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Kobal2 07-16-2019 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Typo Negative (Post 21754290)


Hey, fuck you Kellyane. No disrespect.

Monty 07-16-2019 07:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Typo Negative (Post 21754290)
Kellyanne Conway says she meant 'no disrespect' with question about reporter's ethnicity

Quote:

"This was meant with no disrespect," Conway wrote to her 2.8 million Twitter followers, referring to her exchange with the reporter during a press gaggle earlier in the day at the White House.

"We are all from somewhere else 'originally.' I asked the question to answer the question and volunteered my own ethnicity: Italian and Irish," she continued. "Like many, I am proud of my ethnicity, love the USA & grateful to God to be an American."
Yeah, that's a good one. Go with that.


Of course she's missing a few nifty details. White people, not even Italian and Irish white people, were subjected to Jim Crow, nor held in slavery before that. Nor are white people routinely treated as though they're from another country as many Asian-Americans are.

Oh, and why isn't the proper answer to her "question" NOT "I'm American, you bigoted piece of crap"?

manson1972 07-16-2019 07:18 PM

I'm from Ohio originally, and now I live in Maryland. Is that what she meant?

Moron.

running coach 07-16-2019 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kobal2 (Post 21754354)
Hey, fuck you Kellyane. No disrespect.

That's no way to treat a Desiccated-American.

Sherrerd 07-16-2019 08:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick Kitchen (Post 21753941)
Congressman Andy Harris says that when Individual 1 said that the liberal Congresswomen should go back to where they came from, he meant their Congressional districts. Even though Individual 1 himself said, right their in his tweet, "country".
https://www.baltimoresun.com/politic...boq-story.html

Quote:

Originally Posted by Typo Negative (Post 21754290)
Kellyanne Conway says she meant 'no disrespect' with question about reporter's ethnicity
Quote:

"This was meant with no disrespect," Conway wrote to her 2.8 million Twitter followers, referring to her exchange with the reporter during a press gaggle earlier in the day at the White House.
"We are all from somewhere else 'originally.' I asked the question to answer the question and volunteered my own ethnicity: Italian and Irish," she continued. "Like many, I am proud of my ethnicity, love the USA & grateful to God to be an American."
Yeah, that's a good one. Go with that.

These "explanations" are so epically, blatantly, radically bad, that they must be something other than what they literally purport to be: means of justifying atrocious speech and conduct. That's what they seem to be, but that's not what they are.

They must, instead, be intended to be seen as a means of declaring WE HAVE ALL THE POWER AND WE WILL DO EXACTLY AS WE PLEASE.

They are a giant "fuck you" to all non-deplorables. They are the Bully's Boast.

While it's important both to use whatever's left of the rule of law against these disgusting individuals (including using the ballot box to ensure they have no place in government), we should also keep in awareness that these self-aggrandizers are contemptible.

That contempt can armor us against the common reaction to being bullied---to wonder if we should attempt to placate the bully, or to fear the bully, or to look for ways to stay out of the bully's way. We should not react that way; we should react with resolve to get these people out of positions of power. Kellyanne Conway, Andy Harris, and all their ilk are despicable. They need to go.



https://www.air.org/resource/bullying-prevention

foolsguinea 07-16-2019 08:28 PM

If it were an exotic name, or a hard to place name like DeVos or Kobach, I could understand Ms. Conway's question. It might be impolite in that particular context, but still, a fair question.

The reporter's name was Feinberg. Kellyanne has lived in NYC, she presumably has seen an ornamental German-language name before.

Sherrerd 07-16-2019 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by foolsguinea (Post 21754582)
If it were an exotic name, or a hard to place name like DeVos or Kobach, I could understand Ms. Conway's question. It might be impolite in that particular context, but still, a fair question.

The reporter's name was Feinberg. Kellyanne has lived in NYC, she presumably has seen an ornamental German-language name before.

Of course. Conway was asserting her first-class citizenship, and putting the second-class citizen in his place.

The Tooth 07-16-2019 08:55 PM

Trump said they hate America, based on nothing. How can that be meant with anything other than disrespect?

Euphonious Polemic 07-16-2019 09:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Tooth (Post 21754621)
Trump said they hate America, based on nothing. How can that be meant with anything other than disrespect?

They hate Trump.

Trump IS America.

Dear Leader Trump and America are the exact same thing.

Therefore, they hate America.

QED

Skypist 07-16-2019 11:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sherrerd (Post 21754547)
These "explanations" are so epically, blatantly, radically bad, that they must be something other than what they literally purport to be: means of justifying atrocious speech and conduct. That's what they seem to be, but that's not what they are.

They must, instead, be intended to be seen as a means of declaring WE HAVE ALL THE POWER AND WE WILL DO EXACTLY AS WE PLEASE.

They are a giant "fuck you" to all non-deplorables. They are the Bully's Boast.

This seems to be about right.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sherrerd (Post 21754547)
We should not react that way; we should react with resolve to get these people out of positions of power. Kellyanne Conway, Andy Harris, and all their ilk are despicable. They need to go.



https://www.air.org/resource/bullying-prevention

I don't know how to do that. I can call my congressman or supposed representative, who is not going to do anything. I'll be lucky to get a form letter that says, "Yeah, yeah, whatever. Pipe down." I'd have to spend all my free hours between now and November 3, 2020, going door to door or making phone calls and probably still not get anyone to change their minds. I don't have any money so can't buy any TV ads or get any attention. I'd like to donate to some candidates or organizations, but they either can't or won't do what really needs to be done. They will get distracted and trip over their own feet, politely handing "him" the ammunition to make them sound like the bad guys.

It feels like I'm being forced to lie in the street with a big 18-wheeler just coming to run me down. There is nowhere else to go and nothing to be done. There will be lawsuits to fight every atrocity, but eventually "he" will get his way because he always does, it's just a matter of whether it will be now or in a few months. I don't know what to do with this feeling of despair.

And it's not about some petty political disagreement. It's about a bully who can and will insist that everyone live the way he wants them to, with no health care coverage, no protection for preexisting conditions (he says he will do something about that but I won't hold my breath), enact racist and inhumane policies, lie about socialism, abortion, etc.

I'm just so tired of it. I have no representation and no voice at all and I guess I never did but just now realized it at the age of almost 50. It's so lonely.

I'm so tired of the constant insistence that people with similar political beliefs as mine don't deserve representation and are just crazy and should be stomped down.

Snowboarder Bo 07-17-2019 12:02 AM

They are punching down; get yourself prepared to punch up.

Kobal2 07-17-2019 05:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skypist (Post 21754862)
I'm so tired of the constant insistence that people with similar political beliefs as mine don't deserve representation and are just crazy and should be stomped down.


You sound like a tired, poor, huddled mass yearning to be free. Wish there was some place those could be tempest-toss'd.

Ludovic 07-17-2019 06:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sherrerd (Post 21754547)
These "explanations" are so epically, blatantly, radically bad, that they must be something other than what they literally purport to be: means of justifying atrocious speech and conduct. That's what they seem to be, but that's not what they are.

They must, instead, be intended to be seen as a means of declaring WE HAVE ALL THE POWER AND WE WILL DO EXACTLY AS WE PLEASE.

Yeah, it's not even right to call it gaslighting at this point because they know you won't believe them. They're just saying "fuck you, I'm in charge."

Speaking of Trump's military parades, (we weren't, but now I am), some people say that that is the whole point of goose-stepping in totalitarian regimes: the leaders are saying "I can make my men perform a silly walk and everyone needs to pretend to take them seriously or I'll kill them," rather than saying "look at this beautiful display of synchronized walking."

CalMeacham 07-17-2019 06:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sherrerd (Post 21754547)
These "explanations" are so epically, blatantly, radically bad, that they must be something other than what they literally purport to be: means of justifying atrocious speech and conduct. That's what they seem to be, but that's not what they are.

They must, instead, be intended to be seen as a means of declaring WE HAVE ALL THE POWER AND WE WILL DO EXACTLY AS WE PLEASE.

They are a giant "fuck you" to all non-deplorables. They are the Bully's Boast.

While it's important both to use whatever's left of the rule of law against these disgusting individuals (including using the ballot box to ensure they have no place in government), we should also keep in awareness that these self-aggrandizers are contemptible.

That contempt can armor us against the common reaction to being bullied---to wonder if we should attempt to placate the bully, or to fear the bully, or to look for ways to stay out of the bully's way. We should not react that way; we should react with resolve to get these people out of positions of power. Kellyanne Conway, Andy Harris, and all their ilk are despicable. They need to go.



https://www.air.org/resource/bullying-prevention



Have a look at this Salon piece by Heather Digby Parton -- https://www.salon.com/2019/07/15/tru...election-plan/


Quote:

I noted last week that Trump had mentioned in passing that he wanted to take reporters to a recently cleaned-up facility featuring happy, well-fed children to prove how "fake" the reports of cruel and disgusting conditions were. So last Friday officials rounded up the vice president and a couple of senators, including Lindsey Graham, R-S.C., and Mike Lee, R-Utah, and brought them in for an "inspection." The propaganda ploy was exactly as one might expect: The kids were in a new, air-conditioned facility and seemed to be well cared for.

But even after observing and writing about the Trump administration's depraved use of xenophobia, racism and general fear-mongering for years now, I'm never quite prepared for the depths to which they will sink. I assumed they were doing this because they believed they needed to reassure their own voters of their basic humanity. I was wrong. The visit to the kiddie-camp was a little sop to some embarrassed churchgoers and the press. What Team Trump really wanted their voters to see was another camp — the one with hundreds of single, dark-skinned men in overcrowded cages, sleeping on concrete floors, desperately trying to get the attention of the exalted visitors from Washington to let them know what was going on.

As I see it, Trump officials wanted to reassure their voters that they were treating the scary brown people with much cruelty as they could get away with.



...


Pence objected to media coverage of this event over the weekend, complaining that they failed to show the nice pictures of the happy children and instead focused on the misery of all those men caged up like animals. But you'll notice that he immediately turns to the claim that many of the men were criminals, a charge Trump himself made over the weekend as well.


...


I'll say it again: If they hadn't wanted people to see those men being held in inhumane conditions, they wouldn't have gone there with the press in tow.




Lindsey Graham made it very clear what they were up to. “I don’t care if they have to stay in these facilities for 400 days," he said. "We’re not going to let those men go that I saw. It would be dangerous.” That's right: Apparently he could tell that they were dangerous just by looking at them.


So it's no coincidence, I'm sure, that in the same week Trump announced that ICE would be conducting raids around the country to round up alleged criminals who have managed to avoid being thrown in cages, after which they will either be jailed or deported or both. Reports from major cities show that immigrant communities are now living in the grip of a terrible fear, which is half the point of doing it. The other half is to make Republican voters believe that Donald Trump is as tough and macho as he constantly proclaims himself to be.

I was prepared to call Pence's border tour the most insidious public demonstration of bigotry we'd seen in many a moon. But Trump took it to a whole other level on Sunday with his openly racist tweets about the four freshman Democratic women of color, in which he basically told them to go back to their shithole countries.

...

This escalation of bigotry is no coincidence. I'm not saying that Trump sat down and strategized all this. He doesn't do that. But he has a well-honed feral instinct about the ugly underbelly of American life and he knows how to make it work for him.

Procrustus 07-17-2019 07:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CalMeacham (Post 21755096)
Have a look at this Salon piece by Heather Digby Parton -- https://www.salon.com/2019/07/15/tru...election-plan/

Many people who have associated with Trump have seen their reputations destroyed. Has anyone fallen further than Senator Graham?

dropzone 07-17-2019 07:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by foolsguinea (Post 21754582)
If it were an exotic name, or a hard to place name like DeVos or Kobach, I could understand Ms. Conway's question. It might be impolite in that particular context, but still, a fair question.

The reporter's name was Feinberg. Kellyanne has lived in NYC, she presumably has seen an ornamental German-language name before.

Worse yet, it is a German Jewish name. Her question was a warning, "We have our eyes on you, Jew."

Kobal2 07-17-2019 08:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lindsey Not_Lohan
"We’re not going to let those men go that I saw. It would be dangerous.” That's right: Apparently he could tell that they were dangerous just by looking at them.


Shades of late Bush era Gitmo rationalization there. "Well, they probably weren't terrorists when we nabbed them but now that we've tortured them and held them incommunicado for years, we can't release them, they really hate us !"

Rick Kitchen 07-17-2019 02:06 PM

Congressman Mike Kelly: "I'm a person of color. I'm white."
https://www.yahoo.com/news/gop-congr...175120812.html

Apparently Congressman Kelly is unaware of the discrimination against Irish people in this country. Kelly is an Irish name, even though he tries to claim he's Anglo-Saxon.

Knowed Out 07-17-2019 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Tooth (Post 21754621)
Trump said they hate America, based on nothing. How can that be meant with anything other than disrespect?

He says what he wants to be true. Anybody who disagrees with him deserves disrespect. Therefore, lies about his opponents become truth because they deserve it for being mean to him.

Repeat a lie often enough, and it becomes the truth.

Followers have gone from "Trump speaks the truth" to "Trump is so funny!" Then they say Obama and the Clintons did the same thing. Anything to avoid buyer's remorse.

Kobal2 07-17-2019 03:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick Kitchen (Post 21755944)
Congressman Mike Kelly: "I'm a person of color. I'm white."
https://www.yahoo.com/news/gop-congr...175120812.html

Apparently Congressman Kelly is unaware of the discrimination against Irish people in this country. Kelly is an Irish name, even though he tries to claim he's Anglo-Saxon.


Nah, he's pretending that the phrase "people/persons of colour" is really meaningless or to not understand that it describes non-white people for historico-cultural reasons. Further, he pretends to not understand why it matters, or why telling non-whites to "go back to their country" is beyond the fucking pale because hey, he's a person of colour by his revelatory definition and if somebody said that to him (not that anyone ever would, or did) he wouldn't be offended. Why do these bitches have such thin skin, amirite ?

Steve MB 07-17-2019 04:34 PM

Alabama Secretary of State John Merrill explains why there ain't no more good shows on the teevee:

Quote:

There are no more good TV shows on like ‘Gunsmoke,’ ‘Bonanza,’ ‘The Virginian,’ ‘Andy Griffith,’ ‘I Love Lucy.’ We don’t have those shows anymore. We’re too interested in homosexual activities.

74westy 07-17-2019 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yahoo news
In a statement Wednesday, Kelly suggested his conversation with the Vice News reporter was “mischaracterized” and missed his “broader point.”

“We’re all created equal,” the statement said. “It’s time to stop fixating on our differences and focus on what unites us.”

Telling US citizens to, "go back where they came from" is focusing on what unites us and complaining about it is fixating on our differences. Did I get that right?

Ukulele Ike 07-17-2019 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve MB (Post 21756189)
Alabama Secretary of State John Merrill explains why there ain't no more good shows on the teevee:

Hell, I still watch Gumsmoke, Bonanza, and The Virginian for the hot gay sex parts. Subtext, people.

Kobal2 07-17-2019 06:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve MB (Post 21756189)
Alabama Secretary of State John Merrill explains why there ain't no more good shows on the teevee:


Piss off, you panderer. You were born in 1963. You've never watched Gunsmoke, I Love Lucy or the Andy Griffith Show in your entire misbegotten life.

Sherrerd 07-17-2019 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve MB (Post 21756189)
Alabama Secretary of State John Merrill explains why there ain't no more good shows on the teevee:
Quote:

There are no more good TV shows on like ‘Gunsmoke,’ ‘Bonanza,’ ‘The Virginian,’ ‘Andy Griffith,’ ‘I Love Lucy.’ We don’t have those shows anymore. We’re too interested in homosexual activities.

Wow, that last sentence came out of, literally, nowhere.

Merrill apparently doesn't realize what he just revealed about himself.

Sherrerd 07-17-2019 06:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skypist (Post 21754862)
... I don't know how to do that. I can call my congressman or supposed representative, who is not going to do anything. I'll be lucky to get a form letter that says, "Yeah, yeah, whatever. Pipe down." I'd have to spend all my free hours between now and November 3, 2020, going door to door or making phone calls and probably still not get anyone to change their minds. I don't have any money so can't buy any TV ads or get any attention. I'd like to donate to some candidates or organizations, but they either can't or won't do what really needs to be done. They will get distracted and trip over their own feet, politely handing "him" the ammunition to make them sound like the bad guys.

It feels like I'm being forced to lie in the street with a big 18-wheeler just coming to run me down. There is nowhere else to go and nothing to be done. There will be lawsuits to fight every atrocity, but eventually "he" will get his way because he always does, it's just a matter of whether it will be now or in a few months. I don't know what to do with this feeling of despair.

And it's not about some petty political disagreement. It's about a bully who can and will insist that everyone live the way he wants them to, with no health care coverage, no protection for preexisting conditions (he says he will do something about that but I won't hold my breath), enact racist and inhumane policies, lie about socialism, abortion, etc.

I'm just so tired of it. I have no representation and no voice at all and I guess I never did but just now realized it at the age of almost 50. It's so lonely.

I'm so tired of the constant insistence that people with similar political beliefs as mine don't deserve representation and are just crazy and should be stomped down.


Remember:
  • There are a lot more of us than there are of them. Trump's hardcore white-supremacist base is, at most, around a quarter of the country--that's a lot, but it's far from being a majority. At least half of white people are sane and non-deplorable.
  • A lot of people (including well-known figures such as Obama) have their eyes on the election process, to make it as fair as possible. We have a real chance in 2020 to get rid of Trump and the worst of his enablers.
  • If you, merely through conversations and on-line activity, can influence even one person to get registered and vote for Democrats, you'll have doubled the impact of your own vote. And you may well influence more than one person, over the course of the coming months.

Don't despair. Instead, focus on throwing the bums out.

Rick Kitchen 07-17-2019 07:47 PM

Trump rally participants chant "Send her back" about Ilhan Omar.
https://www.thedailybeast.com/trump-...rep-ilhan-omar

Skypist 07-17-2019 08:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sherrerd (Post 21756341)
Remember:
  • There are a lot more of us than there are of them. Trump's hardcore white-supremacist base is, at most, around a quarter of the country--that's a lot, but it's far from being a majority. At least half of white people are sane and non-deplorable.
  • A lot of people (including well-known figures such as Obama) have their eyes on the election process, to make it as fair as possible. We have a real chance in 2020 to get rid of Trump and the worst of his enablers.
  • If you, merely through conversations and on-line activity, can influence even one person to get registered and vote for Democrats, you'll have doubled the impact of your own vote. And you may well influence more than one person, over the course of the coming months.

Don't despair. Instead, focus on throwing the bums out.

This is very encouraging. I hope it works out. It's easy to get sucked into the pit of despair. It seems like it's been so long and still a long way to go, especially if 2020 goes how I fear. I wish there was some way to reach the potential voters who are not paying attention! And Democrats running for election really, really need to hire better PR advisors IMO.

Morgyn 07-17-2019 09:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kobal2 (Post 21756334)
Piss off, you panderer. You were born in 1963. You've never watched Gunsmoke, I Love Lucy or the Andy Griffith Show in your entire misbegotten life.

Maybe not first run, but reruns. I was born in 1964, and I've seen multiple episodes of all three shows. (NB: Alabama Secretary of State John Merrill is an asshole. But you knew that.)

digs 07-17-2019 10:08 PM

Quote:

There are no more good TV shows on like ‘Gunsmoke,’ ‘Bonanza,’ ‘The Virginian,’ ‘Andy Griffith,’ ‘I Love Lucy.’ We don’t have those shows anymore. We’re too interested in homosexual activities.
Look, the rebuttal to that can be summed up in three words: Floyd the barber.

Euphonious Polemic 07-17-2019 10:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve MB (Post 21756189)
Alabama Secretary of State John Merrill explains why there ain't no more good shows on the teevee:

Quote:

There are no more good TV shows on like ‘Gunsmoke,’ ‘Bonanza,’ ‘The Virginian,’ ‘Andy Griffith,’ ‘I Love Lucy.’ We don’t have those shows anymore. We’re too interested in homosexual activities.

I think what he meant was "Why does every show on TV these days make me think of hot steamy man-on-man sex? Constant. Constant . nothing but sex with men, all the time.

Monty 07-17-2019 11:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by digs (Post 21756653)
Look, the rebuttal to that can be summed up in three words: Floyd the barber.


I hated that character almost as much as I hated Aunt Bee. Seriously, how on Earth did those two characters become so popular and how on Earth did those two "actors" get jobs as actors?

Kobal2 07-17-2019 11:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morgyn (Post 21756601)
Maybe not first run, but reruns. I was born in 1964, and I've seen multiple episodes of all three shows.


But like... by choice ? No gun to your head or nothing ?! :o

digs 07-17-2019 11:59 PM

Between Floyd and Lost in Space's Dr. Smith and Paul Lynde on Bewitched, my third grade psyche was slapped with a trifecta of "Not necessarily gay, but certainly effeminate" actors.

I think some UECs (Uptight Evangelical Congressmen) were affected, and soon adopted Suspiciously Wide Stances in airport restrooms.

Snowboarder Bo 07-18-2019 12:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sherrerd (Post 21756341)
Remember:
  • There are a lot more of us than there are of them. Trump's hardcore white-supremacist base is, at most, around a quarter of the country--that's a lot, but it's far from being a majority. At least half of white people are sane and non-deplorable.
  • A lot of people (including well-known figures such as Obama) have their eyes on the election process, to make it as fair as possible. We have a real chance in 2020 to get rid of Trump and the worst of his enablers.
  • If you, merely through conversations and on-line activity, can influence even one person to get registered and vote for Democrats, you'll have doubled the impact of your own vote. And you may well influence more than one person, over the course of the coming months.

Don't despair. Instead, focus on throwing the bums out.

And you will lose with this strategy.

They are prepared to kill people to get their way. Some of them have recently (within the past month) declared that they will murder anyone who tries to stop them, even law enforcement officers.

Until the left is willing, ready and able to defend themselves and their ideals with the same level of gusto, the left is doomed to lose.

Snowboarder Bo 07-18-2019 12:28 AM

For instance: what will you do if the bums refuse to leave?

eschereal 07-18-2019 12:33 AM

in an unguarded moment,
CALLER: In 2019, there's gonna be a $1 trillion deficit. Trump doesn't really care about that. He's not really a fiscal conservative. We have to acknowledge that Trump has been cruelly used.
LIMBAUGH: Nobody is a fiscal conservative anymore. All this talk about concern for the deficit and the budget has been bogus for as long as it's been around.
a big fat idiot pulls back the curtain

foolsguinea 07-18-2019 12:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dropzone (Post 21755149)
Worse yet, it is a German Jewish name. Her question was a warning, "We have our eyes on you, Jew."

Yeah, I probably should have spelled that out.

A lot of Jews got "ornamental" German names when family names became a thing.
Goldfarb
Silberberg
Gruenwald
Rosenfeld

and so forth.

Snowboarder Bo 07-18-2019 12:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eschereal (Post 21756802)
in an unguarded moment,
CALLER: In 2019, there's gonna be a $1 trillion deficit. Trump doesn't really care about that. He's not really a fiscal conservative. We have to acknowledge that Trump has been cruelly used.
LIMBAUGH: Nobody is a fiscal conservative anymore. All this talk about concern for the deficit and the budget has been bogus for as long as it's been around.
a big fat idiot pulls back the curtain

From your link:
Quote:

As I've noted before, there is a clear and present danger to the GOP's willingness to abandon at least some of its first principles in order to keep Trump happy -- or, more accurately, in order to keep him from turning on them and siccing the GOP base on their reelection campaigns. And that danger is this: If the party is built solely around a person without any underlying, unwavering principles, then it's not a party at all. It's a cult of personality.
Aye; call it what it is.

foolsguinea 07-18-2019 12:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kobal2 (Post 21756334)
Piss off, you panderer. You were born in 1963. You've never watched Gunsmoke, I Love Lucy or the Andy Griffith Show in your entire misbegotten life.

I'm about ten years younger, and I saw all of those shows in syndication as a wee thing.

Kobal2 07-18-2019 06:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snowboarder Bo (Post 21756793)
And you will lose with this strategy.

They are prepared to kill people to get their way. Some of them have recently (within the past month) declared that they will murder anyone who tries to stop them, even law enforcement officers.

Until the left is willing, ready and able to defend themselves and their ideals with the same level of gusto, the left is doomed to lose.


I'm thinking the folks agitating for Civil War 2.0 would be surprised at how it would turn out in practice. Which isn't altogether surprising : they were surprised the first time around, too. As were their more recent, more teutonic heroes.

History is nothing if not an often tiresome repetition. They always see themselves as wolves declaring war on sheep. They always forget that when the sheep are backed in a corner, they turn around and trample the shit out of the wolf.


Quote:

Originally Posted by eschereal


I'll note that even as they start to tentatively open their eyes, for that caller it's still not "Trump fucking lied to us". It's "Trump has been cruelly used".

Brings to my mind the early French Revolutionary trope (well, throughout the feudal period really, but it was more dramatic then) that no matter how bad things got or how harsh the repression was ; for many people it was not, it was never the absolute King's actual fault. Even in their squalor and famine (or stewing in their absence of civil rights, for the more bougie types) they still couldn't quite bring themselves to the notion that the King really didn't give a solitary shit. They axiomatically, dogmatically believed the King to be good, caring, sharing the suffering of his subjects and having their best interests at heart - because that was the foundation of their entire political thought system and idea of the social contract. And so they'd automatically move on to "the King's counsellors must be lying to him, misdirecting him, manipulating him. Oh, those Swiss bankers and Italian meddlers and his wife's Austrians !". And they reviled them as weren't blinded by these fig leaves who marched the fucker to the guillotine.
But again, that had been true throughout the Middle Ages, and not just in France - when peasants revolted it wasn't hoping for social change or even to kill their oppressors. It was always a matter of "being heard by the King/Emperor", who would sort the bad things out and the only reason he hadn't must perforce be that he didn't know about it, since he's a Good King, QED.

Cognitive dissonance is a hell of a drug.

John_Stamos'_Left_Ear 07-18-2019 07:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snowboarder Bo (Post 21756807)
From your link:Aye; call it what it is.

They called Obama that too, remember?

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Knowed Out 07-18-2019 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eschereal (Post 21756802)
in an unguarded moment,
CALLER: In 2019, there's gonna be a $1 trillion deficit. Trump doesn't really care about that. He's not really a fiscal conservative. We have to acknowledge that Trump has been cruelly used.
LIMBAUGH: Nobody is a fiscal conservative anymore. All this talk about concern for the deficit and the budget has been bogus for as long as it's been around.
a big fat idiot pulls back the curtain

I used to listen to his show in the 80s, and that was his main talking point while Reagan was in office. Deficit and budget. He blamed the deficit squarely on liberal spending policies. Now he's saying that he was "bogus" from the very beginning. Fat fucking traitor.

Morgyn 07-18-2019 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kobal2 (Post 21756767)
But like... by choice ? No gun to your head or nothing ?! :o

Yep.

Hell, at any time of day, somewhere in this world, there's reputedly an episode of I Love Lucy playing. It's not that hard. ;-)

Really Not All That Bright 07-18-2019 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Knowed Out (Post 21757348)
I used to listen to his show in the 80s, and that was his main talking point while Reagan was in office. Deficit and budget. He blamed the deficit squarely on liberal spending policies. Now he's saying that he was "bogus" from the very beginning. Fat fucking traitor.

Limbaugh does this all the time.

Vinyl Turnip 07-18-2019 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kobal2 (Post 21756959)
I'll note that even as they start to tentatively open their eyes, for that caller it's still not "Trump fucking lied to us". It's "Trump has been cruelly used".

"Democrats talk down to me and sometimes tell me things I don't want to hear. President Trump lies to me in words I can understand!"

ElvisL1ves 07-18-2019 12:34 PM

Or, "They all lie anyway, so I'll go with the guy whose lies I like!"

Horatius 07-18-2019 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Knowed Out (Post 21757348)
I used to listen to his show in the 80s, and that was his main talking point while Reagan was in office. Deficit and budget. He blamed the deficit squarely on liberal spending policies. Now he's saying that he was "bogus" from the very beginning. Fat fucking traitor.


And it's particularly infuriating in that the underlying point that routine deficit financing is ultimately bad for the country is actually a legitimate point, unlike all the other crap the GOP has been pushing.

The one actually good thing they claimed to be concerned about was nothing but a smokescreen.

JohnT 07-18-2019 02:27 PM

I think that if Trump has taught us anything, it's that "old fashioned" Reagan conservatism: small government, low taxes, local control... really has no appeal for the American people any more. You can't win on it, the leader of the Republican party doesn't give a shit about Reagan conservatism, 60-odd million people didn't vote for Reagan's stated view of America in 2016, and it's sure as shit obvious the GOP isn't going to run on being the party of "small government and lower taxes" in 2020.

So, yeah, Reagan-era conservatism is spent as a political force which can move elections. Sure, there's millions of them out there who pine for the good ol' days of... 2005? 1991? 1984?... but they're not the ones driving the cart, and they never will as long as they allow Trump and his inevitable successors continue to take control of their party.

Knowed Out 07-18-2019 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Really Not All That Bright (Post 21757467)
Limbaugh does this all the time.

I remember he used the "I'm just an entertainer" line whenever he was trapped in a corner. I think he genuinely believed in fiscal conservatism at the time. I don't buy he was being purposely deceitful. He sold what was left of his soul when he supported Trump, and he realizes that. Saying it was bogus the whole time is a way to imply he was actually smart and clever and pulled off a long con. He wasn't really colossally stupid for throwing his ample weight behind Trump, because he's not really a fiscal conservative.

If it takes vaguely implying untruth to cover his lard ass, he'd rather say he's a liar than that he's wrong. Nobody was ever put in jail for hypocrisy.


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