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Old 12-06-2019, 06:00 PM
MulderMuffin is offline
Join Date: Jun 2019
Location: Buckle of the bible belt
Posts: 164
Originally Posted by elucidator View Post
There's a wrinkle here worth exploring. A reason why it might be best to let the case simmer rather than boil.

The best of the Ukraine approach is that it is so provable. The downside is that it is not as dramatic, the ordinary citizen is not impressed. We pretty much know about Citizen Trump's financial chicanery, how a property is valued just below the Taj Mahal when applying for a loan, and is worth a pack of gum for tax purposes. These lines of inquiry are slow, there's a lot of shit still working its way through the courts.

So....what if the impeachment inquiry is kept open and then the extent of his fiscal corruption becomes clear? So clear the Trump becomes toxic, the Senate shield dissipates. A situation arises wherein Il Douche would be convicted. Now, for questions of tax fraud, etc., a lot of courtly meandering could be expected, so that an impeachment attempt would be forestalled well into next year.

The only thing that is going to shake and frighten the Pubbie Senators is the prospect of a cessation of incumbency, the bums get thrown out. If such investigations render him so unpopular that defending him is a threat to their sacred asses.....they might bail, they might be willing, however reluctantly, to convict on the "lesser" charge. To git while the gitting is still good.

The tactic then would be to allow the Republicans to slow the process to a crawl and allow this factor to ripen and bloom. The best tactic might be to move ahead with all deliberate speed, as in slow and steady. Keep all options open. Just let the Republican Senators know that the parachutes are ready and waiting.

This would defeat the purpose of at least trying to make sure that Trump isn't around come the 2020 election to continue meddling in it. I don't believe anymore that anything will make the Republicans admit out loud how badly he has suborned the office of the President. Right now they're complaining the House is moving to fast, and if becomes more deliberate they will complain that the House is dragging its collective feet. It doesn't matter, whatever is said or however it is accomplished, it will have been done wrong in their eyes because the point is not whether or not he's guilty. It beggars belief that they don't know that he is. It's throwing as many spanners into the works as they can because they have decided as a group that it doesn't even matter, and they plan to have his back no matter what.

We know about Russia, though there can be some debate about whether the interference from Russia was sought or merely accepted; there's little doubt that it occurred. We've learned about Ukraine, with only specious doubts from Republican ostriches that interference was sought and would have been eagerly accepted if Ukraine had caved to his pressure campaign. I have strong suspicions that there are more plots and schemes rolling around in the background that we know nothing about as of yet.

North Korea? They have a robust hacking underground, as does China. Russia isn't definitely out of the picture. The point is, Trump has been credibly accused twice of involvement in varying degrees with foreign countries helping him by meddling in our elections (one willingly, one under duress). Aside from the fact that he's a detestable human being and a waste of good oxygen, aside from his politics and policies, his actions show him to be a real danger to the democracy of the United States.

I don't foresee a future where there are enough votes to remove him from office in the Senate, either with the evidence we have now or with anything that might come out if the House keeps investigating. The sad fact is that the people who can be convinced have been convinced. If what has already been uncovered hasn't moved the needle, and for many it hasn't, then I don't see what might change their minds.

There is one way that waiting and keeping the investigation in the House until closer to the election would be beneficial: as soon as the Senate doesn't convict, Trump will be crowing about being completely exonerated just like he did after the Mueller report came out. Gah! Minimizing that as much as possible would be good.

Though this is a good point:
Originally Posted by jsc1953 View Post
There is something to this approach. Assuming Trump doesn't get caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy (as the saying goes), he'll escape conviction by the Senate.

So the second-best outcome is to make him and his congressional supporters so toxic, that November 2020 is a Republican bloodbath. It seems like the best way to do that is to drag out the hearings for another 6-8 months, and pile on more and more charges before they ever go to trial (if at all).

Last edited by MulderMuffin; 12-06-2019 at 06:02 PM.