Songs With Factual Inaccuracies

[Bakhesh]

Pink Floyd - "We don't need no education"

It's "We don't need ANY education", and clearly, you do

[DrDeth]

Originally Posted by Bakhesh

Pink Floyd - "We don't need no education"

It's "We don't need ANY education", and clearly, you do

The whole "double negative = a positive" is not actually part of English grammar. No one, after hearing that line, misunderstands what is being said.

[Ponch8]

In Eminem's "Stan," he alludes to the story of Phil Collins' "In the Air Tonight."

You know this song by Phil Collins
"In the Air Tonight'
About that guy who could have saved
That other guy from drowning?
But didn't, and Phil saw it all
Then at his show he found him?

It's a well-known story, but it isn't true.

[Small Hen]

Originally Posted by Ponch8

In Eminem's "Stan," he alludes to the story of Phil Collins' "In the Air Tonight."

You know this song by Phil Collins
"In the Air Tonight'
About that guy who could have saved
That other guy from drowning?
But didn't, and Phil saw it all
Then at his show he found him?

It's a well-known story, but it isn't true.

It doesn't matter if it's true, it only matters if Stan thinks it's true.

[Siam Sam]

Originally Posted by MikeF

Snoopy vs the Red Baron - The Royal Guardsmen - Snoopy didn't shoot down the Red Baron. He wasn't even there.

I'd be careful about making such wild claims. You could set sued by a World Famous Attorney.

[Voyager]

Originally Posted by MikeF

Snoopy vs the Red Baron - The Royal Guardsmen - Snoopy didn't shoot down the Red Baron. He wasn't even there.

Where in that song did you hear that Snoopy shot down the Red Baron. IIRC the verse goes

"but the Baron shot him down
Curses foiled again. "

Anyhow you forgot to mention that doghouses don't fly.

[bup]

Final verse:

Originally Posted by Royal Guardsmen

That Bloody Red Baron was in a fix
He'd tried everything, but he'd run out of tricks
Snoopy fired once, and he fired twice
And that Bloody Red Baron went spinning out of sight

Also, dogs can't talk.

[tim-n-va]

Originally Posted by AaronX

But they say wall, not walls

I thought it was "we built a wall" I'm sure there was at least one wall before a pyramid.

[Alley Dweller]

Originally Posted by DrDeth

The whole "double negative = a positive" is not actually part of English grammar. No one, after hearing that line, misunderstands what is being said.

So, if a double negative is not a positive then the sentence "No one, after hearing that line, misunderstands what is being said" means the same as "No one, after hearing that line, understands what is being said"? We can just disregard the second and subsequent negatives in a sentence without changing its meaning?

[Martian Bigfoot]

Originally Posted by Alley Dweller

So, if a double negative is not a positive then the sentence "No one, after hearing that line, misunderstands what is being said" means the same as "No one, after hearing that line, understands what is being said"? We can just disregard the second and subsequent negatives in a sentence without changing its meaning?

Obviously, not every instance of multiple negatives in the same sentence intensify the negation. It only works in certain cases, in sentences that are constructed in very specific ways, and it does so very consistently. Which is to say that double negation (negative concord) follows rules, i.e., it's part of English grammar. Portugese, Spanish and French all have it too. German doesn't and Latin didn't, but Old English and Middle English both did, and the notion that modern English doesn't and using it is wrong, dammit, is a purely imaginary one.

(Edit: Think about it: Isn't it strange that a usage that is supposed to be "wrong" seems to show up repeatedly in just about every bleedin' so-called non-standard dialect of English as soon as you step away from the "standard", as well as in lots of people's everyday speech as soon as the Language Police isn't looking?)

[Lamia]

Originally Posted by Martian Bigfoot

Obviously, not every instance of multiple negatives in the same sentence intensify the negation. It only works in certain cases, in sentences that are constructed in very specific ways, and it does so very consistently. Which is to say that double negation (negative concord) follows rules, i.e., it's part of English grammar. Portugese, Spanish and French all have it too. German doesn't and Latin didn't, but Old English and Middle English both did, and the notion that modern English doesn't and using it is wrong, dammit, is a purely imaginary one.

(Edit: Think about it: Isn't it strange that a usage that is supposed to be "wrong" seems to show up repeatedly in just about every bleedin' so-called non-standard dialect of English as soon as you step away from the "standard", as well as in lots of people's everyday speech as soon as the Language Police isn't looking?)

While I agree with the above, it is also true that using a double negative as an intensifier is going to sound uneducated to a lot of people, and that saying things like "We don't need no education" may cause them to think that one does in fact need more education. Schools are generally expected to teach children how to write/speak a standard dialect.

However, I think this choice of phrasing was a deliberate rejection of "proper" English on Roger Waters' part. The point of "Another Brick in the Wall Part II" isn't that the kids "don't need no education" because they already know everything, but rather that the education system is unnecessarily controlling and brutal. While "don't need no" may not be standard English, that doesn't mean it's appropriate for a teacher to beat or mock a student for using double negatives or that it's wrong to use double negatives in informal speech/writing. So I'm coming down on the side of "We don't need no education" being somewhat ironic but not factually inaccurate.

[Slow Moving Vehicle]

Originally Posted by Smapti

Detroit is located on the north side of the strait that connects Lake Erie to Lake Superior and forms the border between the US and Canada. If you go south from downtown Detroit, you'll end up in Windsor, Ontario.

Thus the classic bar-bet question "If you're standing in downtown Detroit, and start walking due south, what's the first foreign country you reach? Of course, I'd bet that you're more likely to reach the undiscovered country, first.

Originally Posted by lost4life

Steve Perry finally weighs in on this troublesome topic.

Steve Perry
I ran the phonetics of east, west, and north, but nothing sounded as good or emotionally true to me as South Detroit, he says. The syntax just sounded right. I fell in love with the line. It’s only been in the last few years that I’ve learned that there is no South Detroit. But it doesn’t matter.

And he's absolutely correct.

[DrDeth]

Originally Posted by Ximenean

You're making me labour this point more than I wanted -- I am not suggesting that Jack White needs to rewrite the lyrics of Seven Nation Army or anything -- but the crowns of England and Scotland were merged in the Act of Union in 1707. Since then there have been kings and queens of the United Kingdom, but not of England or Scotland per se. There is no political entity "England" for her to be queen of. No English government, no England-only jurisdiction.

I don't want to give the impression that this is something British people actually get upset about. It's just a little factual nitpick. This thread is full of them.

England is a nation that makes up per of the UK, thus England still exists, and ERII is Queen of that area, and in fact the entire island. Like I said, she's also Queen of London. Or Shropshire.

True, she does not style herself Queen of Shropshire since that is included in England which is included in the UK.

[Trans Fat Og]

Originally Posted by Voyager

...Anyhow you forgot to mention that doghouses don't fly.

I beg to differ. You certainly can fly a doghouse... after you've quaffed enough root beers!

[Typo Negative]

Originally Posted by buddha_david

Tom Petty:
It's a long day, living in Reseda
There's a freeway runnin' through the yard

There is no freeway in Reseda.

To be fair, the 405 Freeway runs along the eastern border of Reseda

http://maps.google.com/maps?q=zent&o...en&sa=N&tab=wl

[hermann]

No East Side in Chicago? Funny, my sister's address is something something East Chestnut.

[j666]

I have to join in the quibbles.

The Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald is a ballad; ballads are never inaccurate. They are romantic legends.

In The Night the Lights Went out in Georgia, just because the guy fired his gun to flag down the Staties doesn't mean they would be the first ones to show up. Nothing else went right for the poor guy that night.

(I have always wondered why a recently married man would have stopped for a beer after being gone for two weeks; if I'd been his 'young bride', I would have been checking out Seth Ames, too.)

[BigT]

Originally Posted by Martian Bigfoot

(Edit: Think about it: Isn't it strange that a usage that is supposed to be "wrong" seems to show up repeatedly in just about every bleedin' so-called non-standard dialect of English as soon as you step away from the "standard", as well as in lots of people's everyday speech as soon as the Language Police isn't looking?)

No, because the entire concept of "proper grammar" is that is that it's how you speak in formal English. The fact that people often do it differently in another style has jack all to do with it. This isn't one of those constructions that was accepted in formal English until someone made up a rule that it shouldn't. It's always been considered wrong because it's confusing, and formal English is, among other things, about removing ambiguities like that.

[terentii]

In the Monty Python "Universe/Galaxy Song," it says our planet is revolving at 900 mph. The Earth rotates on its axis at roughly 900 mph (more like 1,000 mph); it revolves around the Sun at 66,000 mph.

[california jobcase]

The song Lowlife by Theory Of a Dead Man has the line "I've got an '82 Fiero with a car seat in the middle broken down on the interstate". Not possible- Fieros were built '84-'88.

In Ridin' the Storm Out by REO Speedwagon, how can the singer see the full moon crossing the range when he's riding out a storm?

[Irishman]

He says he's waiting for the thaw out, so it seems that the snow has fallen and now they're snowed in, riding out the storm's effects. On a full moon night, watching the moon go by, because they are snowed in.

[Boulter's Canary]

A somewhat geeky one:

1952 Vincent Black Lightning: "He reached for her hand and slipped her the keys."

The Vincent Black Lightning didn't have keys. It kick started.

[JKellyMap]

Originally Posted by hermann

No East Side in Chicago? Funny, my sister's address is something something East Chestnut.

Addresses east of State Street are named thus. Doesn't mean there's any neighborhood or other entity known as "East Side".

[JKellyMap]

Has anyone yet mentioned how Stephen Foster changed "Suwanee River" to "Swanee River" because it fit the song's meter?

[Boyo Jim]

There's East Chicago (Indiana).

[Krokodil]

Starship did not, in fact, build that city on Rock and Roll. It was built on gold mining a good 130+ years earlier.

[Krokodil]

Actually, San Francisco was founded in 1776 by Spanish colonists maintaining a fort and a mission, but it only had around a thousand people in it until the Gold Rush; that's when it really took off. Starship/Jefferson Airplane got into the game pretty late, IMHO.

[kayaker]

Originally Posted by JKellyMap

Has anyone yet mentioned how Stephen Foster changed "Suwanee River" to "Swanee River" because it fit the song's meter?

The first time I saw the river in person, I thought he sign was misspelled!

[sahirrnee]

Emotional Rescue Rolling Stones

"I will be your knight in shining armour
Riding across the desert on a fine Arab charger"

I doubt an Arabian horse could carry a knight in armor, and if it could it wouldn't be charging. I don't know how long someone would last wearing armor in the desert before they dropped over from heatstroke.

[Biffy the Elephant Shrew]

Originally Posted by sahirrnee

I don't know how long someone would last wearing armor in the desert before they dropped over from heatstroke.

Only if the sun is out. Jagger clearly points out that he's going to come to you so silent in the night.

[Seanette]

Originally Posted by Biffy the Elephant Shrew

Only if the sun is out. Jagger clearly points out that he's going to come to you so silent in the night.

Silent, in armor?

[Biffy the Elephant Shrew]

Originally Posted by Seanette

Silent, in armor?

From the sound of it, Mick was pretty well oiled while singing that.

[Cumbrian]

In Prove It All Night, Bruce Springsteen claims that "we'll drive that dusty road from Monroe to Angeline". I read on another forum I frequent that, whilst there are a number of places called Monroe, there aren't any called Angeline. It's not like he's driving to a woman called Angeline either - in the next line he explains he's in the car with his girl to buy her a gold ring and a blue dress.

[Biffy the Elephant Shrew]

Originally Posted by Cumbrian

I read on another forum I frequent that, whilst there are a number of places called Monroe, there aren't any called Angeline.

Texas has both a Monroe and an Angelina. "Angeline" could be taken as a poetic contraction, along the lines of songs that refer to states called "Caroline" or "Alabam."

[Siam Sam]

Oops! nm.

[Oly]

This one has always bothered me:

You've been as constant as the Northern Star
The brightest light that shines

Sorry, Mr Rafferty, but the Northern Star is pretty wimpy, brightness-wise. (Critique notwithstanding the prospect that the songwriter may, in fact, have proffered the smilie sarcastically. If so, strong work.)

[Mosier]

Originally Posted by "Against the Grain" by Garth Brooks

But sometimes you just can't be afraid to wear a different hat
If Columbus had complied
Then this old world might still be flat

Nope. Sorry Garth, but your grade school teachers lied to you.

[Trans Fat Og]

Originally Posted by Oly

This one has always bothered me:

You've been as constant as the Northern Star
The brightest light that shines

This.
(I put off contributing it as an example a bit too long.)

Originally Posted by Oly

(Critique notwithstanding the prospect that the songwriter may, in fact, have proffered the smilie sarcastically. If so, strong work.)

I don't think so at all. There is nothing about the song as a whole that suggests any sarcastic intent, for one thing. It strikes me as a very straightforward ballad of ultimate loving devotion.

In the immediate context, (while I could nitpick about Polaris being "constant" as marking celestial north for earth) it is essentially true considering the length of a human lifetime. If Rafferty were to be sarcastic about Polaris' apparent visual magnitude ("brightness") being overrated, he would presumably also be referring to the technical nitpick one could make about the precession of the equinoxes, or perhaps the fact that Polaris isn't exactly at the celestial north pole during this relative eye-wink of time that we live in. That, I am sure, is giving him far too much credit for knowledge and cleverness in sneaky sarcasm.

Besides, as you probably know, this is a fairly common misconception about Polaris. I mean, among people who take at least a passing interest in the stars. (I'm afraid that lately, with declining education and intellectual interest in America, many folks would be puzzled at the the very idea of a "Pole Star" or even why anyone at all would care.) Several years ago my local planetarium featured an entire program about various astronomical misconceptions, and this was perhaps the most striking. I wasn't surprised about its lack of prominence, since I had already no doubt memorized the three brightest stars by that time, but I may have been mildly surprised by how far down such a list it fell. The tone of the clarification was both "You have got to be kidding about it being #1" and "Many, many people are sold on the idea, and probably will continue to be so!"

[Irishman]

Originally Posted by Oly

This one has always bothered me:

You've been as constant as the Northern Star
The brightest light that shines

Sorry, Mr Rafferty, but the Northern Star is pretty wimpy, brightness-wise. (Critique notwithstanding the prospect that the songwriter may, in fact, have proffered the smilie sarcastically. If so, strong work.)

Nitpick, while the common interpretation is that he is calling the Northern Star the brightest light that shines, that is not the only parsing of the stanza.

He is listing traits, ways that his woman has been there for him. With tweaking of the punctuation, that reads as

"You've been as constant as the Northern Star.
The brightest light that shines,
it's been you, woman,
right down the line."

He's comparing her constancy to the Northern Star. He's also calling her the brightest light that shines.

[Oly]

Originally Posted by Irishman

He's comparing her constancy to the Northern Star. He's also calling her the brightest light that shines.

While I like your alternate parsing possibility, wouldn't that just be replacing one factual error with another? (Unless, of course, the object of his affection is the Sun, in which case, I say, again, strong work, Mr Raffertry.)

[Irishman]

No, that's just poetic expression. He's not saying she literally glows light.