Is it o.k. for Panera to be out of Bread Bowls?

[bienville]

For those of you not familiar with Panera, here is a link to their website. Of course, if you're not familiar with it then you probably don't have a strong opinion to share.


I went to Panera today and ordered a bread bowl. As I put my order in, the food prep person called out to the order taker person that my order took the last bread bowl. No more bread bowls. Boy, did I breathe a sigh of relief. I would have been really sad not to get my bread bowl.

This did happen to me once before. Panera was out of bread bowls. I ordered soup in a non-edible bowl and got some bread on the side but it was a wholly disappointing experience.

I am sure there are people who consider themselves avid fans of Panera and yet have never ordered a bread bowl. There are lots of choices on the menu and if bread bowls just aren't your thing, they could be out of bread bowls and you'd never notice.

For me, the bread bowl is the reason I go to Panera. I get in my car and think to myself "Oh boy! I'm going to get tomato soup in a bread bowl!" So, for me, for Panera to be out of bread bowls is analogous to McDonalds being out of burgers.



What do the rest of you think? Panera being out of bread bowls:
Like McDonalds being out of burgers?
More like Subway being out of avocados?
Somewhere in between?

[Little Nemo]

I went to a Kenny Rodger's one time and was told they had run out of chicken.

I asked the counter guy why they were open if they didn't have chicken. He said they still had side orders.

Yes, I'm sure a lot of people went to Kenny Rodger's to get a plate of rice.

[WOOKINPANUB]

I feel your pain. I personally am not a fan of the bread bowl, but that is one of their specialties and yes, it is comparible to say, Olive Garden running out of bread sticks. I've personally been pissed off more than once when there was no black bean soup left at 2:00 in the afternoon. I would let management know.Not in a "by God, someone must pay" sort of way, but it seems there's been a breakdown in the system when one of the main products is unavailable.

[zoid]

It's happened to me before. I wouldn't have minded so much but I was with my daughter and it was one of the few chances we get to spend time together and she really, really wanted a bread bowl. It was like 5:00 on a Saturday. Seriously, just make a few extra

[urban1a]

I am a fan of KFC crispy chicken, not the original stuff. Very often, however, I go to a KFC (3 sort of close to me) around noon and they are out of the crispy. I'm not sure whether it's management or the staff, but you'd think that they would have plenty of all kinds of chicken at lunch time. Usually, I'll just drive off.

Bob

[voltaire]

Just like Popeye's being out of spicy chicken - regular isn't even worth it anymore. It's such a letdown!

And sometimes, you can tell they're running low on red beans when your red beans & rice is like 90% rice. Bastards!

LOL, first-world problems!

[Meeko]

Originally Posted by Little Nemo

I went to a Kenny Rodger's one time and was told they had run out of chicken.

I asked the counter guy why they were open if they didn't have chicken. He said they still had side orders.

Yes, I'm sure a lot of people went to Kenny Rodger's to get a plate of rice.

We tried to order a pizza once. We wanted the pizza promotion of the month at Dominos or Pizza Hut.... you know the near dead horse that Pizza Hut likes to bring out from their stable in forced rotation....

The phone picks up, and the employee reads his script, pitching the promoted pizza that we wanted.

They were sold out.

Us : "Then why did you offer it to us?"

Them : "It's on the paper we have to read."

[Sudden Kestrel]

Sort of related to the OP: Years ago when Caller ID was still worth something we started receiving calls at 5 a.m. from a Panera bread store. Most of the time they'd hang up without saying anything, but sometimes they'd start telling us what their morning order was. We let them know each time that they had the wrong number, and then we called their manager and let him know they had the wrong number, but they continued to call. Finally we started accepting their orders (6 dozen of this roll, 4 dozen of that pastry), then hung up and went to bed. It didn't take them long to stop calling after that.

For me, Arby's being out of potato cakes is unthinkable, and they're always out of potato cakes at lunchtime. I can make a roast beef sandwich at home, but I don't want to haul out the deep fryer for just a couple of tri-taters.

[Saint Cad]

Ther is an El Pollo Chicken in Lakewood, CA that had been out of chicken more times than it has had chicken when we've been in there.

[blondebear]

There was a Mexican place right around the corner that had tamales on the menu,and I love tamales. But they never seemed to have tamales when I ordered them. I stopped going because of that. When I want a tamale I accept no substitutes!

[dnooman]

I'm not sure what their waste policies are, but they're only going to make as many as they think they can sell while still being able to serve them fresh, otherwise it's money down the drain. It's not like you can make a bread bowl while someone is waiting in line either.

Ages ago I was a manager at an Arby's. Know why it's called Arby's? R.B. stands for roast beef, or so the lore goes. Anywho, one day we had a couple of busses come in right after the lunch rush, it was a perfect storm really. Those roasts take HOURS too cook, and yes they are made from frozen then thawed loaves of beef. Even when you try to speed the process up by halving a loaf and/or raising the temp, sometimes you just get caught with your pants down. The fact that my pants were down did not enter into the equation on this day though.

The drive through soon filled with people incredulously crowing "Yer outta WHUTTT? This is tha dang Arbeeeees!" I offered our turkey sandwiches, chicken sandwiches and fingers, Italian sub, appetizers, turnovers, and a squirt of Horsey sauce to the face, but most people had their hearts set on (and planned on damaging them with) beef.

By the time our emergency beef (band name!) was done, we were hitting a slow spot and all of our planning was out the window. We ended up with much more beef left over at night than we usually have, they don't really re-use the beef the next day, maybe a small amount for the "you've been open two minutes give me four Big Montanas" kind of people.

Guess who's little brother and his stoned little buddies got roast-beef-the-fuck-out that night?

[zoid]

Originally Posted by dnooman

I'm not sure what their waste policies are, but they're only going to make as many as they think they can sell while still being able to serve them fresh, otherwise it's money down the drain. It's not like you can make a bread bowl while someone is waiting in line either.

But bread bowls can't cost more than a few pennies. I agree that roasting a huge hunk of beef is an investment, but really a dozen extra bread bowls can't cost more than $2.50, $3.50 tops. Having them on hand is probably worth the good will alone.

[Inner Stickler]

It's not.

[dnooman]

Originally Posted by Sudden Kestrel

For me, Arby's being out of potato cakes is unthinkable, and they're always out of potato cakes at lunchtime. I can make a roast beef sandwich at home, but I don't want to haul out the deep fryer for just a couple of tri-taters.

I missed this while posting. During the breakfast hours they almost can't stock enough of them, seems some people equate them with hash browns. If they did give you some at lunch, chances are they had been there waiting for you for quite a while. It really only takes 3 mins IIRC to cook them, 5 at the max. They could tell you to pull up and then cook some so hot they would fuse your molars as you ate them. We had guys that demanded fresh chicken strips every time they came in, so we just dropped two orders when they walked in, they were fine with waiting the 5 mins or so.

Favorite Arby's hack of mine: Chicken Parmesan. I was getting damn tired of the food there so I made a few changes and came up with what I thought was a winner.

Order a fried chicken sandwich with nothing but Swiss. They might have provolone now, but I chose Swiss as it was on the chicken Swiss sammie. That's chicken, and cheese only on a bun.
Then get a packet of the marinara they serve with the mozzarella sticks (which are as insanely bad for you as you might think, but are pretty good for fast food).

Open sammie, put on marinara, close sammie, and eat that mutha. Upon tasting this deliciousness, you must remember that some random dude on the internet provided you with this knowledge, and you must grin because you have now defeated "the man".

Ages ago, like late 80's, Wendy's used to have a recurring Chicken Parmesan sandwich which was just their fried chicken with marinara and maybe mozzarella. Since I last had it, I moved down the damn street from their national headquarters, and have been in numerous tasting sessions for new food and current menu item tweaks (paid of course ). I have also appointed myself as a crusader for getting this back on the menu. This is 100% true.

Well maybe not a "crusader", more like the guy who always whines about the Chicken Parm when we do taste tests. I do this at their research lab unashamedly.

Were we talking a bout Panera? I'm sorry for the hijack and my over-use of the word sammie which I understand may induce rage in some people.

[Pai325]

I like Panera, but to be out of bread bowls would just make me think they were popular that day. It's not like KFC being out of chicken; that's what they serve. Panera has all kinds of sandwiches and salads, as well as pastries. It's just one item that they're out of. I can see being disappointed, but not upset. I guess I would liken it to your example of Subway and avocado.

[dnooman]

Originally Posted by zoid

But bread bowls can't cost more than a few pennies. I agree that roasting a huge hunk of beef is an investment, but really a dozen extra bread bowls can't cost more than $2.50, $3.50 tops. Having them on hand is probably worth the good will alone.

Keep in mind you're talking about an industry that has to control things as small as the amount of black olives on a subway sub, making sure to give two, one or ZERO napkins to each customer (Jimmy John's I'm looking at you...).

The food cost, labor cost, and electricity involved in making a bread bowl may not seem like much, but look at it this way. Let's say they do cost $3 all costs accounted for, which may be a bit high I think. How long would it take to make up for that loss in pure profit? Depending on what people are ordering and their associated margins, it could take 2 orders or 7 if they're ordering cheap stuff. Every person involved in those 2-7 orders is doing extra work to make up for the loss. Same with the guy that made the extra loaves, he could have been baking the higher profit pastries that sold out early that day.There are infinite combinations that can happen in a day, but overall sales records, P&L, waste tracking etc. all pretty much dictate what a store has to do in order to be as profitable as the chain would like. Yes there are a few cases where they run out, but they'd ofter rather run out than throw away, even if it goes to the homeless. That whole thing is a topic for another thread though.

[dnooman]

Originally Posted by Pai325

I like Panera, but to be out of bread bowls would just make me think they were popular that day. It's not like KFC being out of chicken; that's what they serve. Panera has all kinds of sandwiches and salads, as well as pastries. It's just one item that they're out of. I can see being disappointed, but not upset. I guess I would liken it to your example of Subway and avocado.

KFC can and has run out of chicken before, but it usually takes a certain level of celebrity endorsement to achieve that.

That said, they are ALWAYS out of the original recipe wings when I want one. Their spicy wings are like the damn fruit from the tree in Eden, but if I'm gonna get some awful disease, I'm gonna choose which flavor does it.

[The Hamster King]

Years ago Subway only had two bread options -- white or wheat.

My wife and I once had the following exchange with the woman behind the counter in a small Subway in North Carolina:

Subway drone: "White or wheat?"

Me: "White."

Subway drone: "We're all out."

Me: "Wheat then."

Subway drone: "There's only one left and it's not any good."

She points at a single sad, mangled loaf of wheat bread.

My wife: "This isn't much of a cheese shop."

Me: "Well, it is very clean."

[runner pat]

dnooman, I worked at an Arby's in the days when the potato cakes were baked.

And I remember pushing roasts.

And the name is derived from the founders-Forrest and Leroy Raffel, the Raffel Brothers

[Mr Downtown]

I was once in a famous Chicago pizzeria that reported it was out of house wine.

[dnooman]

Originally Posted by runner pat

And the name is derived from the founders-Forrest and Leroy Raffel, the Raffel Brothers

I reject your reality and substitute it with my own.

Next you'll be telling me that neither Popeye nor a Church developed delicious chicken recipes.

Let's both just set our pistols down reeeeall slow like.

[runner pat]

Now that you're disarmed.

History of Arby's

When foodservice veterans Leroy and Forrest Raffel opened the first Arby's in Boardman, Ohio on July 23, 1964, customers enjoyed roast beef sandwiches, potato chips, and Texas-sized iced teas. To name their new venture, the brothers decided on Arby's, which stands for R.B., the initials of the Raffel Brothers - although many suspect the R.B. stands for roast beef.

[Inner Stickler]

Runner Pat probably just saw the same training video that I did. Let's at least all agree that microwaving the turkey for turkey reubens smelled awful.

Inner Stickler (whose hands are still insensitive to temperature because of the roast beef.)

[runner pat]

Originally Posted by Inner Stickler

Runner Pat probably just saw the same training video that I did. Let's at least all agree that microwaving the turkey for turkey reubens smelled awful.

Inner Stickler (whose hands are still insensitive to temperature because of the roast beef.)

They didn't have videos in those days, just paintings on the rock walls. No microwaves either. Just a little steam drawer for the ham 'n' cheese.

[Sudden Kestrel]

Originally Posted by dnooman

I missed this while posting. During the breakfast hours they almost can't stock enough of them, seems some people equate them with hash browns. If they did give you some at lunch, chances are they had been there waiting for you for quite a while.

I worked at Arby's back in the '70s when they weren't even open before lunchtime. Potato cakes were their answer to french fries at the burger joints, not some sort of breakfast dish. I think so many people order curly fries now (yuck) that they don't make enough tri-taters for traditionalists like me.

[SnakesCatLady]

No, they've now gone on to the tater cakes with bacon and cheese. I am an addict and no 12-step program can help me.

[Lynn Bodoni]

For a while, Arby's ran a commercial which had the jingle "America's Roast Beef, Yes Sir!"

[Antigen]

Originally Posted by Pai325

I like Panera, but to be out of bread bowls would just make me think they were popular that day. It's not like KFC being out of chicken; that's what they serve. Panera has all kinds of sandwiches and salads, as well as pastries. It's just one item that they're out of. I can see being disappointed, but not upset. I guess I would liken it to your example of Subway and avocado.

I wouldn't think anything of it either. They must have had more bread-bowl orders than usual.

I have to say, I hate seeing people finish their bread-bowl soup and just throw out the whole hollowed-out bread. Why did you get a bowl made of bread just to throw it out? You can eat it, that's the point.

[Sudden Kestrel]

Originally Posted by SnakesCatLady

No, they've now gone on to the tater cakes with bacon and cheese. I am an addict and no 12-step program can help me.

Oh, that is truly evil. I must find some.

[FairyChatMom]

Originally Posted by Antigen

I have to say, I hate seeing people finish their bread-bowl soup and just throw out the whole hollowed-out bread. Why did you get a bowl made of bread just to throw it out? You can eat it, that's the point.

Sometimes you just can't eat any more, and I'm thinking a soggy bread bowl isn't a good candidate for a doggy bag.

[PunditLisa]

Years ago, we went to a KFC's on the 4th of July and they were out of chicken. The hapless manager put a scribbled sign on the front door, but no one read it. so he had to endure their wrath. Boy, can people get angry over chicken. I'm surprised he wasn't tarred-and-feathered.

[Shoeless]

Driving across Missouri sometime last year, my wife and I stopped at a combination KFC/Taco Bell for lunch. At home when we get KFC we get the grilled chicken, so that's what we ordered. Counter dude tells us they don't have the grilled chicken (I didn't realize it wasn't available everywhere) so we order regular. We sit down and wait for our order... and wait, and wait, and wait. People who came in five minutes after we did are getting their food, and we're still sitting there. Meanwhile the kid who took our order has mysteriously disappeared. After ten minutes I went up to the counter to see what was going. There was nobody up front so I had to flag down someone from the kitchen to ask about our order. "The chicken's still cooking. It's going to be about ten more minutes," she tells me. WTF? Why didn't they tell us when we ordered that they were out of chicken? I would have ordered Taco Bell! So it took 20 minutes to get our lunch, but they did give us free drinks.

[Ludovic]

Originally Posted by Sudden Kestrel

For me, Arby's being out of potato cakes is unthinkable, and they're always out of potato cakes at lunchtime.

Originally Posted by dnooman

The drive through soon filled with people incredulously crowing "Yer outta WHUTTT? This is tha dang Arbeeeees!"

'round here, they make potato cakes fresh because so few people order them, which means you have to pull around and wait for your order if you go through the drive thru.

So the last time I went to this particular Arby's, I was feeling in a hurry so I only ordered the roast beef sandwich. And they had me pull around to wait anyway. Like I said, it was the LAST time I went to that Arby's.

[stegon66]

Restaurants can run out of things for various reasons. An unexpected increase in buisness, simple oversight on the part of whoever does inventory/ordering on either end, vendors being out of stock on certain items, etc. They usually don't run out of things just to piss you off....

[obfusciatrist]

When it comes to KFC is say I have about a 20% rate of having to wait for them to cook some portion of the order. They always offer free stuff while I wait but if I wanted that I'd have ordered it in the first place.

The winner for me is the time we stopped at a Taco Bell in Oakland (Grand and Telegraph) an they were out of both rice and tortillas.

[hogarth]

Originally Posted by stegon66

Restaurants can run out of things for various reasons. An unexpected increase in buisness, simple oversight on the part of whoever does inventory/ordering on either end, vendors being out of stock on certain items, etc. They usually don't run out of things just to piss you off....

Agreed. To be out of bread bowls on a rare occasion where there's a very rare spike in demand is to be expected. For a restaurant to be out of an item on a daily basis is just poor planning.

[El_Kabong]

Originally Posted by PunditLisa

Years ago, we went to a KFC's on the 4th of July and they were out of chicken. The hapless manager put a scribbled sign on the front door, but no one read it. so he had to endure their wrath. Boy, can people get angry over chicken. I'm surprised he wasn't tarred-and-feathered.

Well, tarred, maybe. After all, you just said they were out of chicken.

[Cheesesteak]

How about a Starbucks without coffee? Well, to be fair, they were only out of decaf, it was late, and they weren't going to brew a new pot. Had to go next door to McDonalds.

[obfusciatrist]

Does Panera make the bread on site? They will, after all, then have a limit to how much they can make, regardless of how high the demand is.

[sachertorte]

Originally Posted by Cheesesteak

How about a Starbucks without coffee? Well, to be fair, they were only out of decaf, it was late, and they weren't going to brew a new pot. Had to go next door to McDonalds.

How strange. Pretty much every coffee place that doesn't have decaf or runs out offers a decaf americano as a substitute. I would think Starbucks of all places would be aware of this practice.

[Vihaga]

I've noticed this to be a particular problem with our Panera. It's not just bread bowls; they are out of some damned thing almost half the time we go there. (Why do we still go there then? Because they have relatively fast options that are less deadly than average.) It's annoying, but if it doesn't stop us from going there, it probably doesn't stop anyone else either. If they can waste less money on extra food without losing customers, they have no real reason to change.

[Fenris]

If it happens once in a while...well, shit happens.

However, I stopped going to Popeyes because the only one even close to nearby where I live was always--like 8 consecutive times in a row--out of
A) Spicy chicken
B) regular chicken

"But we have chicken strips/nuggets/tenders/whatever they're called"
"I don't like those. When will you have chicken--is it cooking now?"
"We're not allowed to make any more."
"It's 5:30 pm. You're open 'till 10:00 pm. Really? You're out until then?"
"Most people don't like chicken with bones"

I gave up at that point. Also, while I'm all for hiring the handicapped, Popeyes seems to go overboard with that policy--and really, should they always be behind the register?

(I love Popeyes, but man--never having chicken and always getting something wrong in an order--they're making it hard for me to have them as my guilty pleasure.)

[Joey P]

Originally Posted by zoid

But bread bowls can't cost more than a few pennies. I agree that roasting a huge hunk of beef is an investment, but really a dozen extra bread bowls can't cost more than $2.50, $3.50 tops. Having them on hand is probably worth the good will alone.

I just checked my Sysco order guide. The have a few options for bread bowls, but they all cost about a dollar. Let's say they cost Panera 50¢ each all said and done, if they throw away three each day, that's over $1600 a year in the garbage. That's an extra $1600 that the customers have to come up with via higher prices.

Also, a good rule of thumb when you want to know how much a restaurant pays for something is to take what they charge you and divide it by three. (The standard restaurant profit margin is 70%). Can you walk into a Panera and buy just a bread bowl (empty)? What do they charge for it?

[Enderw24]

I went to a hamburger restaurant one time that was out of buns. Out of buns! They offered to put it on some white bread that they use for grilled cheese. I grudgingly accepted and it was as bad as I expected it to be.

And you ever notice that McDonald's shake machines always break down an hour before they close? It's weird, really. Suddenly every shake machine in the McDonald's universe is broken right before closing time. I assume it just needs a good night's sleep because it's working just fine the next morning.

[Vinyl Turnip]

Originally Posted by Vihaga

I've noticed this to be a particular problem with our Panera. It's not just bread bowls; they are out of some damned thing almost half the time we go there.

I haven't been to Panera in a while but I recall being annoyed when on three consecutive visits, at least one of which was still early in the day (lunchtime), they were already out of bread bowls for the rest of the day. I asked them honestly if it was ever actually possible to buy soup in a bread bowl, or if it was just a legend.

Maybe you have better odds if you show up at 7 a.m. for a breakfast of chicken noodle soup. I gave up trying.

[Labdad]

Some years ago I went into my regular Mexican restaurant and ordered a house margarita, only to be told they were out of house margarita. OK, fine, give me a top-shelf margarita for the price of house.

NO! If you want a margarita you'll have to get the $7.00 one instead of the $5.00 one.

How the hell do you run out of house margaita???

[Speak to me Maddie!]

I think it's just Panera's SOP to run out of stuff. The local one runs out of bagels all the time, and that's their bread and butter. They always run out of "souffles" before 9 am too. I've pretty much stopped going there since I can be reasonably sure they won't have what I want.

I can understand the concept of saving through waste reduction, and I know it can be near impossible to plan perfectly at a place like PB, but I'd also think if you ran out of bagels before 9 am, and had to turn away customers every single damned day, you'd maybe, just maybe bake a few extras each day until you reach that sweet spot. Maybe they only have the capacity to make so many.

There is a popular greasy burger place in my hometown. Often I would order the open faced chili burger, only to be told they didn't have chili. This happened at least 20 times. One day I told the manager he should just take it off the menu if he didn't want to make or buy chili. And he did! He put white tape up over the lettering while I watched. Funny.

[Labdad]

Some years ago I went into my regular Mexican restaurant and ordered a house margarita, only to be told they were out of house margarita. OK, fine, give me a top-shelf margarita for the price of house.

NO! If you want a margarita you'll have to get the $7.00 one instead of the $5.00 one.

How the hell do you run out of house margarita???

[smithsb]

Originally Posted by Labdad

Some years ago I went into my regular Mexican restaurant and ordered a house margarita, only to be told they were out of house margarita. OK, fine, give me a top-shelf margarita for the price of house.

NO! If you want a margarita you'll have to get the $7.00 one instead of the $5.00 one.

How the hell do you run out of house margaita???

They've been filling the top shelf bottles from the rotgut booze and accidentally ran out of the cheap stuff.

[Kimballkid]

Originally Posted by Enderw24

And you ever notice that McDonald's shake machines always break down an hour before they close? It's weird, really. Suddenly every shake machine in the McDonald's universe is broken right before closing time. I assume it just needs a good night's sleep because it's working just fine the next morning.

Maybe they meant they 'broke them down' to clean them.