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  #1  
Old 04-14-2016, 04:17 PM
Rick Kitchen Rick Kitchen is offline
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California primary election

The Sacramento Bee gave a rundown this morning of how California delegates are chosen for both parties. The Republican delegates are pretty straightforward, but the Democrats are very complicated.

Republican:
Total delegates: 172
Three delegates each to the winner of each Congressional district, for a total of 159.
10 at large delegates go to the candidate who receives the most votes statewide.
Three pre-determined delegates - the state Republican Party Chairman and two state National Committeeman and -woman.

Democrat:
Total delegates: 546
317 delegates allocated by Congressional district based on population and presidential voting in prior elections. (It isn't clear if this is just population by census, or by the number of registered Democrats)
105 at-large delegates confirmed at a statewide delegation meeting on June 19 and subject to approval by the presidential candidate they pledge to support (this is very vague)
53 party leaders and elected officials, including big-city mayors, statewide elected officials and legislative leaders.
71 Unpledged superdelegates, including the Governor and members of Congress.

The article also says that there will be a mandatory meeting of all Republican delegates in Los Angeles on June 25.

The cost for each Democratic delegate to stay in Philadelphia for the convention will run $3600 to $4100 per delegate. The cost for each Republican delegate to stay in Cleveland for the convention will run $3000 to $6000 per delegate (plus, presumably, the cost of the mandatory Los Angeles meeting).
  #2  
Old 04-14-2016, 04:33 PM
The Devil's Grandmother The Devil's Grandmother is offline
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For California residents eligible to vote and not registered yet, please use http://registertovote.ca.gov/ to register before May 23rd for the California primary. Yes, I know the presidential primaries may be all sewn up by then, but there are several other very important races to consider. Other voter California information here: http://www.sos.ca.gov/elections/voter-registration

USA residents eligible to vote and not registered yet, please use https://vote.usa.gov/

Last edited by The Devil's Grandmother; 04-14-2016 at 04:34 PM. Reason: added multi-state link
  #3  
Old 04-14-2016, 05:07 PM
DSeid DSeid is offline
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Originally Posted by Rick Kitchen View Post
The Sacramento Bee gave a rundown this morning of how California delegates are chosen for both parties. The Republican delegates are pretty straightforward, but the Democrats are very complicated. ...
Same allocation method as every other state Dem side. That's the Green Papers and they go into quite a bit of detail. California as a late state gets a 20% bonus number of delegates compared to early states. Some that day also get a "cluster" bonus of another 15% (Both of the Dakotas and Montana.)

Too early for polls to be meaningful.
  #4  
Old 04-14-2016, 05:11 PM
Chronos Chronos is offline
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53 party leaders and elected officials, including big-city mayors, statewide elected officials and legislative leaders.
71 Unpledged superdelegates, including the Governor and members of Congress.
Aren't the former a subset of the latter?
  #5  
Old 04-14-2016, 05:30 PM
Rick Kitchen Rick Kitchen is offline
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Apparently not. That confused me as well, but they are different counts, so I guess not.
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Old 04-14-2016, 06:16 PM
DSeid DSeid is offline
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Apparently not. That confused me as well, but they are different counts, so I guess not.
They are both Party Leaders and Elected Officials (PLEOs) - one is the pledged group and the other the unpledged group (the superdelegates).
  #7  
Old 04-14-2016, 07:29 PM
John Mace John Mace is offline
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It's so strange having a primary vote that can actually matter!!

IIRC, The Republican primary is closed (registered Republicans only), but the Democratic one is open. Is that right?

I'm not registered to a party, so I have to vote Democrat. It might have been more interesting to vote against Trump.
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Old 04-14-2016, 07:50 PM
BrainGlutton BrainGlutton is offline
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Relevant article about the Pub primary. In a nutshell, California is so overwhelmingly blue that its GOP is reduced to a remnant of RW cranks . . . and those are the people who will be deciding whether to give the state's vast number of delegates to Trump or Crus.
  #9  
Old 04-15-2016, 09:52 AM
John Mace John Mace is offline
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Relevant article about the Pub primary. In a nutshell, California is so overwhelmingly blue that its GOP is reduced to a remnant of RW cranks . . . and those are the people who will be deciding whether to give the state's vast number of delegates to Trump or Crus.
But just to be clear, CA is not a winner-take-all state. Still, all the polls I've seen show Trump in a comfortable lead among Republicans.
  #10  
Old 04-15-2016, 12:17 PM
YogSothoth YogSothoth is offline
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Hurray our vote matters this year!

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Originally Posted by BrainGlutton View Post
Relevant article about the Pub primary. In a nutshell, California is so overwhelmingly blue that its GOP is reduced to a remnant of RW cranks . . . and those are the people who will be deciding whether to give the state's vast number of delegates to Trump or Crus.
There's a fair number of cranks but also a sizeable number of non-cranks. The problem with this state for the GOP nominee is that its so large and spread out that if you want to ensure a good haul of delegates, you have to campaign all over and spend a lot of money. With smaller states, you can just hit "Iowa" or "Nebraska" and do well enough in a big population to get enough delegates, but here you must appeal from everyone to LA Republicans to Fresno Republicans to Orange County Republicans and all of their votes are equal.
  #11  
Old 04-15-2016, 12:54 PM
CarnalK CarnalK is offline
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It's so strange having a primary vote that can actually matter!!

IIRC, The Republican primary is closed (registered Republicans only), but the Democratic one is open. Is that right?
Surprisingly, to me, that does seem to be the case according to the green papers. Republican side is party only but Dem side is members and independents. I thought that since the State fixed the rules for primary voting that woukd be the same for both sides. Though if you really want to vote against Trump for some crazy reason you should look into how late you can register as a Republican to get in. Some States let you register as you pick up your ballot.
  #12  
Old 04-15-2016, 01:35 PM
Biffy the Elephant Shrew Biffy the Elephant Shrew is offline
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Though if you really want to vote against Trump for some crazy reason you should look into how late you can register as a Republican to get in. Some States let you register as you pick up your ballot.
The registration deadline for the June 7 primary is May 23.
  #13  
Old 04-15-2016, 01:50 PM
CarnalK CarnalK is offline
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The registration deadline for the June 7 primary is May 23.
That's voter registration deadline but I don't think that necessarily is the same deadline as when you had to sign up for the party to be eligible. It's my understanding that in New York voter registration was until March 23rd but to be eligible to vote in the Republican primary you had to have been a registered Republican since last October.
  #14  
Old 04-15-2016, 02:52 PM
Rick Kitchen Rick Kitchen is offline
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I think I read that the Democratic primary in New York is also open to independents, but the Republican primary is closed.
  #15  
Old 04-15-2016, 03:01 PM
hajario hajario is offline
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Surprisingly, to me, that does seem to be the case according to the green papers. Republican side is party only but Dem side is members and independents. I thought that since the State fixed the rules for primary voting that woukd be the same for both sides. Though if you really want to vote against Trump for some crazy reason you should look into how late you can register as a Republican to get in. Some States let you register as you pick up your ballot.
The California law is as follows: People who are registered as "Non-Partisan" * can either select a non-partisan ballot or they can choose the ballot of any of the other parties so long as the party explicitly allows it. At the moment, the parties that allow it are the Dems and two third parties that I can't recall. I am a Non-Partisan who votes absentee. A few months before the election, I get a post card sent to me that I mail back with my choice of ballot. I always choose Democratic.

*Not "Independent." There is a thing called the American Independent Party that is a minor third party.

Last edited by hajario; 04-15-2016 at 03:01 PM.
  #16  
Old 04-15-2016, 03:06 PM
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I'm curious why the polls only vs. the polls plus results at 538 are so lopsided on the Republican side in CA. That seems strange.
  #17  
Old 04-15-2016, 03:17 PM
CarnalK CarnalK is offline
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I'm curious why the polls only vs. the polls plus results at 538 are so lopsided on the Republican side in CA. That seems strange.
That is funny. It's almost aa mirror flip between Trump and Cruz. Since Trump is polling well I can only assume that all the extra factors that go in to polls plus are in Cruz's favour. e.g. Cruz's endorsements and Trump's recent string of losses.
  #18  
Old 04-18-2016, 08:09 PM
Rick Kitchen Rick Kitchen is offline
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A recent poll in California shows that 73% of California voters registered as members of the American Independent Party thought they were registering as independents. Voters registered as independent will be allowed to vote in the Democratic primary, but if you're registered as an American Independent, you can only vote in the AIP primary.

http://static.latimes.com/american-i...fornia-voters/
  #19  
Old 04-18-2016, 08:19 PM
BrainGlutton BrainGlutton is offline
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That's voter registration deadline but I don't think that necessarily is the same deadline as when you had to sign up for the party to be eligible.
What's the difference? The big two American parties have no membership rolls or cards or dues -- you "join" by registering to vote as R or D and there is no other way to join.
  #20  
Old 05-13-2016, 02:59 PM
Rick Kitchen Rick Kitchen is offline
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I just got my California primary ballot (we're in a mail-in only precinct). There are 34 candidates for US Senate.
  #21  
Old 05-13-2016, 03:14 PM
That Don Guy That Don Guy is offline
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Surprisingly, to me, that does seem to be the case according to the green papers. Republican side is party only but Dem side is members and independents. I thought that since the State fixed the rules for primary voting that woukd be the same for both sides.
Originally, it was a true open primary; anybody could vote for any party. However, the Republican Party Rules say that primaries "don't count" if any non-Republicans can vote in them, so the first year (2000, I think), they actually had to have two separate counts for the Republicans - one that counted all of the votes, which was ignored, and that counted only registered Republicans, which was used to allocate delegates. The state soon changed it to allow each party to dictate its own rules concerning votes to select its own convention's delegates.
  #22  
Old 05-17-2016, 03:01 PM
Ulf the Unwashed Ulf the Unwashed is online now
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I think I read that the Democratic primary in New York is also open to independents, but the Republican primary is closed.
I know this is a relatively old post, but just to clear up any possible confusion: the NY primary is closed for both parties, with an unusually long "lead time" for changing parties (back in October 2015 I believe); you can register as a brand-new voter up to about 3 weeks before the primary and qualify, but people who registered and didn't choose a party originally have a much more stringent deadline. Anyway, the Democrats do not allow non-Democrats to vote in the NY primary.
  #23  
Old 05-31-2016, 09:09 AM
dalej42 dalej42 is online now
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Jerry Brown endorses Clinton. Interesting since he ran a Bernie like campaign against Bill in 1992. Still, I think he realizes it's best for the party to put a stop to Bernie after June 7.
http://www.jerrybrown.org/an_open_le...d_independents
  #24  
Old 05-31-2016, 07:15 PM
Johnny Ace Johnny Ace is offline
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Jerry's the man. (Just don't tell Pearl-catching-whatever his name is that.)

Absolutely perfect timing. It gives the more reasonable Bernie supporters and the waffling independents some time to think about their primary votes, but not too much time. And it might just bump Hillary over into winning California. If she does, it's the tombstone for Bernie's campaign and she doesn't go into the convention with the 'limping' perception problem.
  #25  
Old 06-03-2016, 07:34 PM
guizot guizot is offline
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I just got my California primary ballot (we're in a mail-in only precinct). There are 34 candidates for US Senate.
Yes, but the "Official Voter Information Guide" that we get in the mail will clarify everything. I started a new thread, though, to help out.
  #26  
Old 06-03-2016, 08:25 PM
Measure for Measure Measure for Measure is online now
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The San Jose riots outside of Trump's rally need to be denounced. Anti-trumpsters pelted a pro-Trump woman with eggs. This is bullshit. It makes Trump look good.* And people have a right to attend a rally.

Josh Marshall pointed out that Trump's antics tend to attract violent supporters and opponents. (If you are violent, where else would you go?) True enough. Over at the Atlantic Conor Friedersdorf characterizes the violence as an attack on democracy. Yup. He also suggests that Bay Area folk who like to promote tolerance need to look in the mirror.

With respect, methinks the tolerance supporters and the rioters come from different sub-cultures. Hippies and assholes, if you want loose terminology. The Bay Area has a certain number of fringe groups, some of which style themselves as revolutionaries. Others are just into recreational rioting. Assaulters need to be arrested. Bozos need to be ridiculed.

Want to take Trump down? Do it at the ballot box. And turn out again during the midterms for good measure.


* And congratulations! I didn't think that was possible!

Last edited by Measure for Measure; 06-03-2016 at 08:28 PM.
  #27  
Old 06-03-2016, 09:22 PM
Urbanredneck Urbanredneck is offline
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All those people waving Mexican flags and burning American ones - yeah real smart.
  #28  
Old 06-03-2016, 10:37 PM
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I'm obviously not a supporter of Trump, but I'm gonna come out and say it: some Mexican "Americans" have a lot of nerve. The same ones who went around beating up Trump supporters are the ones who go out and beat up people at 49ers and Raiders games for wearing the wrong jerseys or colors at a game. Flame me if you want, but I lived in NorCal for years and know the type.
  #29  
Old 06-04-2016, 02:25 AM
elucidator elucidator is offline
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..some Mexican "Americans" ...
Perhaps you can come up with a way to explain the scare quotes around "American" in a way that doesn't make you look....bad. Give it a shot.
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Old 06-04-2016, 09:00 AM
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How about those who waive Mexican flags and burn American flags for starters? Of course I'm not at all talking about all or even a majority of Latinos but I've seen some who have an outrageous amount of nerve, like some of those who are brawling with Trump supporters for no reason than just to intimidate and harass them.
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Old 06-04-2016, 10:18 AM
John Mace John Mace is offline
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Does that make them "Americans" as opposed to Americans? I think that was what elucidator was trying to get at. What if their ancestors weren't from Mexico? Would that make a difference?

Last edited by John Mace; 06-04-2016 at 10:19 AM.
  #32  
Old 06-04-2016, 12:21 PM
asahi asahi is offline
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Does that make them "Americans" as opposed to Americans? I think that was what elucidator was trying to get at. What if their ancestors weren't from Mexico? Would that make a difference?
I understood the point he was trying to make. My point is if you want to call yourself American, then at least show a little respect for the country you claim to want to be a part of. I understand they feel threatened and singled out not only by Trump but by angry nativist sentiment, but there's a right reaction and a wrong one. Throwing eggs at people, surrounding their cars, jumping on police cars, burning police cars, waving Mexican flags while burning American flags...is probably not going to convince someone that they really want to make the effort to be a part of the fabric of this country. Is anyone seriously suggesting that I'm wrong on this?
  #33  
Old 06-04-2016, 12:32 PM
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So, then, if anti-Trump protesters peaceably assemble to protest Trump, but don't do any of those things, then everything will be just peachy-keen, because Trump people are all, like, civil and respectful? That what you are trying to sell, here?
  #34  
Old 06-04-2016, 12:40 PM
hajario hajario is offline
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So, then, if anti-Trump protesters peaceably assemble to protest Trump, but don't do any of those things, then everything will be just peachy-keen, because Trump people are all, like, civil and respectful? That what you are trying to sell, here?
That those people were being unreasonable fucking assholes and how a different group of people might theoretically behave is irrelevant.
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Old 06-04-2016, 12:54 PM
elucidator elucidator is offline
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Well, then, by the same token, wouldn't that mean that the behavior of violent asshole Trump protesters is irrelevant to another different group? Like non-violent Trump protesters?
  #36  
Old 06-04-2016, 01:05 PM
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Okay, fine, violent Trump supporters probably would have been brownshirt Nazis in the 1930s. I said it. Happy now?
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Old 06-04-2016, 01:16 PM
asahi asahi is offline
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That those people were being unreasonable fucking assholes and how a different group of people might theoretically behave is irrelevant.
Yes, but more than that, by engaging in that type of unruly mob behavior, they are playing right into the hands of Trump and his nativist supporters, who will argue that they are dangerous. Right or wrong, fair or unfair, accurate or not, the images shown on television pretty much reinforce that view.
  #38  
Old 06-04-2016, 02:00 PM
John Mace John Mace is offline
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So, then, if anti-Trump protesters peaceably assemble to protest Trump, but don't do any of those things, then everything will be just peachy-keen, because Trump people are all, like, civil and respectful? That what you are trying to sell, here?
What do Trump protester have to do with anything? Surely you're not advocating "two wrongs make a right", but that is a very reasonable reading of your post.
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Old 06-04-2016, 02:17 PM
BrainGlutton BrainGlutton is offline
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What do Trump protester have to do with anything? Surely you're not advocating "two wrongs make a right", but that is a very reasonable reading of your post.
No, I think elucidator is saying that a peaceable anti-Trump protest at a Trump event would be impossible because the Trump supporters would make it impossible.
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Old 06-04-2016, 02:22 PM
hajario hajario is offline
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Yes, but more than that, by engaging in that type of unruly mob behavior, they are playing right into the hands of Trump and his nativist supporters, who will argue that they are dangerous. Right or wrong, fair or unfair, accurate or not, the images shown on television pretty much reinforce that view.
Precisely. Anyway, it's on video. They need to find those cowardly pricks and charge them with battery.
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Old 06-04-2016, 02:24 PM
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No, I think elucidator is saying that a peaceable anti-Trump protest at a Trump event would be impossible because the Trump supporters would make it impossible.


You just know Trump supporters would be violent so anti-Trump folks need to preemptively respond! What a morally bankrupt position.

Last edited by Bone; 06-04-2016 at 02:25 PM.
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Old 06-04-2016, 02:54 PM
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True dat. When Bernie offered to pay the legal expenses for people who were charged with violence, that was way, way out of line!
  #43  
Old 06-04-2016, 03:01 PM
Ukulele Ike Ukulele Ike is offline
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Yes, but more than that, by engaging in that type of unruly mob behavior, they are playing right into the hands of Trump and his nativist supporters...
Tiny, tiny hands.
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Old 06-04-2016, 03:43 PM
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No, I think elucidator is saying that a peaceable anti-Trump protest at a Trump event would be impossible because the Trump supporters would make it impossible.
Nah, I don't buy that one at all. I think that's just making an excuse to defend mob behavior because someone believes that those on the receiving end of it somehow deserved to get roughed up. Well I don't. I think Obama was spot on a few weeks ago in his commencement speech. People may think they're right and they may feel good about themselves, but they're not going to get any closer to getting other people to agree with them and work together. The fact that some Trump protesters are douchebags doesn't justify preemptive douchebaggery.
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Old 06-04-2016, 03:53 PM
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Tiny, tiny hands.
I think you might want to rethink that assumption because right now there are probably a lot of people who are otherwise disinterested in supporting Trump who might decide after watching that sort of debacle that their country is under attack and that they need to do something about it, and that maybe this crackpot has a point after all. This is what happened in the 1990s when there was a debate about Proposition 187. People got all sorts of American flag burning irate over this proposed law that denied services to undocumented immigrants. What was the result? It PASSED! It was overturned in the courts, not the voting booth.
  #46  
Old 06-04-2016, 06:23 PM
Measure for Measure Measure for Measure is online now
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From the NYT:
The precise cause for the violence on Thursday night remains unclear. Some protesters claimed that supporters of Mr. Trump instigated it, while others who were there said the violence was escalated by the sudden presence of a few local gang members.

“I saw a couple kids that I knew from the neighborhoods that I know run with the local Norteños and Sureños, and they were just there to fight,” said James Anderson, who lives in San Jose and was attending a protest organized by a Dump Trump Facebook group. “They weren’t there to protest anything. They were just there to cause havoc and fight.”
Yes, proud members of the asshole-American community. I guess they came to the right place! Josh Marshall quoting himself from last March:
What we have seen over the last two weeks isn't just an escalation of chaos and low level violence but a progressive normalization of unacceptable behavior - more racist verbal attacks, more violence. This is in turn clearly attracting more people who want trouble - on both sides. If you're an angry racist who wants to act out on his anger, can you imagine any better place to go than a Trump rally? If you hate Trump, his supporters and all he stands for and want to get physical about it, where best to go?
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Precisely. Anyway, it's on video. They need to find those cowardly pricks and charge them with battery.
Yes. I would enjoy such charges.
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How about those who waive Mexican flags and burn American flags for starters? Of course I'm not at all talking about all or even a majority of Latinos...
Tiny minority of course. But I haven't read any reports of flag burning, except by Trump himself. AFAIK the only thing burnt during the San Jose Trump rally were pro-Trump hats (see NYT article). Which strikes me as lame, but not offensive.
  #47  
Old 06-04-2016, 06:39 PM
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How many would have been there if Trump wasn't trumpeting his disdain for Hispanic Americans. (I don't say Mexican Americans, because who knows? I doubt Trump knows Guatemala from Guantanamo...but I digress...)

Shit disturbers will make trouble regardless, its what they do. But if they can do it and feel self-righteous about it at the same time, so much the better. And in this instance, provocation is, to some degree, responsibility. So how big a slice of the turd pie does Donald have to eat? Dunno. But some.

The thugs aren't damaging Trump's free speech rights or those of his supporters so much as they are damaging the free speech rights of people who came to loudly proclaim their anger at the Donald. The good people amongst them will be reluctant, embarrassed. And so it goes.

A bit mistrustful, perhaps, seems to me a number of folks want to pour a bucket of calumny on those who deserve it, but aren't too particular if it gets slopped over one whole side of the argument. Maybe just messy, weren't raised right.
  #48  
Old 06-04-2016, 07:29 PM
John Mace John Mace is offline
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No. Just no. Free speech is a right guaranteed by the constitution. Not liking said free speech is never, ever, ever, a justification for thuggery.

If anyone thinks Trump is "inciting to riot", notify the authorities.

Last edited by John Mace; 06-04-2016 at 07:31 PM.
  #49  
Old 06-04-2016, 11:49 PM
Measure for Measure Measure for Measure is online now
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Bernie Sanders, yesterday:
"Violence is absolutely and totally unacceptable," said Sanders, after a press conference on the jobs market with former Secretary of Labor Robert Reich. "If people are thinking about violence, please do not tell anybody you are a Bernie Sanders supporter, because those are not the supporters that I want."

"I understand how reprehensible and disgraceful Donald Trump's positions are; how ignorant they are," said Sanders. "I can understand the anger, I surely can, because I feel it. The bigotry that is coming out of his mouth. The insults to the Mexican community, the Latino community, the Muslim community, and women, and African-Americans and veterans. I understand the anger. But we are not going to defeat Trump by throwing eggs or getting involved in violence of any kind. We defeat Trump when we stand together as one people and fight for a progressive agenda. Educate. Organize. Bring out large numbers of people."
Bernie Sanders stands shoulder to shoulder with John Mace.
  #50  
Old 06-05-2016, 12:43 AM
Trinopus Trinopus is offline
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