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Old 07-30-2019, 06:54 PM
Wrenching Spanners is offline
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Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: London
Posts: 538
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Me: The single-best economic stimulus is investment, which funnily enough is often government investment. Picking an easy two, federal vaccination programmes and the US interstate system are two incredibly effective economic stimuli.
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Originally Posted by k9bfriender View Post
Funny you should say that, as the actual best government investment in economic stimulus is education.
This is a thread hijack, which I started, but within modern times, I don’t think you can find a better government investment than vaccinations. The benefit/cost ratio is probably in the hundred-thousands. I agree and have stated that education is a societal investment. However, at some point, the beneficiaries of that investment need to pay it back. This is especially true if the students have received greater benefits than someone who opted out of those benefits due to cost.

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Originally Posted by k9bfriender View Post
If you get rid of the mountain of debt that a new student is signing up for, then you create more graduates, who make more innovations and spend more money, didn't you put up a cite before that having college graduates is good for the economy? Why would you choose to follow policies that make people avoid going to college?
Because at a certain point, societally necessary education turns into personally beneficial education. There’s no clear dividing line between the two, and indeed the point isn’t binary, but a crossing of a variable percentage threshold. Nevertheless, American society has determined that point to be high school graduation. Students who pursue college education are generally expected to pay for at least a part of their education and often the entirety. The students borrow student loans to receive the personally beneficial education. No one is forcing them to do so, and if the education is not personally beneficial to them, they can choose not to pursue it.

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Me:
Actually, deferred spending in terms of saving and investment matter hugely to the economy. Also, relevant to this thread, hasn’t spending already happened? A purchase of a college education has taken place. Are you discounting a college education and saying it has less value than “moving out, renting an apartment, buying a car, buying a house, starting a family, starting a business, or just spending their money on small comforts and luxuries”?
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Originally Posted by k9bfriender View Post
They are not deferring their spending in terms of saving and investment, they are deferring spending because they are paying off loans. As far as saving and investment, that is another thing that they are being denied. If you start saving for retirement in your 20's, you are going to be in a far better position than if you start in your 30's. This is forcing them to deffer their savings and investment until later in life when it will do them less good.
The students are making an investment in their university education that they will have to pay off later, unless that debt is relieved. While attending university, they are undergoing an expense which they are not paying off with an asset, but are instead accepting a liability. My argument is that they are knowingly accepting this liability, which will need to be paid off later.

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Originally Posted by k9bfriender View Post
your last question is pure strawman.
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Me (repeating my question that was an alleged strawman): “Why should the rest of society, including people who didn't go to college, pay for their lack of forethought?” Which statement of yours am I creating a false likeness of in order to burn down?
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Originally Posted by k9bfriender View Post
None of my statements, as that is more or less out of whole cloth. I may as well ask you "Why won't you stop beating your wife?" for as leading and inaccurate as your statement was.
If I’m not creating a strawman, why are you accusing me of doing so? Also, in a thread discussing personal responsibility, to state that a question relating to personal responsibility is a false question is a dodge of the question.

I’m sure there’s more to the remainder of your response to debate, but I think this current post is long enough.