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-   -   The Trump Administration: A Clusterfuck in the Making (https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=813085)

Budget Player Cadet 01-20-2017 02:23 AM

Washington Post has a solid overview:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...=.b6cb46224e73

madsircool 01-20-2017 03:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Budget Player Cadet (Post 19934441)
Washington Post has a solid overview:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...=.b6cb46224e73

Do you know the difference between an editorial and an opinion piece?

Bridget Burke 01-20-2017 04:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by madsircool (Post 19934486)
Do you know the difference between an editorial and an opinion piece?

Seems pretty accurate to me:

Quote:

Any time a new administration comes into office, there will be some complaining about the new presidentís cabinet picks. But weíre seeing something extraordinary happening now. Donald Trumpís cabinet brings with it a combination of ethical problems, inexperience, hostility to the missions of the departments its members are being called to lead, and plain old ignorance that is simply unprecedented.

This is shaping up to be nothing less than the worst cabinet in American history....

running coach 01-20-2017 06:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by madsircool (Post 19934486)
Do you know the difference between an editorial and an opinion piece?

There are still facts in that article. It's fact that most, if not nearly all of trump's nominees are hostile to the mission of the agency they're being appointed to lead.
It's opinion whether that's good or bad.

An editorial is also an opinion piece. The only difference being is it's a consensus opinion, not an individual.

Bricker 01-20-2017 06:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by running coach (Post 19934578)
There are still facts in that article. It's fact that most, if not nearly all of trump's nominees are hostile to the mission of the agency they're being appointed to lead.
It's opinion whether that's good or bad.

No, I disagree that this is a fact. Either it's not "most," or your notion of hostility is not mine.

Snarky_Kong 01-20-2017 07:11 AM

Yeah, it's not most.

EPA and Labor. I would say Education, but I guess that's arguable. Perry both wanted Energy gone and simultaneously didn't know what the function of the agency was, but has since flip-flopped after someone introduced him to Wikipedia. So that's a maybe, depending on how sincerely you think his change of heart is.

Bricker 01-20-2017 07:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snarky_Kong (Post 19934622)
Yeah, it's not most.

EPA and Labor. I would say Education, but I guess that's arguable. Perry both wanted Energy gone and simultaneously didn't know what the function of the agency was, but has since flip-flopped after someone introduced him to Wikipedia. So that's a maybe, depending on how sincerely you think his change of heart is.

Agreed on EPA and Labor, and I'm not sanguine about Education or Energy. But that's four.

El_Kabong 01-20-2017 08:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bricker (Post 19934612)
No, I disagree that this is a fact. Either it's not "most," or your notion of hostility is not mine.

Agreed. To claim that Trump's cabinet is the worst ever, before they've even done a day's worth of work, seems a bit much, even before getting into the nuances of what makes a 'good' cabinet.

May I propose 'least likely to inspire confidence' instead?

Bricker 01-20-2017 09:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by El_Kabong (Post 19934750)
Agreed. To claim that Trump's cabinet is the worst ever, before they've even done a day's worth of work, seems a bit much, even before getting into the nuances of what makes a 'good' cabinet.

May I propose 'least likely to inspire confidence' instead?

I can't get up enough energy to dispute this.

But part of it is that a few nominees are dragging down the average. Rick Perry *in my opinion) hurts the batting average for the team quite a bit. De Vos does too. And both of these appointments arise (again in my opinion) from a President that himself has no depth of knowledge in these policy areas.

But it's important to recognize that this is my opinion; I won't try to bluster and cloak it with the imprimatur of 'fact.' These are not objectively measurable assessments.

foolsguinea 01-20-2017 09:34 AM

Wow, Bricker, that was well put.

Does Trump have an FDA head yet?

RickJay 01-20-2017 09:35 AM

Nitpick: "DeVos," no space.

In terms of "probability of success of a Cabinet pick" DeVos is probably the worst Cabinet pick of your lifetime. I would strongly argue she is MUCH worse than Perry, and Perry is a terrible choice.

If one goes by "probability of success" there are a lot of low batting averages in that lineup. Tillerson is a potential catastrophe.

Bricker 01-20-2017 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RickJay (Post 19934984)

In terms of "probability of success of a Cabinet pick" DeVos is probably the worst Cabinet pick of your lifetime.

I think McNamera was worse for the country. Earl Butz was abysmal. And surely John Mitchell deserves some censure as well? I don't see the probability that DeVos will run the ship further aground than any of those worthies actually did.

RickJay 01-20-2017 11:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bricker (Post 19935068)
I think McNamera was worse for the country. Earl Butz was abysmal. And surely John Mitchell deserves some censure as well? I don't see the probability that DeVos will run the ship further aground than any of those worthies actually did.

Relative to the importance of her department, she matches anyone. Earl Butz was an world class asshole, but I don't think you can clearly say he was a terrible Secretary of Agriculture. John Mitchell, well, you have me there.

DeVos's department can't start a war, so one could look at it that way. Not all Cabinet positions are equal in impact.

Damuri Ajashi 01-20-2017 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drad dog (Post 19933627)
"Not the best and brightest"? Man you can't tell the difference between Rick Perry and a human you could have a beer with!?

So now Rick Perry isn't a human or just not a human I could have a beer with?

Quote:

"Not the best and brightest"? He thought the job he was up for was as an ambassador to the oil industry. He couldn't remember the name of it 4 years ago, now he doesn't know what they do.
Yeah, that was sort of my point snowflake.

Quote:

It sounds like you are a republican and just trying to save some kind of face, with little touchups and mascara.
Your insistence on ideological purity and partisanship seems much more Republican to me than concluding that Rick Perry might be a decent guy, just not one you want in charge of anything.

John Bredin 01-20-2017 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RickJay (Post 19934984)
In terms of "probability of success of a Cabinet pick" DeVos is probably the worst Cabinet pick of your lifetime. I would strongly argue she is MUCH worse than Perry, and Perry is a terrible choice.

Sessions as Attorney General is IMHO worse than DeVos at Education. The federal Attorney General has a lot more to do with enforcing civil rights laws than the federal Education Department has to do with the overall operation of public schools in the 50 States and thousands of school districts across the country. He can [pauses to check we're in the Pit] fuck up civil rights more than she can fuck up the schools.

Euphonious Polemic 01-20-2017 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RickJay (Post 19934984)
Nitpick: "DeVos," no space.

In terms of "probability of success of a Cabinet pick" DeVos is probably the worst Cabinet pick of your lifetime. I would strongly argue she is MUCH worse than Perry, and Perry is a terrible choice.

.

Well, if she succeeds at getting guns into schools, I bet the incidence of grizzly bear attacks on students will be low. So that'll count as a success.

Rick Kitchen 01-20-2017 01:21 PM

White House web pages concerning Civil Rights, Climate Change and LGBT Rights have already been taken down.

Defensive Indifference 01-20-2017 01:27 PM

Don't worry. He'll replace them with something really special.

running coach 01-20-2017 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Euphonious Polemic (Post 19935820)
Well, if she succeeds at getting guns into schools, I bet the incidence of grizzly bear attacks on students will be low. So that'll count as a success.

Only a good guy with a gun can stop a guy in a grizzly mascot suit.

k9bfriender 01-20-2017 01:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bayard (Post 19935851)
Don't worry. He'll replace them with something really special.

Maybe this?

https://www.heartlightministries.org/

running coach 01-20-2017 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by k9bfriender (Post 19935899)

How much does it cost to phone home from there?

ThelmaLou 01-20-2017 02:16 PM

Truthiness is here.

I Love Me, Vol. I 01-20-2017 02:35 PM

Just heard Trump's inauguration speech. A laundry list of imaginary perks and promises for all. May it henceforth be known as his Pony Speech.

"A Pony in Every Pot!"

elucidator 01-20-2017 03:11 PM

Does Trump appoint the head of Drug Enforcement? Asking for a friend.

elucidator 01-20-2017 03:16 PM

Perry for Ag, duh! He's an actual graduate of an accredited agricultural college, which affords him the honorable status as an "Aggie". In my native Texas, they are widely admired and acclaimed for their intelligence, wisdom, and acute insight.

The Tooth 01-20-2017 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bayard (Post 19935851)
Don't worry. He'll replace them with something really special.

Just making room for the Muslim Registry database. It'll be huge. You'll love it. It'll be great.

The Tooth 01-20-2017 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elucidator (Post 19936254)
Perry for Ag, duh! He's an actual graduate of an accredited agricultural college, which affords him the honorable status as an "Aggie". In my native Texas, they are widely admired and acclaimed for their intelligence, wisdom, and acute insight.

Yes, in Texas.

standingwave 01-20-2017 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elucidator (Post 19936237)
Does Trump appoint the head of Drug Enforcement? Asking for a friend.

The DEA is part of the DOJ, so yes.

Rick Kitchen 01-20-2017 08:28 PM

So apparently the official First Lady page on the White House website was pimping Melania's line of QVC jewelry, until it was pointed out in the press, and it quickly got removed.

running coach 01-20-2017 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick Kitchen (Post 19937027)
So apparently the official First Lady page on the White House website was pimping Melania's line of QVC jewelry, until it was pointed out in the press, and it quickly got removed.

Despite the fact it's not on QVC anymore.

Personal 01-20-2017 08:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick Kitchen (Post 19937027)
So apparently the official First Lady page on the White House website was pimping Melania's line of QVC jewelry, until it was pointed out in the press, and it quickly got removed.

Here is a citation: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.bfc6b54905da

foolsguinea 01-20-2017 11:27 PM

Wow, that is tacky.
How far down the autism spectrum are they?
Or are they just from such an insular little commercialized world that that they think this is normal?

Rick Kitchen 01-20-2017 11:39 PM

He has already redecorated the Oval Office in all gold.

ThelmaLou 01-21-2017 04:23 AM

Worth noting-- quoted from another thread.
Quote:

Originally Posted by madmonk28 (Post 19937579)
The photos come from the Dept of Interior, which has now had its twitter account shut down.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.9dfb4973a3ef


Bricker 01-21-2017 06:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RickJay (Post 19935328)
Relative to the importance of her department, she matches anyone. Earl Butz was an world class asshole, but I don't think you can clearly say he was a terrible Secretary of Agriculture. John Mitchell, well, you have me there.

That's fair. I was trying to weigh overall performance, and I agree that Butz was more of a disaster for non-agriculture reasons. But you agree that Mitchell was worse, and worse in a more influential department, to boot.

So DeVos has that going for her: not the all-time worst cabinet pick in Bricker's living memory. And as number two on the list, perhaps she'll try harder.

Bricker 01-21-2017 06:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Bredin (Post 19935765)
Sessions as Attorney General is IMHO worse than DeVos at Education. The federal Attorney General has a lot more to do with enforcing civil rights laws than the federal Education Department has to do with the overall operation of public schools in the 50 States and thousands of school districts across the country. He can [pauses to check we're in the Pit] fuck up civil rights more than she can fuck up the schools.

The problem here is that "worse," is a judgement call that depends greatly on how your own policy preferences align with the directions the nominee will take. As I observed above:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bricker (Post 19934905)
But it's important to recognize that this is my opinion; I won't try to bluster and cloak it with the imprimatur of 'fact.' These are not objectively measurable assessments.

And you agree as well, I see, adding the caveat "IMHO," to your assessment.

In the case of Sessions, I suspect there's a significant gap between you and me and how we define "civil rights," and what our expectations are for the Attorney General to enforce them. For example, I'd guess (and of course I could be wrong) that you'd call the issue of states passing Voter ID laws to be one of "civil rights," and you want the Justice Department to invoke legal processes challenging states that require voters to furnish photo ID.

I don't. I don't agree that such requirements are impositions on civil rights, and I don't want the Justice Department involved in discouraging such laws.

So in this respect, we probably disagree.

iiandyiiii 01-21-2017 06:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bricker (Post 19937662)
I don't. I don't agree that such requirements are impositions on civil rights, and I don't want the Justice Department involved in discouraging such laws.

So in this respect, we probably disagree.

Do you mean this absolutely in all cases, or just in general? It seems pretty clear that, at least some of the time, such laws are instituted with the intention of making it harder for black people to vote. When/if such a motivation is determined, do you still think the JD shouldn't be involved at all?

elucidator 01-21-2017 10:43 AM

Those court rulings are mere opinions, and do not have the force and legitimacy of settled law. The other ones, like "valid neutral justification" are totally different, and have the advantage of being actual decisions, and not mere commentary. And since you would have to be a lawyer to understand the intricate subtlety of such distinctions, it is best if you just take his word for it.

Rick Kitchen 01-21-2017 05:33 PM

His inaugural ball cake was plaigiarized.

Rick Kitchen 01-21-2017 05:45 PM

Canadians denied entry into the US to attend protest marches, asked their religious beliefs.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a7539341.html

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montre...rder-1.3943996

Walken After Midnight 01-21-2017 06:13 PM

So on his first full day and in his first press conference as president, Trump declares he's in a "running war with the media" (who he describes as being "among the most dishonest human beings on Earth"), accuses photos of lying, and declares that God Himself looked down and said, "we're not gonna let it rain on your speech".

Rick Kitchen 01-21-2017 09:48 PM

Sean Spicer claims ground covers had never been used on the mall before and that that cut down the size of the crowd pictures. He also said that magnetometers used to search the people at the mall cut down on their numbers.

Wrong on both counts.

Fiveyearlurker 01-21-2017 09:57 PM

Trump is demonstrably lying about his inauguration crowd numbers. I'm wondering if people think that he actually believes this lie? Does he know his numbers are lower, and he's just trying to spin it, or does he actually think his numbers are higher?

Steve MB 01-21-2017 09:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick Kitchen (Post 19939477)
Sean Spicer claims ground covers had never been used on the mall before and that that cut down the size of the crowd pictures. He also said that magnetometers used to search the people at the mall cut down on their numbers.

Wrong on both counts.

Crooked words from a witless worm.

Walken After Midnight 01-21-2017 10:16 PM

The role of White House Press Secretary/spokesman should provide some great comedy over the next few years. America will have its very own Comical Ali!

RickJay 01-21-2017 10:59 PM

Get used to it. Trump and his minions are going to do this for four years; lie every single day about absolutely indisputable facts. And the Trumpists will go along with it.

The days of a post truth society are here and honest to God I don't know what the solution is.

Bridget Burke 01-22-2017 01:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Tooth (Post 19936569)
Yes, in Texas.

Alas, I'm afraid that elucidator was being a bit facetious. In Texas, the Aggie Joke is a long-standing tradition.

In its early years, Texas Agricultural & Mechanical college was meant for all-white, all-male future farmers & engineers. Participation in ROTC was compulsory & the Corps became notorious for thickheaded idiocy. That wasn't totally even true back then--but the T-sips in Austin & the elite Rice kids in Houston fostered the legend.

Now A&M has a more diverse student body & some interesting programs like the Institute of Nautical Archaeology & the Center for the Study of the First Americans.

Still, for most Texans, Aggie means "dumbass."

elucidator 01-22-2017 01:12 AM

You know why Baylor has a football team? Aggies get outsmarted by tackling dummies!
Aggie seven course dinner? Six-pak of Pearl beer and a road-kill possum.

Most all of America has no real knowledge or appreciation for Texas culture. Perhaps that is for the best.

Siam Sam 01-22-2017 01:19 AM

With all the troubles and the potential hotspots that are poised to cause trouble, our Weirdo-in-Chief is fixated on crowd size. What a fucking loser moron. It's going to be a long four years but not dull.

elucidator 01-22-2017 01:34 AM

Dull can be OK. Don't mind a spot of dull, now and again. Six, seven years, be all right with me. Sure, why not?


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