I’ll refrain from mentioning zombies . . .
Your advice applies equally to many Jews as well, and not just to non-Jews. My sense has always been that most of the ultra-orthodox treat, if not consider, any Jew who is not also ultra orthodox, as not even being Jewish.
I know this thread is a zombie, but I had to respond to this. Although my grandmother herself was not ultra-Orthodox (she was just plain Orthodox), the funeral and cemetery were run by an ultra-Orthodox sect. I attended with my wife, who is not Jewish. Nobody said a word against her.
Thank you for speaking for the entire haredi community. I’m certain that they agree with you to the extent that they agree with each other.
I don’t know about super-orthodox wishes, but I have sent a fruit basket to a bereaved Jewish family before. Nothing non-kosher about oranges and apples, and they last for over a week. It’s sending something colorful, it’s a nice gesture, and it’s bringing food. And if it’s unwelcome, it can always be given to a neighbor.
cipora:
No idea where you get this from. If the non-Jews in question know the deceased, they’re certainly welcome to pay their respects at the funeral. All that’s required of attendees is respectful silence while listening to the speeches and Psalms.
The question was from 2006, but…
Speaking generally, for an ultra-Orthodox or Hasidic family: anyone would be welcome at the funeral service, who is polite and respectful. However, during the week after the funeral (“shiva”), it is customary for family and friends to visit the bereaved, bring food, and lots of rituals are involved. It could be potentially awkward for someone non-Jewish (or non-Orthodox) to come to the shiva house.
For any other Jewish group (Reform, Conservative, Modern Orthodox) any friend of the deceased would be welcome at both the funeral and the shiva house. Don’t bring food to the shiva house without checking whether it needs to be kosher (and usually someone close friend will be organizing food). Flowers are generally NOT appropriate, but making a donation to some charitable organization in memory of the deceased is nice to do. (Often the family will specify a charity that has meaning to them.)
I am an observant Jew (non “ultra-orthodox”) and a friend/acquaintance to many who are, in fact, “ultra-orthodox,” and I would venture the opinion that your sense is quite incorrect.
Well, maybe you’ve hit the nail on the head, i.e. that you, yourself, are observant and not a strictly ‘secular Jew’ - I will assume that your friends and acquaintances are aware of that. I will further assume, speculate really, that that buys you some respect or at least tolerance from the UO. On the other hand, I, all of my family members, and my Jewish friends are all quite obviously totally non-observant, e.g. we drive on the Sabbath, have Chinese food delivered (sometimes on various Jewish holidays :eek:), etc. Perhaps that explains why even our long-time ultra-orthodox neighbours declined to have anything to do with us, whether it was a spontaneous ‘good morning’ or letting my young nieces and nephews have any contact with their (age-matched) kids.
Even now, at my work (a hospital which draws many of its patients from the nearby ultra orthodox Jewish community) when I try to make conversational ‘pleasantries’ with them (e.g. when in the elevator, in-line for a coffee or tea, etc.) I get the same lack of response whether I’ve made it clear that I’m Jewish or not (e.g. speaking Yiddish to them, or wishing them a ‘gut yontuff’). (And, when I do let be known that I’m Jewish, my general attire and demeanor, earring, and lack of yarmulkeh must surely make it immediately clear that I am quite secular.)
I guess my point would have been better stated as: in my experience, and from my observations (e.g. noticing how ultra orthodox patients and their visitors interact with nurses, other patients and their families, etc.) ultra orthodox Jews generally avoid any contact with those who are not themselves ultra orthodox or non-orthodox but devout Jews. And, to be explicit, my sense is that that lack of interaction extends to include obviously secular Jews. YMMV. 
I am gentile and went to a Jewish graveside service of a friend today. It was beautiful and one other gentile fellow attended besides myself. I wish I had read up on traditions on the web before going because although we were made to feel welcome and we tried to be careful in following during the service when it came to using the shovel to put in a bit of earth on the casket he unfortunately handed me the hand shovel and that is just not done according to what I read when I got home. Also I should have worn a dress I now understand (it was pouring down rain and I had worn pants and a rain slicker). From now on if I am ever to attend a wedding or other ceremony I will surely take a minute to read up on etiquette. Again, everyone was very nice and I never would have known we two made a mistake unless I read about it later!
Meh. I wouldn’t worry over it, but I commend your efforts to conform. Did you put a pebble/rock on the grave and ‘wash’ your hands after the burial? These were two of the things that I (a Gentile) found most intriguing the first time that I attended a Jewish funeral.
People (and etiquette books) always say these things, but I wonder how much they matter to the mourning family. I know that after my parents funerals, we just remembered who was there, but no memory at all of what they were wearing. It sure didn’t matter to us.
Definitely. I attended the funeral of my Orthodox grandmother and for the life of me I can’t remember what people wore. It was, however, a graveside ceremony in St. Louis in February - I’m pretty sure there were pants-clad women in the group and a lot of very practical boots as opposed to dress shoes.
Gentiles should remember that keeping the head covered is the custom. At my grandmother’s service the rabbi had some spare yarmulkes for the men and someone brought some scarves for the women because gentile guests are far from unknown, but gentile-style hats and headgear are entirely appropriate, just remember not to remove it.
As a general rule Jews are aware that their customs aren’t universally known and will usually take things in the spirit given.
As for the ham given to the the grieving family, I, too, would have thought the pork prohibition for Jews was universally known but since I moved to my current area I’ve been rather appalled at the ignorance of Jews (and other) among some people.
If you’re a non jewish male and make a shiva call, don’t wear a suit as you might if you went to a wake/viewing in a non-Jewish setting (I’ve made this mistake), casual but respectful is fine. It’s been explained to me that its similar to the covering mirrors custom, in that there shouldn’t be any attention paid to personal vanity.
I’m vaguely recalling there’s also a custom of tearing ones clothing slightly in one spot too, or of wearing a scrap of cloth pinned to you to symbolize that, but don’t go destroying your clothes without confirming that with someone who knows what theyre talking about!
Only a member of the immediate family of the deceased would be expected to rend their garment or wear a torn ribbon.
And now that you mention it, I remember having a piece of ribbon pinned on me the time I attended a Jewish funeral. (The funeral was for my fiance’s grandmother.)
I had totally forgotten about that custom! :smack:
I did remember the ‘stone on the grave’ and the ‘washing of hands’, after the funeral, just not the signifigance of the acts. (Hence my thread asking about that.)
The incident was a long time ago.
This is an oldie! Still, good advice and well-intentioned all around, it seems; no one wants to bring more stress on a grieving person by ignorance of a courtesy.
A great reason to take kosher food to a shiva house is that the giver doesn’t know whether other attendees eat only kosher, regardless of whether the homeowners do. This way a hungry mourner could look at the closed box of macaroons, see that it’s fine for them to eat and not be so hungry anymore.
Alcohol is also a welcome gift, something nice like MacAllen or those same lines.
I’d like to think that, ‘Let the mourners guide the conversation’ is a common courtesy;but we humans can get chatty when we get nervous and that’s not always easy to control.
There’s no need to ask, “How are you?”; there’s only one way they are. Say, “I’m so sorry.”, and open your ears while you close your mouth. When you go to leave, ask what you can help with. Maybe nothing but maybe something; so much going on, sometimes mourners forget to make a plate of food for themselves or even bring in the mail.
I’m glad that even nearly 7 years later people are still reading a thread, interested to make people feel comfortable at a very stressful time.
At the shiva following my brother’s funeral, the young man who would become my niece’s fiance and later husband and I swapped jokes and riddles to the entertainment of the others in the room. I stumped him with “How many Jewish mothers does it take to change a light bulb?” what with him not being Jewish.
“Oh no, I don’t mind - I’ll just sit here in the dark, like a dog.”
A rabbi recently explained this tradition to me. There is a long-standing superstition among older school, more European-based Jews of the Evil Eye. Whatever the hell that means, it’s bad. You don’t want to draw the Evil Eye’s attention. Flowers on a grave could do that. Pebbles, on the other hand, recognize that a visitor has been there to pay respects, but they don’t cause undue attention. Hence, when you visit the grave of a deceased Jew, you put a pebble on the site but you don’t leave flowers. Religious rituals and traditions don’t have to be rational to have power, as we know.