countries would become rather strained if anything were to happen to His Holiness while in Britain.

Not only that, but actual important people might stop visiting. What would happen to Britain's economy if Britney Spears doesn't show up at the HMV in Knightsbridge to autograph CDs?

[Euphonious Polemic]

Originally Posted by Leaking Boot

Last week, the Pope came to visit England for 4 days.
It cost the taxpayer £12million.
Twelve. Million. That's 3 mil per day.
Did they ask us where they could spend our taxes? NO!

If it makes you feel any better, let me know where I can send the 20p that you personally had to pay.

And you know what? I've really never been asked where a government is allowed to spend taxes in that sort of excruciating detail. Are they supposed to poll every person in the country for any expense about 10 million pounds?

ETA: When he dropped by my place, I'm pretty sure he's the one who left pubic hairs on the soap. Gross.

[silenus]

At least the money was spent internally. British firms and people received all the monies, so the cash stayed in the economy instead of going somewhere else.

Unless Ratzy ordered real Chinese that is.

[Really Not All That Bright]

I would be surprised if the Pope ate local food more than once or twice.

[The Great Sun Jester]

Originally Posted by Dog80

Those numbers are always artificially inflated. For example, there were 1,000 policemen guarding the Pope, each policeman is paid 50 pounds per day so 1,000 policemen x £50 x 4 days = £200,000

Of course this is bullshit because the policemen would get paid anyway regardless Pope visited or not.

So I would be very curious to see a breakdown of that 12 million.

THAT'S bullshit. Sure, the cops would have been paid anyway, but presumably they would have been out busting hippies and writing tickets. By being diverted to pope duty there was nobody performing those duties and society became that much more derelect as a result. If the cops could be spared for the duty, then they're overstaffed.

More likely, in your scenario, the popeduty cops would be off-duty cops working overtime and incurring time and a half--so £300,000, not just a paltry £200,000. As for popesecurity...why? If the pope's afraid to die, what hope does that give the rest of us?

[Really Not All That Bright]

What makes you think that Britain has the same overtime rules as the US?

[Yossarian]

Originally Posted by Really Not All That Bright

What makes you think that Britain has the same overtime rules as the US?

No shit. Have you ever seen a soccer game that didn't end in a tie?

[The Great Sun Jester]

Originally Posted by Yossarian

No shit. Have you ever seen a soccer game that didn't end in a tie?

Coffee--nose--keyboard--bill.

[Really Not All That Bright]

Times two. Only with Mountain Dew.

[Leaking Boot]

Originally Posted by Rhythmdvl

Maybe they weren't, you know ... expecting him.



I'm not sure I understand the rant. Don't you have kings and queens and whatnot? Aren't useless expenses for less-than-useful nobility par for the course? (Note, I'm not saying anything about the Pope's intrinsic usefulness.) Can't most expenses be balanced by increased traffic, revenue, and local economic activity? Don't you all get cool souvenir Poperings?

You're 100% spot on. I think my rant is just about the *dramtic sigh* injustice of it all.
Did you know we have to pay a TV license - to the BBC alone?
Every other channel has to use commercials for funding, but we are not allowed a TV unless we fork over £100 quid and more each year.
And the sneaky bastards have dozens of their repeat channels on satellite, absolutely peppered with adverts.

And as for inviting the Pope; I personally sent him 3 texts, a dozen emails and left a message on his machine, all telling him Britain wouldn't be home that week. He turned up anyway.
Boy, was my face red.

[SteveG1]

Originally Posted by Rhythmdvl

Maybe they weren't, you know ... expecting him. ...

NO ONE expects the ...

[Ludovic]

Originally Posted by SteveG1

NO ONE expects the ...

Do you know who ELSE England didn't expect? That the Pope was a member of? The Inquisition, that's what!

[KarlGauss]

Originally Posted by Captain Amazing

The Vatican ran a deficit of 4.1 million euros this year, with revenues of 250.2 million euros and expenses of 254.3 million. So it's not like the Vatican is rolling in money either.

Piffle. A mere cash flow problem. What counts is what is has "in the bank", so to speak. And, you can bet your last communion cookie that The Vatican has assets that make Bill Gates look downright middle class. My gawd, its art collection alone . . .

(And don't forget to add in that splinter from His cross they've got sitting in the basement. That would bring a pretty penny on eBay, I'll tell you for sure. And I can't remember for sure, but didn't the Vatican also put in the winning bid for the grilled cheese Jesus? That alone could pay for a new Popemobile.)

[Kozmik]

Originally Posted by Captain Amazing

Besides, if the British government really didn't want the pope to come, they could have said no.

What if the Queen said she didn't want to the Pope to come?


I know, I know - I learned in World Politics 101 that the Queen is largely symbolic, but still.

[SteveG1]

Originally Posted by Ludovic

Do you know who ELSE England didn't expect? That the Pope was a member of? The Inquisition, that's what!

Dun Dun DUUUNNNNNNHHHH!

[Frank]

Originally Posted by Kozmik

I know, I know - I learned in World Politics 101 that the Queen is largely symbolic, but still.

She's symbolic as the Head of State. Even I know that.

How symbolic is she as the Defender of the Faith? Which I'm not so sure of.

[Really Not All That Bright]

Only slightly less so. The Archbishop of Canterbury is the de facto head of the Church of England. The Prime Minister appoints bishops from nomination lists prepared by the Crown Appointments Committee (technically, the PM "recommends appointments to the Crown", but this is a polite fiction).

[alphaboi867]

Originally Posted by Really Not All That Bright

Only slightly less so. The Archbishop of Canterbury is the de facto head of the Church of England. The Prime Minister appoints bishops from nomination lists prepared by the Crown Appointments Committee (technically, the PM "recommends appointments to the Crown", but this is a polite fiction).

Doesn't that committee only put two nominees on the list; someone totally unsuitable for the job, and the guy they really want? Or has Yes Prime Minister lied to me?

[Nava]

Originally Posted by Really Not All That Bright

I would be surprised if the Pope ate local food more than once or twice.

Why wouldn't he eat local food? Or at least prepared by local cooks?

Are you confusing the Pope with Madonna? Hint: he's the one with the cute hat.

[Cinnamon Imp]

Originally Posted by Leaking Boot

Last week, the Pope came to visit England for 4 days.

Did he really? I wasn't aware Glasgow and Edinburgh were in England.

[Leaking Boot]

Originally Posted by hermette

Did he really? I wasn't aware Glasgow and Edinburgh were in England.

Sorry hermette, I obviously meant 'Greater England.'

[cochrane]

I extended an invitation for the Space Pope to visit. I'm still waiting for him to reply.

[Really Not All That Bright]

Originally Posted by alphaboi867

Doesn't that committee only put two nominees on the list; someone totally unsuitable for the job, and the guy they really want? Or has Yes Prime Minister lied to me?

It's a very short list, typically. I don't think it's quite as short as YPM made it out to be.

Originally Posted by Nava

Why wouldn't he eat local food? Or at least prepared by local cooks?

Are you confusing the Pope with Madonna? Hint: he's the one with the cute hat.

The POTUS doesn't eat local food when traveling either. Security.

[Wallenstein]

Let's face it £12m is peanuts in the grand scheme of things - given that our national debt is increasing at £18m per hour spending that sum on a one-off visit from the pope isn't a big deal.

In terms of policing, if it's OK for the police to spend £3-4m each year on Premiership football matches, spending £1.5m every 18 years for the pope's visit doesn't seem too unreasonable.

Originally Posted by Nava

Why wouldn't he eat local food? Or at least prepared by local cooks?

The classic dish for Birmingham is the balti curry, best enjoyed late at night with copious amounts of lager and a big group of slightly rowdy mates. Can't really see El Popo heading down to the Taj Mahal for their Friday-night special

And Glasgow's local dish is the deep-fried mars bar, which may just represent too much sybaritic decadence for His Grooviness.

[Leaking Boot]

Originally Posted by Wallenstein

In terms of policing, if it's OK for the police to spend £3-4m each year on Premiership football matches, spending £1.5m every 18 years for the pope's visit doesn't seem too unreasonable.

But football is entertaining and has the added bonus of violence. Nobody tries to take out His Holiness anymore. And can you imagine Catholic hooliganism?
oh yeah.....

Let's not forget, Premiership football matches host tens of thousands of fans. There's usually 11 or so going off every given weekend. Per capita, that's not bad value for money, protecting all those people at once. The Pope is one person (who hasn't scored a goal all season). And he already has that fish tank on wheels to look after his wrinkly righteous hide.

[Wallenstein]

Originally Posted by Leaking Boot

Nobody tries to take out His Holiness anymore.

Au contraire, mon petit filou.

Not quite up to the level of an Old Firm ruck, but I bet Herr Ratzinger has some kind of nazi death-grip he can unleash when it all goes off.

Originally Posted by Leaking Boot

Let's not forget, Premiership football matches host tens of thousands of fans. There's usually 11 or so going off every given weekend. Per capita, that's not bad value for money, protecting all those people at once. The Pope is one person (who hasn't scored a goal all season). And he already has that fish tank on wheels to look after his wrinkly righteous hide.

13m total Premiership attendance against £4m policing costs (acutally costs more but the clubs pay a proportion) is about 30p per fan per year.

150,000 papal attendance against £1.5m policing is about £10 per pilgrim, BUT amortized over 18 years that's only 55p so it's not too bad.

I think they should let The Stig have a bash with the Popemobile... I bet you'd get some righteous two-wheel action around Gambon.

[bucketybuck]

Originally Posted by Thudlow Boink

The Pope dropped by my apartment unannounced the other day. The dude used my landline to make three long distance phone calls

He drops into my house in Dublin the odd time, uses my phone to call the big man up in heaven.

Of course thats a local call, so it doesnt cost too much...

[Wallenstein]

Originally Posted by bucketybuck

He drops into my house in Dublin the odd time, uses my phone to call the big man up in heaven.

Of course thats a local call, so it doesnt cost too much...

Thank you for your call. Please select from one of the following options.

To hear these instructions in Hebrew or Arabic please hold the line.

Dial 1 for Allah, Dial 2 for Yahweh...

[SteveG1]

Originally Posted by Leaking Boot

.... The Pope is one person (who hasn't scored a goal all season). ...

If he doesn't improve soon, he is going to be traded.

[Really Not All That Bright]

Sold, not traded. But well played otherwise.