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  #101  
Old 11-23-2013, 09:46 PM
Ambivalid Ambivalid is online now
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Originally Posted by Brynda View Post
Oh, and aren't cordons sometimes used for men who dribble a bit but don't need a catheter?
You are referring to condom catheters. They are devices that are worn outside of the penis (like a condom) as opposed to inserted inside the urethra like a regular catheter. While a man who leaks some may use such a product, they are also used for more significant urinary incontinence as well. They are used a lot for travelling, when access to restrooms can be difficult. But they aren't actual condoms that are used for sex. They drain into a bag that is attached to the device. http://www.incontinencesupport.info/...condomcath.jpg

Last edited by Ambivalid; 11-23-2013 at 09:51 PM..
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  #102  
Old 11-24-2013, 01:16 AM
Doggo Doggo is offline
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When I was a trainee nurse I was on a ward with a long term completely disabled patient, and the scuttlebut was that a certain nurse on that ward did indeed jack him off, however, there is no way, ever, that I would have done the same, or that any nurse I knew would have.

While nurses have to deal with some pretty bad stuff, that would be a step too far for the vast majority.

So, IMO, if you're completely disabled and institutionalised, your sex life is basically over.

BTW, if I end up in hospital and some nurse asks me about my sex life, s/he won't enjoy the response, AT ALL.
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  #103  
Old 11-24-2013, 02:16 AM
Doggo Doggo is offline
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Originally Posted by WhyNot View Post
For what it's worth, I'm all in favor of legalizing prostitution and allowing prostitutes to be hired by patients or their Power of Attorney so that the sexual health of patients can be attended to. I do agree that we tend to ignore sexual health and that probably has a negative effect on mental/emotional health and directly or indirectly on physical health.

Want to make a prostitute part of your health care team? Sure, why not? Want me to provide sexual therapy? No. I don't do Physical Therapy, Occupational Therapy or Speech Therapy, either.
Quite right too.
I can't abide people that consign men unable to convince a woman to have sex with them to a life time of involuntary celibacy.
Shame on you all, you bigots.
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  #104  
Old 11-24-2013, 02:19 AM
Doggo Doggo is offline
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Originally Posted by Reply View Post
The ponderings here have been amusing

But truly, I am still wondering about the medical necessity of this and its treatment. Surely patients can't just be expected to go without sexual release for the rest of their existence. Are they really just expected to call a hooker or a "sex surrogate" (still not sure what that is)?
Short answer, yes.
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  #105  
Old 11-24-2013, 02:23 AM
Doggo Doggo is offline
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Originally Posted by al27052 View Post
Actually, there have been studies relating lack of ejaculation to prostate cancer and other prostate problems.

At some point, I'm going to start pitting you for this. You really ought to know better.


http://www.webmd.com/prostate-cancer...ation-prostate
Having had the prostate problem in the worst possible way, I can state that whatever those studies say, they are BS.
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  #106  
Old 11-24-2013, 02:26 AM
Doggo Doggo is offline
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Originally Posted by For You View Post
It is the medical paradigm, though. Fixing problems largely takes priority over making them not develop in the first place. In this case, prevention is viewed as distasteful so surgery is preferable and generally yields more revenue. Consider also the hospital setting in which these activities would be performed: a great many hospitals have names that start with "Saint", or the like. Catholic doctrine defines masturbation as a hell-worthy sin, so the administration surely could not condone it.
Catholic or not, there is no administration on earth that could have made me jack off patients, and I had do do some REALLY scuzzy things for patients.
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  #107  
Old 11-24-2013, 02:36 AM
Doggo Doggo is offline
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Error.

Last edited by Doggo; 11-24-2013 at 02:37 AM..
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  #108  
Old 11-24-2013, 02:39 AM
Doggo Doggo is offline
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Originally Posted by Ambivalid View Post
Hey, is this the same "Munkypoop" that's on "Apparlyzed" too?
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Originally Posted by Munkypoop99 View Post
in my situation, being paralyzed from the shoulders down 30 years old male.... It really sucks. I've gone 6 1/2 years without release and it drives you nuts, and it is painful. I wish nurses or doctors or my home nurse could do it. I don't want hookers or anything like that. When it beat medical necessary or not it's helping someone do something everyone does and loves but can't do it themselves. Like everyone else can. And you get the feeling of being really horny, but can't fix it, and it really does start hurting the longer it goes. There's nothing I can do to fix it myself or I would. Everyone who is able to do it, does it... I miss that I really wish I could do it. Since I can't wish that someone would do it for me with it be sexually or not... It is needed
< I don't want hookers or anything like that.>

But you want nurses to be hookers!
Tough shit if you asked any nurse I know for the biz. You just lost any sympathy I might have had for you with that diatribe. Hookers are people too.
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  #109  
Old 11-24-2013, 09:26 AM
Broomstick Broomstick is offline
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Originally Posted by Qwertol View Post
But you probably are sexually active or you do masturbate (does masturbation counts as sexually active? I guess not, but it probably might depend on context...).
Masturbation is a form of sex.

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Originally Posted by The Great Sun Jester View Post
As far as paralyzed folks go, as I understand it if you can't move your arms, your nethers aren't gonna be working anyway.
Incorrect. The nerves affected in any one individual is variable depending on cause of paralysis, where the damage is, whether or not lower spinal reflex actions are intact, whether sensory or motor nerves are affected, and so on.

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Originally Posted by Really Not All That Bright View Post
Other way around. Hypogastric plexus stops working if the legs stop working, IIRC.
Not always, but it's a good rule of thumb. A quadriplegic man is actually more likely to be able engage in sex than a paraplegic man but you have to be careful about assumptions. There are quads with no sexual function and paras with fully functional equipment.

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Originally Posted by WhyNot View Post
Or it's possible your grandfather had a girlfriend in the nursing home. It happens. Just because they're old doesn't mean they've stopped boinking.
The older I get the more I am happy that sex does NOT stop at an arbitrary age!

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should we be providing private spaces in nursing homes for residents who want to have sex? What if grandma's in the nursing home and grandpa comes to visit? What if people meet and fall in love in the nursing home? What if their (adult) children are profoundly uncomfortable with their aging parent(s) sexuality? How do we respect the privacy and sexual needs of consenting adults while preventing abuse?
My personal opinion is that YES, we should provide private spaces for such instances, but with controls to prevent abuse. If grandpa comes to visit grandma in the nursing home they should be allowed time together alone and undisturbed whether they want it for sex, for gossiping about people they know, watching a G-rated movie, or juggling sex toys. If the adult kids are uncomfortable at the notion of old people sex too bad for them - grow the eff up and deal with it.

The biggest issues are for those for whom sex is a genuine medical/physical risk, and those who are brain injured or demented to the point where consent can't be meaningfully given, but the mentally competent should have options.

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Originally Posted by Reply View Post
Surely patients can't just be expected to go without sexual release for the rest of their existence.
Yes, there really are people who expect just that - disabled people go the rest of their lives without sex. There are even people who believe the disabled simply aren't sexual beings.

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Are they really just expected to call a hooker or a "sex surrogate" (still not sure what that is)?
Worse that that - there are people who expect the disabled to not even do that, would forbid them that, and just expect them to be horny as hell for their rest of their lives, or simply don't believe that someone paralyzed even has sexual feelings.

I'm not real fond of such peoples' opinions on the matter...

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Originally Posted by DataX View Post
Jesus - 6 1/2 years? Do you really plan on possibly going your whole life cause of some issue with hookers? How is having your home nurse do it (for money) any different than a hooker?
The home nurse is there to take care of medical needs. The hooker is there for sexual needs.

Actually, there is another difference - part of what you can pay for with a sex worker is the illusion of a relationship, a role-playing session, or catering to a fetish, and so forth which is considerably different than simply clinical stimulation to ejaculation. The emotional interaction is part of the reason sex with another human being, even if part of a commercial transaction, can be so much more satisfying than masturbating yourself.

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The only one standing in your way is you (and possibly your pocket book).
Well, there's also the possibility of being arrested as a john. Just because you're paralyzed doesn't get you off the hook for breaking the law. There are jail cells that can accommodate wheelchairs.

There's also the difficulty that quadriplegics are seldom if ever alone, and when they are alone, there can be problems with, say, dialing a phone to call an "escort service". Would a nurse or home health aid be willing to dial the phone for the patient to place the call to a prostitute? Send a text or e-mail?

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Originally Posted by Doggo View Post
< I don't want hookers or anything like that.>

But you want nurses to be hookers!
Tough shit if you asked any nurse I know for the biz. You just lost any sympathy I might have had for you with that diatribe. Hookers are people too.
Either that, or what he wants is not simply a handjob/blowjob/quick bang but, ya know, maybe a relationship with another human being that also incorporates sex? Something that might potentially lead to dating or marriage or some such?

I had a cousin who married a quadriplegic. They had a long happy life together, including several children so yes, there was sex in their marriage though I never asked for details. The sad thing is that, eventually, when she became disabled as well they wound up in the same nursing home, but in separate wings because the place had a strict policy about segregating the sexes. Even a long-term married couple were not permitted to share a room. That always struck me a both ludicrous and cruel.
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  #110  
Old 11-24-2013, 10:10 AM
GusNSpot GusNSpot is offline
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Best reply in the thread. ↑
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  #111  
Old 11-24-2013, 10:38 AM
WhyNot WhyNot is offline
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Originally Posted by Broomstick View Post
The biggest issues are for those for whom sex is a genuine medical/physical risk, and those who are brain injured or demented to the point where consent can't be meaningfully given, but the mentally competent should have options.
Exactly. And how the heck to you determine that when the patient population is so heavy with dementia, memory deficits and difficulties in higher thought processing? This isn't true of every elder, of course, or even every elder in a skilled nursing home...but it's true of a lot of them. Do you do have a competency hearing every time Dorothy wants to get her freak on? What if Sam recognized Diane when she came to visit him at 2, but by the time they are done with dinner, he can't remember who she is? Is it okay to allow him to have sex with this woman he doesn't know at a time when he's clearly not mentally all there? Does it make a difference if he and Doris have been married for 40 years?

Lots of ethical conundrums.

By the way, we did have a test question on more than one final in nursing school that went something like this: "At 8:55, you're getting ready to hang Mr. Jones' IV antibiotic, due to be administered at 9. When you enter his room, you see him engaged in sexual activity with a visitor. What do you do?" The answer: close the door and wait about ~30 minutes before you go KNOCK THIS TIME! (You've got until 9:55 to hang a 9:00 med.) Patient autonomy was the key concept here: patients have the right to a sex life, and we need to respect that as long as it's consensual and safe. But that was in the context of acute care. The specific topic of nursing home sex wasn't clearly answered, although it was occasionally discussed. At this point, our teachers have more questions for us to consider than Industry Approved Answers.

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The home nurse is there to take care of medical needs. The hooker is there for sexual needs.
Precisely. I can't cut nails, either. Not won't - can't. It's outside the scope of practice for an RN in my state. Not only will insurance not pay me to do it, but I could lose my license if I do it and I got reported. Same thing for handjobs. I'm not opposed to handjobs, but that's not within my scope of practice, even though it's certainly within my skill set.
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  #112  
Old 11-24-2013, 10:55 AM
Iggy Iggy is offline
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Originally Posted by Bricker View Post
Isn't this one of the sections in Obamacare?

I kid, I kid.
You need social services to pay for that.


Councils pay for prostitutes for the disabled
(UK)
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  #113  
Old 11-24-2013, 11:00 AM
nearwildheaven nearwildheaven is offline
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Originally Posted by Doggo View Post
< I don't want hookers or anything like that.>

But you want nurses to be hookers!
Tough shit if you asked any nurse I know for the biz. You just lost any sympathy I might have had for you with that diatribe. Hookers are people too.
My sister and SIL are both LCMTs, and part of their ethics training includes what to do if a client asks for more than a massage. And here's what it is. You end the session immediately, and give them 5 minutes to get dressed and leave or you will call the police. And they probably won't get a refund, either.
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  #114  
Old 11-24-2013, 11:06 AM
Broomstick Broomstick is offline
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Originally Posted by WhyNot View Post
Exactly. And how the heck to you determine that when the patient population is so heavy with dementia, memory deficits and difficulties in higher thought processing? This isn't true of every elder, of course, or even every elder in a skilled nursing home...but it's true of a lot of them.
I'm sure you're aware of this, but the general public all too often assumes there are binary answers to those questions. By the end my mother had problems with all of the above, but she also was clearly competent enough to give consent to at least some things, including whether or not she desired physical contact of any sort. My father had power of attorney but still asked her about many things to get her input even if, by the end, the final decision was his and not hers. The disabilities involving brain dysfunctions are a spectrum. One could be incompetent to manage one's financial affairs but still competent to consent to sexual intercourse with one's spouse. Only can be severely mentally impaired yet still have wants, desires, and wishes.
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  #115  
Old 11-24-2013, 11:10 AM
nearwildheaven nearwildheaven is offline
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Originally Posted by Broomstick View Post
Masturbation is a form of sex.


Incorrect. The nerves affected in any one individual is variable depending on cause of paralysis, where the damage is, whether or not lower spinal reflex actions are intact, whether sensory or motor nerves are affected, and so on.


Not always, but it's a good rule of thumb. A quadriplegic man is actually more likely to be able engage in sex than a paraplegic man but you have to be careful about assumptions. There are quads with no sexual function and paras with fully functional equipment.


The older I get the more I am happy that sex does NOT stop at an arbitrary age!


My personal opinion is that YES, we should provide private spaces for such instances, but with controls to prevent abuse. If grandpa comes to visit grandma in the nursing home they should be allowed time together alone and undisturbed whether they want it for sex, for gossiping about people they know, watching a G-rated movie, or juggling sex toys. If the adult kids are uncomfortable at the notion of old people sex too bad for them - grow the eff up and deal with it.

The biggest issues are for those for whom sex is a genuine medical/physical risk, and those who are brain injured or demented to the point where consent can't be meaningfully given, but the mentally competent should have options.


Yes, there really are people who expect just that - disabled people go the rest of their lives without sex. There are even people who believe the disabled simply aren't sexual beings.


Worse that that - there are people who expect the disabled to not even do that, would forbid them that, and just expect them to be horny as hell for their rest of their lives, or simply don't believe that someone paralyzed even has sexual feelings.

I'm not real fond of such peoples' opinions on the matter...


The home nurse is there to take care of medical needs. The hooker is there for sexual needs.

Actually, there is another difference - part of what you can pay for with a sex worker is the illusion of a relationship, a role-playing session, or catering to a fetish, and so forth which is considerably different than simply clinical stimulation to ejaculation. The emotional interaction is part of the reason sex with another human being, even if part of a commercial transaction, can be so much more satisfying than masturbating yourself.


Well, there's also the possibility of being arrested as a john. Just because you're paralyzed doesn't get you off the hook for breaking the law. There are jail cells that can accommodate wheelchairs.

There's also the difficulty that quadriplegics are seldom if ever alone, and when they are alone, there can be problems with, say, dialing a phone to call an "escort service". Would a nurse or home health aid be willing to dial the phone for the patient to place the call to a prostitute? Send a text or e-mail?


Either that, or what he wants is not simply a handjob/blowjob/quick bang but, ya know, maybe a relationship with another human being that also incorporates sex? Something that might potentially lead to dating or marriage or some such?

I had a cousin who married a quadriplegic. They had a long happy life together, including several children so yes, there was sex in their marriage though I never asked for details. The sad thing is that, eventually, when she became disabled as well they wound up in the same nursing home, but in separate wings because the place had a strict policy about segregating the sexes. Even a long-term married couple were not permitted to share a room. That always struck me a both ludicrous and cruel.
Christopher Reeve said that his sex life with his wife never went away, although it definitely changed. John Hockenberry, who is a partial paraplegic, has also said that in addition to having normal sexual function, he also has normal bladder and bowel function too; he uses a wheelchair because his legs cannot support him. He does have some motion and sensation in them. There is a Discovery Channel program that has aired a number of times titled "Paralyzed and Pregnant", about a quadriplegic woman who had a baby, and she did say that her orgasms are much more powerful now than they were before her accident. Unfortunately, that marriage failed; she shares custody with her ex-husband, and sadly is completely unable to do any physical care for her child - all of it must be done by other people. Not a small number of people have said, "Typical man, runs out on his disabled wife" but she had been disabled for some years before he met her, and I'll be the first to say that disabled or chronically ill people can be EXTREMELY difficult to live with. Nobody would criticize a woman who left her quadriplegic husband, I can assure you of that.

Does anyone remember the story about Sandra Day O'Connor's husband, now deceased, who struck up a relationship in the nursing home with another woman? Apparently this is fairly common, and a movie was made about it a few years ago. He didn't know who she or their kids were any more, and the family was actually okay with it after the shock wore off, because as one of their sons said, "The light has come back on for him again."

Last edited by nearwildheaven; 11-24-2013 at 11:11 AM..
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  #116  
Old 11-24-2013, 01:07 PM
Kobal2 Kobal2 is offline
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OK, so nurses are out, least as part of regular care. What about sperm banks & donations ? Would they possibly help out somebody who can't donate solo ?

Anecdotally, I know for a fact that vets will extract such from cats and dogs the old fashioned way, although apparently larger, potentially dangerous animals such as bulls require more care and equipment. That was an interesting family dinner w/ my then 22 y.o. sister the vet-in-training, let me tell you .
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  #117  
Old 11-24-2013, 01:10 PM
Ambivalid Ambivalid is online now
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Originally Posted by Kobal2 View Post
OK, so nurses are out, least as part of regular care. What about sperm banks & donations ? Would they possibly help out somebody who can't donate solo ?
While I have no personal experience with such matters, I feel somewhat comfortable going out on a limb on this one and saying no, that would never happen.
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  #118  
Old 11-24-2013, 02:19 PM
Munkypoop99 Munkypoop99 is offline
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Originally Posted by DataX View Post
Jesus - 6 1/2 years? Do you really plan on possibly going your whole life cause of some issue with hookers? How is having your home nurse do it (for money) any different than a hooker? The only one standing in your way is you (and possibly your pocket book). I'm assuming you mean everything works (I don't know much about being paralyzed, but had thought shoulders down meant you couldn't - but admit I know nothing in that area) . I'm assuming I'm wrong since you wish your home nurse could.

You could probably even find someone willing to give you a lap dance which if it's been 6 1\2 years would probably get the job done just fine - if that would make you feel better about the moral issue.
I don't know anyone, nor have any friends anymore. A lot of situations. "Friends" leave the friendship after an accident that causes horrible results like paralysis or something
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  #119  
Old 11-24-2013, 02:24 PM
Munkypoop99 Munkypoop99 is offline
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Yes another shitty thing about being a quadraplegic. I wouldn't have thought you guys could feel pain because of that. And colour me non surprised that nobody would want to touch this issue with a ten feet pole. Yet another exemple of the consequences of sexual hang-ups in our societies sucking big time.
I thought that as well. Until it happened to me. You feel lots of pain lots of chronic pain. In a lot of situations, you can feel your muscles and inside your body just not the outside. A lot of people can tell when they are sick or have an infection because they can feel that certain part on the inside, example: feeling lower back pain/bladder for bladder infection. Some can even feel everything, just can't move.
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  #120  
Old 11-24-2013, 02:31 PM
Munkypoop99 Munkypoop99 is offline
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Originally Posted by Doggo View Post
< I don't want hookers or anything like that.>

But you want nurses to be hookers!
Tough shit if you asked any nurse I know for the biz. You just lost any sympathy I might have had for you with that diatribe. Hookers are people too.
home nurses you know, and caregivers. And generally, if you don't, they are clean and especially they have to be for their job. And when I speak hookers I'm speaking your stereotypical one. The dirty missing tooth woman on crack standing on the corner. LOL. I've seen some very disturbing women standing in the alley getting into vans. No thank you! LOL. And when I said home nurse I was meaning that while they are here and you know them and they couldn't get fired.. Why not
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  #121  
Old 11-24-2013, 02:48 PM
Munkypoop99 Munkypoop99 is offline
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okay, so can you honestly tell me that someone in a wheelchair, unable to move anything, who usually has someone with them all the time for medical reasons or whatever it may be, comes up to you in a bar... You'll give your number? It's pretty much impossible to meet people, let alone date someone. Think of that image, but dating instead. So you become disabled and cannot move your body, one of the many side effects is your future. Not just your future of movement, but of relationships in any kind. And humans need a lot emotional and physical to be happy and for health reasons and for other reasons. So because you are paralyzed, you have to give up sex and everything or have to pay money(, which in most cases you are on disability and are already having hard times paying your bills with that already ) to have sex illegally with a prostitute. Or if you are in a nursing home and don't have all those bills are they really going to let you bring in prostitutes? If you couldn't have sex or masturbate because you couldn't use your arms you would feel differently, and want something done about it
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  #122  
Old 11-24-2013, 03:55 PM
Nisslbody Nisslbody is offline
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Originally Posted by Munkypoop99 View Post
in my situation, being paralyzed from the shoulders down 30 years old male.... It really sucks. I've gone 6 1/2 years without release and it drives you nuts, and it is painful. I wish nurses or doctors or my home nurse could do it. I don't want hookers or anything like that. When it beat medical necessary or not it's helping someone do something everyone does and loves but can't do it themselves. Like everyone else can. And you get the feeling of being really horny, but can't fix it, and it really does start hurting the longer it goes. There's nothing I can do to fix it myself or I would. Everyone who is able to do it, does it... I miss that I really wish I could do it. Since I can't wish that someone would do it for me with it be sexually or not... It is needed
This is relevant, and some might find it interesting: http://www.theguardian.com/social-ca...sabilities-sex
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  #123  
Old 11-24-2013, 04:26 PM
Munkypoop99 Munkypoop99 is offline
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Originally Posted by Nisslbody View Post
This is relevant, and some might find it interesting: http://www.theguardian.com/social-ca...sabilities-sex
that's interesting. In the UK, they do a lot for people with disabilities. This is an example of more than the public physical activities. I'm in the US though.
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  #124  
Old 11-24-2013, 05:15 PM
nearwildheaven nearwildheaven is offline
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Originally Posted by Kobal2 View Post
Anecdotally, I know for a fact that vets will extract such from cats and dogs the old fashioned way, although apparently larger, potentially dangerous animals such as bulls require more care and equipment. That was an interesting family dinner w/ my then 22 y.o. sister the vet-in-training, let me tell you .
There's a "Dirty Jobs" episode where they show Mike Rowe extracting sperm from a pig. They used a gadget called an "Elec-Tro-Jac" that was basically an anal probe , and a pig produces up to a liter of semen at a time.

In another episode, he went to a turkey farm and squeezing the turkey's scrotum wasn't as bizarre as the mouth pipette used for collecting it.
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  #125  
Old 11-24-2013, 05:40 PM
DataX DataX is online now
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Originally Posted by Munkypoop99 View Post
okay, so can you honestly tell me that someone in a wheelchair, unable to move anything, who usually has someone with them all the time for medical reasons or whatever it may be, comes up to you in a bar... You'll give your number? It's pretty much impossible to meet people, let alone date someone. Think of that image, but dating instead. So you become disabled and cannot move your body, one of the many side effects is your future. Not just your future of movement, but of relationships in any kind. And humans need a lot emotional and physical to be happy and for health reasons and for other reasons. So because you are paralyzed, you have to give up sex and everything or have to pay money(, which in most cases you are on disability and are already having hard times paying your bills with that already ) to have sex illegally with a prostitute. Or if you are in a nursing home and don't have all those bills are they really going to let you bring in prostitutes? If you couldn't have sex or masturbate because you couldn't use your arms you would feel differently, and want something done about it
I have no idea what your situation is like. Not all prostitutes look like street walkers. I know some that have had disabled clients before, but granted I don't think any were as severe as your situation. I don't know how it would work in your situation, but in theory they would not need to know they were a prostitute. They might suspect - and I have no idea how the logistics would work, but if they'd be willing to help you or someone else have private time with girlfriend or wife - they shouldn't prohibit you from doing the same with a woman of your own choosing.

Not having friends makes it fairly difficult to arrange - I was simply responding earlier to what seemed like an out of hand rejection of a possible solution. I don't know what I'd do in that case.

The solution to your problem IMHO - is not to increase the responsibilities of health care providers (most of whom wouldn't want that) - but to give you greater access to a service that should be legal anyway. The medical community is conservative enough as it is.

Oh and yes it is illegal in most areas, but if anyone really believes that if done discretely you would get in any trouble - well I think they have over active imaginations.
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  #126  
Old 11-24-2013, 06:01 PM
Ambivalid Ambivalid is online now
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Originally Posted by Munkypoop99 View Post
I thought that as well. Until it happened to me. You feel lots of pain lots of chronic pain. In a lot of situations, you can feel your muscles and inside your body just not the outside. A lot of people can tell when they are sick or have an infection because they can feel that certain part on the inside, example: feeling lower back pain/bladder for bladder infection. Some can even feel everything, just can't move.
I'm curious though, and I hope you don't mind me asking, but what is the extent of your sexual functioning and sensation? If you had the ability to have a home sex worker satisfy you, what would you have her do, exactly? Are you capable of orgasm?

Last edited by Ambivalid; 11-24-2013 at 06:03 PM..
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  #127  
Old 11-24-2013, 07:26 PM
WhyNot WhyNot is offline
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Originally Posted by Munkypoop99 View Post
okay, so can you honestly tell me that someone in a wheelchair, unable to move anything, who usually has someone with them all the time for medical reasons or whatever it may be, comes up to you in a bar... You'll give your number? It's pretty much impossible to meet people, let alone date someone. Think of that image, but dating instead. So you become disabled and cannot move your body, one of the many side effects is your future. Not just your future of movement, but of relationships in any kind. And humans need a lot emotional and physical to be happy and for health reasons and for other reasons. So because you are paralyzed, you have to give up sex and everything or have to pay money(, which in most cases you are on disability and are already having hard times paying your bills with that already ) to have sex illegally with a prostitute. Or if you are in a nursing home and don't have all those bills are they really going to let you bring in prostitutes? If you couldn't have sex or masturbate because you couldn't use your arms you would feel differently, and want something done about it
Every person on earth has three groups of potentials: Group A is people that would never ever sleep with you. Group B is people that might concievably sleep with you. Group C is people that view you as part of their fetish and will seek you out not for yourself, but for your ____.

____ might be a disability, a BMI, a hair color, a personality quirk, a hobby, a profession...

While Cindy Crawford probably has a smaller Group A than most of us, and Group B is pretty large, there are some in Group C who are turned on by facial moles and/or fucking models.

Is your Group A larger than most? Absolutely. That sucks, and it's not fair and I really really wish we could advance our evolution a little faster so that we'd get to the point where needing a wheelchair didn't make your Group A so small. (But, hey, at least we're not routinely letting those with disabilities starve to death, so there's some progress for ya...)

But yes, there are also people in Group B and Group C who will fuck you, and maybe have a meaningful intimate relationship with you. There are dating sites to find them, if you really want to. Do they suck? Yeah, probably...I have yet to meet a dating site that didn't. Just like for anyone else, it's probably more effective to find people doing things you're interested in and meet people naturally.
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  #128  
Old 11-25-2013, 07:52 AM
mo50 mo50 is offline
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I used to work w people w/ disabilities in an outpatient mental health clinic. I recall at least one disabled guy claiming to have had a sexual relationship with his homecare attendant. I'd guess when someone is bathing and clothing you, and so forth, its not such a huge leap to think that level of intimacy could lead to sexual contact. Could've just been his fantasy, and purely anecdotal, of course. I've never heard of this being done out of medical neccesity, though I can understand how it could feel that way!
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  #129  
Old 11-25-2013, 08:31 AM
kayaker kayaker is offline
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I'd guess when someone is bathing and clothing you, and so forth, its not such a huge leap to think that level of intimacy could lead to sexual contact.
My son and daughter would take exception with this statement, as would I!
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  #130  
Old 11-25-2013, 08:55 AM
Broomstick Broomstick is offline
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Kayaker, I think there's an assumption here that we're talking about non-related adults, not parent and child situations.

As an interesting bit of trivia, Stephen Hawking's second wife originally was one of his home health care nurses.

A big problem for folks like Munkypoop99 is simply getting out to meet people in the first place. Most human contact he has is (presumably) with either what family/friends still bother to visit him and his carers. Family is off limits for an intimate relationship, and if you put the carers entirely off limits then... who the hell is he ever going to meet?

A social life is not easy for a quad to achieve. Even something as simple as going out to Starbuck's for a cup of coffee is no minor thing, it requires advance planning and assistance from other people. Christopher Reeve wrote and spoke about how non-spontaneous his life became after his accident, how hard it was for him to get out and about even with his wealth and his celebrity generating invitations and making people willing to accommodate his limitations.

If the wealthy/famous/desired-by-society quads like Reeves and Hawking (Hawking is functionally a quad if even not due to spinal injury) find getting out difficult how much more so would it be for the young, obscure, and non-wealthy quad? All too often a young quad in the US will find himself warehoused in a nursing home with the debilitated elderly, or largely confined to a modified room of a home. Whether or not he ever gets out is entirely dependent on the willingness of others to get him out of the house, which they may be reluctant to do between perceived fragility of the quad and the sheer physical effort involved in moving an unmoving adult body, maneuvering a large, heavy wheelchair in and out of a building, in and out of a van, and in and out of public places whose "accessibility" is laughable at times. On top of that, compared to conditions in some other places, such US warehousing of the disabled is far from the worst alternative.

The internet is giving the disabled more of a social life of sorts, and is an opportunity to "meet" people, but I gather Munkypoop99 wants more than IM's and Skype in the way of a relationship.

By the way - if I'm wrong on any of this, Munkypoop99, feel free to correct me.
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  #131  
Old 11-25-2013, 01:00 PM
Munkypoop99 Munkypoop99 is offline
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Originally Posted by Ambivalid View Post
I'm curious though, and I hope you don't mind me asking, but what is the extent of your sexual functioning and sensation? If you had the ability to have a home sex worker satisfy you, what would you have her do, exactly? Are you capable of orgasm?
I don't know. Haven't been able to try, obviously. erections and intense feeling of being "in that mode" LOL
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  #132  
Old 11-25-2013, 01:09 PM
Munkypoop99 Munkypoop99 is offline
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Originally Posted by Broomstick View Post
Kayaker, I think there's an assumption here that we're talking about non-related adults, not parent and child situations.

As an interesting bit of trivia, Stephen Hawking's second wife originally was one of his home health care nurses.

A big problem for folks like Munkypoop99 is simply getting out to meet people in the first place. Most human contact he has is (presumably) with either what family/friends still bother to visit him and his carers. Family is off limits for an intimate relationship, and if you put the carers entirely off limits then... who the hell is he ever going to meet?

A social life is not easy for a quad to achieve. Even something as simple as going out to Starbuck's for a cup of coffee is no minor thing, it requires advance planning and assistance from other people. Christopher Reeve wrote and spoke about how non-spontaneous his life became after his accident, how hard it was for him to get out and about even with his wealth and his celebrity generating invitations and making people willing to accommodate his limitations.

If the wealthy/famous/desired-by-society quads like Reeves and Hawking (Hawking is functionally a quad if even not due to spinal injury) find getting out difficult how much more so would it be for the young, obscure, and non-wealthy quad? All too often a young quad in the US will find himself warehoused in a nursing home with the debilitated elderly, or largely confined to a modified room of a home. Whether or not he ever gets out is entirely dependent on the willingness of others to get him out of the house, which they may be reluctant to do between perceived fragility of the quad and the sheer physical effort involved in moving an unmoving adult body, maneuvering a large, heavy wheelchair in and out of a building, in and out of a van, and in and out of public places whose "accessibility" is laughable at times. On top of that, compared to conditions in some other places, such US warehousing of the disabled is far from the worst alternative.

The internet is giving the disabled more of a social life of sorts, and is an opportunity to "meet" people, but I gather Munkypoop99 wants more than IM's and Skype in the way of a relationship.

By the way - if I'm wrong on any of this, Munkypoop99, feel free to correct me.
most caregivers are family members or my one friend who stayed after my injury, a guy. I have looked into relationships and don't think it would be fair to someone else because they would pretty much be a caregiver not a significant other with all the work needed on a daily, or even hourly, routines. Of course I would love it to be the other way. Before my accident, low 20s in age with girlfriend hell, humping
like rabbits every day. And then boom, everything comes to a halt and everything changes. I'm not saying here. There should be prostitutes coming to my house or it would be in the job description for a home nurse or whatever. The truth is that it's pretty much impossible to meet people, let alone have a sexual relationship with someone. Getting in a wheelchair alone sucks, hurts a lot, and your self-esteem is lowered by a lot. It hurts and is not fun. With a build up. No one here can say that when they get in the mood, they ignore it. Every time for years and years. And yes, years. It's been proven to release endorphins, which is much needed, especially with disability since you are usually more depressed than you were before. But, I guess there's nothing any of us can do but wonder if it's right or if it's wrong. Just the daily struggles of being paralyzed
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  #133  
Old 11-25-2013, 01:31 PM
Broomstick Broomstick is offline
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It's not impossible to have a long term relationship that includes sex - as I've mentioned before, one of my cousins met her husband after the accident that rendered him a quadriplegic, but yes, MUCH more difficult. The reality is that it seldom happens.

As WhyNot mentioned, your group of potential mates has shrunk enormously. As it happens, I did marry a man with a spinal injury, albeit nowhere near as severe as yours or Ambivalid's. We've dealt with the problems that entails for 25 years now. If for some reason I was single again and I ran into someone in a wheelchair I wouldn't automatically cross him off my list, even if we're talking quaderiplegia. I won't lie and say it's an asset, either, because it's not. It's a monstrous inconvenience at best, and often much worse than that. You'll have to have a stunning personality and various other outstanding qualities in compensation - which is all the harder when you're horny, depressed, feeling sorry for yourself, look on yourself as broken and an inconvenience to everyone around you. It sucks and it's really hard to come back from that.

No, it's not fair. I wish you weren't in this situation.

However, my point is that it's not hopeless. There are women out there willing to deal with the problems inherent in having a relationship with someone disabled. One of the big obstacles, though, is you have to change your strategies for socializing. Young men rely on things like looking good, being athletic, being strong, and so forth to attract young women. Well, you can still look good from the neck up and wear decent clothing, but the 'chair gets in the way of that whole athletic and strong thing. So you'll have to cultivate something else.

My spouse became a musician, so even though he walked funny and had various other problems his talent was enough to attract groupies and girlfriends. Other guys who are disabled have cultivated their humor, basically becoming comedians and entertainment for the larger crowd. You'll have to figure out what your talents are and cultivate the ones you can to make yourself more of a catch than you currently are.

It does suck. You spent your teen years cultivating certain things and learning who you were and how to get female attention one way, and now it doesn't work anymore. To be honest, it will probably take you into your 30's to reinvent yourself. I'm sorry about that, we women can be brutal at times about mate selection. I do think you'd prefer honesty, though, rather than some sort of false chirpy bullshit.
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  #134  
Old 11-25-2013, 01:36 PM
Leo Bloom Leo Bloom is offline
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I'm honestly surprised no has said it yet, including me as a zombie:

Garp.
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  #135  
Old 11-25-2013, 05:01 PM
Irishman Irishman is offline
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Originally Posted by Leo Bloom View Post
I'm honestly surprised no has said it yet, including me as a zombie:

Garp.
Post 28, with link.
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  #136  
Old 11-25-2013, 05:48 PM
gracer gracer is offline
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Tough, difficult, unfortunate etc? Sure. I sympathise, I really do. But sex isn't a right. You're not entitled to it, nobody is.

If for some unfortunate reason you cannot find someone willing to have sex with you, then yes, what is expected is that you do not have sex. I don't see what's hard to understand about that. Of course people should be open-minded in helping with arrangements, but nobody is owed sex.
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  #137  
Old 11-25-2013, 06:58 PM
clairobscur clairobscur is offline
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Tough, difficult, unfortunate etc? Sure. I sympathise, I really do. But sex isn't a right. You're not entitled to it, nobody is.

If for some unfortunate reason you cannot find someone willing to have sex with you, then yes, what is expected is that you do not have sex. I don't see what's hard to understand about that. Of course people should be open-minded in helping with arrangements, but nobody is owed sex.
The problem is that society takes steps to *prevent* people from having sex. For instance by making prostitution a crime. Or by making inconvenient, limiting or even banning "spousal" visits or intimacy in care institutions.

And in any case, nothing is done to *facilitate* the procurement of sex. I'm pretty sure you could find plenty of charities that would help as much as they could a disabled individual in many way, up to climbing the Everest or somesuch. I doubt you'd find even one willing to help searching for a reliable prostitute.

And yes, I find this shocking. People shouldn't be left in the cold just because others have hang ups regarding sexuality.
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  #138  
Old 11-25-2013, 08:01 PM
Ambivalid Ambivalid is online now
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Originally Posted by Munkypoop99 View Post
I don't know.
6 1/2 years and you don't know? I asked what was the extent of your sensation as well as sexual functioning; how do you not know whether or not you can feel your dick? And do you or don't you get erections from thoughts? Psychogenic erections, I believe is the term.

Last edited by Ambivalid; 11-25-2013 at 08:05 PM..
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  #139  
Old 11-25-2013, 08:08 PM
Ambivalid Ambivalid is online now
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Originally Posted by Munkypoop99 View Post
I don't know. Haven't been able to try, obviously. erections and intense feeling of being "in that mode" LOL
Sorry, missed the edit window. Are you saying that "erections and feelings of being in 'that mode'" are what you know of as far as being sexually able?
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  #140  
Old 11-26-2013, 03:10 AM
gracer gracer is offline
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Originally Posted by clairobscur View Post
The problem is that society takes steps to *prevent* people from having sex. For instance by making prostitution a crime. Or by making inconvenient, limiting or even banning "spousal" visits or intimacy in care institutions.

And in any case, nothing is done to *facilitate* the procurement of sex. I'm pretty sure you could find plenty of charities that would help as much as they could a disabled individual in many way, up to climbing the Everest or somesuch. I doubt you'd find even one willing to help searching for a reliable prostitute.

And yes, I find this shocking. People shouldn't be left in the cold just because others have hang ups regarding sexuality.
I completely agree that it would be great if charities were accommodating. The organisation I used to work with was in touch with prostitutes for their clients with various disabilities. There was also a poster who linked to an organisation that does that, so it definitely exists. Obviously not as nurses giving handjobs, but as organisations facilitating it absolutely happens.

It just strikes me as a little absurd to hear the tone in this thread of "what, I'm just supposed to not have sex??!!11one1!" As if society owes people sex. That's not the case, nobody should be forced to deal with another persons sexual needs. If there is someone who just likes to have sex with you that's great, if someone will do it for money also great and if a charity wants to help people then props to them. But this isn't an obligation and nobody is owed sex.

I just want to have it clear, because the idea that society owes people sex is a pervasive one and very dangerous.
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  #141  
Old 11-26-2013, 02:21 PM
Irishman Irishman is offline
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Wait, society owes us sex? Where's my sex? Come on society, bring it here. I'm waiting.

I don't think society owes anyone sex with another person. I think the frustration is that there are folks that cannot take care of it themselves. When masturbation isn't an option, it makes things a lot less pleasant. Seems a lot for people to be completely cut off from.
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  #142  
Old 11-26-2013, 02:49 PM
t-bonham@scc.net t-bonham@scc.net is offline
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I just want to have it clear, because the idea that society owes people sex is a pervasive one and very dangerous.
Just how do you see this idea as "very dangerous"?
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  #143  
Old 11-26-2013, 03:44 PM
SerafinaPekala SerafinaPekala is offline
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Originally Posted by t-bonham@scc.net View Post
Just how do you see this idea as "very dangerous"?
I take it to mean that ppl think they can rape, harass and bully others into having sex, if they believe it to be some sort of God give right.
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  #144  
Old 11-26-2013, 04:08 PM
BMalion BMalion is offline
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Data point:

I also am in a wheelchair. Progressive Multiple Sclerosis. I have not had an erection since 2005.

I still have one or two femele friends who might help me out (if I begged) but I wouldn't have any ability to function.

And yes, social life does indeed suck. The rare times I mix with people is when they visit me at my house.
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  #145  
Old 11-26-2013, 05:52 PM
Senegoid Senegoid is offline
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Originally Posted by Munkypoop99 View Post
most caregivers are family members or my one friend who stayed after my injury, a guy. I have looked into relationships and don't think it would be fair to someone else because they would pretty much be a caregiver not a significant other with all the work needed on a daily, or even hourly, routines [ . . . ]
Munkypoop99, sounds like maybe you have a possibility here. You're lucky to have even one friend who is still your friend. Do you feel able to discuss your needs with him? He may be your one remaining point of social contact with the rest of the outside world. Maybe, if he's sympathetic, he can help set you up with someone.

Maybe , just maybe there's some female out there who has a bit more heart and friendliness in her soul, than some of the cold-hearted sex-hostile people who tell you that being horny for 6+ years is just too damn bad, boo-hoo, sucks to be you, etc.

It's already been remarked that yes, you have a limited pool of possible dates, and limited ways to even meet them in the first place. Maybe , just maybe your one remaining friend can help set you up with someone. Maybe , just maybe (can we just fantasize a little here?) there's some female who'd even be willing, considering your case, to help you out with the occasional hand-job, even if nothing more.

Ferchrisfuckingsake, ladies, is a penis that toxic gross radioactive that it's that disgusting gross revulsive to even touch one, to give this guy the occasional hand-job? Is the male body that vile? Are males such gorgons that the very sight of the snake in the hair turns you to solid stone?

Munkypoop99, ask your friend about this. If he's really your friend, maybe he can ask around and help set you up. Find out who your real friends are.

Last edited by Senegoid; 11-26-2013 at 05:53 PM..
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  #146  
Old 11-26-2013, 06:04 PM
Senegoid Senegoid is offline
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Originally Posted by SerafinaPekala View Post
I take it to mean that ppl think they can rape, harass and bully others into having sex, if they believe it to be some sort of God give right.
Our OP here, and anyone else similarly situation, has,,,, uh,,,,, "special needs" wouldn't you agree? Yes, it's standard advice to tell the sex-starved, usually in hostile tones, that they can damn well sit home alone and jerk off.

Here, we have a guy who can't even do that. How is this guy, or anyone else similarly situated, going to go about raping, harassing, and bullying anybody?
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  #147  
Old 11-26-2013, 06:11 PM
Senegoid Senegoid is offline
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Correction

CORRECTION

(Missed edit window.)

Okay, upon review, I see that it's not our OP here who's been saving up for 6+ years, but a more recent member here. Please consider my above post(s) to be revised accordingly, but my basic points still remain.
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  #148  
Old 11-26-2013, 06:20 PM
gaffa gaffa is offline
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Abco Research Associates manufactures masturbation machines for both men and women.

The Sybian, is the more popular of the two. The woman straddles the main unit, operated the remote, and it provides both vibration and internal G-Spot stimulation (not to say that a male user couldn't use it anally for prostate stimulation). It has received a lot of attention due to famous owners like the Howard Stern Show (though they use it wrong, without the part to go inside and provide G-Spot stimulation).

Their product for men is the Venus 2000. There is a main box, a control unit and a "receiver" that fits onto a lubricated penis. It strokes back and forth at variable speed. The receivers are custom made for each users length and diameter, and the unit can be used to achieve orgasm even if an erection is not possible. In use, it looks a lot like a milking machine.

From their web site:

Quote:
The Venus 2000 has a gearmotor that drives a reciprocating diaphragm. Air moves to and from the outer chamber of the Receiver by a connecting hose. The amount of air in the system, or lack of it, is adjustable and determines the stroke length. Most guys can adjust it to move the full length of their shaft. To use it, you simply put some lubricant in the Receiver and place the head of your penis to the opening. When you turn the Venus 2000 on it will suck you in. It has the velvety feel of a well lubricated partner. Venus can be set to a soft and sensual 8 strokes per minute, or you can crank it up to a ball shaking 300 strokes per minute.
(All direct links are safe for work. There are explicit videos of the units in use, but there is an age verification step.)

So, how would the care professionals posting here feel about placing this unit on the penis of a patient? It would require no more contact than putting on a condom catheter. I don't know if the controls are available for operation via accessibility systems, so the user might need an assistant to operate the controls. But this a a small company, and they seem open to user feedback and customization. It's been a number of years since I last visited their site, and previously they offered discounted units to disabled veterans. They have a 45 day satisfaction guarantee for the main unit - obviously the receiver cannot be returned.

I first learned about this via an article in The Reader, but the gutless wonder of a writer never actually tried the unit, which would have meant that he supply his measurements to Abco to get his fitted receiver.

Obviously, like almost all of us, someone like Munkypoop99 would prefer human sexual contact, but if that's not an option this could at the very least get him off. Check out the testimonials on their web site.

Last edited by gaffa; 11-26-2013 at 06:21 PM.. Reason: Removed Sybian link as it had images of penis shaped inserts
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  #149  
Old 11-26-2013, 06:27 PM
Senegoid Senegoid is offline
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Originally Posted by gaffa View Post
Abco Research Associates manufactures masturbation machines for both men and women.
There once was a man of Racine
Who invented a sexing machine.
Both concave and convex,
It could serve either sex
While amusing itself in between.
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  #150  
Old 11-26-2013, 06:29 PM
gaffa gaffa is offline
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Originally Posted by Senegoid View Post
There once was a man of Racine
Who invented a sexing machine.
Both concave and convex,
It could serve either sex
While amusing itself in between.
Tragically, they are not located in Racine, but in Monticello, IL.
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