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Old 09-12-2019, 10:25 AM
Gyrate is offline
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Greater Croydonia
Posts: 23,824
Originally Posted by LAZombie View Post
For 18 years I believed the official government narrative and believed that Truthers were deranged individuals, then I decided to take the time to hear Truther arguments. They have some very disturbing points to make that resonate with me. Some things they say may be wrong or exaggerated or twisted to support their overall beliefs, but I have seen enough to say the official narrative is not correct.
And we have seen enough of your argument to say that your justification for that conclusion is not well-founded.

I joined this discussion to get a rebuttal to what I have recently learned. It is quite shameful that people feel the need to mock me when I just want a civil discussion.
Skywatcher has rebutted all your points, and you have responded with more "faulty assumptions based on bad information", to quote a different poster. And most of us have been around and around these theories enough to know that there is nothing that will sway you from a position you have not reasoned yourself into.

But consider: you have asked several questions. When a rebuttal is provided, do you a) reconsider your position based on new information; b) simply ignore the rebuttal and restate the already-rebutted point; c) move on to a new talking point without acknowledging that the rebuttal of the previous one has already put a serious dent in your theory; or d) b and c, but never a?

If the answer is b, c or d, there is no point in either you asking or us answering your questions.

do not believe airplane with the amount of fuel they carry could destroy buildings in the manner we witnessed.
Neither science nor reality are reliant on your beliefs.

All three buildings collapsed as if they were in a controlled demolition.
No they didn't. At all. And that's not even getting into the whole thing about:

1) If they were controlled demolitions, why did no one notice the rather sizable bundles of explosives and wiring attached around the building beforehand?
2) How did they know exactly where the planes would hit, given that the collapses started from those points?
2) If you were going to make it look like you were bringing down the buildings with planes, why bother with a controlled demolition at all?

The Twin Towers has a massive asbestos issue and the cost of abatement could have ruined the owner Larry Silverstein. Some have suggested Larry Silverstein conspired with government forces. Yeah, it sounds crazy but it would not be the first time a landlord engaged in murder and arson.
While that is a cool story, bro, it remains purely speculative, and is evidence of nothing.

I do not know what happened to the people in the planes, but I would suggest that entities that would create a "New Pearl Harbor" that resulted in two wars, hundreds of thousands if not millions of deaths, and 4.5 trillions in costs are not above anything.
Again, that is a ludicrous statement. Yes, governments are more than capable of mass murder, but you cannot extrapolate from there to "Therefore it follows that the government killed JFK/vanished hundreds of airplane passengers on 9/11/is grinding babies up into soylent green". Also, there were literally body parts found scattered around lower Manhattan.

The stupidest thing about these Truther conspiracy theories is this: they would require the cooperation and ongoing silence of literally thousands of people including government, military and private individuals and the international media, plus a level of technology not generally known to exist, to pull off a plan so convoluted that it would be virtually impossible to pull off correctly and without discovery even if it were true, to achieve a vague and undefined goal.

Conversely, even if you want to assume the government was responsible for planning and facilitating 9/11, a plan in which a small group of terrorists hijack some planes and fly them into buildings would require maybe two or three dozen conspirators including the ones on the planes, some cash, some student visas and a couple of boxcutters, which is a far more plausible plan by several orders of magnitude. If William of Ockham were alive, he'd be bitchslapping you right now.

Last edited by Gyrate; 09-12-2019 at 10:26 AM.