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Old 02-26-2012, 12:25 PM
Untoward_Parable Untoward_Parable is offline
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 656
The basic idea we're discussing here is that an anarchist society lacks a clear formal hierarchy, and as such has trouble being as organized and efficient at many tasks (including coercive violence) as opposing social groups who have a clear formal hierarchy. It would be absurd, in my opinion, to dispute this, and I've known plenty of anarchists who freely admit that this is true; they're willing to give up efficiency in favor of social justice and liberty. As would I, if I didn't think that lack of efficiency at coercive violence compared to hierarchical groups were a fatal flaw.
You've read the majority of comments in this thread? The OP?

Much of the dispute Anarchism has with other systems is the conjecture that hierarchy is not needed for organization. People can assume roles without assuming dominance. I'm happy to be absurd in any case. Absurdity is usually a social distinction rather than a logical one after all.

I don't know who these people calling themselves Anarchists are but in most cases more participation creates better efficiency not worse. The more centrally directed an economy is the less efficient it usually is unless you're the ruler and want the last dodo bird for dinner.

There are the inefficiencies in law enforcement now. People would prefer that drug offenses not be treated like violence or theft and yet they are. We would like to see real rehabilitation instead of places that turn out more virulent criminals. People do not trust the police and do not cooperate with them. The police themselves are unaccountable or much less so for their crimes.

One could also argue that much of US war is a PR campaign ala 1984's endless war prescription for keeping the domestic population docile and cooperative to the status quo. The modern economic practices that include virtual monopoly/oligopoly (microsoft, apple, cable companies ect), advertising over quality or safety (I've heard its over a trillion dollars a year, in relation GDP that doesn't sound like efficiency to me), the larger a company is the less likely it is to be interfered with by the government or even given tax gifts by it as they are able to manipulate regulators and elected officials, this is the opposite dynamic one would want if you were considering efficiency.

All of these things occur because of the power and unaccountability of hierarchies. No serious Anarchist believes that society would work worse without the hierarchies that prey upon humanity now.

Originally Posted by Lumpy View Post
These two statements seem contradictory to me.
"minimally impactful" IE stay out of my bedroom, my church, my diversionary activities ect but don't expect society to stay out of your election rigging mountiantop removal mining, manufacturing explosives in a densely populated city ect.

Last edited by Untoward_Parable; 02-26-2012 at 12:28 PM.