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Old 08-12-2019, 10:01 AM
Max S. is offline
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Florida, USA
Posts: 1,556
Originally Posted by AHunter3 View Post
No, having extended the question to the whole gamut of universal physical determinism, I am no longer speaking merely of the unitary consciousness of the collective human race, but rather the consciousness of the whole situation. I'm saying we already know there is a consciousness choosing here. A causal-deterministic analysis would tend to say that the surrounding universe creates (or constitutes) the stimuli to which the entire species responds, and therefore that it is still a deterministic behavior. I'm saying that instead of that, the entire system ("external" universe and species as a collective set) is the self, or at least is not to be relegated strictly to being external to the self and then posited as the cause of a self that it is, in actuality, a component of.
I am still not fully understanding. Even if we designate the entire universe as a single holistic entity called "self", thus removing any "external" factors, I may still cling to the notion of causality. It may be said that my arm moves because my self willed it to move, but I have not yet escaped the fact that my will to move my arm has a number of exact causes. Whether we extend the idea of self to envelope all possible causes makes no difference for the question of free will, if the chain of causality is unbroken. It can be said that the self presently has no choice as to its state, for the current state was determined by the previous state; that the self had no choice as to its previous state, for that state was determined by the state proceeding it; etcetera ad infinitum. There may be no end to the chain of causation, or there may be a single origin point at which a God or supernatural non-self being decided to arrange the universe, but either way it does not follow that the self has any choice or free will at any point in existence.