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VarlosZ
02-24-2009, 02:09 PM
Please rank, in order, the three most undeserving winners of the Academy Award for Best Picture in the last quarter century: a 1st place vote is worth three points, a 2nd is worth two, and a 3rd one. Hopefully we can settle this once and for all.

We're starting with 1984. You can see all the winners and nominees here (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Academy_Award_for_Best_Picture#1980s). Below I'll list the winners, along with the films' most notable competition for the prize; an asterisk denotes a film that was not actually nominated for Best Picture. Your vote isn't entirely context dependent, but if a movie won in an unusually weak year (or bested an "obviously" superior film), you may wish to take that into consideration.


1984 -- Amadeus (The Killing Fields)
1985 -- Out of Africa (The Color Purple, Witness)
1986 -- Platoon (Hannah and Her Sisters)
1987 -- The Last Emperor (Broadcast News, Moonstruck)
1988 -- Rain Man (Mississippi Burning, The Accidental Tourist, *Big)

1989 -- Driving Miss Daisy (Born on the 4th of July, Field of Dreams, My Left Foot)
1990 -- Dances With Wolves (Goodfellas)
1991 -- The Silence of the Lambs (JFK)
1992 -- Unforgiven (A Few Good Men)
1993 -- Schindler's List (The Fugitive)

1994 -- Forrest Gump (Pulp Fiction, The Shawshank Redemption, Quiz Show)
1995 -- Braveheart (Apollo 13, Babe, *Toy Story, *Se7en)
1996 -- The English Patient (Fargo, Jerry Maguire)
1997 -- Titanic (L.A. Confidential, Good Will Hunting)
1998 -- Shakespeare in Love (Saving Private Ryan)

1999 -- American Beauty (The Insider, The Sixth Sense, The Cider House Rules)
2000 -- Gladiator (Traffic, Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon)
2001 -- A Beautiful Mind (The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring, Gosford Park)
2002 -- Chicago (The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers, Gangs of New York)
2003 -- The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King (Lost in Translation, Mystic River)

2004 -- Million Dollar Baby (Sideways, *The Incredibles, *Spider-Man 2)
2005 -- Crash (Brokeback Mountain, Good Night and Good Luck, Munich, *Batman Begins)
2006 -- The Departed (Letters from Iwo Jima, Little Miss Sunshine)
2007 -- No Country For Old Men (There Will Be Blood)
2008 -- Slumdog Millionare (Frost/Nixon, The Curious Case of Benjamin Button, Milk, *The Dark Knight)

VarlosZ
02-24-2009, 02:20 PM
1. Crash
2. Dances With Wolves
3. Gladiator


I strongly disliked Crash: there are plenty of Best Picture winners to which I'm more or less indifferent, but Crash is the only one I've seen that I would describe as a bad movie.

Steve MB
02-24-2009, 02:31 PM
1. 2004 -- Million Dollar Baby
2. 2005 -- Crash
3. 1998 -- Shakespeare in Love

delphica
02-24-2009, 02:34 PM
1. Dances with Wolves
2. Gladiator
3. A Beautiful Mind

Looking at my choices, as well as some of the others I seriously considered, is that they all seem so drecky compared to the competition.

There's not really much to say about Dances with Wolves as compared to Goodfellas, is there? Goodfellas is a better film in just about every sense. If the category was "Best Movie that Had a Herd of Buffalo In It, I would say the two movies are tied, even though there wasn't a herd of buffalo in Goodfellas.

I do agree that Gladiator had a compelling story (I think, I don't really remember it that well, which also says something to me), but it wasn't better storytelling than either Traffic or Crouching Tiger.

And A Beautiful Mind seems so forgettable to me, only eight years out. Personally, Gosford Park would have gotten my vote but both it and Fellowship strike me as much sturdier choices.

MaxTheVool
02-24-2009, 02:42 PM
1. Shakespeare in Love
2. A Beautiful Mind
3. Forrest Gump

SaharaTea
02-24-2009, 02:43 PM
1. Crash
2. Dances With Wolves
3. Forrest Gump

AuntiePam
02-24-2009, 02:49 PM
1. Crash
2. Bravehart
3. The English Patient

I hated Crash. The other choices are because I thought other nominated movies were "better".

Lantern
02-24-2009, 02:50 PM
1. Million Dollar Baby
2. Braveheart
3. Titanic

I don't like Amadeus much either but I haven't seen any of the other films nominated that year. Dances with Wolves is also a contender but I don't really remember much about it. I rather like Titanic actually but it's not as remotely as good as LA Confidential.

Rube E. Tewesday
02-24-2009, 02:52 PM
I would say that not only did any other the other candidates deserve to beat Braveheart, any Jenna Jameson movie that was released that year deserved to. I thought it was about as ridiculous as anything I've ever seen, but maybe I've got unrealistic expectations about movies that purport to be based on history.

TJVM
02-24-2009, 02:52 PM
1. Crash. This movie seemed like a big After School Special on racism. I have no strong feelings about its competitors that year, but Crash seems lightweight.

2. Dances with Wolves. Unlike Crash, this isn't a case of a bad movie winning, but a case of a classic getting snubbed. GoodFellas is still a frequently-watched movie, and will probably still be one 20 years from now. Dances with Wolves, not so much.

3. Forrest Gump. Same deal -- a good movie, but it's no Pulp Fiction, which influenced other films for years (and maybe still does).

Edited to add: I've always thought it would be interesting if the Academy revisited the best-picture contest 10 years later, and voted on which movie now seems the best, in hindsight. I think there would be a lot of changed votes.

MovieMogul
02-24-2009, 02:53 PM
There are movies that I wouldn't have voted for, but that are still OK, if not necessarily the best from that year.

And then there are those that I can't even call Good. At all. Braveheart and Gladiator (two sub-par Spartacus remakes) top that list, followed closely by the unbearable A Beautiful Mind and Forrest Gump.

Robot Arm
02-24-2009, 02:53 PM
Could you go back one more year? Terms of Endearment beating The Right Stuff is a travesty.

GargoyleWB
02-24-2009, 02:55 PM
1. Crash - trite and unsubtle, an especially poor movie when judged against its competition.
2. Gladiator - personal bias, but CTHD succeeded better on all levels that one would judge a best picture by.
3. Chicago - a weak film with no standout acting that won only out of industry nostalgia for the old musical days.
4. Forrest Gump - all of its competitors were substantially better. I can only think that it was because of Tom Hank's academy darling status at the time.

Zakalwe
02-24-2009, 02:58 PM
1. Forrest Gump - Cute movie, but not an Oscar winner.
2. Dances With Wolves - Enough has been said about this to fill a library.
3. Out of Africa - The epitome of a boring film being lauded simply for having a normally good cast/crew.

SaharaTea
02-24-2009, 03:06 PM
I've always thought it would be interesting if the Academy revisited the best-picture contest 10 years later, and voted on which movie now seems the best, in hindsight. I think there would be a lot of changed votes.
If only the Academy could think about what they're putting in the history books before they voted. I don't think you had to be Nostradamus to predict that Brokeback Mountain was going to have a much more lasting impact than Crash.

BrotherCadfael
02-24-2009, 03:08 PM
The worst Best Picture selection I can recall was in 1968: The Lion in Winter was beat by freakin' Oliver!. To say nothing of 2001: A Space Odyssey, which wasn't even nominated...

RealityChuck
02-24-2009, 03:11 PM
1. Gladiator. It was a weak year, but still a long 50s costume drama. Just because Russell Crowe is better that Steve Reeves, it doesn't make a good picture.
2. A Beautiful Mind. So-so biopic.
3. Forrest Gump. Not all that bad, but there were better movies that year.

As for best, that's easy.

1. Shakespeare in Love. One of the Academy's all-time best choices. One of the best written screenplays ever.
2. Crash. Brilliant melding of stories and characters around the theme, and especially good because of the way it portrayed all facets of the racial issue in all their complexity.
3. Chicago. Great reinvention of the musical genre.

Don Draper
02-24-2009, 03:15 PM
1. Titanic
2. Forrest Gump
3. Gladiator

Key Lime Guy
02-24-2009, 03:17 PM
1. Gladiator
2. Rain Man
3. Crash

anu-la1979
02-24-2009, 03:29 PM
1. Forrest Gump being picked over The Shawshank Redemption-single biggest travesty IMO.

2. Titanic being picked over L.A. Confidential

3. Gladiator over Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon

Typo Negative
02-24-2009, 03:32 PM
1985 -- Out of Africa
2005 -- Crash
2001 -- A Beautiful Mind

They were.....just bad movies!

Munch
02-24-2009, 03:32 PM
1. Crash
2. Forrest Gump
3. Shakespeare in Love

I narrowed it down to:

1990 -- Dances With Wolves (Goodfellas)
1994 -- Forrest Gump (Pulp Fiction, The Shawshank Redemption, Quiz Show)
1996 -- The English Patient (Fargo, Jerry Maguire)
1998 -- Shakespeare in Love (Saving Private Ryan)
2000 -- Gladiator (Traffic, Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon)
2005 -- Crash (Brokeback Mountain, Good Night and Good Luck, Munich, *Batman Begins)

CTHD didn't age nearly as well as Gladiator did (which I'm still not impressed with), so it was off. DWW wasn't that much worse than Goodfellas, so off it goes. The English Patient was really tough - I HATED that movie. But I hated the rest (in comparison to their competition) much more.

Marley23
02-24-2009, 03:43 PM
I've seen few of these movies prior to about 1993, so I'll start there:

1. Forrest Gump over Pulp Fiction in 1994
2. Titanic over L.A. Confidential in 1997
3. Chicago over The Pianist in 2002

I realize the OP didn't propose this, but the idea that JFK (a boring piece of historical fiction with no more connection to reality than The Da Vinci Code) deserved the Oscar over Silence of the Lambs is silly.

ShibbOleth
02-24-2009, 03:49 PM
First, I actively disliked:

Out of Africa
Forrest Gump

I never saw:

Titanic
Million Dollar Baby
Slumdog Millionaire

but I'll likely get around to seeing Slumdog Millionaire. The first two don't even interest me. I've seen enough clips that I could probably describe the plot without seeing them.

But then taking into account which ones they beat out:

Dances with Wolves --> Goodfellas should have won by a mile or three.
Driving Miss Daisy --> My Left Foot
Forrest Gump --> Pulp Fiction (although The Shawshank Redemption was also better)
English Patient --> Fargo

are what I see as the biggest travesties.

Which makes my first choice easy:

Forrest Gump
Dances with Wolves
The English Patient

are my top three, since when I examined the whole list of others I didn't like or see, there was no clear "Crap, I can't believe that didn't win" factored in.

davekhps
02-24-2009, 03:50 PM
1. Chicago
2. Shakespeare in Love
3. Crash

UncaStuart
02-24-2009, 03:50 PM
1. Braveheart
2. Forrest Gump
3. Crash

Sarahfeena
02-24-2009, 03:55 PM
Forrest Gump and Titanic. Two movies that thought they were saying more about the human condition than they actually were.

Titanic, especially, frustrated me to no end. Special effects-wise, an amazing film. If Cameron had stuck to the human drama of the ship sinking, and what happens to people who realize they probably only have an hour or so to live (or are seeing family members for the last time), it could have been brilliant. The star-crossed romance and ham-handed class warfare story lines were just awful.

VarlosZ
02-24-2009, 03:55 PM
Could you go back one more year? Terms of Endearment beating The Right Stuff is a travesty.
My thought going into this thread was to have it go back 30 years, to 1979 (Kramer vs. Kramer over Apocalypse Now? Really???), but I thought we'd run into the problem of most people never having seen most of the nominated films from so far back. Of the 15 nominees from '84-'86, I've only seen 4 of them (and Best Picture winner Out of Africa isn't one of them -- is it good?). I've actually seen a much higher percentage of the nominees from '79-'83, but it still seemed like it would be tough to have an informed electorate if we went back that far.

I realize the OP didn't propose this, but the idea that JFK (a boring piece of historical fiction with no more connection to reality than The Da Vinci Code) deserved the Oscar over Silence of the Lambs is silly.
I agree, but among the other nominees (JFK, Beauty and the Beast, Bugsy, and The Prince of Tides) it was by far the most noteworthy. However, taking a second look, I did miss an opportunity by failing to include Terminator 2: Judgment Day, which is probably the only 1991 film that even has a chance of deserving to be in the same conversation as Lambs.

Intergalactic Gladiator
02-24-2009, 03:56 PM
1. Rain Man
2. Crash
3. Forrest Gump

kasuo
02-24-2009, 03:57 PM
1. Crash. This movie seemed like a big After School Special on racism.

I like TVTropes' name for this: Anvilicious (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Anvilicious).

Dewey Finn
02-24-2009, 04:03 PM
1997 L.A. Confidential
2001 Gosford Park
1990 Goodfellas

And I thought that either ET or Tootsie would have been a better choice than Gandhi, based on their cultural significance.

HoboStew
02-24-2009, 04:05 PM
The hard thing about this list is there are some just plain BAD movie years. For example, I sorta liked American Beauty but at no time did I ever think I was watching an oscar worthy movie. However the alternatives are even worse, so I guess I would give it the nod. I didn't like A Beautiful Mind much at all, but I can't see LotR winning best picture. So for my list I pick movies that clearly had a better movie that should have won that didn't.

1. Crash - Brokeback DEFINITELY should have won, and I don't even like BBM that much. This was an awful movie in just about every respect.
2. Forrest Gump - I could see the case made for Pulp Fiction or Shawshank, although to me it is no contest. Pulp Fiction was THE defining movie of the 90's for me.
3. Dances With Wolves - Goodfellas was a better movie, although I think they are both pretty overrated.

TheMerchandise
02-24-2009, 04:09 PM
1. American Beauty
2. Crash
3. The English Patient

KneadToKnow
02-24-2009, 04:10 PM
1. Crash
2. Gladiator
3. Crash again, because it's just that bad.

astorian
02-24-2009, 04:17 PM
The Worst Oscar Winners, From Worst to Least Bad


1985 -- Out of Africa Snoooooze... (And why is Meryl Streep trying so hard to do a Danish accent when NOBODY else in the movie is trying to do their proper accent?)

1987 -- The Last Emperor Yawn...

2000 -- Gladiator I enjoyed this one well enough, but then saw it with a bunch of my male friends in the aftermath of a bachelor party. We treated it as our own "MST3K" and made wisecracks through the whole thing! ("Pizza pizza!" "Say Billy, you like movies with gladiators in them?"). The idea that this campy joke would win an OScar was beyond us.

1996 -- The English Patient Tedious and immoral. A bad combination.

1999 -- American Beauty Gosh, I'm soooo glas Hollywood made another movie showing how sterile and soul-linn ght suburbs are. It had been at LEAST ten minutes since we'd seen another movie with that theme.

Typo Negative
02-24-2009, 04:36 PM
Are we pretty much all agreed that Crash sucked?

Marley23
02-24-2009, 04:43 PM
Are we pretty much all agreed that Crash sucked?
I found it thought-provoking even though some of the characters were wooden. I haven't seen Brokeback Mountain or Munich - although given my history with Spielberg movies I'd be unlikely to prefer Munich.

Red Barchetta
02-24-2009, 04:55 PM
Are we pretty much all agreed that Crash sucked?

Nope.

Katriona
02-24-2009, 04:57 PM
Forrest Gump

Braveheart

Shakespeare in Love

Those are the three that just annoy me to think about.

obfusciatrist
02-24-2009, 05:05 PM
1. Forrest Gump (hate it with a passion because it is awful)
2. Chicago (hate it with a passion because it is mediocre and overhyped)
3. Gladiator (didn't hate it, just a really weird choice)

Ian D. Bergkamp
02-24-2009, 05:23 PM
As for best, that's easy.

1. Shakespeare in Love. One of the Academy's all-time best choices. One of the best written screenplays ever.

I'm glad to see someone else support Shakespeare in Love. I simply can't fathom the dislike for it, unless it's rooted in the Affleck/Paltrow casting (Affleck, I'll admit was miscast, but I liked Paltrow). Wonderful movie, IMO, and one of the very few I've pegged as an Oscar Best Picture winner immediately upon seeing it in the theater.

As for my three worst choices:

1. American Beauty. I actually hated this movie. Boring, pretentious tripe. None of the other choices were all that great, either, so I suppose I'd have chosen The Sixth Sense as the lesser of the remaining evils.

2. Rain Man. I did not care for this movie at all (though I don't hate it). Tom Cruise's performance grates on me and I wasn't all that impressed by Hoffman, either. Mississippi Burning was a far better film.

3. Forrest Gump. Not a bad movie, but I would've gone with Pulp Fiction, personally.


My (dis)honorable mention goes to No Country For Old Men. I liked it okay, but thought Michael Clayton was more deserving that year.

Marley23
02-24-2009, 05:29 PM
I missed RealityChuck's post the first time through: I agree that Shakespeare in Love deserved the Oscar in 1998.

Dewey Finn
02-24-2009, 05:45 PM
Count me as another who thought that Shakespeare In Love was a worthy winner. Saving Private Ryan was a good movie, but I dislike the tendency to give the award to the noble epic (see Gandhi, The Last Emperor, Braveheart, etc.). I appreciate that they rewarded the romantic comedy.

GrandWino
02-24-2009, 06:03 PM
1. The English Patient
2. The English Patient
3. The English Patient

If I need to add two others, they would be Crash and Dances With Wolves. Both fine enough movies, but not deserving the award against their competition.

VarlosZ
02-24-2009, 06:03 PM
Are we pretty much all agreed that Crash sucked?
It's like it tries to be complex, but fails because it's the least subtle movie ever. It's idea of well-rounded characters is to have every character show exactly two sides.

I missed RealityChuck's post the first time through: I agree that Shakespeare in Love deserved the Oscar in 1998.
I get the impression that one's opinion of the movie is highly dependent on how familiar one is with Shakespeare's plays. It's a good movie pretty much regardless, but for people like myself who just know High School Shakespeare, that's pretty much all it is. So for me, Saving Private Ryan was a much better choice.

I agree with Dewey Finn, however, that the Academy should show more appreciation for lighter fare. Comedic acting, in particular, is criminally underrated; everyone says that comedy is harder to do than drama, which seems to be borne out by all the comedians who can successfully cross over to being serious actors, and all the serious dramatists who can't do comedy well.

jk1245
02-24-2009, 06:12 PM
1) The English Patient - over Fargo????

2) Braveheart - Apollo 13 was better, Toy Story was much more creative and influential. Dead Man Walking wasn't even nominated??

3) Crash - Brokeback was better

4) Dances with Wolves - Not terrible, just that Goodfellas is a all-timer.

5) Gladiator - OK, but didn't seem like an Oscar winner. Kind of a "Well, someone's got to win this year" award.


Special Mention - Forrest Gump - A popular pastime to rip on this one. A better movie than it gets credit for, it's just that Shawshank and Pulp Fiction were better. And Hoop Dreams was better than all 3 (Man what a year for movies).

Invisible Chimp
02-24-2009, 06:13 PM
1 American Beauty

2 Titanic

3 Driving Miss Daisy

Oredigger77
02-24-2009, 06:15 PM
1) 1996 -- The English Patient
2) 1998 -- Shakespeare in Love
3) 1999 -- American Beauty

Shirley Ujest
02-24-2009, 06:20 PM
1. The English Patient
2. The English Patient
3. The English Patient

If I need to add two others, they would be Crash and Dances With Wolves. Both fine enough movies, but not deserving the award against their competition.

This movie is what I call " Ralph Lauren Safari Collection". The movie was horrible.

robardin
02-24-2009, 06:23 PM
For way too many of years under discussion I've seen NONE of the nominated movies, so my domain is somewhat restricted here. Nevertheless, I'll go ahead and say with a fair amount of certainty that my answer would be the same anyway that 1994 was the biggest travesty. I liked The Shawshank Redemption and Pulp Fiction way, way better than Forrest Gump. In the end I supposed I'd go with Pulp Fiction over Shawshank, but I actually didn't particularly enjoy Forrest Gump.

The next year (1995) saw me similarly disappointed. I have to admit though that I have not ever seen Braveheart, so I can't say for sure it was "undeserving", but I was pretty blown away by Toy Story, Se7en and Apollo 13, while Braveheart seems to have gotten the nod primarily due to its being "epic".

In 1998 I felt like it was the opposite reaction: while I definitely enjoyed Shakespeare in Love, it's not even close in the lasting emotional impact it made on me compared to Saving Private Ryan.

robardin
02-24-2009, 06:29 PM
I must disagree about The English Patient! When I saw it I was deeply moved. I don't know if it'd stand a re-viewing, but I did not see the ending coming...

And the list for 2001 nominations in the OP:

2001 -- A Beautiful Mind (The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring, Gosford Park)

Didn't include what I felt was one of the best pictures of the year, and one of my all time favorites: Moulin Rouge!. I know this is a "love it or hate it" movie, but it WAS nominated in 2001, and I would easily pick it over Fellowship or Gosford Park. (I did very much like A Beautiful Mind though, and will not contest its winning over Moulin Rouge!)

Ronald C. Semone
02-24-2009, 06:32 PM
1. Silence of the Lambs
2. American Beauty
3. The English Patient

And although it wasn't asked, the three I think were most deserving were

1. Gladiator
2. Chicago
3. The Last Emperor

JohnT
02-24-2009, 07:12 PM
1. Gladiator
2. Dances with Wolves
3. Slumdog

Estilicon
02-24-2009, 07:19 PM
There's not really much to say about Dances with Wolves as compared to Goodfellas, is there? Goodfellas is a better film in just about every sense. If the category was "Best Movie that Had a Herd of Buffalo In It, I would say the two movies are tied, even though there wasn't a herd of buffalo in Goodfellas

I love you and I want you to have my babies. That made my day.

mr. jp
02-24-2009, 07:35 PM
1. American Beauty
Why so few nominations for American Beauty? 122 minutes of stupid and obvious cliches. Oh, the homophobic marine guy is gay himself. Wow. Annoying teenagers who think they're the shit because they like to look at plastic bags, and obviously the director does too. Give it 10 more years, and I'm sure this cliche-fest terrible movie will be on more of these lists.

2. Crash
This:
It's like it tries to be complex, but fails because it's the least subtle movie ever. It's idea of well-rounded characters is to have every character show exactly two sides.

3. Forrest Gump

An irrelevant semi-comedy that beat Shawshank Redemption AND Pulp fiction. There is a goddamn content chart with the boxes. What are you, stupid?

drm
02-24-2009, 07:41 PM
1. The English Patient - If we were to recast votes now can anyone honestly tell me that The English Patient wins over Fargo? Really?
2. Crash - If I were the academy the award would belong to Good Night and Good Luck.
3. Chicago - Not only is it a horrible movie but there were not one, but two great movies to take it's place.

First Alternate: Forrest Gump - I like Forrest Gump, I think it's a good movie, but I LOVE Quiz Show and Pulp Fiction

Second Alternate: Titanic - LA Confidential should have won the award.

Snowboarder Bo
02-24-2009, 07:44 PM
1. Gladiator
2. Forrest Gump
3. Crash

Honorable Mention: 1991 - This was a horrible year, as films from both Oliver Stone and Jonathon Demme were nominated. Someone please make these guys go away, and take back the BP Oscars they both have.

pravnik
02-24-2009, 07:46 PM
I must disagree about The English Patient! When I saw it I was deeply moved. I don't know if it'd stand a re-viewing, but I did not see the ending coming...[/I])Indeed, I feared it may never come at all.

RickJay
02-24-2009, 07:46 PM
1. The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King
2. The English Patient
3. Gladiator

IMHO, "Return of the King" is EASILY the worst movie of modern times to win Best Picture. I really enjoyed the first two and thought "The Fellowship of the Ring" in particular was a genuinely wonderful, great movie. The third installment was just a muddled, badly paced dungheap. I'll be the only person to pick it I bet, 'cause people love the sword and sorcery and hobbits and Tolkein, but really, if you take that movie by itself it's just an awful film. It looked like it had been edited by someone trying to make a deadline more than a movie. After that I just picked two bloated, epic movies that didn't really have very good stories; you could replace them with "Out of Africa" and "Dances with Wolves" and I'd have few complaints.

I'll pipe up and say I do not agree, and have never agreed, with the hatred for "Forrest Gump." It was a magnificent movie in every respect. It's a shame that it and Pulp Fiction were nominated in the same year because both movies are better than at least half the movies to win Best Picture in the last 25 years.

Justin Credible
02-24-2009, 07:58 PM
1. Shakespeare in Love
2. The Departed
3. Crash

Also, A Beautiful Mind, Gladiator and Chicago.

Saving Private Ryan should have won in 1998, Brokeback Mountain in '05, and Little Miss Sunshine in '06. I like Gladiator, but Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon should have won that year.

amarinth
02-24-2009, 08:20 PM
1. Crash. All of the nominated movies were better. Any movie that wasn't released straight to video that year was better.

2. Rain Man

3. Shakespeare in Love

The last two are more matters of opinion and I'd be willing to entertain arguments for their merit. But Crash had one good scene in the midst of a bunch of awfulness.

Justin_Bailey
02-24-2009, 08:35 PM
3. Forrest Gump

An irrelevant semi-comedy that beat Shawshank Redemption AND Pulp fiction. There is a goddamn content chart with the boxes. What are you, stupid?

Not in 1994 when the movie was made and definitely not in the early 80s of which the film is set.

Zebra
02-24-2009, 09:01 PM
Crash

Chicago

Driving Miss Daisy

Although Forrest Gump is a close 4th

mhendo
02-24-2009, 09:09 PM
Crash
Titanic
Forrest Gump

Baker
02-24-2009, 09:50 PM
Dances With Wolves

Out of Africa

Driving Miss Daisy


If I could pick a fourth it'd be the current winner Slumdog Millionaire.

mhendo
02-24-2009, 10:06 PM
For anyone who's interested, i've been keeping a running tally.

The "Score" is based on a 3-2-1 system. Movies voted worst got 3 points, second worst got 2 points, and third-worst got 1 point. So, the higher the score, the worse the movie (in the collective opinion of this thread). Where people did not provide actual numbers for their selections, i took them in order, starting with worst.

The "Mentions" is a simple tally of how many people chose each movie, regardless of whether it was first, second, or third on their list.

Year Movie Score Mentions

1984 Amadeus 0 0
1985 Out of Africa 9 4
1986 Platoon 0 0
1987 The Last Emperor 2 1
1988 Rain Man 9 4
1989 Driving Miss Daisy 3 3
1990 Dances With Wolves 21 11
1991 The Silence of the Lambs 3 1
1992 Unforgiven 0 0
1993 Schindler's List 0 0
1994 Forrest Gump 43 21
1995 Braveheart 16 7
1996 The English Patient 18 9
1997 Titanic 17 8
1998 Shakespeare in Love 15 9
1999 American Beauty 15 6
2000 Gladiator 26 14
2001 A Beautiful Mind 9 6
2002 Chicago 10 6
2003 The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King 3 1
2004 Million Dollar Baby 6 2
2005 Crash 53 24
2006 The Departed 2 1
2007 No Country For Old Men 0 0
2008 Slumdog Millionare 1 1

Note: for people who mentioned more than 3 movies, i just took the first three. For people who mentioned fewer than 3, i just took the ones mentioned.

Crash has a reasonably comfortable lead over Forrest Gump, and then there's a fair gap to Gladiator, with Dances With Wolves close on its heels.

Of the 25, there are five movies that have not yet received a single vote, and five others with only a single mention.

Frostillicus
02-24-2009, 10:14 PM
The English Patient, hands down. What a load of crap. (Especially because it beat out Fargo.)

Baker
02-24-2009, 10:39 PM
I've also been making a running count, but slightly differently. If people mentioned less than three movies, I didn't count any. If, as in two cases, a person mentioned a movie more than once in an entry, I gave it points as mentioned(Crash, and The English Patient, I'm looking at you!)

Crash 52
Forrest Gump 36
Gladiator 24
The English Patient 21
Dances with Wolves 19
American Beauty 15
Shakespeare in Love 14
Titanic 12
Braveheart 11
Chicago 10
Rainman 9
Out of Africa 8
A Beautiful Mind 6
Million Dollar Baby 6
Driving Miss Daisy 3
L.A. Confidential 3
Silence of the Lambs 3
The Return of the King 3
Gosford Park 2
The Departed 2
The Last Emperor 2
Goodfellas 1
Slumdog Millionaire 1

Windwalker
02-24-2009, 10:48 PM
Yay, someone's counting the votes:

1) Crash - My God, I saw this with non-native English speakers who were not terribly familiar with America, and even they thought this was about as subtle as Dennis Rodman and as insightful as Paris Hilton.

2) The English Patient - Some good costumes, some good scenes, and some decent characterizations. However, the movie as a whole was just so long, meandering, and boring that I almost fell asleep, and it was a 6 PM screening!

3) Forrest Gump - It was a cute movie that I liked, and I'd say even a good movie. However, there's simply no excuse for this beating out Pulp and Shawshank. I'm not especially outraged about this one, though.

Honorable Mention:

Titanic - I liked it, but I'm completely biased since I watched it with my first girlfriend...

Return of the King - very enjoyable, but also quite repetitive and non-sensical at times. Characterization and a greater perspective of the war were cut for unnecessary and unending battle scenes.

A Beautiful Mind - It almost felt like a by-the-numbers TV drama, with a standard psychologically-afflicted plot, complete with paranoid scenes and supporting wife. It felt pointless and brought nothing new to the table.

Baal Houtham
02-24-2009, 10:48 PM
Least Deserving:
1. Forrest Gump --1994. There were three superior nominees: Pulp Fiction, Quiz Show, and Shawshank Redemption.

2. English Patient --1996. A good movie, but unfortunately it beat Fargo which is a great movie.

3. Gladiator --2000. I didn't care much for any of the nominees (not a Crouching Tiger fan) but dammit Gladiator was a piece of Hollywood hack work.

VarlosZ
02-24-2009, 11:00 PM
Damn, now I wish I'd voted for Platoon, which I disliked for much the same reason as Crash, and which (IMO) doesn't deserve to be one of the movies that hasn't been mentioned yet. Unfortunately, among its competition I've only seen The Mission, so I didn't feel totally comfortable listing it. And I like Woody Allen; I've got to rent Hannah and Her Sisters.

LVBoPeep
02-24-2009, 11:17 PM
I am another person that thought The English Patient was a good movie. Maybe not as good as Fargo, but I found it very interesting. As far as being too long, just to put it into perspective, the theater projector broke down twice for a total of twenty minutes of the film, and I still enjoyed it. My favorite books and movies are often very long, so maybe I just was blessed with a decent attention span.

I don't know, I guess I would say Forrest Gump, Titanic and Shakespeare in Love. I was born to love a movie called Shakespeare in Love- it's so like all of my favorite movies, but I really disliked it and never want to see it again.

Sir T-Cups
02-24-2009, 11:21 PM
I am sure I am the only one with these particular opinions but....

Goodfellas bored the living crap out of me and I have never liked or recommended it to anyone in my life.

It is a very very close vote between Forrest Gump and Shawshank as to the two best...not necessarily my favorite...but overall BEST movies I have ever seen. To me this award goes to Forrest. I believe that in every aspect of filmmaking Forrest is the best movie I have ever seen. And even more to a point, the character of Lt. Dan is the best characterization in any movie I have seen, and most that I haven't

I am also gonna give some quick love to Dances, I thought it was a great movie with some heart-string tugging moments in it.

Hilarity N. Suze
02-24-2009, 11:33 PM
1. Forrest Gump. Every other thing nominated was better.
2. Titanic.
3. Shakespeare in Love.

Hmm, the mid-90s.

Asylum
02-25-2009, 12:17 AM
1) Forrest Gump - I hated this movie when it came out, but my opinion of it has softened over the years. But at best that movie is treacle and does not deserve a Best Picture nomination, especially compared to Pulp Fiction and The Shawshank Redemption.

2) Titanic - I thought it was an okay movie when I saw it but I didn't get the hype. It's a so-so love story with cool special effects. Another "shouldn't have been nominated". L.A. Confidential and Good Will Hunting were both Best Picture worthy IMO.

3) Chicago - I actually thought it was good flick and worthy of a nom, but how the hell did it beat out Gangs of New York? If you cut down Gangs of New York to just Daniel Day Lewis's screen time you still have an Oscar worthy movie.

There were a few more I thought shouldn't have won: Shakespeare in Love (over Saving Private Ryan?), Braveheart, and Gladiator are a few.

But there's a special not mentioned for Crash: my girlfriend rented it and I only got fifteen minutes into it before I left the room. Those fifteen minutes contained the shittiest, most non-subtle appeals to emotion that I had ever seen in a movie, and ironically succeeded in sterotyping what racists were like in an "enlightened" way. It's not on my list because I never watched the whole movie, but if I had I suspect it would top my list of undeserving Oscar winners.

HoboStew
02-25-2009, 12:27 AM
Originally Posted by robardin
I must disagree about The English Patient! When I saw it I was deeply moved. I don't know if it'd stand a re-viewing, but I did not see the ending coming...[/i])

Indeed, I feared it may never come at all.<giggling>

Yookeroo
02-25-2009, 02:11 AM
1. Forrest Gump
2. A Beautiful Mind
3. Braveheart

Also count be as one who thinks Shakespeare in Love was the right choice (and I think Saving Private Ryan is terrific).


Titanic, especially, frustrated me to no end. Special effects-wise, an amazing film. If Cameron had stuck to the human drama of the ship sinking, and what happens to people who realize they probably only have an hour or so to live (or are seeing family members for the last time), it could have been brilliant. The star-crossed romance and ham-handed class warfare story lines were just awful.

Yes. There's a lot to like about Titanic, but there are serious problems with it. Shouldn't have been anywhere near the Oscars.

I agree, but among the other nominees (JFK, Beauty and the Beast, Bugsy, and The Prince of Tides) it was by far the most noteworthy. However, taking a second look, I did miss an opportunity by failing to include Terminator 2: Judgment Day, which is probably the only 1991 film that even has a chance of deserving to be in the same conversation as Lambs.

I'll take Beauty and the Beast over all of those.

don't ask
02-25-2009, 02:23 AM
Crash
The English Patient
No Country For Old Men

Mesquite-oh
02-25-2009, 02:35 AM
If I had to pick three....

1. Crash
2. Shakespeare in Love

As soon as these movies were over, and the lights were turned on in the theater, I was angry about how totally stupid these movies were, then I basically forgot that I had seen them and never thought about them again. Brokeback Mountain and Saving Private Ryan are two movies that I thought about and discussed with others a great deal, and they occassionally cross my mind to this day.

3. Gladiator-

Didn't Kirk Douglas do this same exact movie a couple of decades prior? Any movie that has Joaquin Phoenix utter "It vexes me. I am terribly vexed" should never have even been nominated for anything.

Cat Fight
02-25-2009, 02:39 AM
I wasn't overwhelmed by a single flick on the OP's list. How depressing. Silence of the Lambs was scary and funny, and The Departed was highly entertaining, Titanic was an orgy of cool effects, but not one of them was a work of art, IMHO.

Yorikke
02-25-2009, 03:01 AM
First Place - 1990 -- Dances With Wolves (Goodfellas)
Second Place - 1997 -- Titanic (L.A. Confidential, Good Will Hunting)
Third Place - 1994 -- Forrest Gump (Pulp Fiction, The Shawshank Redemption, Quiz Show)

Tough decision on 1/2. Goodfellas is a GREAT film, deserving of an Oscar in any year. But godDAMN, Titanic stunk it up something fierce.

Is the worse travesty that Goodfellas lost in 1990, or that Titanic was nominated AT ALL in 1997?

Joe

Carmady
02-25-2009, 03:02 AM
1. A Beautiful Mind

Easily the most undeserving. Not that good, and Fellowship was a clear choice.

2. Return of the King

AKA we should have given Fellowship best picture, so let's give it to the massively inferior sequel instead. This movie is pretty much a mess. Maybe a weak year, but Lost in Translation was more deserving, and honestly I would go with Finding Nemo ahead of this.

3. The English Patient

Fargo was fantastic. English Patient, not so much.

4. Titanic

L.A. Confidential, Good Will Hunting, and Princess Mononoke were all much more deserving.

5. Dances With Wolves

Miller's Crossing is vastly superior. Failing that, Goodfellas is also better.

6. Braveheart

Seven, The Usual Suspects, 12 Monkeys, Before Sunrise, City of Lost Children... there is no shortage of movies from this year that put Braveheart to shame.



I'm only listing movies that were not very good, and were up against much better movies.

Notable for not being listed:

Forrest Gump: Yes, Pulp Fiction should have won. But in many other years I could see Forrest winning, so I don't consider it the most undeserving.

Shakespeare in Love: Very good romantic comedy. Not a clear winner, but hardly an all time worst.

mhendo
02-25-2009, 03:51 AM
Last score update before i go to bed:

Year Movie Score Mentions

1984 Amadeus 0 0
1985 Out of Africa 9 4
1986 Platoon 0 0
1987 The Last Emperor 2 1
1988 Rain Man 9 4
1989 Driving Miss Daisy 3 3
1990 Dances With Wolves 24 12
1991 The Silence of the Lambs 3 1
1992 Unforgiven 0 0
1993 Schindler's List 0 0
1994 Forrest Gump 60 28
1995 Braveheart 17 8
1996 The English Patient 28 14
1997 Titanic 25 12
1998 Shakespeare in Love 19 12
1999 American Beauty 15 6
2000 Gladiator 28 16
2001 A Beautiful Mind 14 8
2002 Chicago 11 7
2003 The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King 5 2
2004 Million Dollar Baby 6 2
2005 Crash 62 27
2006 The Departed 2 1
2007 No Country For Old Men 1 1
2008 Slumdog Millionare 1 1

The tussle is now very close between Crash and Forrest Gump, with the former leading in total score, but the latter just ahead on mentions. The English Patient has moved into equal third place in Score, tied with Gladiator, but the latter still has the edge in Mentions. The battle for first seems to be a two-horse race, though.

maplekiwi
02-25-2009, 04:01 AM
Titanic
Forrest Gump
Chicago

If I was alowed a fourth I'd say Gladiator. I liked it - but I can't believe it was the best movie of the year.

Hrududu
02-25-2009, 11:18 AM
1. Crash.
2. A Beautiful Mind.
3. Forrest Gump.

Clothahump
02-25-2009, 11:23 AM
1989 -- Driving Miss Daisy. Field of Dreams should have had it.
1995 -- Braveheart. Apollo 13 should have had it.
1998 -- Shakespeare in Love. Saving Private Ryan should have had it, even with the shaky-cam issues.

Can we have ties? Because if we can, I'm tied for third with
1999 -- American Beauty over The Sixth Sense

If not, never mind.

wolfman
02-25-2009, 11:31 AM
Hmm I am having a lot of trouble deciding. I really hate the vast majority of movies on that list.

Unforgiven was a great movie. LOTR was a damn good movie. Amadeus was a good movie. and Braveheart was okay as was Shindlers and last Emporer. I havn't seen the last 4.

So all the other movies get 1/15th of a last place vote.

jackdavinci
02-25-2009, 01:34 PM
1) 2005 -- Crash
2) 1985 -- Out of Africa
3) 2006 -- The Departed

Crash, because it shouldn't have even been nominated, and it was really Brokeback's year to win.

Out of Africa, just because The Color Purple was so excellent.

The Departed, because it was a pale imitation of the original, and obviously pandering to the critics, but not actually very good other than a few excellent individual scenes that failed to tie together to make a coherent or cohesive whole.

YogSothoth
02-25-2009, 01:48 PM
1) A Beautiful Mind
2) Crash
3) Slumdog Millionaire

gigi
02-25-2009, 02:00 PM
1. Forrest Gump - my hate knows no bounds
2. The English Patient - hate given a wide berth but not quite boundless
3. Titanic - just being stubborn

magnusblitz
02-25-2009, 02:44 PM
1) Return of the King (agreed with Carmady that this was basically just a make-up vote for Fellowship)
2) The English Patient
3) Braveheart (if only because there were so many other good choices that year)

(Dis?)honorable mention to Crash, which had its moments but also a lot of moments that didn't work.

I'm surprised at all the hate for Gladiator.

Shodan
02-25-2009, 02:59 PM
The English Patient over Fargo? No.
Forrest Gump over Pulp Fiction? Also no.
Million Dollar Baby over The Incredibles - See 1 and 2 above.

Regards,
Shodan

Wakinyan
02-25-2009, 03:39 PM
Braveheart, Gladiator, and The Return of the King. Neither of these are very good story telling wise, IMHO, though they might be entertaining any Sunday afternoon.

Baal Houtham
02-25-2009, 06:04 PM
1)
(...)
I'm surprised at all the hate for Gladiator.

Well, It's been awhile, but wasn't the climax that the emperor (or similar)...
...got so annoyed with Russell Crowe's incredible success as a gladiator, that he decided to get in the ring and fight Russell himself.

Yeah, right.

Before that came an unjust betrayal and then Russell getting powerful again by winning lots of fights.

So.. by the numbers plot with an absurd resolution.

Braveheart had a similar set-up, but more interesting history, better script, direction, characters, visuals... and a less ridiculous ending.

Reloy3
02-25-2009, 06:06 PM
Worst:
1. American Beauty (hated it - just a bad movie)
2. English Patient
3. Dances with wolves

I agree that Forrest Gump and Braveheart weren't great either. Shakespeare in Love was a good movie and should have won almost any other year, but Saving Private Ryan was better.

Dewey Finn
02-25-2009, 06:22 PM
I have a bias against Braveheart and Dances With Wolves, because both were basically first-time efforts of big-name Hollywood stars who produced and directed these films to Best Picture/Best Director wins when longtime, respected directors like Kubrick, Altman, Scorsese and Hitchcock had never won Best Director (although Scorsese since won). It may be unfair, but it seems wrong.

Chum
02-25-2009, 06:53 PM
1. No Country for Old Men. I actively loathe this movie. And There Will Be Blood is one of the best movies I've ever seen.
2. Million Dollar Baby. I watched this for the first time recently and could not understand why anyone would think it's good. At all. I would have given the Oscar to The Aviator, which I thought was wonderful.
3. A Beautiful Mind. Absolutely wretched. The Oscar should have gone to The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring.

MovieMogul
02-25-2009, 06:55 PM
I have a bias against Braveheart and Dances With Wolves, because both were basically first-time efforts of big-name Hollywood stars who produced and directed these films to Best Picture/Best Director wins Nitpick: Braveheart was the second film Gibson directed (The Man Without a Face was the first).

Gangster Octopus
02-25-2009, 07:01 PM
1. Crash
2. Out of Africa
3. The English Patient

I had originally put ROTK, but pulled back because I think it was an award for the trilogy of sorts. But I think it is the weakest of the three movies in the trilogy.

Gangster Octopus
02-25-2009, 07:06 PM
I'm glad to see someone else support Shakespeare in Love. I simply can't fathom the dislike for it, unless it's rooted in the Affleck/Paltrow casting (Affleck, I'll admit was miscast, but I liked Paltrow). Wonderful movie, IMO, and one of the very few I've pegged as an Oscar Best Picture winner immediately upon seeing it in the theater.

As for my three worst choices:

1. American Beauty. I actually hated this movie. Boring, pretentious tripe. None of the other choices were all that great, either, so I suppose I'd have chosen The Sixth Sense as the lesser of the remaining evils.

2. Rain Man. I did not care for this movie at all (though I don't hate it). Tom Cruise's performance grates on me and I wasn't all that impressed by Hoffman, either. Mississippi Burning was a far better film.

3. Forrest Gump. Not a bad movie, but I would've gone with Pulp Fiction, personally.


My (dis)honorable mention goes to No Country For Old Men. I liked it okay, but thought Michael Clayton was more deserving that year.

Actually, I agree about the honroabel mention, except I would put There Will Be Blood as better. Just watched it again the other day and it is a pretty stunning piece of filmmaking, storytelling and acting.

WormTheRed
02-25-2009, 07:08 PM
1. Chicago
2. Braveheart
3. Titanic

Dewey Finn
02-25-2009, 07:10 PM
I have a bias against Braveheart and Dances With Wolves, because both were basically first-time efforts of big-name Hollywood stars who produced and directed these films to Best Picture/Best DirectorNitpick: Braveheart was the second film Gibson directed (The Man Without a Face was the first).
Good point, but it still seems like Gibson and Costner lucked out very early, while the other directors I named never got the Best Director award despite decades of work.

Kiros
02-25-2009, 07:17 PM
1. Forrest Gump - disliked the movie personally, and also from a semi-objective sense feel that both Pulp Fiction and Shawshank were better done AND more important/influential
2. Dances With Wolves - not a terrible movie but not on the same level as Goodfellas
3. Million Dollar Baby - thoroughly underwhelming movie in a thoroughly underwhelming year, I actually would have gone with The Incredibles that year, probably my favorite of Pixar's excellent catalogue

Dishonorable mentions to The English Patient and American Beauty, two movies I wasn't particularly impressed by but couldn't make the list above because their years were both very weak all around, so it is much more difficult to call them undeserving.

I love Shakespeare in Love and wholeheartedly agree with its win. I neither particularly loved nor hated Crash, but I was also generally less enamored of Brokeback than most, and honestly might have gone with Batman Begins that year. Actually, here's a sentence for you: Batman Begins was a better movie than <blank>; it may not have had Ledger's excellent performance, but it was the superior movie in most other aspects, especially pacing and plot. You can fill in <blank> with either Brokeback Mountain or The Dark Knight as you please - that's why it's a good sentence!

koeeoaddi
02-25-2009, 09:34 PM
1. American Beauty
2. Crash
3. Titanic

I liked The English Patient.

Baker
02-25-2009, 09:45 PM
I've also been keeping a running total. So far, as I counted, and I could be wrong, the top ten vote getters are:

Crash
Forrest Gump
The English Patient
Gladiator
Titanic
Dances with Wolves
American Beauty
Braveheart
Shakespeare in Love
A Beautiful Mind

The above ten movies have 80% of the votes, with Crash at 74 and A Beautiful Mind at 17.

Little Nemo
02-25-2009, 11:10 PM
1 - Dances With Wolves
2 - Out of Africa
3 - Chicago

Dances With Wolves happened to be when Costner's popularity was peaking. I gave it the top spot because Goodfellas was such a worthier alternative. Out of Africa and Chicago are two movies that I feel are forgettable. I put Out of Africa ahead because it's older so I think the judgement on it is solidified. Chicago's reputation might still turn around.

The Tof
02-25-2009, 11:25 PM
1. Forrest Gump
2. Crash
3. Shakespeare in Love

1> An enjoyable movie- but how in the WORLD did it beat Pulp Fiction and The Shawshank Redemption. (I know Shawshank wasn't commercially successful, but that can't be said of Pulp Fiction.)

2> I don't dislike this movie like a lot of people here, but really this is The Academy awarding itself for saying "something meaningful".

3> This has been debated- but I still feel Saving Private Ryan as the superior movie.

equinoxi
02-26-2009, 06:01 AM
These are the films which I think should win and only a few have won.
1984 -- The Killing Fields
1985 -- After Hours
1986 -- Hannah and Her Sisters
1987 -- Raising Arizona
1988 -- Cinema Paradiso
1989 -- When Harry Met Sally...
1990 -- Edward Scissorhands
1991 -- Raise the Red Lantern
1992 -- The Player
1993 -- The Piano
1994 -- Pulp Fiction
1995 -- Twelve Monkeys
1996 -- Breaking the Waves
1997 -- Deconstructing Harry
1998 -- Happiness
1999 -- Being John Malkovich
2000 -- In the Mood for Love
2001 -- Donnie Darko
2002 -- Hero
2003 -- Kill Bill vol. 1
2004 -- Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind
2005 -- Brokeback Mountain
2006 -- V for Vendetta
2007 -- No Country For Old Men
2008 -- Slumdog Millionare

Ian D. Bergkamp
02-26-2009, 10:56 AM
I liked The English Patient.

I did, too. Great performances by Ralph Fiennes, Juliette Binoche and Kristin Scott Thomas, among others.

And I've seen it more than once. :)

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