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Old 11-19-2000, 03:31 PM
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I've heard several DoD people and a few Germans refer to the French this way. Any ideas why and what is the origin of this term?
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Old 11-19-2000, 03:39 PM
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I don't know this to be the case, but I've always thought that frog starts with "fr" as does french, and referring to someone as a small bug-eating critter can hardly be considered complimentary.

Maaybe it has something to do with eating frogs' legs?
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Old 11-19-2000, 03:53 PM
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Maybe they were just being polite
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Old 11-19-2000, 03:53 PM
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French frogs


It's definitely because the French are partial to frogs' legs, a taste considered revolting by the English. It's not just a DoD term, it goes back a long long way.
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Old 11-19-2000, 03:58 PM
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I always thought it was because of frogs' legs, too.
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Old 11-19-2000, 04:40 PM
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The French word for frog is "grenouille." This was an old slang term that people from other parts of France used to refer to inhabitants of Paris, because Paris was built on a drained swamp. I'm not sure if this is the origin of the English slang term "frog" for a Frenchman.

"Frog" is also an obsolete English slang term for a Dutchman.
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Old 11-19-2000, 05:39 PM
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The word "frog" was used in a general derogatory manner as early as 14th C. standard English. And in 1626, the OED cites: these infernall frogs[Jesuits] are crept into the West and East Indyes.

The earliest cite I can find that specifically refers to frogs' legs is 1809, but it must go back a longer way, based on some other cites from about this time.
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Old 11-19-2000, 07:18 PM
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Brewer, in his Dictionary of Phrase and Fable, claims that the term originated for Parisians (later extended to the French, in general) because an early heraldic device for Paris contained three frogs or toads (possibly in allusion to their drained swamp?). I cannot find direct corroboration for Brewer, but I have been able to find several references to frogs appearing on late medieval French arms, either those of the king or those of the nation or those of the city of Paris.

However,

Evan Morris, author of The Word Detective does not even consider Brewer's tale worthy of direct acknowledgement. He holds in No Respect that "frog" was a general-purpose insult that arose in the 1300s (he notes Dutch and Jesuits--mentioned in earlier posts--being so slandered) and was only settled upon the French during the Napoleanic era (with the frog-legs idea and the Paris coat-of-arms both tacked on as rationalizations).
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Old 11-19-2000, 08:07 PM
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ANOTHER THEORY...


Could it be because to English speakers, the word "frog" seems to mimic that peculiar sort of drawling accent that French speakers have? Example: in the Forester novel Hornblower and the Hotspur the ship has sailed out of range of the French shore cannon, and Bush the first mate sneers "Fire away, Monseer le Frog!"
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Old 11-20-2000, 02:00 AM
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A long-serving State Department employee once mentioned to me that staple-pullers are known as "frogs" in French workplaces.

I always figured that was the center of the antipathy between America and France. They think we're stupid, and we reinforce it by slurring them as office supplies.
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Old 11-20-2000, 03:10 AM
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I'm sure this is not the origin, but in Hebrew frog is "tzafardea" and France is "tzarfat".
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Old 11-20-2000, 03:56 AM
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I'm sure this is not the origin, but in Hebrew frog is "tzafardea" and France is "tzarfat".

The connection is...? Other than the change beginning with tza? I think Tom has hit the nail on the head here, with his citation.
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Old 11-20-2000, 03:59 AM
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The French eat frogs legs and the English like to make fun of them so call them Frogs.

The Germans eat saurkrout (sp?) and the English like to make fun of them so call them Krouts.

The French do not like it when the English make fun of them and have noticed that the English eat roast beef and so sometimes call them 'le rosbif' (sp?) but as usual have failed to make it funny.
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Old 11-20-2000, 09:35 AM
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'Cuz its easier to say 'frogs' in a sentence than 'cheese-eating-surrender-monkeys'?
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Old 11-20-2000, 10:50 AM
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Thanks, Tomcat. This thread was sadly bereft of gratuitous slurs. I appreciate you rectifying that absence.

P.S. I'm being sarcastic. Keep that crap out of General Questions.
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Old 11-20-2000, 11:25 AM
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Thanks, Tomcat. This thread was sadly bereft of gratuitous slurs. I appreciate you rectifying that absence.

P.S. I'm being sarcastic. Keep that crap out of General Questions.
hey, he was quoting the groundskeeper willy! isn't there an exception for simpsons quotes?
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Old 11-20-2000, 01:08 PM
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Thought that maybe it was of German origin? The people using the term "Frogs" to me were either DoD in Germany or Germans. I believe the term for frog in German is "der Frosch" and didn't know if this was the link or how to research it?
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Old 11-20-2000, 01:49 PM
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The Patriot had a line that referred to the cheese eating surrender monkeys as "frog eaters" that made it more clear to me.
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Old 11-20-2000, 03:13 PM
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Of course, The Patriot was another example of the outstanding historical research associated with all of Mel's movies, so it may not have actually been totally accurate. (I believe that Mr. Gibson's last authentic movie was Mad Maxx--which is not to say that his flicks are not tremendous fun; I just wouldn't rely on them for historical realities.)
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Old 05-20-2013, 08:44 AM
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Well some good thoughts but this is the truth The french actually adopted this heritage from their history. Yes they arose from the Marshes of france from three different clans. If you look into the six centuary The french bore arms and shields and flags displaying the three french frogs clearly on it. (you can google it) And infact during Napoleans rule after the revoloution they set something up called democracy. And they call it three things... Democracy was born from the french. And is what america pushes on the world and infact the three things democracy stands for is .... Liberty equality and fraternity. Which was written on the statue of liberty given to USA by the french. And also Napolean hand a motto which he had on posters and flags explaining this new ideal. This is why the French (frogs) and Britian do not get along britian has it monarchs and the french killed theirs to establish its democracy and its spreading of...the three frog like sprits.

Know where this stems from ... the bible!!!! the bible talks about three frog like spirits spreading over the earth which is democracy!!!! And explains how problematic it is and the corruption which comes from it and also talks about its spreading and push on the earth before christs return. See the upheavel and the toppling of dictators and the wanting for democracy in the world on the tv of late.

Look into it you will find your answers why the french are called frogs and what they have put on this earth.

if your interested look up this link http://www.genusa.com/BibleTeaching/thrfrogs.htm

or look up the bible magazine online there is a good section on french history just after christs death through napolean and the revolution and today
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Old 05-20-2013, 08:51 AM
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Reported, because ... WTF.
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Old 05-20-2013, 09:03 AM
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Reported, because ... WTF.
Crap, I already subscribed to his newsletter.
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Old 05-20-2013, 09:12 AM
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Don't report it, I think it's highly entertaining!
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Old 05-20-2013, 09:23 AM
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Why are the French called 'Frogs'?

You ask most Englishmen (or women) and the likely answer would be because they like to eat the legs of frogs. It doesn't sound very convincing to me but, as far as I know, there's never been a voluminous disagreement from the French so the moniker has stuck, even though frogs aren't particularly 'cute' or friendly. The same with the return of 'Le rosbif'; it's a large, slow, dumb animal that farts a lot but is rather useful when dead. Why should the British/French accept the portraits? It's small fry in comparison with the history between the two countries.

Yes, I am a bit of a Francophile
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Old 05-20-2013, 09:30 AM
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"The French" in the 6th Century?

I don't think France was called France back then, was it?

The only stuff I saw in my google images was the fleur de lis in triplicate.
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Old 05-20-2013, 09:44 AM
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my bad 16th centuary typo

Clovis 1st or Chlodowech (Latin Chlodovechus), was the first king of the Franks to unite all of the Frankish tribes under one ruler, changing the form of leadership from a group of royal chieftains to rule by a single king and ensuring that the kingship was passed down to his heirs. He was also the first Christian king to rule Gaul, known today as France.
Clovis was the son of Childeric I, a Merovingian king of the Salian Franks, and Basina, Queen of Thuringia. He succeeded his father in 481, at the age of fifteen.[2] He is considered the founder of the Merovingian dynasty, which ruled the Franks for the next two centuries.

18 french kings came from clovis the 1st and this was his shield
http://thetalkingpot.files.wordpress...vis-shield.jpg
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Old 05-20-2013, 09:47 AM
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The only stuff I saw in my google images was the fleur de lis in triplicate.
Obviously the French breaded the frogs in fleur before pan-frying their legs. It all comes together.
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Old 05-20-2013, 09:56 AM
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"The French" in the 6th Century?

I don't think France was called France back then, was it?
.
No, it wasn't. There weren't any coat of arms at this time, either (FTR, the coat of arms of Paris depicts a ship). It's nonsense like the rest of the post you're refering to, obviously.


And the original question has been correctly answered, I guess, by Tomndebb 13 years ago, with his cite about "frog" being a general insult applied to a variety of people.

I too believed it was because of the frog's legs.

Last edited by clairobscur; 05-20-2013 at 09:57 AM.
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Old 05-20-2013, 09:56 AM
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Alot of people say that its because they eat frogs, has anyone considered why ? why would france or gaul or gallia way back before even christ use frogs as their symbols and why three. Frogs because they were apparent in the region as people know of france and its muddy marshes from whence frogs come from.... correct? Three because near the end of the 5th century, the Franks (a Germanic civilization), headed by King Clovis, overtook the Romans and conquered the land which was eventually divided into three parts, the western part being “Francia”, which means "country of the Franks").

Around 1000 A.D., the first French speaking king, Francien, demanded that the ruling class use French, a graduated form of Latin which had evolved through years of dialects, as the official language.
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Old 05-20-2013, 10:09 AM
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Alot of people say that its because they eat frogs, has anyone considered why ? why would france or gaul or gallia way back before even christ use frogs as their symbols and why three. Frogs because they were apparent in the region as people know of france and its muddy marshes from whence frogs come from.... correct? Three because near the end of the 5th century, the Franks (a Germanic civilization), headed by King Clovis, overtook the Romans and conquered the land which was eventually divided into three parts, the western part being “Francia”, which means "country of the Franks").

Around 1000 A.D., the first French speaking king, Francien, demanded that the ruling class use French, a graduated form of Latin which had evolved through years of dialects, as the official language.
That too is entirely wrong. Evidence that frogs were used as a symbol back then?

Gaul wasn't particularly known for its marshes (even though *part* of Paris was build over drained marshes, indeed. But Paris at this time covered the central island and part of the south bank of the Seine, and the marshes were on *the other side*).

The Franks originally were Foederati, not conquerors. Clovis did conquer most of Gaul, but the only "Romans " left were in the the kingdom of Syagrius. I don't know what "three parts" you're refering too, either. The kingdom of the Franks was divided in many ways over the centuries (For instance Neustria, Austrasia, Aquitaine, Bourgogne, Britania Minor....)
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Old 05-20-2013, 10:09 AM
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You see i thought we looked beyond the surface on subjects here? not just seeing things as the rest of populous...trust me if you look into it the reasoning of the frog term which was used to describe the french during many battles by the french was because the french used it as there symbol if you look closely on the image linked below you will see a shield of the english lion and then a french shield with three frogs on it ... look into it a bit more i thought we where fighting ignorance not sercuming to it?


http://www.flickr.com/photos/tonyynot/6751972405/
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Old 05-20-2013, 10:10 AM
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Why are the French called "frogs"? I've given this a lot of thought over the years and have narrowed the definitive answer down to two choices: !) They are small and slimy; or 2) They eat frogs' legs. The jury is still out, but I think Occam's razor dictates choice #1.
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Old 05-20-2013, 10:15 AM
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You see i thought we looked beyond the surface on subjects here? [......)]
http://www.flickr.com/photos/tonyynot/6751972405/

Your *own* cite says the imaginary arms of Satan with three frogs what does it have to do with the French, let alone the Franks?
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Old 05-20-2013, 10:18 AM
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funny to even hollywood can put it on its props and they don't have a good track record for having correct history in there plots mapped out. But if you see the movie timeline which was a silly movie with paul walker in it flashing back in time to see the battle of castleguard with the french liberating a french castle taken buy the british. This is a fictional war fabricated by director but if you see the french captain had a shield with three frogs clearly on it. I freeze framed it. If hollywood can get it ...well
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Old 05-20-2013, 10:23 AM
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Know where this stems from ... the bible!!!! the bible talks about three frog like spirits spreading over the earth which is democracy!!!! And explains how problematic it is and the corruption which comes from it and also talks about its spreading and push on the earth before christs return. See the upheavel and the toppling of dictators and the wanting for democracy in the world on the tv of late.

Look into it you will find your answers why the french are called frogs and what they have put on this earth.

if your interested look up this link http://www.genusa.com/BibleTeaching/thrfrogs.htm

or look up the bible magazine online there is a good section on french history just after christs death through napolean and the revolution and today
According to the Bible, what is the derogatory term I should be using for Panamanians?
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Old 05-20-2013, 10:29 AM
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what did the french do to the catholic church? they cast them out what did napolean do ?
he said i have seen all manner of war but what i seen in the dungeons of the cathlic church no man should see and he took the lands away from the catholic church which they owned 1 fith of france during this time and he cast them into their???? dungeons!!!!in there own device of torture, and he gave the lands back to the people. This has happened in repeated times in french history. The pope and his system and its many daughters are the churches of this world being 666 the beast.
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Old 05-20-2013, 10:30 AM
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If hollywood can get it ...well
Well, what?

ETA:
Quote:
Originally Posted by thereality View Post
what did the french do to the catholic church? they cast them out what did napolean do ?
he said i have seen all manner of war but what i seen in the dungeons of the cathlic church no man should see and he took the lands away from the catholic church which they owned 1 fith of france during this time and he cast them into their???? dungeons!!!!in there own device of torture, and he gave the lands back to the people. This has happened in repeated times in french history. The pope and his system and its many daughters are the churches of this world being 666 the beast.
Ah, I see. Never mind then.

Last edited by Tamerlane; 05-20-2013 at 10:32 AM.
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Old 05-20-2013, 10:33 AM
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Look i work for a company that produces prospectus for companies floating on the stock exchange. the level of harrasement and detail investors go to get the truth is staggering when they want to be sure they are investing their hard earned money and time in to something they want to be sure.....

how sure are you have you looked and studied ? honestly look it up i think you will very surprised.
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Old 05-20-2013, 10:55 AM
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Is this some sort of elaborate spam?
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Old 05-20-2013, 11:31 AM
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how sure are you have you looked and studied ?
Clearly, more than you have.

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honestly look it up i think you will very surprised.
We did, you're wrong. This isn't rocket science.
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Old 05-20-2013, 11:33 AM
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.... I don't know what "three parts" you're refering too, either. ....
The worst are the Belgians.
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Old 05-20-2013, 11:37 AM
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What else would you call them?
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Old 05-20-2013, 11:48 AM
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The worst are the Belgians.
Only two kinds of people I hate: Bigots and Belgians.
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Old 05-20-2013, 12:02 PM
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'Cuz its easier to say 'frogs' in a sentence than 'cheese-eating-surrender-monkeys'?
That took a lot of Gaul.
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Old 05-20-2013, 12:04 PM
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Clearly, more than you have.


We did, you're wrong. This isn't rocket science.
Sorry mate your wrong!!!! Your looking in the wrong places

If you want to see proof and I have friends who live in Paris who have seen the artwork and the history who believe these things as I also do. If you want to know the true Orgin of the frog power look this link up.

http://www.biblemagazine.com/magazin...1/v11i2mag.pdf

Case closed
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Old 05-20-2013, 12:09 PM
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I know they're remaking the movie, Carry, but I didn't realize her mom was already posting here!
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Old 05-20-2013, 12:29 PM
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If you want to know the true Orgin of the frog power look this link up.

http://www.biblemagazine.com/magazin...1/v11i2mag.pdf
Now it can be revealed. After much bombast but no links to sources, you have exposed your true colors. Your source, and one that cannot be contradicted, is Teh Bible.
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Old 05-20-2013, 12:36 PM
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I know they're remaking the movie, Carry, but I didn't realize her mom was already posting here!
Carry On, My Wayward Son... would be a good title for thereality, but the movie and book are spelled Carrie.
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Old 05-20-2013, 12:48 PM
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According to this fairly authoritative site on Heraldry, says

Quote:
Frogs, toads, tadpoles, and powets are all named, though rarely in English heraldry. They have not been observed in French examples.
As far as all of this being bible related, given that the reference to frogs in Revelation is very negative
Quote:
And I saw three foul spirits like frogs coming from the mouth of the dragon, from the mouth of the beast, and from the mouth of the false prophet.
I doubt that one use this passage as a basis for placing frogs on their coat of arms.
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Old 05-20-2013, 12:56 PM
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I doubt that one use this passage as a basis for placing frogs on their coat of arms.
Oh, Ye of little faith! Biblical passages can be twisted and used for anything you want, and often are. A little imagination goes a long ways.
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