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-   -   Elizabeth Warren has Dropped Out. (https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=891129)

Paul in Qatar 03-05-2020 10:01 AM

Elizabeth Warren has Dropped Out.
 
-=Link=-


Now we have a clear fight.

Velocity 03-05-2020 10:09 AM

No woman president for America for quite some time more yet.

Paul in Qatar 03-05-2020 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Velocity (Post 22173377)
No woman president for America for quite some time more yet.

With all these old guys, maybe the Veep will get in.

Happy Lendervedder 03-05-2020 10:12 AM

If I were her, I'd be talking with the Biden people about being running mate. But then publicly endorse Bernie until the veep announcement is made in a few months. That way they can make a big show of the party uniting to take on Trump.

orcenio 03-05-2020 10:12 AM

The race isn't over, but unless Joe has a seriously disastrous "Joe moment" during the primaries, he's going to be your candidate.

Ravenman 03-05-2020 10:16 AM

I bet that moment of Warren saying that Bernie called her a liar on national TV (in her opinion) is looming large on who she may endorse.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/01/15/polit...dio/index.html

FlikTheBlue 03-05-2020 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Velocity (Post 22173377)
No woman president for America for quite some time more yet.

Maybe. Maybe not. Iím still predicting that Klobuchar will be Bidenís running mate. Given his age and health, I think she would have a decent shot at becoming #47 if Biden wins and she is the VP. If I was to bet I think her odds of being the 47th POTUS (46th if Trump wins this year) are probably higher than any other single individual.

ETA. I also predict that Warren is not going to endorse either Biden or Sanders at this time.

Happy Lendervedder 03-05-2020 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlikTheBlue (Post 22173396)
If I was to bet I think her odds of being the 47th POTUS (46th if Trump wins this year) are probably higher than any other single individual.

Was it her bland debate appearances, lackluster polling throughout the past year, or disastrous delegate count that makes you think that?

I'm not saying she won't, stranger things have happened, but what on earth makes her the odds-on favorite in your opinion to be the 46th/47th president over any of the other candidates that lost this year?

FlikTheBlue 03-05-2020 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Happy Lendervedder (Post 22173404)
Was it her bland debate appearances, lackluster polling throughout the past year, or disastrous delegate count that makes you think that?

I'm not saying she won't, stranger things have happened, but what on earth makes her the odds-on favorite in your opinion to be the 46th/47th president over any of the other candidate that lost this year?

Itís mostly my guess that Biden promised her the VP position. I think thereís a small chance he may have even promised her that he would not run in Ď24 and endorse her for that election.

Happy Lendervedder 03-05-2020 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlikTheBlue (Post 22173405)
Itís mostly my guess that Biden promised her the VP position. I think thereís a small chance he may have even promised her that he would not run in Ď24 and endorse her for that election.

Ah, fair enough.

CarnalK 03-05-2020 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Happy Lendervedder (Post 22173384)
If I were her, I'd be talking with the Biden people about being running mate. But then publicly endorse Bernie until the veep announcement is made in a few months. That way they can make a big show of the party uniting to take on Trump.

That sounds slick but Warren has neither the political skill nor cynicism required to pull it off.

Wesley Clark 03-05-2020 10:29 AM

Warren as VP would placate a lot of Bernie supporters, which is good.

RTFirefly 03-05-2020 10:31 AM

Totally expected, but sad anyway.

Since this time Saturday, Steyer, Buttigieg, Klobuchar, Bloomberg, and now Warren have dropped out. At this rate we'll be down to zero candidates by Monday. ;)

Bijou Drains 03-05-2020 10:33 AM

I think Biden really has to get a much younger running mate. Most likely he picks Harris or someone like her. Warren would take attorney general or treasury secretary if offered.

I guess nobody noticed or cares, but Gabbard has not dropped out yet.

RTFirefly 03-05-2020 10:35 AM

I wouldn't want Warren to be Biden's veep. They disagree on a great deal, and being his veep would effectively muzzle her.

In the unlikely event that Bernie wins the nomination and the election, I'd love to see Warren as either Fed chair or Treasury secretary.

RTFirefly 03-05-2020 10:37 AM

I wouldn't want Warren to be Biden's veep. They disagree on a great deal, and being his veep would effectively muzzle her.

In the unlikely event that Bernie wins the nomination and the election, I'd love to see Warren as either Fed chair or Treasury secretary.

E-DUB 03-05-2020 10:37 AM

Warren is from MA, Harris from CA. Amy best meets my "Euchre principle for VP selection". You count on your partner for one trick.

Happy Lendervedder 03-05-2020 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CarnalK (Post 22173409)
That sounds slick but Warren has neither the political skill nor cynicism required to pull it off.

I don't know, all she really has to do is say "I endorse Bernie Sanders," then go back to the Senate and keep her head down for the next couple months. Plus I imagine having the opportunity to be a 78-year-old heartbeat away from the presidency could probably make even the most ingenuous among us a crafty political beast.

orcenio 03-05-2020 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Happy Lendervedder (Post 22173404)
Was it her bland debate appearances, lackluster polling throughout the past year, or disastrous delegate count that makes you think that?

I'm not saying she won't, stranger things have happened, but what on earth makes her the odds-on favorite in your opinion to be the 46th/47th president over any of the other candidates that lost this year?

A poor showing didn't stop Obama from choosing Biden as veep, and Obama's shine pulled through for him on Tuesday. Biden's veep can ride that residual shine onward; and their veep after that, ad infinitum. We'll call it the Obama perpetual motion machine. Can't lose.

Gyrate 03-05-2020 10:39 AM

And yet Tulsi Gabbard keeps going, like that gym membership you haven't gotten around to cancelling.

CarnalK 03-05-2020 10:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Happy Lendervedder (Post 22173433)
I don't know, all she really has to do is say "I endorse Bernie Sanders," then go back to the Senate and keep her head down for the next couple months. Plus I imagine having the opportunity to be a 78-year-old heartbeat away from the presidency could probably make even the most ingenuous among us a crafty political beast.

No way, man. Reporters will constantly be peppering her to talk more about her endorsement and why she's not out stumping, and she'll blow it eventually. You don't recruit people like her for shenanigans.

Folacin 03-05-2020 10:58 AM

I don't understand why people want always try to take effective people out of the Senate.

But if I were going to appoint her to something, I'd let her control her baby - the CFPB. Especially if SCOTUS rules that POTUS can replace the head at will.

Little Nemo 03-05-2020 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gyrate (Post 22173436)
And yet Tulsi Gabbard keeps going, like that gym membership you haven't gotten around to cancelling.

I'm predicting big shifts in momentum. It'll end up being Gabbard versus Weld in the general. You heard it here first.

Do Not Taunt 03-05-2020 11:06 AM

Stacey Abrams would be a good choice: young, ambitious, and put freakin' Georgia in play in 2018. Plus she's not currently in the Senate (or any elective seat), so no loss to bring her up to VP.

Shodan 03-05-2020 11:07 AM

I can't see Warren as a Biden VP. They disagree on everything, and she adds as much charisma to the ticket as day-old cornflakes. Plus I would think you need at least one person on the ticket who doesn't look like the model in a Depends commercial.

The Democratic establishment seems to have put their thumb pretty heavily on the scale for the safe candidate. People don't hate Biden as much as they did Hillary, at least not yet, but that didn't work out well in 2016. Or in 2004 - Kerry got the nod because he was "not-Bush", with the observed results.

Regards,
Shodan

Bijou Drains 03-05-2020 01:50 PM

If Trump polls are not looking good in the summer he would not hesitate to dump Pence for someone like Nikki Haley. In fact he may have already decided to dump Pence.

Happy Lendervedder 03-05-2020 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bijou Drains (Post 22173735)
If Trump polls are not looking good in the summer he would not hesitate to dump Pence for someone like Nikki Haley. In fact he may have already decided to dump Pence.

Can't link to it right now, but there's a CNN talking head who has said exactly this. Trump has put pence in charge of the coronavirus as a set-up for him to fail. Then on the day the Dems introduce their nominee at the convention, Trump calls a press conference in the Rose garden to announce he's replacing Pence with Haley.

RickJay 03-05-2020 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gyrate (Post 22173436)
And yet Tulsi Gabbard keeps going, like that gym membership you haven't gotten around to cancelling.

She''s still working on that job at Fox News.

ZipperJJ 03-05-2020 02:14 PM

I'm sad, but also not surprised. I gave "a lot" of money to Warren's campaign. As in, I usually gave $2 or $5 when they asked. I went on my own and gave a whole $15 the night of that awesome debate.

I'm glad she stopped, looking at the numbers, but super bummed that the numbers got to where they were. I don't know what people were missing when it came to Warren as a candidate. To me, she was perfect.

I don't know who to vote for next week in the OH primary. I almost kinda think I don't care (they're both (yes, forget Gabbard)) fine to me. I might just vote for Warren anyway...I'd stay home but there's a local issue I want to support.

FlikTheBlue 03-05-2020 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZipperJJ (Post 22173763)
I'm sad, but also not surprised. I gave "a lot" of money to Warren's campaign. As in, I usually gave $2 or $5 when they asked. I went on my own and gave a whole $15 the night of that awesome debate.

I'm glad she stopped, looking at the numbers, but super bummed that the numbers got to where they were. I don't know what people were missing when it came to Warren as a candidate. To me, she was perfect.

I don't know who to vote for next week in the OH primary. I almost kinda think I don't care (they're both (yes, forget Gabbard)) fine to me. I might just vote for Warren anyway...I'd stay home but there's a local issue I want to support.

The way this primary has gone down has me rethinking some of my baseline assumptions. Iím now of the opinion that what happened is that Sanders, both in 2016 and this year, has stunted the liberal wing of the Democratic party. Rather than looking at Sanders being the last liberal standing and saying that Warren was splitting his vote, it could very well be that it was Sanders who has been taking votes from other liberal Democrats like Warren. In another universe in which Sanders dropped out last year for whatever reason, we might be down to Warren vs. Biden in a 50/50 matchup.

Left Hand of Dorkness 03-05-2020 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZipperJJ (Post 22173763)
I'm glad she stopped, looking at the numbers, but super bummed that the numbers got to where they were. I don't know what people were missing when it came to Warren as a candidate. To me, she was perfect.

All my negatives for her were negatives about her personally (she's said some things during the campaign that struck me as disingenuous about other candidates), or very minor policy differences. For all measures I can think of, she was our best option for president starting in 2021, would do the best job, run the executive branch with the most competence and efficacy.

But our campaigns are super fucked up. And they don't look to be any less fucked anytime soon.

I'm pretty sad that she's out. My wife is furious.

Shodan 03-05-2020 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Happy Lendervedder (Post 22173738)
Can't link to it right now, but there's a CNN talking head who has said exactly this. Trump has put pence in charge of the coronavirus as a set-up for him to fail. Then on the day the Dems introduce their nominee at the convention, Trump calls a press conference in the Rose garden to announce he's replacing Pence with Haley.

More fake news from CNN.

Regards,
Shodan

Indyellen 03-05-2020 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlikTheBlue (Post 22173771)
The way this primary has gone down has me rethinking some of my baseline assumptions. Iím now of the opinion that what happened is that Sanders, both in 2016 and this year, has stunted the liberal wing of the Democratic party. Rather than looking at Sanders being the last liberal standing and saying that Warren was splitting his vote, it could very well be that it was Sanders who has been taking votes from other liberal Democrats like Warren. In another universe in which Sanders dropped out last year for whatever reason, we might be down to Warren vs. Biden in a 50/50 matchup.

Flik, I hadn't thought of that, but that's very possible. Had Sanders dropped out after his heart attack, it would likely be Warren v. Biden.

ZipperJJ 03-05-2020 02:38 PM

I was surprised recently when I was talking to my brother about one of the debates, and he said he didn't know much about Warren and hadn't really considered her. My brother's a 42-year-old very 'woke' guy with a good head on his shoulders and almost in lock step with me when it comes to politics. My boyfriend had the same non-reaction as my brother, he's also a 42-year-old white guy with politics very close to mine. Neither of them are "Bernie Bros" but they would also consider themselves Democratic Socialists, like myself. I don't know if they were gung-ho for any candidate yet. I think if it were closer, I would have convinced them to vote for Warren in the primary. It's interesting to note that whatever campaigning Warren was doing, it didn't reach those two in any meaningful capacity.

Hari Seldon 03-05-2020 02:39 PM

She was my favorite. I identify as a wonk she is the wonkiest candidate I have ever seen. But now it is a straight head to head contest. It looks like Biden has the inside track, but a lot can change in a month. Try to picture what the race looked like a month ago.

Great Antibob 03-05-2020 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shodan (Post 22173786)
More fake news from CNN.

It's somebody's opinion on Trump's strategy.

That's neither fake nor was it presented as news. It was presented on CNN but it was an opinion from a talking head and not from the network.

Maybe you were making a joke, in which case I apologise, but every significant part of this post is incorrect, which is impressive in its own right.

Locrian 03-05-2020 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlikTheBlue (Post 22173405)
Itís mostly my guess that Biden promised her the VP position. I think thereís a small chance he may have even promised her that he would not run in Ď24 and endorse her for that election.

^^ This.

I've been hoping for a Biden/Warren ticket for a while. An experienced politician like Biden and a new progressive woman in the WH is a huge step forward.

madmonk28 03-05-2020 04:29 PM

With a combined age of 147. My hope is that Biden would promise to make his VP pick someone with politics more in line with Warren’s but young.

Bryan Ekers 03-05-2020 05:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by madmonk28 (Post 22173977)
With a combined age of 147. My hope is that Biden would promise to make his VP pick someone with politics more in line with Warrenís but young.

Will, if something happens to both of them, Nancy Pelosi is next in line.

Of course, now that's a combined age of 226.

DinoR 03-05-2020 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by E-DUB (Post 22173430)
Amy best meets my "Euchre principle for VP selection". You count on your partner for one trick.

That truly was a laugh out loud moment. Amy is even from a part of the country where I suspect she would make a good actual euchre partner.

River Hippie 03-05-2020 06:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Do Not Taunt (Post 22173472)
Stacey Abrams would be a good choice: young, ambitious, and put freakin' Georgia in play in 2018. Plus she's not currently in the Senate (or any elective seat), so no loss to bring her up to VP.

I was hearing a lot about her being a VP pick and I believe she already said she'd be open to it. They may want someone with more name recognition among people who aren't politics junkies. Not saying she's unknown but if I polled my co-workers I'd bet few have heard of her or if they know the name they might not be able to say what her experience has been.

madmonk28 03-05-2020 07:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bryan Ekers (Post 22174126)
Will, if something happens to both of them, Nancy Pelosi is next in line.

Of course, now that's a combined age of 226.

The future of the party.

RioRico 03-05-2020 08:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by madmonk28 (Post 22174239)
The future of the party.

Divide by ten. Okay, by eight, then. But I've got one word for the future: demographics.

madsircool 03-05-2020 08:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RioRico (Post 22174359)
Divide by ten. Okay, by eight, then. But I've got one word for the future: demographics.

Those same demographics have elected consecutive PAN Presidents. This tells us nothing.

DSeid 03-05-2020 08:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Indyellen (Post 22173794)
Flik, I hadn't thought of that, but that's very possible. Had Sanders dropped out after his heart attack, it would likely be Warren v. Biden.

And I'd be betting on her in that case.

Two comments re her announcement today -

1) Buttigieg just didn't comment as people shouted about 2024, but it would have been nice for him to correct them with a comment that the job will be the Democratic incumbent's until 2028. She OTOH mentioned after what was to some listeners an emotional moment about all the pinkie swears to little girls that they'll have to wait four more years ... which to me implicitly assumes a loss by the D nominee or a one-termer at best. Was that meant as a dis?

2) She talked about getting into the race thinking that there was another place to be than the progressive and moderate lanes occupied by Sanders and Biden respectively, but she was wrong. She is wrong now. Her fatal error was going all in on the progressive lane, trying to out-Bernie Bernie rather than staying consistently true to her own brand. If she had done the latter instead of trying to get in front of the Sander healthcare parade, she might have found that sweet spot

thorny locust 03-05-2020 09:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RTFirefly (Post 22173414)
At this rate we'll be down to zero candidates by Monday. ;)

Hey, have we got time left to start over with a new batch?





(yeah, I know we don't. Just dreaming -- )

Ulf the Unwashed 03-05-2020 09:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DSeid (Post 22174396)
And I'd be betting on her in that case.

Two comments re her announcement today -

1) Buttigieg just didn't comment as people shouted about 2024, but it would have been nice for him to correct them with a comment that the job will be the Democratic incumbent's until 2028. She OTOH mentioned after what was to some listeners an emotional moment about all the pinkie swears to little girls that they'll have to wait four more years ... which to me implicitly assumes a loss by the D nominee or a one-termer at best. Was that meant as a dis?

2) She talked about getting into the race thinking that there was another place to be than the progressive and moderate lanes occupied by Sanders and Biden respectively, but she was wrong. She is wrong now. Her fatal error was going all in on the progressive lane, trying to out-Bernie Bernie rather than staying consistently true to her own brand. If she had done the latter instead of trying to get in front of the Sander healthcare parade, she might have found that sweet spot

I also noticed your point number 1 in Warren's speech. I hope it was not a dis, just getting emotional in an emotional moment, but like you I'm not positive about that.

Regarding point 2, I agree. Seems like in the popular imagination at least there is a lot of room between Sanders and Biden. She could've said "We don't need a corporate Democrat, but on the other hand we do need a Democrat," and staked out a middle position that no one else was occupying. She didn't do it.

My wife is exactly the kind of voter Warren appealed most to--in her fifties, white, sort-of suburban, generally liberal, masters degree, huge supporter of HRC. She really liked Warren at first, but the shine came off the shinola for her over the last few months. Interesting to watch the trajectory...

Elendil's Heir 03-05-2020 10:45 PM

Very sorry she dropped out. I thought she was the best of the field heading into Super Tuesday. I doubt either Biden or Bernie would pick her as a running mate, given all of their ages, but I could see her as a Treasury or Commerce secretary, or AG, in the next Dem Cabinet.

sps49sd 03-06-2020 12:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bijou Drains (Post 22173420)
I think Biden really has to get a much younger running mate. Most likely he picks Harris or someone like her....

Harris? Why? Blacks didn't vote for her. Women didn't vote for her. Progressives didn't vote for her.
For good reason.

Johanna 03-06-2020 05:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by madsircool (Post 22174366)
Those same demographics have elected consecutive PAN Presidents.

:confused:
Vicente Fox and Felipe Calderůn?


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