SR1 after minor accident - does insurance company also report you?

[Yarster]

The other day, my wife backed her car into a railing at a parking lot and did some minor damage to her right rear quarter panel and fender. There was no damage to any other vehicle or person, and even the rail was undamaged. She has not had a claim on her insurance since 1994, which was also a fairly minor repair at the time (stereo stolen and dash board mangled in the process). After calling Allstate (in California if that matters), and being upfront with them on the accident, we received surprisingly hostile treatment. We were told if we filed a claim over $1,000 total (which included our $250 deductible), our insurance would double for three years as a result. O.k., I got quotes for the damage and got one for $958, so I figured I was o.k.

I filed the claim, was told the repair shop was on their list of approved places they would recommend anyway, and got the check for the difference between the repair cost and the deductible. BUT...my wife also read them the riot act and told them we would be shopping around our insurance (which includes our homeowners' insurance) if that was how they treated people.

Now suddenly we get an SR-1 form in the mail from the insurance company, which strikes me as a "fuck you" from them as a way to tarnish her record so that if we file it with the DMV, our rates will go up anyway, such that it will dis-incentivize us from switching and shopping around. According to this ridiculous form, you are supposed to file it if you have over $750 in damage and it is the same form if you have $751 in damage, or you re-create the end of "Gone in 60 Seconds" and cause millions in damage and kill several people. I should add that there was no police report of the incident, if that matters.

So my question is, what happens if I don't file it? Whose to say it didn't get lost in the mail? More importantly, if I don't file it, does the insurance company send something to the DMV alerting them to the fact they had to pay out a claim, especially since they only paid out $708 on that claim when you subtract the deductible?

[gotpasswords]

You better believe the insurance company will file the SR-1 on your behalf, and they'll pass it around to pretty much every other insurance company via a system called CLUE. (Comprehensive Loss Underwriting Exchange)

The same system will make it tough on you to shop for a new insurance company. Your CLUE report probably already contains a notation about a comprehensive claim of less than $1000. As you may have noticed, longevity or "persistency" as your agent would call it, means bupkus when you actually need to use your insurance policy.

[Yarster]

So what happens if I don't file the equivalent SR-1 with the DMV but it shows up in the CLUE system? Is there any consequence to that? Also, is there a monetary fine, or does it go unnoticed at the DMV? I realize the form says you could "lose your driving privileges" if you don't file, but since this form asks about other vehicles and people affected by the accident (injuries/deaths), and there were none in this case, I assume that is who the message is directed to. Anyone else here have a minor accident, but still over $750, who didn't file an SR-1? What happened?

[Mama Zappa]

Wow - this is just insane.

I can't offer anything to the GQ side of things, being on the other side of the country, but why on earth would the insurance company EXPECT you guys to file this SR-1; you'd think it would be automatically filed by them, since there's a pretty big disincentive on your part.

That said, this is an unfortunate example of why paying for insurance, and expecting to be able to actually USE it, are not necessarily the same thing. We had two losses on our homeowners' insurance in a single year, back in the late 90s. One clearly out of our control (severe windstorm, blew the chimney into the back yard), the other arguably less so, as we filed a property-loss claim for items stolen from Typo Knig's car at work.

2 years later, the insurance had been renewed twice already, but we asked for a new policy when we moved to a new house - and suddenly we were lepers. Our current insurer finally agreed to write the new policy, but ONLY because we'd been customers for so long. No other company would have touched us, even at a higher rate, and even with the explanation that one of the losses was an act of god....

Once you figure out what you HAVE to do, legally (including filing that SR1 if you need to), go ahead and look around. You might be stuck with Allstate for a bit but as that claim ages off you can move elsewhere and GOOD RIDDANCE.

[TerpBE]

I initially read this as "SR71 after minor accident" and thought this thread would be much cooler. (no offense)

[Fubaya]

I'm not from California, but maybe this would apply?

Vehicle Code Section 16000.1 Reportable Off Highway Accident
Reportable Off-Highway Accident

16000.1. (a) For purposes of this division, a "reportable off-highway accident" means an accident which includes all of the following:

(1) Occurs off the street or highway.

(2) Involves a vehicle that is subject to registration under this code.

(3) Results in damages to the property of any one person in excess of seven hundred fifty dollars ($750) or in bodily injury or in the death of any person.

(b) A "reportable off-highway accident" does not include any accident which occurs off-highway in which damage occurs only to the property of the driver or owner of the motor vehicle and no bodily injury or death of a person occurs.

ETA. That was from here. Index of vehicle codes here.

[Mama Zappa]

Originally Posted by gotpasswords

You better believe the insurance company will file the SR-1 on your behalf, and they'll pass it around to pretty much every other insurance company via a system called CLUE. (Comprehensive Loss Underwriting Exchange)

The same system will make it tough on you to shop for a new insurance company. Your CLUE report probably already contains a notation about a comprehensive claim of less than $1000. As you may have noticed, longevity or "persistency" as your agent would call it, means bupkus when you actually need to use your insurance policy.

Slight hijack: Is there a way for consumers to see their own CLUE reports?

When we sold our townhouse, the buyer's agent pulled the report on our townhouse and so asked about that chimney claim I mentioned. Our agent never suggested we do anything like that for the place we were moving to.

If the OP doesn't file the SR-1 (as Fubaya's link suggests might not be needed), then it might be worth it for he and his wife to check this.

[Mama Zappa]

Answering my own question, there does indeed:
https://personalreports.lexisnexis.com/

[gotpasswords]

Thanks for providing that - I was just coming back now to give almost exactly the same link.

Thanks to the "FACT Act" you can get a free CLUE once a year, just like you can get a credit report. If you go here, you can select one or the other, or both your Auto Clue and your Personal Property Clue. I advise getting both, since they're free. The registration is a bit dorky - I had to first create a user name / password, then ask for the reports again, enter my name and address info, then ask for the reports again, then answer some questions of my past (Who did I buy my house from? What street did I live on?) and ask for the reports again. Success at last.

[Yarster]

Thanks Fubaya - that exactly describes my situation. I did check into the CLUE thing this morning and saw that I could get a free report but didn't bother. The truth is, either it was reported by my insurance company, or it wasn't. Either way, according to that link, I DO NOT need to file anything, although I find it interesting Allstate never mentions this or cites the vehicle code.

At this point, I am throwing out the form and plan to go get comparison quotes from other insurers to "vote with my wallet" and let Allstate know exactly how I feel about them.

Sadly I think with the economy in a nosedive, particularly here in California, all the insurance companies are playing this game - "Well, we are making less money because families are carpooling and getting rid of their second cars when someone gets laid off so we are getting fewer premiums. I guess the solution is to screw our existing customers harder and use any minor accident as an excuse to raise their rates."

[MarcusF]

Just curious as a Brit but can you get what we would call a "Protected No-Claims Discount" on your motor insurance? The way is works in the UK is that for each year you don't claim you get a discount on the basic cost of insuring the vehicle - up to 75-80% if no claims in - I think - 7 years. Any claim and you loose part, but not all, of this discount. To go with this the companies then offer to "protect" the No-Claims-Discount for a reasonably small additional premium. So, in my case, I can have - I think - up to two claims in 24 months without my premium rising.

The companies do exchange information on claims but they also generally match each other's NCD in trying to win business from each other - competition is pretty fierce for transferring motorists with a reasonable accident record.

One more question: is this SR-1 form common across the States? As far as I know we do not have any equivalent where an accident has to be reported to the vehicle licencing authorities. What is the reasoning behind this? I can't see what concern it is of the authorities if you have an argument with a post. Unless the vehicle is written off they are not interested!

[Mama Zappa]

Originally Posted by MarcusF

Just curious as a Brit but can you get what we would call a "Protected No-Claims Discount" on your motor insurance? The way is works in the UK is that for each year you don't claim you get a discount on the basic cost of insuring the vehicle - up to 75-80% if no claims in - I think - 7 years. Any claim and you loose part, but not all, of this discount. To go with this the companies then offer to "protect" the No-Claims-Discount for a reasonably small additional premium. So, in my case, I can have - I think - up to two claims in 24 months without my premium rising.

The companies do exchange information on claims but they also generally match each other's NCD in trying to win business from each other - competition is pretty fierce for transferring motorists with a reasonable accident record.

One more question: is this SR-1 form common across the States? As far as I know we do not have any equivalent where an accident has to be reported to the vehicle licencing authorities. What is the reasoning behind this? I can't see what concern it is of the authorities if you have an argument with a post. Unless the vehicle is written off they are not interested!

Insurance is certainly cheaper if you have a clean history - basically the companies add on costs if anything has gone wrong. The OP would have their rates increased somewhat (ignoring the whole SR-1 thing) as a result; if you have a "moving violation" (speeding ticket, running red light, unsafe merge etc.) that would get higher rates, etc.

So it's sort of the opposite - you don't so much get a discount, as not get nailed with higher rates.

Some companies - but not all - do have a policy of "deductible reduction" - say your deductible is 1,000 dollars, which means if you cause an accident, you have to pay the first thousand dollars of your own car's repair, out of pocket. If you go a year without an accident, the policy "forgives" 100 of that deductible so in year 2, if you cause an accident, you only have to pay 900 and so on.

Insurance is a "fun" thing in the US. I don't know how California rates compare to other states, but the same car, same driver, same driving patterns can vary WIDELY in cost depending on which state you're in. New Jersey for example is notorious for having horrible insurance rates. I suspect California is better, but not by much.

In the OP's case, the post wasn't damaged, there was no property damage other than to their car, so I agree the authorities shouldn't give a rat's ass. If the thing had been knocked over, on the other hand, that would be a different matter.

[Mama Zappa]

Originally Posted by gotpasswords

Thanks for providing that - I was just coming back now to give almost exactly the same link.

Thanks to the "FACT Act" you can get a free CLUE once a year, just like you can get a credit report. If you go here, you can select one or the other, or both your Auto Clue and your Personal Property Clue. I advise getting both, since they're free. The registration is a bit dorky - I had to first create a user name / password, then ask for the reports again, enter my name and address info, then ask for the reports again, then answer some questions of my past (Who did I buy my house from? What street did I live on?) and ask for the reports again. Success at last.

Interesting - your link has a way to do it online, mine seemed to suggest you HAD to do it by mail.

This link says there are others that would be covered under the same "free report" requirement. I'll have to do some noodling around - somewhere else I found a more comprehensive list. One at least was a healthcare report.

[Broomstick]

Originally Posted by Mama Zappa

Insurance is a "fun" thing in the US. I don't know how California rates compare to other states, but the same car, same driver, same driving patterns can vary WIDELY in cost depending on which state you're in. New Jersey for example is notorious for having horrible insurance rates. I suspect California is better, but not by much.

Vary by state? No, hon - it varies by zip code. Where you live affects your insurance rates, too, so by moving 10 miles you can halve or double your premiums - the assumption being if you live in a bad/poor neighborhood you're more likely to cost the insurance company money.

[MarcusF]

Thanks Mama Zappa. One thought how does it work for newly insured drivers who by definition have not made any claims? The logic of the NCD is that the person with no driving history should pay full wack, as you prove you don't run into things (or at least don't make claims) the cost comes down.

On your other points. In the UK the Excess (Deductible) will come down in line with age and driving experience but not on the sort of "10% a year" basis you mention and we too have massive variations in premiums depending on where you live - as Broomstick says, based on local post-code. I think these are primarily based on crime rates as the likelihood of theft seems to be the main factor.

[Yarster]

Marcus F - In my experience, when you first get insured as a teenager in the U.S. you are treated as if you are a terrible driver that effectively already has an accident, and also get a worse rate if you are male versus female. Your rate doesn't normalize until you are 25. That is one of many reasons to drive a piece of junk used car when you are starting out, because it helps lower the overall cost since if you total it, the insurance company has to pay less.