#1  
Old 02-17-2015, 02:47 PM
flight flight is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Newport News, VA, USA
Posts: 2,704
Plumbing SOS!

I have the day off of work today and decided to repair a leaky bathtub faucet. I pulled the handle off and the escutcheon. I was left with what looks like a kitchen sink faucet. It is not one of the types I am familiar with, but I figure it should not be too hard. Probably just needs a new seal somewhere in there.

There was a ring on the front I was able to unscrew (here), but that did not lead anywhere as it did not free the internal mechanisms at all. It appeared that the was a dome cover that could be removed by unscrewing, but it would not budge. I WD-40ed it, let is rest, and then tried again. It seemed like it was going, but then I noticed I had actually twisted the whole section protruding from the wall. Damn.

Does anyone recognize this style of faucet? How do I get the thing out? How badly damaged do you think it is now?

Thanks.

Oh, and the Escutcheon had "Winner" printed on it, but I have had little luck finding info on it before. It was probably installed around 1991.

Last edited by flight; 02-17-2015 at 02:50 PM.
Advertisements  
  #2  
Old 02-17-2015, 02:59 PM
GaryM GaryM is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: St. Louis, MO 50mi. West
Posts: 4,386
The guts look like a Delta to me. I believe that the knurled dome needs to be unscrewed, but you'll need to keep the part closer to the wall from turning.
If it is a Delta, there are spring loaded seals that press on the brass ball that's visible in your photo. A repair kit contains a replacement ball, seals, springs , and o-rings. Take your picture to a hardware store where they know things.

This is a Delta http://terrylove.com/forums/index.ph...2-1-jpg.15592/
__________________
GaryM

Last edited by GaryM; 02-17-2015 at 03:01 PM.
  #3  
Old 02-17-2015, 03:05 PM
flight flight is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Newport News, VA, USA
Posts: 2,704
Thanks. That sounds like what I need to do, but the thing seems more likely to destroy itself than come apart. I could try counter-rotating the base while rotating the cap, but it does not seem like it will come off. I may have to try a real plumbing store rather than a Home Depot to ask, but most things here are closed today and I am a bit afraid to turn the water back on after torquing the hell out of it. There is no cutoff just for the shower.
  #4  
Old 02-17-2015, 03:33 PM
flight flight is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Newport News, VA, USA
Posts: 2,704
Looked it up on the Delta site, and it appears to be a Classic Monitor 13 Series. Called Delta and they say I need to unscrew that cap, just like we both thought. They suggest wrapping it in a towel soaked with 50/50 white vinegar and water with a plastic bag around the whole thing to concentrate the fumes. Change every half hour and after an hour and a half try again.

Thanks a lot GaryM. I hope this works.
  #5  
Old 02-17-2015, 04:30 PM
gigi gigi is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Flatlander in NH
Posts: 24,491
I hope it works out, and I also now know what an escutcheon is.
  #6  
Old 02-17-2015, 04:46 PM
Amateur Barbarian Amateur Barbarian is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: F.O.S.O.N.E.
Posts: 19,905
O, sh*t.

I once tried to repair a similar valve and discovered that (1) the outer bezel-ring was corroded to the base threads, and (2) the design simply could not take any torque without twisting the valve body against its connections... which is what appears to have happened to you. The design has the valve body connected to brass sweat or threaded pipe connectors via short segments of copper tubing, and no other mechanical support. As far as I can tell, there was no way to grip the body and allow sufficient torque to unscrew the bezel; it was all but designed for repairman-destruction when the copper tubing breaks or tears out of its lightly-sweated connections.

I ended up having to saw a very careful hole in the wall and got a very, very experienced plumber to solder in a new valve unit without having to tear out a lot of the tile or the outside wall.

It's a real bastard of a design, and has probably bitten quite a few experienced plumbers as well as uncounted DIYers.

I hope you haven't done the damage I described. Good luck.
  #7  
Old 02-17-2015, 06:49 PM
GaryM GaryM is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: St. Louis, MO 50mi. West
Posts: 4,386
CLR, a commercial scale and lime remover, might work better than vinegar.
__________________
GaryM
  #8  
Old 02-17-2015, 06:54 PM
Enola Straight Enola Straight is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Somers Point, NJ
Posts: 5,750
I would sacrifice the compromised part with a channel lock pliers.
http://thenewamericanconsumer.com/wp...er-300x300.jpg
  #9  
Old 02-17-2015, 07:16 PM
gotpasswords gotpasswords is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 1999
Location: San Francisco area
Posts: 16,098
By the looks of things, you twisted the faucet body about 45 degrees. On Deltas, the flat side of the sort of triangular hole in the white plastic part is where you push the handle to full on, and to the skinny tip is off.

I don't hold a lot of hope that the faucet has survived this. What is on the other side of the wall? Hopefully, it's a closet or some other inconspicuous spot where you or your plumber can cut out the wall on that side, replace the faucet and not disturb the tile. If not, there are thousands of showers and bathtubs across the country where there's a decoratively contrasting section of new tile put in after the original tile was smashed out in order to replace the faucet.
  #10  
Old 02-17-2015, 07:45 PM
GaryM GaryM is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: St. Louis, MO 50mi. West
Posts: 4,386
They also make stainless steel "tower" units that incorporate shower heads and tub faucets. You knock out a bunch of tile, hook this unit to your pipes and fasten to your existing surface.

http://www.jlconline.com/appliances/...ad-shower.aspx
__________________
GaryM
  #11  
Old 02-17-2015, 08:04 PM
flight flight is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Newport News, VA, USA
Posts: 2,704
Amateur Barbarian, that seems to be what is going on. It appears to be three small copper pipes based on online videos I have seen.

GaryM, if the vinegar does not work, I will try CLR.

gotpasswords, the back side is the exterior of the building... on the fourth floor. Not much chance of getting at it from the back.

GaryM, I would love a nice system like that, but if everything goes to hell I will probably take the higher work, lower cost method of rebuilding the plumbing.

I turned the water back on to the unit and it does not leak from the handle, so I have not broken it yet. I am off the project until tomorrow as the idea of being without water for this evening sent my girlfriend into conniptions.

I am leaving the vinegar wrap on all night and tomorrow I will try to remove it again. I will use my channel lock pliers on the dome (like I had been doing) while counter torquing the body with a pair I will have to borrow.

So, assuming I am able to pull it apart and repair it without too much trouble... what about the twist? Is it worth trying to twist it back to normal, or should I get use to leaving it at a cockeyed angle? It is a second bathroom that never gets used for showers, just cleaning pet supplies.

Any thoughts?
  #12  
Old 02-17-2015, 10:18 PM
GaryM GaryM is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: St. Louis, MO 50mi. West
Posts: 4,386
I'd be tempted to not twist it back. I don't believe you ever mentioned what's on the other side of the wall. Is it a closet or someplace where patched drywall isn't too big an issue? I believe I'd have a plumber standing by before much twisting.
__________________
GaryM
  #13  
Old 02-18-2015, 12:12 AM
flight flight is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Newport News, VA, USA
Posts: 2,704
The other side of the wall is open air four stories up.

I think the smart thing to do is try to repair the drippy faucet tomorrow and then button it up with the bend still in it. If I can't get the thing apart tomorrow without a lot of force then I put it back together leaving the bend and the drip there.

Then, when I have an open weekend I try to bend it back and/or fix the drip. If I damage it I will then have time to replace the shower hardware (and likely some tile).

Thanks for all the help.
  #14  
Old 02-18-2015, 02:23 AM
48Willys 48Willys is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Western Colorado
Posts: 752
Good plan. You might look at adding a couple of shut off valves while you are fixing this. I would.

OTOH, You should only have to do this once every ten years.
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:54 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

Send questions for Cecil Adams to: cecil@chicagoreader.com

Send comments about this website to: webmaster@straightdope.com

Terms of Use / Privacy Policy

Advertise on the Straight Dope!
(Your direct line to thousands of the smartest, hippest people on the planet, plus a few total dipsticks.)

Publishers - interested in subscribing to the Straight Dope?
Write to: sdsubscriptions@chicagoreader.com.

Copyright 2017 Sun-Times Media, LLC.

 
Copyright © 2017