Fringe - Feb 24, 2012 - The End of All Things

[Nobody]

Pretty good episode. I was worried that revealing who the Observers are might be a bad thing if they did it poorly, but scientists from a possible future isn't too bad.

When Olivia started opening up about how Peter would activate her powers I immediately realized that she was talking to the fake Nina and the Nina that Fringe had was the real one.

Also, as Jones was going through the portal I thought Olivia or Peter would shoot the machine, closing the portal, and we'd get Jones getting sliced in half for a second time. Oh well.

I was glad to see the capsules in the preview. And finally, when Jones said that Oliva's powers were greater than she realized, I figured that it will be her power that finally gets Peter home.

[Half Man Half Wit]

A lot of good things, I agree, but that nobody even voiced the suspicion that there might be two Ninas, one from each universe, seemed very implausible, especially after they already considered the shapeshifter option. Are there any grounds on which the Fringe team might believe that there is only one Nina in both universes that I just forgot? Was the other Nina reported dead, or something, perhaps? Because in a world where there's more than one of everything, I can't see how the thought wouldn't immediately cross everybody's mind, especially given that they are steeped in parallel universe conundrums on a regular basis...

And I'm not a great fan of the observer reveal. Certainly, it fits with everything, but it's also probably everybody's first suspicion. I would've liked something with a little more of a surprise element. (Not that I immediately can think of something. But then again, I'm not a show writer...) That said, I think it could've been worse, too.

But why did Astrid wonder about the table falling over? Was this just a throwaway line to setup Lincoln's joke, or is there something more behind it? Perhaps this is an indication of the mode of travel of the observers: they don't appear and disappear instantaneously, they just move very, very fast from our perspective, and one of them accidentally knocked it over...

[Nobody]

Originally Posted by Half Man Half Wit

But why did Astrid wonder about the table falling over? Was this just a throwaway line to setup Lincoln's joke, or is there something more behind it? Perhaps this is an indication of the mode of travel of the observers: they don't appear and disappear instantaneously, they just move very, very fast from our perspective, and one of them accidentally knocked it over...

I wondered about that too.

Then again, come to think of it, the Observer just disappearing shouldn't have knocked over the table, I don't think.

Edit: Oh, and while I wasn't thrilled with the Observer reveal either, it still left a little air of mystery around them. Such as them being from a possible future.

[enalzi]

I honestly was surprised by the Observers being from the future. I always took them as sort of being around since the beginning of time. But I liked the reveal. just like the "First People," having them be from the future definitely feels more "scifi" than being from the past.


Regarding the table being knocked over, it didn't look like the Observer just disappeared. There was a blur like he moved really fast. Was that the first time we've seen an Observer leave? Usually we look away and when we look back he's gone.

[Nobody]

While Peter was in his mind he said that they were coming, so obviously he knew the others found him and were coming for him. So I'm guessing they took him.

Oh, and while I think about it, why do the producers feel the need to jerk us around about Peter and Olivia? Yeah yeah, it's bad to end sexual tension on a show because it can ruin the show, but I'd rather have that then, there together; They're apart. They're back together again. They're apart again. They're back together. Oh, they're broken apart.

Enough already. Sheesh!

[TBG]

I found it odd how quickly Peter's back on the "I'm projecting my memories onto this Olivia" train even though he ruled it out last week after she knew things that Peter didn't about Olivia Prime.

[simster]

The table falling over is important because it shows that this observer was 'taken' vs him just 'leaving'.

Peter is again right for all teh wrong reasons - TBG is spot on.

[Nobody]

Originally Posted by TBG

I found it odd how quickly Peter's back on the "I'm projecting my memories onto this Olivia" train even though he ruled it out last week after she knew things that Peter didn't about Olivia Prime.

Yeah, I found that odd too.

I figured that maybe he realized that the Cortexiphan was causing her mind to link with his Olivia's, so even though she has the genuine memories of Olivia from the old timeline she's still not his Olivia.

[TBG]

Originally Posted by Nobody

Yeah, I found that odd too.

I figured that maybe he realized that the Cortexiphan was causing her mind to link with his Olivia's, so even though she has the genuine memories of Olivia from the old timeline she's still not his Olivia.

Possible, but they should've had him say something to the effect to make it clearer.

[Nobody]

That's just my guess. I don't think any of the characters really know for sure what's going on.

[Nobody]

I found something which changes my opinion about what happened to Peter. Although it's somebody's opinion and not established fact, it's a very educated opinion and so I'll put it in a spoiler tag. Although if you subscribe to this thread and get an E-mail then the spoiler tag won't hide anything . Anyway:

Crave Online

SPOILER:

One notion that "Fringe" has been stubbornly clinging to all season is that the original timeline still exists somewhere else or that Peter can somehow return there and resume his life as it was. I still believe that's a false assertion, and there's some thematic proof of that within the episode itself. At one point, Peter and Walter explained the concept of a palimpsest; which is a medium that is reused or altered while retaining traces of its earlier iterations. That's the perfect metaphor for the fourth season of "Fringe." The original timeline has basically been recorded over by Peter's removal from history, but traces of Olivia's memories are bleeding through. Peter himself is the most prominent reminder of the previous timeline, since by all accounts he shouldn't even exist anymore.

Next, the writer says about Olivia:

SPOILER:

Last week, the question posed was whether the Olivia of this new timeline was a separate and equal counterpart to the Olivia of the original timeline that didn't deserve to lose her own existence to memories that don't belong to her. I propose that both things are true. The Olivia of our timeline is also the Olivia of this new timeline, but the new Olivia is also a distinct individual created by her revised choices who is just as legitimate as the original Olivia. But there can only be one Olivia in this universe, and for now it's a woman with two sets of memories.

I can't argue with that logic.

[TBG]

Originally Posted by Nobody

I found something which changes my opinion about what happened to Peter. Although it's somebody's opinion and not established fact, it's a very educated opinion and so I'll put it in a spoiler tag. Although if you subscribe to this thread and get an E-mail then the spoiler tag won't hide anything . Anyway:

Crave Online

SPOILER:

One notion that "Fringe" has been stubbornly clinging to all season is that the original timeline still exists somewhere else or that Peter can somehow return there and resume his life as it was. I still believe that's a false assertion, and there's some thematic proof of that within the episode itself. At one point, Peter and Walter explained the concept of a palimpsest; which is a medium that is reused or altered while retaining traces of its earlier iterations. That's the perfect metaphor for the fourth season of "Fringe." The original timeline has basically been recorded over by Peter's removal from history, but traces of Olivia's memories are bleeding through. Peter himself is the most prominent reminder of the previous timeline, since by all accounts he shouldn't even exist anymore.

Next, the writer says about Olivia:

SPOILER:

Last week, the question posed was whether the Olivia of this new timeline was a separate and equal counterpart to the Olivia of the original timeline that didn't deserve to lose her own existence to memories that don't belong to her. I propose that both things are true. The Olivia of our timeline is also the Olivia of this new timeline, but the new Olivia is also a distinct individual created by her revised choices who is just as legitimate as the original Olivia. But there can only be one Olivia in this universe, and for now it's a woman with two sets of memories.

I can't argue with that logic.

Yeah, that's basically how I've been personally thinking about the amberverse all along. It's like when Dawn got added to the Buffyverse, it was still the same place it had always been, just altered, and (almost) no one knew.