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  #1  
Old 10-20-2011, 08:52 PM
obbn obbn is offline
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Getting high from Vicodin/Percocet

Hello All,
I just read another news article about someone getting arrested for buying vicodin and percocets for recreational drug use. Can someone please explain how people get high from these pain killers? The reason I ask is that I have been on both (not at the same time, but have used both for breakthrough pain) and I have never gotten a buzz or high from their use. In fact, even on the morphine I have never felt anything close to a buzz or high. If I didn't feel the pain subsiding I wouldn't even have known that I had taken anything.

How many of these pills do they have to swallow in order to get a buzz? Of course they can't be taking too many or their livers would shut down due to the high content of acetaminophen. Not looking to try to get high, just trying to understand what is the motivation behind it.
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  #2  
Old 10-20-2011, 09:07 PM
not what you'd expect not what you'd expect is online now
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I have an addictive personality. I was given vicoden after my ovary burst. I got hooked for awhile.
The only thing that unhooked me was the constipation. I couldn't solve that problem and it was unbearable.

To your question. One pill works for awhile. I do need higher dosages and more frequency. The buzz is hard to describe. Just relaxed. Not worried about things. A quiet mind.
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  #3  
Old 10-20-2011, 09:09 PM
Covered_In_Bees! Covered_In_Bees! is offline
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Also, very frequently people don't just down whole bottles of pills. They crush them and snort them, which gives you a higher concentration of the pain killer than is intended by the manufacturer and you get it all at once and you get it almost instantly.

That will make for a bad ass high much moreso than swallowing 10 of the damn things at once.
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Old 10-20-2011, 09:12 PM
Ambivalid Ambivalid is offline
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You are taking it for pain, you expect to feel pain relief from it. If you were to take the medication when you were pain-free, it may have a very different effect on you.
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  #5  
Old 10-20-2011, 09:24 PM
needscoffee needscoffee is offline
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When I take it for pain, I still feel the buzz.
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  #6  
Old 10-20-2011, 09:28 PM
panamajack panamajack is offline
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(To the OP): Are you saying vicodin/morphine/etc. doesn't give you a relaxed, pain-free feeling? Or are you wondering why people would get addicted if it doesn't give a 'high' like from marijuana or cocaine? If the former, then maybe those drugs don't affect you that much - it seems to me that almost everyone I've known on a long-term drug regimen that includes painkillers will have some that work better for them than others. If the latter, then it's more of what not what you'd expect said, I'd guess. They aren't doing it to get 'high' but to feel good in a sedated way. Opium has been a popular drug to abuse for quite a long time, so it's not just a "let's try this new drug and see if it's like the others" thing.
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  #7  
Old 10-20-2011, 09:32 PM
Joey P Joey P is online now
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One thing you have to understand is that most people, when taking it for pain, take one or two. When you're taking it for fun, you take more then that. In college, my friends and I, after some experimenting, found that for Vicodin or Tylenol 3, a good recreational dose was 5 pills (or 3 Percocets). I wasn't a drinker, but a lot of them would add a beer into the mix as well (slowly and carefully).
If you're hooked on them, you have to take more and more everyday. I found very quickly, that if I took 3 today and got a good buzz, I'd have to take 4 tomorrow to get maybe half the buzz. I'd imagine most hardcore addicts, the ones that end up getting really sick or winding up in rehab are probably taking 30+ over the course of a day, everyday....as opposed to 1-2 every 6 hours.
Also, if you are taking 1-2 every 6 hours for more then a day or two, you're tolerance is going to build up very quickly. If you got little or no buzz after the first 2 pills, you're really going to get nothing after you've been taking the same amount at the same intervals for 2 days.
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Old 10-20-2011, 09:34 PM
Ambivalid Ambivalid is offline
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Originally Posted by needscoffee View Post
When I take it for pain, I still feel the buzz.
many don't (I'm not one of them either though)
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Old 10-20-2011, 09:43 PM
obbn obbn is offline
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Originally Posted by panamajack View Post
(To the OP): Are you saying vicodin/morphine/etc. doesn't give you a relaxed, pain-free feeling? Or are you wondering why people would get addicted if it doesn't give a 'high' like from marijuana or cocaine? If the former, then maybe those drugs don't affect you that much - it seems to me that almost everyone I've known on a long-term drug regimen that includes painkillers will have some that work better for them than others. If the latter, then it's more of what not what you'd expect said, I'd guess. They aren't doing it to get 'high' but to feel good in a sedated way. Opium has been a popular drug to abuse for quite a long time, so it's not just a "let's try this new drug and see if it's like the others" thing.
The drugs take away the pain, but I don't feel any side effects ie: high/buzz, relaxed feeling etc.. As stated in my OP, if it didn't take the pain away I wouldn't even know that I had taken anything. A skittles has about as much effect as the drugs. Like I said, I have no desire to get high, just trying to understand why someone would choose these drugs.

OTOH one weekend I stopped taking the drugs cold turkey because I had a pain block injected into my back and we wanted to see the effect. It was a very painful weekend, but I didn't seem to experience any withdrawl symptoms. I will admit I did get slightly clammy for a few hours, but other than that no withdrawls. I found that rather strange as I have been on the drugs everyday for 8 years.

Last edited by obbn; 10-20-2011 at 09:47 PM..
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Old 10-20-2011, 09:45 PM
obbn obbn is offline
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Originally Posted by Joey P View Post
One thing you have to understand is that most people, when taking it for pain, take one or two. When you're taking it for fun, you take more then that. In college, my friends and I, after some experimenting, found that for Vicodin or Tylenol 3, a good recreational dose was 5 pills (or 3 Percocets). I wasn't a drinker, but a lot of them would add a beer into the mix as well (slowly and carefully).
If you're hooked on them, you have to take more and more everyday. I found very quickly, that if I took 3 today and got a good buzz, I'd have to take 4 tomorrow to get maybe half the buzz. I'd imagine most hardcore addicts, the ones that end up getting really sick or winding up in rehab are probably taking 30+ over the course of a day, everyday....as opposed to 1-2 every 6 hours.
Also, if you are taking 1-2 every 6 hours for more then a day or two, you're tolerance is going to build up very quickly. If you got little or no buzz after the first 2 pills, you're really going to get nothing after you've been taking the same amount at the same intervals for 2 days.
Very interesting. How in the world did you and your friends keep from frying your liver? Especially since you (or they) drank booze with it, sound like a good way to wake up dead.
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  #11  
Old 10-20-2011, 09:50 PM
Joey P Joey P is online now
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Originally Posted by obbn View Post
Very interesting. How in the world did you and your friends keep from frying your liver? Especially since you (or they) drank booze with it, sound like a good way to wake up dead.
Because we didn't live on Vicodin and alcohol. 5 Vicodins and a beer isn't exactly a recipe for death and doing it once or twice a month for two semesters (which is probably what it averaged out to over the course of the year) isn't going to destroy your liver.

Also, destroying your liver from the Tylenol in the Vicodin would take at least 4 grams (8 Vicodins) and IIRC death isn't instant (you don't wake up dead) it takes several days. I'm not sure how much a single beer would factor into it though. I suppose it would bring the 4 gram limit down a bit.

Last edited by Joey P; 10-20-2011 at 09:53 PM..
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Old 10-20-2011, 10:04 PM
Ambivalid Ambivalid is offline
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Originally Posted by Joey P View Post
Because we didn't live on Vicodin and alcohol. 5 Vicodins and a beer isn't exactly a recipe for death and doing it once or twice a month for two semesters (which is probably what it averaged out to over the course of the year) isn't going to destroy your liver.

Also, destroying your liver from the Tylenol in the Vicodin would take at least 4 grams (8 Vicodins) and IIRC death isn't instant (you don't wake up dead) it takes several days. I'm not sure how much a single beer would factor into it though. I suppose it would bring the 4 gram limit down a bit.
Just to add: one of the dangers of acetaminophen is it's ubiquity in so many everyday OTC medicines and products, some that you would not even think of. This can lead easily to an overdose beyond that 4 grams given the right circumstances.
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  #13  
Old 10-20-2011, 10:11 PM
Joey P Joey P is online now
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Originally Posted by Ambivalid View Post
Just to add: one of the dangers of acetaminophen is it's ubiquity in so many everyday OTC medicines and products, some that you would not even think of. This can lead easily to an overdose beyond that 4 grams given the right circumstances.
I'm well aware of that. In fact, in college I was the go to guy when it came to meds. Everyone always assumed I was going to be a pharmacist when I grew up.
What bothers me the most is how many people take Tylenol PM to help them fall asleep. I can't tell you how many times I've said "Ya know, the PM part of Tylenol PM is Benadryl...you can just take 2 Benadryls instead" A few days ago my sister mentioned that she took 2 Bendryls because of an allergic reaction to something that caused her to break out in hives on her arm and then she took two Tylenol PMs to help her fall asleep because the itching was driving her nuts.
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Old 10-20-2011, 10:12 PM
RearEchelon RearEchelon is offline
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There is a very simple way to separate the narcotic from the acetaminophen for recreational use. I won't go into the details here, but if you must you can search for "cold water extraction" at your own peril.
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  #15  
Old 10-20-2011, 10:15 PM
Ferret Herder Ferret Herder is offline
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I was given a prescription for Vicodin a few years ago after I broke my (dominant hand) wrist. It was right before Christmas, too, and I was stressed over the injury, the high number of limitations I had on what I could do, etc. After I took the first Vicodin, my wrist still felt like it hurt, but I noticed I wasn't so stressed about it any longer, and in fact didn't much care any longer.

Until 20 minutes later when suddenly I got a feeling of nausea in my mouth (not in my stomach), then ran to the bathroom to throw up.

But for 20 minutes I had lost a ton of anxiety, so I understood why someone might seek to escape feelings of stress/sadness/etc.

Edit: Acetaminophen and alcohol - I gather it's much easier to harm your liver (if not necessarily die) if you only moderately up the alcohol intake. I was on a wine touring vacation when I got a terrible cold, and quickly realized that I had best watch out if I wanted to keep my liver intact, so I had to decide what to do. I opted to avoid all acetaminophen-containing cold medications, which is harder than you think if you are miserable and have multiple, tough cold symptoms. There have been times when I've been very sick with a cold that I've actually lost track of how much medicine I've taken out of desperation to sleep, and when - at times like that, I don't drink anything.

Last edited by Ferret Herder; 10-20-2011 at 10:20 PM..
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  #16  
Old 10-20-2011, 10:21 PM
Joey P Joey P is online now
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Originally Posted by RearEchelon View Post
There is a very simple way to separate the narcotic from the acetaminophen for recreational use. I won't go into the details here, but if you must you can search for "cold water extraction" at your own peril.
I did that once...tasted awful. It was the most bitter thing I ever put in my mouth. We also extracted the DXM out of Robotussin which was just as bad.
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Old 10-20-2011, 10:21 PM
obbn obbn is offline
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Originally Posted by Ferret Herder View Post
I was given a prescription for Vicodin a few years ago after I broke my (dominant hand) wrist. It was right before Christmas, too, and I was stressed over the injury, the high number of limitations I had on what I could do, etc. After I took the first Vicodin, my wrist still felt like it hurt, but I noticed I wasn't so stressed about it any longer, and in fact didn't much care any longer.

Until 20 minutes later when suddenly I got a feeling of nausea in my mouth (not in my stomach), then ran to the bathroom to throw up.

But for 20 minutes I had lost a ton of anxiety, so I understood why someone might seek to escape feelings of stress/sadness/etc.
Interesting as well. So would you say that those who take these meds to get high do so for a relaxing feeling vs. a high like from pot or from drinking. Those are the only two things that I have experienced that made me buzzed. Maybe that is why I can't understand those wanting these meds. Perhaps the high they are seeking isn't the high I am using for comparison.
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Old 10-20-2011, 10:26 PM
Ferret Herder Ferret Herder is offline
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That was just my first-timer experience on Vicodin, which is apparently pretty wussy for an opiate. Stronger opiate medications/dosages may have different effects.

Wikipedia seems to suggest that my feelings weren't uncommon, though I don't think I had euphoria per se. Sleepiness and a feeling of satisfaction, sure.

Last edited by Ferret Herder; 10-20-2011 at 10:27 PM..
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  #19  
Old 10-20-2011, 10:27 PM
Romeo and Whatsherface Romeo and Whatsherface is offline
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Vicodin not only doesn't give me a buzz, I have had trouble getting to sleep when I've taken one, and then my dreams are more apt to be vivid and nightmarish. PLUS it makes me queasy. I avoid taking it unless I'm in a lot of pain.

But why would a drug ONLY give someone a buzz if they're not taking it for pain? Is the idea that it works on pain receptors, and if there is no pain, instead of working on pain receptors, it somehow works on other parts of the neurological system instead to produce the buzz? I'd really like to know.
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Old 10-20-2011, 10:36 PM
obbn obbn is offline
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Originally Posted by Romeo and Whatsherface View Post
Vicodin not only doesn't give me a buzz, I have had trouble getting to sleep when I've taken one, and then my dreams are more apt to be vivid and nightmarish. PLUS it makes me queasy. I avoid taking it unless I'm in a lot of pain.

But why would a drug ONLY give someone a buzz if they're not taking it for pain? Is the idea that it works on pain receptors, and if there is no pain, instead of working on pain receptors, it somehow works on other parts of the neurological system instead to produce the buzz? I'd really like to know.
I would like to know this as well. It seems to me with the dosage that I am on I would be getting something. So, perhaps maybe because of my pain the pain receptors are "absorbing" all of the meds, leaving nothing for whatever receptors get you high.
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Old 10-20-2011, 10:42 PM
Joey P Joey P is online now
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Originally Posted by Romeo and Whatsherface View Post
Vicodin not only doesn't give me a buzz, I have had trouble getting to sleep when I've taken one, and then my dreams are more apt to be vivid and nightmarish. PLUS it makes me queasy. I avoid taking it unless I'm in a lot of pain.
I get pretty wired from it as well. I try not to take vicodin after 5pm or so. Even then I usually end up taking Benadryl to fall asleep.

Quote:
But why would a drug ONLY give someone a buzz if they're not taking it for pain? Is the idea that it works on pain receptors, and if there is no pain, instead of working on pain receptors, it somehow works on other parts of the neurological system instead to produce the buzz? I'd really like to know.
I'm getting out of my league here, but I don't think it works on pain receptors, my understanding is that instead of getting rid of the pain directly, it makes you not really care about the pain (the tylenol gets rid of the pain). As for why you don't get buzzed if you take it while in pain, I always looked at it like the buzz and the pain are canceling each other out. But you can take more Vicodin then the pain 'needs' and still get buzzed. It's not that if you take 10 vicodins you'll remain sober because you stubbed your toe.
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Old 10-20-2011, 10:49 PM
Qwakkeddup Qwakkeddup is online now
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I tried MJ two or three times it only made me sick. I was on pain meds, although I don't recall the exact name, once for a crushed hand, then a few years later for a broken collar bone. Even as a kid my mother had to make me take them, I felt they didn't do me any good.
So my thought was that getting high and addicted was just so much garbage, I enjoyed beer and some hard liquor, but that wasn't the same thing. <<to me>>

Somewhere around 2001 I came down with a terrible case of bronchitis coughing so hard all through the night that I couldn't get any sleep. Coughing through the day so bad I could hardly get a short sentence out without hacking every two words. On top of this my feet were swollen, cramped and in screaming agony.

The Dr. prescribed a cough syrup with codeine and another anti-inflammatory.
Slept like a baby the first night, got up took my meds and went to work Heaven. I flew through that day and the next. My wife caught it the second day though and basically talked to me about the meds I was taking. So I had to save the cough syrup for night time use so I could sleep, and use the other only in the morning so I could work while on my feet all day. No more mixing, I think she also reported it to the pharmacy.

I now can see just how easy it could be to get addicted, it just takes the right medication, in the right dose and maybe a little mixing. Find the right "thing" for you and you could be headed down that road before you even know it.

Lucky for me my Wife caught it very early.
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  #23  
Old 10-20-2011, 10:51 PM
TriPolar TriPolar is offline
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If you're trying to get a buzz, it helps to wash it down with some liquor. If it slows you down, do a little meth or blow. If you start getting edgy, smoke some weed and drop some ecstacy. Have a good night.
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Old 10-20-2011, 11:26 PM
horsetech horsetech is offline
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Originally Posted by Joey P View Post
I get pretty wired from it as well. I try not to take vicodin after 5pm or so. Even then I usually end up taking Benadryl to fall asleep.


I'm getting out of my league here, but I don't think it works on pain receptors, my understanding is that instead of getting rid of the pain directly, it makes you not really care about the pain (the tylenol gets rid of the pain). As for why you don't get buzzed if you take it while in pain, I always looked at it like the buzz and the pain are canceling each other out. But you can take more Vicodin then the pain 'needs' and still get buzzed. It's not that if you take 10 vicodins you'll remain sober because you stubbed your toe.
Opiates such as hydrocodone act on opioid receptors in the brain, spinal cord, and peripheral nervous system. In many people, one of the many effects of stimulating these receptors with an exogenous ligand is analgesia. There are multiple types of opioid receptors, with each drug having a different receptor binding profile and therefore different effects. However, the neurobiology of pain in general and of opioid receptors in particular is complex (there is an entire textbook entirely about opioid/opiate receptors!), is only partially understood, and varies between individuals due to differences in receptor morphology (and thus binding of drugs and endogenous ligands), receptor distribution, effects of other neurotransmitter systems, differences in neuronal connectivity, interactions with other gene products which may vary in expression, etc.

I'll let one of the medicos give a more detailed explanation.

On a more personal note, I have found that both Vicodin and morphine actually take away my pain, and we have had threads on here in which many people indicated that it did the same for them.
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Old 10-20-2011, 11:31 PM
njtt njtt is offline
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I have never had any hint of a high from Vicodin, or from the Vicodin-like medicines (also acetominophen/paracetomol* with codeine, and in similar doses to those in VIcodin, I think) that you can buy over the counter in Britain. On occasion I have taken it when I have only been experiencing only quite mild pain or discomfort. (I occasionally take one when my bowels are inconveniently loose, to calm them down, but that is hardly pain.) I still do not get any buzz from it.

On the other hand, the one time I was given Percoset (or possibly Demerol), when I had a colonoscopy, I did feel extremely mellow afterwards. But those are much stronger drugs than Vicodin.

It is worth noting, however, that it is very dangerous to take large doses of Vicodin, not so much because you will get addicted to the codeine, the narcotic component, but because even quite moderately large doses of acetominophen/paracetomol can cause severe and irreversible liver damage, and even death. If people are taking multiple Vicodins to get high, they are probably killing themselves. They would be much safer taking equivalent amounts of pure codeine, which is the component entirely responsible for the high (if there is one) and the putative addictiveness anyway.

I am pretty sure Dr House ought to have been dead long ago. As he and his colleagues should surely know, he ought not to be on Vicodin, but on pure codeine (or some other narcotic painkiller), which would be both much safer and more fun for him..

Mind you, I was once on regular, relatively high doses of codeine (I was taking it for chronic irritable bowel, and I am pretty sure that the dose was considerably higher than were higher than what you would get from a safe dose of Vicodin), and never got a buzz from that either. I was taking it for something like two years, and I may have become mildly addicted, but, when the time seemed appropriate, I was able to wean myself off it quite easily, and, with the irritable bowel now cleared up, I did not miss it at all.

I am not claiming that I do not have an "addictive personality - I may well have (I think I am addicted to The Dope!) - but I am saying that codeine, in the small amounts that are found in Vicodin, or even in the larger amounts that were once prescribed for me, never got me in the least high, nor did it get me seriously addicted.


*Acetominophen and paracetomol are the different names that are, for some unfathomable reason, used for the generic form of the exact same drug in America and Britain respectively. (Americans often call it Tylenol or Motrin too, but those are brand names.) The British name is better however, because it is also the answer to the question "Why are there no aspirins in the jungle?"

Last edited by njtt; 10-20-2011 at 11:34 PM..
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Old 10-21-2011, 12:26 AM
raskolnik raskolnik is offline
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12 shots of vodka in 90 mins has always dulled me enough...for self amputation...
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Old 10-21-2011, 12:36 AM
Der Trihs Der Trihs is offline
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Originally Posted by Romeo and Whatsherface View Post
But why would a drug ONLY give someone a buzz if they're not taking it for pain? Is the idea that it works on pain receptors, and if there is no pain, instead of working on pain receptors, it somehow works on other parts of the neurological system instead to produce the buzz? I'd really like to know.
Something like that. In fact, one emeergy treament for an opiate overdose is to do things that normally inflcit extreme pain to the victim; it uses up the drug.

The physical effects are quite different depending on whether you take narcotics for pain or when you aren't in pain. Most people taking it for pain don't get high, don't get addicted, and don't show an increasing tolerance of the drug.

Last edited by Der Trihs; 10-21-2011 at 12:37 AM..
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Old 10-21-2011, 12:38 AM
Ambivalid Ambivalid is offline
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Originally Posted by njtt View Post
I have never had any hint of a high from Vicodin, or from the Vicodin-like medicines (also acetominophen/paracetomol* with codeine, and in similar doses to those in VIcodin, I think) that you can buy over the counter in Britain. On occasion I have taken it when I have only been experiencing only quite mild pain or discomfort. (I occasionally take one when my bowels are inconveniently loose, to calm them down, but that is hardly pain.) I still do not get any buzz from it.

On the other hand, the one time I was given Percoset (or possibly Demerol), when I had a colonoscopy, I did feel extremely mellow afterwards. But those are much stronger drugs than Vicodin.

It is worth noting, however, that it is very dangerous to take large doses of Vicodin, not so much because you will get addicted to the codeine, the narcotic component, but because even quite moderately large doses of acetominophen/paracetomol can cause severe and irreversible liver damage, and even death. If people are taking multiple Vicodins to get high, they are probably killing themselves. They would be much safer taking equivalent amounts of pure codeine, which is the component entirely responsible for the high (if there is one) and the putative addictiveness anyway.

I am pretty sure Dr House ought to have been dead long ago. As he and his colleagues should surely know, he ought not to be on Vicodin, but on pure codeine (or some other narcotic painkiller), which would be both much safer and more fun for him..

Mind you, I was once on regular, relatively high doses of codeine (I was taking it for chronic irritable bowel, and I am pretty sure that the dose was considerably higher than were higher than what you would get from a safe dose of Vicodin), and never got a buzz from that either. I was taking it for something like two years, and I may have become mildly addicted, but, when the time seemed appropriate, I was able to wean myself off it quite easily, and, with the irritable bowel now cleared up, I did not miss it at all.

I am not claiming that I do not have an "addictive personality - I may well have (I think I am addicted to The Dope!) - but I am saying that codeine, in the small amounts that are found in Vicodin, or even in the larger amounts that were once prescribed for me, never got me in the least high, nor did it get me seriously addicted.


*Acetominophen and paracetomol are the different names that are, for some unfathomable reason, used for the generic form of the exact same drug in America and Britain respectively. (Americans often call it Tylenol or Motrin too, but those are brand names.) The British name is better however, because it is also the answer to the question "Why are there no aspirins in the jungle?"
Tylenol and Motrin are completely different drugs. Tylenol is acetominophen and Motrin is ibuprofen. Ibuprofen is a NSAID.
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  #29  
Old 10-21-2011, 02:38 AM
njtt njtt is offline
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Originally Posted by Ambivalid View Post
Tylenol and Motrin are completely different drugs. Tylenol is acetominophen and Motrin is ibuprofen. Ibuprofen is a NSAID.
You are correct. I am sorry. I suppose that invalidates my whole post.
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Old 10-21-2011, 07:04 AM
Hello Again Hello Again is offline
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I don't process opiates well so I'm in no danger of ever abusing. Or, even, generally, consuming them without hours of vomiting. They say my reaction if on the extreme side for side effects. It's hard to say, really, how the "feeling" of vicodin is for me, when I vomit up the pills half-digested. I can keep down Codeine, barely, but all it does is zonk me out. There's a painkilling affect but the sedating effect is way more predominant for me.

However, I had intravenous morphine once at the hospital and there's a definite "rushy" feeling when it hits. I didn't personally find it pleasurable but it was distinctive. The "rush" sensation was followed by a few hours of vertigo and three days of vomiting (I could not keep down toast, or even water, at first). Also, I could not control the expression of my emotions and laughed hysterically/wept piteously in alternating half hours for the rest of the night. I can clearly remember that in my brain I was thinking "I need to tell the nurse not to write me a scrip for Vicodin." What came out was "nurse (wah) I (wah) can't (wah) have (wah) vicodin (wah) is there (wah) something (wah) else (wah)I can (wah) try (wah)" Where the word "wah" represents uncontrollable crying.

Between the vertigo, vomiting and irrational expression of emotions (note I was not FEELING irrationally sad, I was just not able to control my crying/laughing response), its not an experience I'm eager to repeat.

I'm sure I have as much addictive propensity as anyone, but there is a 0% chance I could ever get addicted to Vicodin, since my body just rejects it, or likely any opiate, since the immediate sensation is extraordinarily unpleasant. I have heard people say "it feels like being hugged by god" and such things but,... yeah. Not for me.
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Old 10-21-2011, 07:30 AM
Qadgop the Mercotan Qadgop the Mercotan is online now
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Opioids have been known to give me a 'hug from God' sensation, where all fears, anxieties, doubts, insecurities, pains, woes, and worries melt away and I feel safe, strong, secure, competent, capable, and at peace with myself and the universe.

I don't even mind that sometimes it makes me barf.

This is a typical type of reaction to opioids for a significant percentage of the population.

Which is why I now stay the hell away from opioids, unless it's under very, very controlled situations for very specific medical needs.

Last edited by Qadgop the Mercotan; 10-21-2011 at 07:31 AM..
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Old 10-21-2011, 08:13 AM
not what you'd expect not what you'd expect is online now
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I also have to be very careful. Extremely painful muscle spasms in my shoulder had me at the ER one night. The Dr. gave me a shot of Demerol. It was like three in the morning by then, I think.

I begged for a to go order. I wanted to go dancing.

I think sometimes I don't give myself enough credit for NOT being a homeless, drug addicted derelict. I crave the calmness these drugs give me. They quite my mind, which otherwise just never shuts the fuck up.

Without something, I am lucky to sleep two hours a night. With something, I get six or so.
Maybe a lobotomy is the best answer. I don't know.
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Old 10-21-2011, 08:41 AM
Shodan Shodan is offline
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Originally Posted by Der Trihs View Post
Something like that. In fact, one emeergy treament for an opiate overdose is to do things that normally inflcit extreme pain to the victim; it uses up the drug.
Do you have a cite for this?

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Old 10-21-2011, 10:28 AM
Qadgop the Mercotan Qadgop the Mercotan is online now
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Something like that. In fact, one emeergy treament for an opiate overdose is to do things that normally inflcit extreme pain to the victim; it uses up the drug.
Yeah, I've never heard of that one either. And I've treated a lot of opioid overdoses.

It doesn't make sense from what I know of the neuropharmacology.

And I don't find such a protocol or recommendation in any of my medical sources for treatment algorithms for opioid overdosing.

Last edited by Qadgop the Mercotan; 10-21-2011 at 10:31 AM..
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Old 10-21-2011, 10:53 AM
taffygirl taffygirl is offline
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Originally Posted by not what you'd expect View Post
I also have to be very careful. Extremely painful muscle spasms in my shoulder had me at the ER one night. The Dr. gave me a shot of Demerol. It was like three in the morning by then, I think.

I begged for a to go order. I wanted to go dancing.
This is why I request that I NOT be given Demerol. I've had it twice: once after a C-section, once before a corneal transplant. The first time, I felt like I was floating three inches off the bed in a golden glow. The second time, the doctor started squirting the rest of the Demerol from the syringe into the trash, and I said, "Oh, my God, why are you doing THAT?" It seemed like such a tragic waste: think of all the sober people in India!

Yeah, no more Demerol for me.

Interesting that different painkillers affect people so differently. Wow, we're complex creatures.
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Old 10-21-2011, 11:26 AM
Fiveroptic Fiveroptic is offline
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Originally Posted by njtt View Post
I have never had any hint of a high from Vicodin, or from the Vicodin-like medicines (also acetominophen/paracetomol* with codeine, and in similar doses to those in VIcodin, I think) that you can buy over the counter in Britain. On occasion I have taken it when I have only been experiencing only quite mild pain or discomfort. (I occasionally take one when my bowels are inconveniently loose, to calm them down, but that is hardly pain.) I still do not get any buzz from it.

On the other hand, the one time I was given Percoset (or possibly Demerol), when I had a colonoscopy, I did feel extremely mellow afterwards. But those are much stronger drugs than Vicodin.

It is worth noting, however, that it is very dangerous to take large doses of Vicodin, not so much because you will get addicted to the codeine, the narcotic component, but because even quite moderately large doses of acetominophen/paracetomol can cause severe and irreversible liver damage, and even death. If people are taking multiple Vicodins to get high, they are probably killing themselves. They would be much safer taking equivalent amounts of pure codeine, which is the component entirely responsible for the high (if there is one) and the putative addictiveness anyway.

[...]

I am not claiming that I do not have an "addictive personality - I may well have (I think I am addicted to The Dope!) - but I am saying that codeine, in the small amounts that are found in Vicodin, or even in the larger amounts that were once prescribed for me, never got me in the least high, nor did it get me seriously addicted. [...]
I know it seems nit-picky, but the opioid ingredient of Vicodin is NOT codeine. Vicodin in the name-brand of generic hydrocodone, usually 5mgs of hydrocodone and 500mgs of acetaminophen. (The group includes Lortab, Norco, Anexia, and combinations of hydro and apap that go from 5 to 10mgs of hydro and 325 to 750mgs of acetaminophen.)

Codeine and hydrocodone are very different opioid analgesics. IME, people tend to have harsher reactions to the side effects of codeine (which leads people to think they have an "allergy" to codeine, when they're actually just getting smacked hard by the possible negative side effects.)
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Old 10-21-2011, 11:37 AM
obbn obbn is offline
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Originally Posted by not what you'd expect View Post
I also have to be very careful. Extremely painful muscle spasms in my shoulder had me at the ER one night. The Dr. gave me a shot of Demerol. It was like three in the morning by then, I think.

I begged for a to go order. I wanted to go dancing.

I think sometimes I don't give myself enough credit for NOT being a homeless, drug addicted derelict. I crave the calmness these drugs give me. They quite my mind, which otherwise just never shuts the fuck up.

Without something, I am lucky to sleep two hours a night. With something, I get six or so.
Maybe a lobotomy is the best answer. I don't know.
With your post I have to edit my origional OP. I HAVE been high from a pain killer and that was from a shot of Demerol in the ER. I guess I forgot about it since it was 8 years ago, but wow is all I have to say. Same reaction as you. When I went into the ER I couldn't walk and had to be helped in. After the shot they could have cut off my arm and I wouldn't have cared. The pain relief was immediate and complete and I was in a great mood.

I thought I had found the perfect drug for pain, until my surgery. They had me on Demerol for about a week while I was recovering. I don't quite remember, but I think I was getting a shot of Demerol about every 4 to 6 hours to control the pain. After about 5 days or so on it I started to hallucinate. I saw spiders on the floor, mice in my bed and started having conversations with non-existent people. The nursing staff found out when a police officer showed up. Apparently I called 911 in a panic. I can't believe I forgot about that episode. That cured me of ever wanting to be on Demerol again.
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Old 10-21-2011, 12:01 PM
not what you'd expect not what you'd expect is online now
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Yes, I guess it's a good thing that these drugs are typically not tolerated for long. Otherwise, we might have even worse problems with addiction than we already do.

Vicoden quiets my mind, but gives horrible constipation and very vivid nightmares (I forgot about those)

I had Demerol again after a partial hysterectomy. Lovely, until the itching got too bad to tolerate.

Alcohol makes me stupid, unable to walk. Not to mention what it does to the liver.

Pot has been the most help to me, but it's not legal and the science isn't really settled on it, I guess.

I saw a news report earlier this week about the increasing number of women in their 40's and 50's on anti-depressants.

I don't know what's wrong with a lot of us, but I think we should try to figure it out. We are complicated, that's for sure.
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  #39  
Old 10-21-2011, 04:03 PM
perfectparanoia perfectparanoia is offline
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I get bad headaches. (They aren't really migraines but I can't even move if they get bad enough.)

When one starts, I take sinus medication (just in case this one is a sinus headache which I also get) and ibuprofen. When that doesn't work I go to Tylenol 3. When that doesn't work, I go to Percoset.

Now, just to be clear, Percoset in no way makes my pain go away. It does, however, make me happy enough that I just don't care. Great stuff, that. (My doctor is very smart and only gives me ten pills at a time. Since I hate going to the doctor and don't ever want to run out, I use them very sparingly.)

In talking to other people, it doesn't work that way (or at all) for them. So, I guess body chemistry is the difference.
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Old 10-21-2011, 04:09 PM
Buchanan Buchanan is offline
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Originally Posted by Joey P View Post
One thing you have to understand is that most people, when taking it for pain, take one or two. When you're taking it for fun, you take more then that. In college, my friends and I, after some experimenting, found that for Vicodin or Tylenol 3, a good recreational dose was 5 pills (or 3 Percocets). I wasn't a drinker, but a lot of them would add a beer into the mix as well (slowly and carefully).
If you're hooked on them, you have to take more and more everyday. I found very quickly, that if I took 3 today and got a good buzz, I'd have to take 4 tomorrow to get maybe half the buzz. I'd imagine most hardcore addicts, the ones that end up getting really sick or winding up in rehab are probably taking 30+ over the course of a day, everyday....as opposed to 1-2 every 6 hours.
Also, if you are taking 1-2 every 6 hours for more then a day or two, you're tolerance is going to build up very quickly. If you got little or no buzz after the first 2 pills, you're really going to get nothing after you've been taking the same amount at the same intervals for 2 days.
Your points about tolerance build-up is why kids start on "the junk", or heroin. Percs are $8 a pill for the lame stuff, $30 for an oxy, while a small balloon of good heroin (which noobs can still snort although its harsh) will last 6 hours and costs $5.
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  #41  
Old 10-21-2011, 04:23 PM
Romeo and Whatsherface Romeo and Whatsherface is offline
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After about 5 days or so on it I started to hallucinate. I saw spiders on the floor, mice in my bed and started having conversations with non-existent people. The nursing staff found out when a police officer showed up. Apparently I called 911 in a panic. I can't believe I forgot about that episode. That cured me of ever wanting to be on Demerol again.
That reminds me of another question. Why do certain painkillers cause hallucinations in some people but not in others? When I had agonizing complications after my daughter was born, the doctor gave me Stadol via IV push. A few minutes later, I said, "I think I'm hallucinating," to which he famously replied, "If you think you are, then you are." For about 25 minutes, I saw flower petals growing out of people's heads and--cliched but true--a white rabbit, along with other oddities and auditory hallucinations. They distracted me from the pain but didn't really kill it. A woman I know who said she's been given Stadol on two different occasions said she had no hallucinations.

If I were to be given Stadol again (no thanks), would I in all likelihood have hallucinations again?
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  #42  
Old 10-22-2011, 12:00 AM
cmyk cmyk is offline
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Buzz is the wrong word. I'd call it a warm, glowing, euphoric sensation at its peak. If I could feel like that all the time, I would, so it's easy for me to see why addiction can be a problem.

A buzz or high I would associate more with pronounced feelings of disassociation or other altered stated of consciousness, like alcohol, pot, cocaine, meth, etc.
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Old 10-22-2011, 12:12 AM
SeaDragonTattoo SeaDragonTattoo is offline
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The first time I had a narcotic was summer 2010, when I had a weird throat infection that was extremely painful and swollen. The first antibiotic didn't work, and I ended up in the ER 2 days after starting that, having not eaten or had anything to drink during those 2 days. They gave me morphine to help me out until the steroid could start to work, then 8 hours, IV fluids, and a bunch of diagnostics (including CT) later, sent me home on a different antibiotic and a scrip for Vicodin. I took the Vicodin that day and the next, and by that next day the antibiotic had started working and I didn't need as much Vicodin as scripted, so I just took one and felt so good I cleaned the whole house and had company over. Good stuff for me.

Since I had a bunch left over, it came in handy later in the year for a series of dental visits. I took one before each visit (I told my dentist that I took one), and the mild anxiety I had just disappeared. Made for much more pleasant visits, so much so that if I need work like that again, my dentist told me he would scrip a tablet for those visits if I ask ahead of time.

I guess I can see how people could get hooked. I'm not a fan of being out of my head, out of control, or whatnot, so I don't see myself doing more than a little alcohol now and then. I guess that's a good thing.
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Old 10-22-2011, 12:36 AM
Quasimodem Quasimodem is offline
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I haven't read the whole thread (yet), but I'd like to remind y'all, that high doses of pain meds over a long period of time may cause you to need a very hefty dose of pain meds should something happen to you (accident, etc.). In that case, one would do well to tell the ER doc that he or she is a recreational drug user (I hate that term. Makes it sound like that's somehow good for you) and the dosage one is taking and how many at a time.

Even then, the doc might get a little nervous giving a stronger dose of anything (morphine, dilaudid, etc.).

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Last edited by Quasimodem; 10-22-2011 at 12:37 AM..
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Old 10-22-2011, 05:26 AM
DxZero DxZero is offline
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Well I had a nice long post written out, but well...twitchy trigger figure on the back button.


Anyway, three kinds of pills you really associating with getting high from an opiate (not including morphine sulfates or a bunch of other stuff all ready mention)


Vicodin/Lortab - Hydrocodone/ Acetaminophen - Basic opiate painkiller - Prescribed for mild to moderate pain, usually short term. Things like pulled teeth, back strains, the like. Lower risk of addiction in my experience because the dosage is pretty low and hydrocodone doesn't necessarily have the effect that oxycodone does. If you have any tolerance for opiates, then this probably won't get you too high for too long. I personally don't even get really sleepy on them anymore. Decent at killing pain though.

Percocet/Percodan/Various other names- Oxycodone/Acetaminophen or Aspirin -Moderate to Severe Pain- Comes in dosages up 10mg per tab of Oxycodone and several mg of the other component. Much higher risk of abuse. Causes euphoria, sedation, general well-being, or nausea in those who can't tolerate opiates well. Its like being pretty drunk, but completely relaxed at the same time. You're giddy and probably somewhat incoherent, but it doesn't really register that its you being the drunken buffoon. Also can suppress breathing (as all opiates can) and asphyxiation(I guess) is a possibility. Tolerance builds up pretty fast too. 1 pill a time one week will turn in 2 the next week to get the same euphoric feeling.

Oxycontin-The granddaddy of them all-"Hillbilly heroin"- Time released oxycodone in dosages up to 80mg a pill. Notice "time-released". If you crush the pill and snort it or cook it up for injection, you're getting basically the equivalent of 8 or so Percocets (minus the competent drug) at once. Super high dependency. Supposed to be prescribed for "break-out" pain in late stage cancer patients, but it has been absurdly overprescribed. All the euphoria of a percocet high heightened to just an unbelievable level. Also the danger of respiratory failure is really imminent. You actually have to force yourself to remember to breath and combine that with the fact that you struggling to stay awake and well you have real trouble keeping yourself alive. Tolerance builds up super fast too when you start to snort or inject. I was, at my worst stage, snorting about 120-140 mgs a night. In retrospect, its a damn miracle I didn't die. Fortunately, when I began to taper off it, I only had a seizure and wound up in the ICU for a week. Other than the seizure, I didn't suffer any other detox symptoms.


Just my experience from what I know and learned the hard way.
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  #46  
Old 10-22-2011, 05:59 AM
not what you'd expect not what you'd expect is online now
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Originally Posted by cmyk View Post
Buzz is the wrong word. I'd call it a warm, glowing, euphoric sensation at its peak. If I could feel like that all the time, I would, so it's easy for me to see why addiction can be a problem.

A buzz or high I would associate more with pronounced feelings of disassociation or other altered stated of consciousness, like alcohol, pot, cocaine, meth, etc.
Yeah, that's another thing. Maybe I just don't know what euphoria feels like, but nothing has ever given me that feeling that I can recall.

My husband once took one of my ativans because he thought he was having a panic attack. He described the feeling as euphoric. Pissed me off. He gets euphoria. All I get is No Panic attack, if I take it quick enough.
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Old 10-22-2011, 07:34 AM
DxZero DxZero is offline
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Originally Posted by not what you'd expect View Post
Yeah, that's another thing. Maybe I just don't know what euphoria feels like, but nothing has ever given me that feeling that I can recall.

My husband once took one of my ativans because he thought he was having a panic attack. He described the feeling as euphoric. Pissed me off. He gets euphoria. All I get is No Panic attack, if I take it quick enough.
Euphoria is kinda like....Life is good. Life will always be good. Everything is beautiful. Nothing can and will ever bother you or ruin your day. You are a perfect state of mind. Its the best you can ever feel about yourself or the world around you.

Kind of hard to describe in objective terms, but thats an idea.
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Old 10-22-2011, 07:40 AM
obbn obbn is offline
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Originally Posted by Romeo and Whatsherface View Post
That reminds me of another question. Why do certain painkillers cause hallucinations in some people but not in others? When I had agonizing complications after my daughter was born, the doctor gave me Stadol via IV push. A few minutes later, I said, "I think I'm hallucinating," to which he famously replied, "If you think you are, then you are." For about 25 minutes, I saw flower petals growing out of people's heads and--cliched but true--a white rabbit, along with other oddities and auditory hallucinations. They distracted me from the pain but didn't really kill it. A woman I know who said she's been given Stadol on two different occasions said she had no hallucinations.

If I were to be given Stadol again (no thanks), would I in all likelihood have hallucinations again?
Hard to say. I have been given Demerol again and it ended up not working on me. I guess my tolerance over the years ruined that. The hallucinations that I had were due to the length of time I was on the Demerol, so unlikely to be repeated with a one time dosage. You however, seemed to have a reaction to a single dose. I would think that your chances of seeing flower and dancing elephants are quite high. But it's just a WAG.
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Old 10-22-2011, 08:15 AM
Moriarty Moriarty is offline
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Originally Posted by TriPolar View Post
If you're trying to get a buzz, it helps to wash it down with some liquor. If it slows you down, do a little meth or blow. If you start getting edgy, smoke some weed and drop some ecstacy. Have a good night.
I sense snark with this one.

But, from a recreational user standpoint, use of these drugs is often in conjunction with other drugs. In my experience, pills are usually combined with alcohol, as they seem to increase the alcohol's effects. You can get really drunk on just a few beers if you also take a Percy (percocet) or zanny bar (Xanax).
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Old 10-22-2011, 08:27 AM
brainstall brainstall is offline
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I like my opiates and have tried a few of them, mostly in the hospital either before or after some kind of surgery. I remember lying on the operating room table and watching the doctor inject something into my IV. And then I felt really good. Relaxed, happy, no worries about the surgery to follow. So I asked what it was. Demerol.

I had another injury requiring hospitalization and I was given Dilaudid (hydromorphone) for pain. It made me vomit, but a Gravol chaser took care of that. I didn't really need the pain control, but the Dilaudid did help pass the time and help me sleep at night. Hospitals are boring and I really just wanted to go home.

When I've been in pain, opiates have been wonderful, but I also like the dreamy feeling I get and the way they still the unrest in my brain. If I could find someone selling $5 balloons of heroin as mentioned upthread, I'd probably be a junkie in no time.
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