Cruise ship security

[Gedd]

A recent news article mentioned how terrorists had plans to hijack cruise ships. The one I read didn’t mention how they planned on doing this, but I see two scenarios. The first would be people buying tickets, smuggling weapons onto the ship and then forcing their way onto the bridge. The second would be trying to board the ship at sea which seems to be the preferred method in the Gulf of Aden.

I’ve only been on a cruise ship once, and I don’t recall seeing much in the way of security other than the airport-like screening to get on board the ship. What kind of security do cruise ships have, and what do you think would happen in these scenarios? Do they train for these kinds of things?

[dolphinboy]

I was recently on a two week cruise from LA to Hawaii and back, and while this is not like cruising off the coast of Africa, there were clearly enhanced security procedures, primarily around making sure that only authorized people were able to get on and off the ship. Your ID was checked when you got off the ship and when you tried to get back on... sometimes multiple times. Yes, they still have the airport-like metal detectors when you first get on the ship, but given the long lines they tried to keep everyone moving through that part as quickly as possible.

I assume that they x-ray your baggage before it is loaded onto the ship, but I couldn't tell you whether that really happened or not.

On one of the sea-days a few passengers started talking about a security response should someone try to board the ship while it is at sea. Looking at the ship from the dock I didn't see any easy access to the ship's interior that was not monitored by a human or a security camera.

Whether there are weapons on the bridge or not, no crew members I asked wanted to talk about it. My guess is yes, they have weapons and the on-board 'security' crew members are likely trained on protecting the ship from an assault.

While a large cruise ship may seem like a 'sitting duck', my guess is that they have various lethal and non-lethal methods to protect the ship in the unlikely event of an attack. Keep in mind that they are not slow lumbering ships and many can travel at 20+ knots if they really need to...

[Sarabellum1976]

I remember hearing about one of the modern cruiseliners (maybe one of those owned by Seabourne? Ah, here we are ) repelled an attack by pirates by using some sort of super-powered sound wave machine. (WTF!)


"...and then the sad, bloody-eared pirates slowly sailed away... "

[Gedd]

Originally Posted by Sarabellum1976

I remember hearing about one of the modern cruiseliners (maybe one of those owned by Seabourne? Ah, here we are ) repelled an attack by pirates by using some sort of super-powered sound wave machine. (WTF!)


"...and then the sad, bloody-eared pirates slowly sailed away... "

I bet Blood Ear the Pirate didn't get too much respect after that.

Reading about the Seabourn Spirit it sounds like the pirates didn't have much of a plan. Did they expect her to stop? How many RPGs would it take to sink a 10,000 ton 400ft ship? How do you board a ship that's trying to escape you? Plus she is a small one!

[Dahu]

Similar old thread here.

[Elendil's Heir]

I keep saying it - time to bring back the Q-ships!: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Q-ships

[Sarabellum1976]

I know that many (most?) of the large cruise ships operated by Carnival, Royal Caribbean and the like are equipped with a helipad. Makes you wonder whether the pirates ever considered using a helicopter to get in and out.

Would it be possible to land a helicopter on a cruiseliner doing 20 knots?

(Note to self - send email to Mythbusters...) I'd love to see someone try it.

[suranyi]

I've been on quite a few cruises.

Essentially, your ID is checked whenever you board the ship. (Technically, at each stop after first boarding, your cruise card is swiped and your picture is brought up from the ship's computer.)

Also, at each stop your hand carry-ons are X-rayed and you go through a metal detector when you board. I presume your large baggage is checked at first boarding but I haven't seen that step.

[Omar Little]

Originally Posted by Gedd

A recent news article mentioned how terrorists had plans to hijack cruise ships.

And do what? Sail it into a beach or dock? I guess they could blow it up, but they would probably have an easier time and greater casulties to blow up a filled sporting event.

[Ludovic]

Originally Posted by Elendil's Heir

I keep saying it - time to bring back the Q-ships!: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Q-ships

What they thought was a simple cruise ship was really...a fully operational battle station.

[drachillix]

Originally Posted by ludovic

what they thought was a simple cruise ship was really...a fully operational battle station.

its a trap!!!!!

[TimToyGeek]

I worked for a cruise line for several years, and you may be surprised to know that the security forces on the ships are surprisingly well trained and capable. The particular ships I sailed on had security guards that were all Gurkhas. And yes, they did carry their giant knives, although not too overtly.

In my experience with the ship-board security, they were trained to be quiet, subtle and no-nonsense, and they seldom interacted with passengers except for checking luggage, ID's, etc.

Knowing what we know about Gurkhas, I wouldn't want to be a terrorist attacking a cruise ship guarded by a few dozen of them. The poor terrorists probably would be dead or captured before they made it to the elevators.

Tim

[Voyager]

Originally Posted by suranyi

Also, at each stop your hand carry-ons are X-rayed and you go through a metal detector when you board. I presume your large baggage is checked at first boarding but I haven't seen that step.

Since your luggage is delivered to your room, there is plenty of time to X-ray it. Not doing so would be a minor hole in security, wouldn't it? On airplanes they just have to worry about bombs, on ships since you get your luggage they have to worry about everything.

[Digital is the new Analog]

On the cruise I took for Thanksgiving..they X-Ray'ed my carry-on when I first bored the ship. There was a many-hour delay before our bags were delivered to our cabin..mine was missing.
I had to go to security, where they had confiscated a pair of scissors that I brought for separating individual strips of athletic tape from a roll of...athletic tape.

I signed a receipt for it, and got it back after I got off the ship the next week.

I can't state if they x-ray'ed that bag or not, but they certainly found my "weapon."


-D/a

[Wesley Clark]

They had pretty tight security on who could get on board the ship when I went on a cruise. However I would assume getting weapons on board wouldn't be too hard. You just have 10 or so terrorists get on the boat unarmed, then after the boat has left shore and gone out a few miles you have a boat filled with terrorists and weapons pull alongside the boat and quickly transfer the weapons to the terrorists on board (possibly by the terrorists on board dropping a rope, and having the ones in the boat tie off the weapons to be pulled up). It would only take a couple of minutes and could be done in the middle of the night.

I have no idea what tools they'd have to stop that, but you'd assume you could get weapons on board pretty fast doing that. And it would bypass all the security screening to get on or off the boat.

[Wesley Clark]

Originally Posted by TimToyGeek

I worked for a cruise line for several years, and you may be surprised to know that the security forces on the ships are surprisingly well trained and capable. The particular ships I sailed on had security guards that were all Gurkhas. And yes, they did carry their giant knives, although not too overtly.

In my experience with the ship-board security, they were trained to be quiet, subtle and no-nonsense, and they seldom interacted with passengers except for checking luggage, ID's, etc.

Knowing what we know about Gurkhas, I wouldn't want to be a terrorist attacking a cruise ship guarded by a few dozen of them. The poor terrorists probably would be dead or captured before they made it to the elevators.

Tim

Was this a cruise line in Europe, the US or another part of the world? I wouldn't be surprised if hidden among all the crew (there are something like 600 crewmen for every 1200 passengers, I believe) there are some highly trained security agents folding towels and just being observant.

Cruise ships tend to be full of upper middle class passengers (so people deemed of value to society, and people who could get a nice ransom). Plus the ships themselves are worth a lot. I'd assume they had a lot of security they don't tell people about.

[Elendil's Heir]

Originally Posted by TimToyGeek

...Knowing what we know about Gurkhas, I wouldn't want to be a terrorist attacking a cruise ship guarded by a few dozen of them. The poor terrorists probably would be dead or captured before they made it to the elevators....

I, for one, would pay good money to see a Die Hard-style movie about Gurkhas taking a cruise liner back from a bunch of hijacking terrorists. Woohoo!

Originally Posted by Digital is the new Analog

On the cruise I took for Thanksgiving..they X-Ray'ed my carry-on when I first bored the ship....

I can't state if they x-ray'ed that bag or not, but they certainly found my "weapon."....

A cordless drill, I presume?

[Duckster]

Originally Posted by Omar Little

And do what? Sail it into a beach or dock? I guess they could blow it up, but they would probably have an easier time and greater casulties to blow up a filled sporting event.

The plan would include dressing passengers in orange jump suits, as if they were al Qaeda prisoners at Guantanamo Bay, and then videotaping their execution.

From the OPs linked article.

Remember the MS Achille Lauro?

[Gedd]

Originally Posted by Wesley Clark

They had pretty tight security on who could get on board the ship when I went on a cruise. However I would assume getting weapons on board wouldn't be too hard. You just have 10 or so terrorists get on the boat unarmed, then after the boat has left shore and gone out a few miles you have a boat filled with terrorists and weapons pull alongside the boat and quickly transfer the weapons to the terrorists on board (possibly by the terrorists on board dropping a rope, and having the ones in the boat tie off the weapons to be pulled up). It would only take a couple of minutes and could be done in the middle of the night.

I have no idea what tools they'd have to stop that, but you'd assume you could get weapons on board pretty fast doing that. And it would bypass all the security screening to get on or off the boat.

In one of the recent Titanic threads someone mentioned ships having sensors (or maybe radar?) to prevent collisions with ice, other ships, people, whatever. Anyone know if they were correct? I think a small ship pulling up alongside would certainly be investigated, especially at night.

[ralph124c]

A related question: what happens when a passenger is a victim of a crime, while on board? Suppose a passenger is robbed or assaulted by an employee of the line. Does the captain ( admiralty law) take charge?

[Tom Tildrum]

Wouldn't another route onto the ship be by joining the crew? What kind of background checks are run on cruise employees when hired?

[Gedd]

Originally Posted by Elendil's Heir

I, for one, would pay good money to see a Die Hard-style movie about Gurkhas taking a cruise liner back from a bunch of hijacking terrorists. Woohoo!

The first Call of Duty had a level on the German battleship Tirpitz and Counter Strike had a level about a hostage situation on an airplane, so you get to work on the movie and I'll get to work on the video game spin off!

[AK84]

Originally Posted by ralph124c

A related question: what happens when a passenger is a victim of a crime, while on board? Suppose a passenger is robbed or assaulted by an employee of the line. Does the captain ( admiralty law) take charge?

The law of the country the vessel is flagged is applied and courts of the same have jurisdiction for crimes on board in international waters and home nation has jurisdiction if within territorial waters.

[TimToyGeek]

To answer one of the questions posed above, it was a Princess ship, which like most cruise ships has an international crew including the Gurkha guards. They weren't really incognito, they were the official ships' security guards. Even if you didn't know they were Gurkha, they tended to radiate an air of cool competency. People just tended to behave themselves when the ships' guards were around.

Besides checking luggage, passengers' IDs on and off the ships, etc. they also were in charge of securing all of the properties of the ships, and policing the crew as well. Most ships, in addition to all of the valuables carried by passengers, usually carry a good amount of cash and the stores onboard carry fine jewelry.

There is definitely a call for policing both of unruly passengers (done with a very polite but firm hand) and of the crew (done less politely), and it was usually done by the Purser's staff backed up by the security guards. Most of the bigger ships have both a ship's jail and a ship's morgue in the 'unseen' areas belowdecks.

Tim

[Elendil's Heir]

The FBI on cruise line security, as of 2007: http://www.fbi.gov/news/testimony/cr...e-and-security

A maritime lawyer critical of current cruise line security measures: http://www.cruiselawnews.com/2012/02...e-ship-safety/

RAINN's views, and tips on safety: http://www.rainn.org/public-policy/s...se-ship-safety

[iamthewalrus(:3=]

Seems to me like terrorists would have a big problem with crowd control if they tried to hijack a cruise ship.

Even ignoring the actual security forces, there are thousands of people on cruise ships, and most of them are no longer inclined to go along with terrorists since 9/11. Yes, I realize you can't easily crash a cruise ship into a building, but I can't think of a good reason for terrorists to attack my cruise ship besides making a huge spectacle by killing a bunch of people, so I wouldn't be inclined to cooperate. Even with 100 terrorists, which is an absurdly large number for one attack, are each of them going to be able to control 20+ passengers, including rooting them out from hundreds of tiny rooms and cramped passageways?

[Jake]

Originally Posted by Elendil's Heir

I keep saying it - time to bring back the Q-ships!: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Q-ships

Yea and Verily! Also the Coast Guard should pop a cap in the hull of the smuggler's boat. Just for warning, of course!

[Mean Mr. Mustard]

Originally Posted by Digital is the new Analog

they X-Ray'ed my carry-on when I first bored the ship.

Originally Posted by Elendil's Heir

A cordless drill, I presume?

No, I think he launched into a long-winded re-telling of a dream he had last night.


mmm

[Digital is the new Analog]

Originally Posted by Mean Mr. Mustard

No, I think he launched into a long-winded re-telling of a dream he had last night.


mmm

Hey! My dreams are interesting!
I'm going with the drill thing.

-D/a